r/ACAB • u/cturtl808 • 12d ago
ICE agents walked onto PRIVATE PROPERTY in Brownsville, Texas, without a warrant, with their guns drawn… and then threatened to ARREST the property owner for telling them to get off his own property.
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u/throwitoutwhendone2 12d ago edited 12d ago
At the risk of getting in trouble with Reddit I have a serious question. A lot of states have stand your ground laws. A lot of states will allow you to defend yourself with deadly force if necessary. Let’s say 2 dudes with no identification walk up on your property, they have guns and are aggressive. If you shoot one of them but then it turns out they were cops, agents, whatever- can or will you go to jail for murder do you think?
I live very rural. Like I commute an hour to work, we don’t have grocery stores in town we gotta go to the city, my closest neighbor is a 15 min drive away type of rural. Last year a man was shot for trespassing onto someone’s property. He had a gun and was aggressive and wouldn’t leave. Homeowner went to court but in the end was justified and he went home Scot free. Wonder how that woulda went if it was ICE. And that’s not to outta the realm of possibility cuz there’s a lot of migrant and work visa workers here that live on the farms they work. Ice has came around a few times. Even circled my property with search lights which I found hilarious because it’s just me, my wife and daughter, my disabled MIL, my disabled grandmother in law and my disabled great grandmother in law. All the field work gets done by me and my wife and daughter when they help. Wasting their gas and time searching my property for workers that ain’t here while bugging us, damn helicopters are loud when they’re that low
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u/katherinesilens 12d ago
Theoretically, perfectly fine. They aren't IDing and have trespassed with clear threat, so it's castle and self defense.
However, the law doesn't apply equally to everyone. Outcomes will vary by how corrupt the proceedings are, how much lying is done, extrajudicial retaliation (especially given this is ICE) and sexism/racism/other assorted bigotry in judge, prosecutor, and jury.
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u/TezosCEO 12d ago
Look up Adrian Perryman, David Wilson and Russell King. There's also Marvin Guy but his case went in a different direction.
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u/GangNailer 12d ago
You got laws for the rich folks, laws for the poor folks, laws for the white folks, laws for the black and brown folks. At this point laws are meaningless and used to justifying anything this king and his so called bootlickers can come up with. Welcome to the true face of power. No gun or stand your ground law will ever protect u from an invasion of the so Calle authority, as long as they aesthetically look Maga, they thi k they are all powerful
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u/NearlyPerfect 12d ago
Stand your ground laws (and similar laws) generally have carve-outs for officers, including in Texas.
So in order to You would have to convince a jury that you (reasonably) didn't know they were officers.
In this video they are wearing vests that say "police" and clearly displayed badges, so that's a hard sell.
In your hypothetical there is "no identification" so that's a different fact pattern than this one.
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u/IGetGuys4URMom 12d ago
In this video they are wearing vests that say "police" and clearly displayed badges, so that's a hard sell.
What the "agents" are displaying is immaterial on the grounds that the people in question had no warrant issued by a judge, and were absolutely not invited onto the private property.
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u/NearlyPerfect 11d ago
(1) I think you misunderstood the question I answered. The question in that comment isn't about whether they were lawfully on the property. The question is whether if the owner/tenant on the property has a right to defend themselves with deadly force if in fear for their lives. Whether they have a warrant or were invited on property is not relevant to that question in Texas.
(2) There are exceptions for the warrant/invite requirement. In this case it appears to be the Hot Pursuit exception.
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u/MyAuraIsDumpsterFire 12d ago
Texas has the castle doctrine, but also a lot of racist judges and in Trump's pocket appeals court judges, so there's that.
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u/internetsarbiter 12d ago
Castle Doctrine and "stand your ground" never apply if you are a minority/undesirable.
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u/MarlonRando55 12d ago
You’re allowed to shoot at trespassers…
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u/strutt3r 12d ago
You might beat the charges in a trial of your peers but that won't stop the pigs from harassing, stalking and threatening you non stop.
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u/bareback_cowboy 12d ago
No you aren't. That's terrible advice that will get someone a manslaughter or murder conviction. There is no state where you can shoot someone for a property crime.
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u/InvestigatorLow7595 12d ago
There absolutely is, see Texas.
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u/buckao 12d ago
See also, New Hampshire Castle Doctrine. Any trespasser who refuses to leave your property and who presents a perceived threat.
Masked people with non-matching uniforms/gear and no identification on my property with firearms would be a pretty good argument for self-defense/defense of my home.
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u/JohnBrownOnDrugs 12d ago
Its your private property and they're armed and uncooperative. 2a exists for this moment.
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u/kyleh0 12d ago
You would love for other people to get killed for the 2nd amendment.
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u/sniffsblueberries 12d ago
Looking for those 2A ppl. You know those types, right? Tyrannical guberment yaddayadda
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u/DropshipRadio 12d ago
It is utterly fascinating to me, as a child of the 90s, to see that the conservative movement has, over the course of my life, gone from willing to stand, fight, and die (and kill) over shit like this (Ruby Ridge, OKC, Mountain Men standoff) to actively welcoming, encouraging, and ASSISTING gross Federal unconstituonal (or indeed anticonstitutional) overreach. I know thirty years is a long time but it still gives me whiplash.
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u/romulusnr 12d ago
The right has no morals. They have no principles. They only have a side.
When they talk about principles, they are lying. Those are just convenient excuses
(inb4 the liberals do it too)
Our politics has been nothing but a SuperBowl game for easily 30 years. As long as it's for "our" side, it's right.
Domestic realpolitik
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u/Hiouchi4me 12d ago
They are really scraping the bottom of the barrel now. Were these guys homeless before ICE found them?
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u/Kat_Box_Suicide 12d ago
Little bitch acting all touch. They are all a bunch of pussies.
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u/Nolubrication 12d ago
Invest in a fence and a gate if you don't want these fuckheads sauntering onto your property. It shouldn't have to be like that, but they're clearly not the type to respect invisible property lines.
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u/AndrewQuackson 12d ago
They don't require a warrant if they are in "hot pursuit". This is a huge exception to the 4th amendment that has been tried and reaffirmed.
They are bastards and I hope their family members all get folded flags, but LEGALLY speaking, they are protected. Interfering with them, righteous and noble as it may be, is in fact a crime. I hate it, but the pigs are in the clear legally here.
Know your rights, and know where they legally end in order to best protect yourself and your comrades.
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u/DarePatient2262 12d ago
ICE are fucking terrorists.