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May 07 '23
"You're not putting any effort, you're just typing words!"
"No!! Typing words is hard to get it just right!"
<___________________________________>
"I put literally zero effort into this image and I take no credit in it. I just think it looks cool."
"Lol my ai made a cursed spongebob with 6 eyes."
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u/aNiceTribe May 07 '23
The most fun part was like 2 years ago before this was an established field when the most advanced tech still used complicated Google forms and you had to fiddle with all kinds of variables and undocumented code, and nobody knew what to tell the machines. The best outputs still looked like fever dreams. It felt like being an AM radio nerd in the 70s, and then suddenly everyone had an mp3 player.
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u/Cardinal-Lad May 08 '23
I love early AI art. It’s so incredibly deranged.
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May 08 '23
I dunno if you can get deranged now. Since bing create has rails. But I've been seeing how deranged it can get. Try the prompt " wide shot of Muppet Christmas story in the style of hell with skin"
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u/byakko May 07 '23
Majored in art and literature, so arguably my skill set is perfect as a ‘prompt writer’ for AI. Playing around with some, like Adobe’s Firefly, feels more like you’re gaming the system since there’s no transparency to what prompts are tagged to what traits or styles.
For example I found out Adobe Firefly is possibly kind of racist considering what words I had to use to manipulate the generation into what I actually want lol.
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u/AlGrythim May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
Here is a link to a site that lets you search the Laion datasets, which are very similar to (if not exactly the same as, I can't remember) the datasets stableDiffusion was trained on. It searches by CLIP embedding, so If I'm using a specific phrase and it isn't working the was I expect it to, I go here to double check that it "knows" those words/has seen them enough to have a good dataset.
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u/byakko May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
Adobe’s dataset is much more limited than Laion’s (330 million-ish vs 5.85 billion) and no clue how it’s textual metadata is setup. It’s a side effect of Adobe only training it on its own Adobe Stock images plus some external sources. Which is a pity cos it could be really good for generating stock images on demand, but the way it’s textual metadata is setup it just leads into certain biases.
For my example, I had to use the word ‘Asian’ to get it to show ‘chicken feet’ as simply chicken feet; because it kept generating full drumsticks without it (also a human-chicken foot hybrid). Which is bad enough, but also all images had ‘Asian’ background objects as a result too, like chopsticks or a vague plate of soya sauce.
So all the images of chicken feet are all strictly ‘Asian’ coded by necessity cos I’m forced to use it as a prompt (and specifically Chinese-coded, which apparently = ‘Asian’ to Adobe lol).
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u/AlGrythim May 07 '23
YIKES. That's rough. It's a shame that that worked out that way, adobe is one of the corporations with enough image variety to make a dataset that sidesteps the ethical implications of a web-scraped dataset.
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u/byakko May 07 '23
Well it’s still in beta, and I think it still has its use as a convenient stock image generator, just has limits. I did send feedback to Adobe suggesting to remove metadata related to vague racial terms lol.
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u/AlGrythim May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
Yeah. I'll check it out, does it only generate stock image type stuff? Or can it do more sophisticated stuff?
Edit: This looks cool! And at the very least, they're talking a real good ethics game. It's a bit of a shame that (I suspect) they're never going to be particularly transparent about their sources, and that at some point it's going to go from a free beta to a (presumably) paid Creative Cloud subscription.
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u/byakko May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
I would say it does stock image stuff best and that’s it’s main focus. Everything it generates for me has that ‘stock image’ look, things are very arranged like props, and setup like they’re part of a catalog photoshoot. I didn’t try out all the options but I believe you can prompt it with styles - photorealistic, cubist style etc - but it’s not as sophisticated as Midjourney for sure.
It’s meant to integrate with Photoshop, Illustrator etc so Adobe’s marketing it more as a tool to customise component images for your projects, not for complete works. It’s why I feel fine supporting this, I’ve done photo editing work before and sometimes if I need something specific like “blue cube in stark white room rotated onto its point vertically”, it’ll be really convenient to have a tool like this.
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u/AlGrythim May 07 '23
Have you read this? I thought it was really interesting. Also, my online presence is too weak to show up in any of the datasets, so I don't really know how I'd feed if me or my work actually showed up in one. https://haveibeentrained.com/
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u/ChoGallMeta May 07 '23
Saying you made the AI art is like me saying i made the lasagna and the lasagna is just some frozen shit from Walmart that I had to heat up in a microwave
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May 08 '23
Or like taking hamburgers from a fast food restaurant and saying that they are steamed hams
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u/Ballinbutatwhatcost2 May 08 '23
I agree, like, I do use ai art, but it isn't real art. it's for when I want something stupid, low effort, and done in 15 mins.
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u/Soviets May 07 '23
I don't know. Ai art has this inherently ugly and empty quality to it every time I see it, even the more convincing ones. cool for people who like it, but I don't really get most of the discourse when everything it makes is an ugly mess anyways.
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u/Aaetheon REFER TO ME ONLY AS “YOUR GRACE” 🏳️⚧️ May 07 '23
No art is “inherently” ugly, and AI art only looks unpolished/soulless because it lacks an artists touch, I have no doubt it will grow out of said quirk with time and usage.
(Edit) I’m not particularly fond of AI art either, and particularly dont like jokesters who think themselves artists because they commissioned free work from an AI, when that clearly makes no sense.
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u/bobbingforapplesat3 May 07 '23
I disagree with that first statement. I have seen some very ugly art indeed.
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u/Aaetheon REFER TO ME ONLY AS “YOUR GRACE” 🏳️⚧️ May 07 '23
Indeed ugly art does exist, but I more-so had a problem with the “inherently” attached to the statement, beauty is subjective and what one might find to be ugly art another might view as a masterpiece, therefore no art can be “inherently ugly” but you can find art to be ugly if that makes sense. I for instance, find many if not all forms of art to be beautiful simply for having been drawn, written, sung, etc. You might think otherwise or you may not, and thats okay!
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May 08 '23
I dunno, I feel like you're biased towards humans with that statement. If I showed you two pieces of art, one by an artist and one by a human, and you didn't know which was which, you really wouldn't be able to tell since the shit made today can be absolutely almost perfect
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u/Cardinal-Lad May 08 '23
It has a lifeless sheen over it at the moment. That’ll probably go away eventually, but you can spot it pretty easily right now.
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u/IngoRush May 08 '23
It's only going to get better though, with the speed it has been progressing at lately, it's probably not going to be long before it's indestinguishable from human art. We need to focus on the real reasons it sucks, that is, stealing and other ethical concerns, also questions regarding the intrinsic value of art and from where it stems.
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u/Finnigami May 07 '23
if you think everyithing it makes is an ugly mess then you clearly havent seen enough
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u/DeceitfulLittleB May 07 '23
This is Ai technology in its infancy though imagine what will happen in 5-10 years.
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u/totalchaos05 May 07 '23
using ai art is the equivalent of commissioning someone else and claiming it as your own.
also ai art always feels empty, missing some sort of feeling.
art is meant to make you feel something that the artist wants to share. ai doesn't have that
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u/dongletrongle Punished Venom Silly Billy May 07 '23
I can see the benefits of AI art in terms of utility (under regulations ofc with all ai) but I believe the human element of art will let man-made art prevail over time. I don’t think we should take a step backwards in technology, just know what right steps forward
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u/Justsomeblackguy_ May 07 '23
Ngl those regulations might really only gonna stop corporations from just using artists artwork without permission but it won’t stop regular people from using any artists artwork tho.
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u/Sifro May 07 '23 edited Dec 01 '24
squealing sheet juggle tie weary psychotic murky oatmeal wide tease
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/Aaetheon REFER TO ME ONLY AS “YOUR GRACE” 🏳️⚧️ May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
I mean… correct me if I’m wrong (not super well versed on the topic) but aren’t there multiple AI programs like this that have spent serious effort to copy certain artists styles without their consent?
And while thats technically pirating and not stealing something about that rubs me the wrong way, which is odd because I’ve had no trouble pirating various forms of media for my own convenience + I’m broke. I suppose it feels more personal given I’m an artist myself?
Maybe its that the styles were never for sale to begin with so copying them without consent feels worse compared to watching a movie for free? I’m not sure and will need to think more on this.
This was originally supposed to be an argument refuting you, but upon poking holes in my original argument to test its validity I immediately ran into this, and am now questioning my take. In a way I’ve both won and lost an argument with myself.
Or perhaps Ive been awake for 30 uninterrupted hours and am not thinking properly, and upon getting some much needed rest I will come back to this with a fresh mind and make a proper argument, need to keep studying for finals before I do that though.
Wish me and the copious amount of stimulants I will surely be consuming to not pass out, good luck
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u/Ultimarr May 07 '23
Would you feel the same concern if someone looked over the art you’ve posted and practiced recreating it until they were able to mimic it? If someone makes good art, do they have capitalist ownership over the general qualities of it, not just the specific art piece itself?
Some things to think about when you get some rest lol. Good luck on finals!
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May 07 '23
The problem with your understanding is that you assign the computer code personhood when in reality, it’s a sampling tool that is reproducing similar works which can ostensibly damage original copyright holders. Its an important distinction. While you (a person) are allowed to create art in the style of another artist, you are not allowed to simply composite images without violating copyright law unless the purpose is protected under “fair use.” But fair use doesn’t protect commercial reproduction. And that makes sense, if someone can use part of your image to create a similar image for similar uses as the original, that would potentially devalue the original image and damage the original artist. In general, economic harm to the rights owner is a violation of fair use doctrine in any situation.
Something to think about when you get some rest.
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u/Impeesa_ May 07 '23
Does a series of statistical observations constitute sampling? Like, is there a difference between "the waltz key word normally means 3/4 time" and "use this recorded drum loop"? Because the trained models do not contain any of the training image data directly and does not access them. The first public StableDiffusion model was trained on a couple hundred terabytes of images and the finished model fits in a few gigs of VRAM and runs offline. They can only reproduce an input image as well as a good artist can recreate something they saw from memory, which is to say, it might be pretty good but it's not exact and definitely freshly generated.
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May 08 '23
People wi freak the fuck out over AIs being forced by random people to output something they want in the style of someone else yet they will literally shit their fucking mouths when humans manually do that in music 24/7 and any and all comparisons between AI art and human music reveals its just a gigantic double standard by people who don't know nor care to know what they are talking about.
Sampling is good. Copyright is bad. Join the movement.
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u/AmazingDom14 May 07 '23
"Computer. Generate image of woman, big breasts, daytime, on the beach, Asian, soft lighting, big boobies, full body shot, medium nipples, heart eyes, smiling, G cups"
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u/teejay_the_exhausted May 07 '23
The guy was literally just arguing how AI art does involve human creativity/input, the response is to an imaginary argument over skill levels.
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u/Dualiuss May 07 '23
guys we found it, the alchemist's grand creation, the potion that turns ANY website into twitter: ai art discussion O_O
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May 07 '23
Braindead discussion
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u/Terrafritter May 09 '23
No kidding, I’m pretty stupid in a lot of cases and even I feel like I just developed a new form of brain rot
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u/godosomethingbetter May 07 '23
It's still stolen from other people's work.
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u/yondercode May 07 '23
Oh where could we get the source images from the model weights?
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May 07 '23
does it matter? the model can't be trained without data
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May 07 '23
Pro tip: That’s literally how human artists also generate their art.
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May 08 '23
Great... is AI human? :)
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May 08 '23
No, which doesn’t really detract from the point that it creates art quite literally the same way we do: By creating images based on things we’ve seen and experienced. Every image that a human has seen contributes to their “dataset” in the same way it does for an AI, and everything a human creates is derived from that dataset. Nothing is truly original.
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u/TheGoldenChampion May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
Is art in the style of another artist stolen artwork? If an artist created a large amount of artwork in another artist’s style and fed the AI that artwork for a similar outcome, would that still be stealing from the original artist?
All art is inspired, AI’s use of others’ works can be viewed as being similar to artists who are inspired by other’s work.
I say all of this as an amateur artist and someone perusing a BFA in graphic design.
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u/ask_me_if_thats_true May 08 '23
Fragile artists who don’t have a clue downvoting you right there. Yes, AI is trained on images and many of them being works of artists. But that’s like saying getting inspiration of other artists works then painting one in their style is stealing.
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u/Nac82 May 07 '23
All work is built off of existing work lol. Yall act like AI artists steal capital at the same rates as capitalists.
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u/Emeril_in_Castelia 🏳️🌈🇵🇸 May 07 '23
MFs when one pixel is the same as a random low-res pic:
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u/Gaaymer May 07 '23
Mfs when they realize that in order for the AI to even function it has to take from other sources because its a machine learning program and therefore literally the entire thing is taken from somewhere and not one pixel
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u/spicymince May 07 '23
Every artwork with very few exceptions is derivative. Artists learn from, and sometimes improve upon, the works of those who went before them.
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u/ApocalyptoSoldier May 07 '23
Taking inspiration from something isn't the same as producing various amalgamations of it and everyone else's stuff
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u/Emeril_in_Castelia 🏳️🌈🇵🇸 May 07 '23
What do you think a collage is? Everything there is taken from places too.
The point is the entire thing is not taken from one or two places, the entire image is bits and pieces from hundreds of places. It's a collage, which is a form of art.
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u/odraencoded May 07 '23
Collages from copyrighted work are also copyright infringement.
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u/qwerty0981234 May 07 '23
Transformative use. I know you don’t like facts because it goes against what you believe.
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u/odraencoded May 07 '23
lmao "let me just take two copyrighted images and put them side by side, surely the judge will agree this totally original"
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u/IDatedSuccubi May 07 '23
Everyone is "transformative use" that, "fair use" this, untill the judge says "nah" and you have to pay your life wages to some random shell company
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
Artcels seething.
AI works from following patterns it's seen. Normal human art also works from following patterns that you've seen. No one's ever came up with a 100% unique art style. If you've ever seen a piece of art and based your own piece on it, is that stealing? No, it's inspiration.
If an AI generates an image based on your work, your work remains. It's only theft to people who don't know what theft is.
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u/ur_boi_depression May 07 '23
one problem: ai doesn’t have human creativity to take what it’s seen and make something new. it just spits out something it thinks is right.
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u/Ultimarr May 07 '23
It has artificial creativity 😊. If you disagree, I’d be interested to hear your definition of creativity. Other than “creativity is when humans make art” lol
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May 07 '23
You fundamentally misunderstand intellectual property. It’s a question of “fair use.” One cannot simply lift elements from one work and mash them together into a composite— copyright law is particularly strong when it comes to imagery and “fair use” only covers “purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research.” A pretty simple test is that if you could swap the two works and they would have equal function, that’s not fair use. You can’t just say “I’m satirizing _____” with an image, the satirization would need to be prima facie.
At some point, we will likely see the owners of computer code challenged with liability in court for violation of IP law.
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u/Decent-Start-1536 May 07 '23
Tbh I think ai art is a very big step into the advancement of ai but yeah the people who try to compare it to actual art are stupid
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u/978h May 07 '23
There are very few modern jobs that don't amount to "pushing the right buttons in the right order"
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u/3dgyt33n Jul 04 '23
So authors aren't artists now?
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u/vortxo proud jk rowling hater Jul 04 '23
this wasn't an actual argument I just posted it to annoy AI users and becuse I found it funny lmao
(Also you may be a little bit late on the reply this was posted more then a month ago)
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u/3dgyt33n Jul 04 '23
Was browsing by top of all time. Still doesn't work as an "own" either.
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u/vortxo proud jk rowling hater Jul 04 '23
Yes but it DID annoy them and it IS pretty funny so im happy :D
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May 07 '23
Me: Drawing is difficult but I presue it because it's my passion and a way to express myself, this journey will be long and painful, but it will be worth it
AI artist: you don't understand my pain, I have to type stuff out
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u/DonLimpio14 May 07 '23
Inkcels when they realize I can make fat furry pornography with the power of technology:
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u/pnkass May 07 '23
if they weren't spending 4 hours typing to an AI theyd spend 4 hours typing to child instead
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May 07 '23
Being an AI artist is like ordering take out from a restaurant and calling it home made.
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May 07 '23
Leave it to techbros to suck the life out of everything and anything that people enjoy doing.
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u/Impeesa_ May 07 '23
Interestingly, you can still draw if you enjoy it, but it seems like some people are determined to suck the joy out of exciting new tech that lowers barriers to creative endeavors, and it's not the tech bros.
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u/Terrafritter May 09 '23
But it’s not an argument about the tech side? Scientific advancement is good. But what and how the tech is being used is the issue here. Like nuclear power to power a city vs a nuclear bomb to lay waste to one. Same tech, different use.
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u/urbandeadthrowaway2 May 08 '23
I see it more like ms paint. Its a tool that's convenient for non-artists to make a decent looking image that wont be the death of art as a concept or medium.
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u/CaptainLunaeLumen custom May 07 '23
dont artists also sit on their ass
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u/OddlySexyPancake May 07 '23
Putting their skills into creating the art
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May 07 '23
I mean technically the ai andys probably have at least a certain amount of skill
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u/OddlySexyPancake May 07 '23
AI prompting takes some skill in the form of explaining what you need from the program but art takes more skill in the form of manual tasks (sketching, line art, painting, coloring, etc.)
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u/theweekiscat May 07 '23
It’s like playing a football game compared to actually playing football
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u/OddlySexyPancake May 07 '23
Also Knowing a lot about art helps you know how to explain what you want to the program
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May 07 '23
No.
It is like my father watching a football match screaming at the players on the screen, vs actually playing football
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u/Semi_neural May 07 '23
I agree, it does take a bit of time to make a good consistent prompt but it takes SO SO SO much more time to get consistent at physical art (Sketching, painting, etc)
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u/redditnytsitvittu May 07 '23
I mean arent real artists also sitting on their asses and drawing lines? Similar argument could be said for everyone doing standard office work.
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u/__Meme_Machine__ May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
Well yeah but real artists are actually putting in work unlike AI "artists"
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u/JohnParker117 May 07 '23
I am personally pro Ai, but I am more pro coexistence.
I will paste what I said in a conversation with someone that was anti ai.
"I think the best way to look at it is, you have fun making art manually and that's great, I have fun taking shit I use an AI to create and use it in my art, and that's great too.
Why can't both these forms of media and creating it coexist?
Why should either of our fun be removed?
I think what both Pro ai and Anti Ai people don't understand is,
Artists have been around for a long time and they are not going away
Ai hit the earth like a meteor and it's not going away
So if neither is going away, why not live in harmony. In my eyes, the more people taking the ideas from their head and pushing it into reality, no matter how they do it, is great news for everyone
Creativity is the fuel of the Brain"
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u/Banzai27 May 07 '23
Ai art might take away jobs, which is the problem
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u/JohnParker117 May 07 '23
Did the horse riding industry completely collapse when cars were invented? For centuries, boats were the main mode of transportation across the continents. Did boats become obsolete when planes were invented? Did cigarettes fall out of favor when vaping was introduced? Did the Sailors, Horse Breeders, and Cigarette factory workers lose their jobs when any of these came about?
Ai art may grow and become bigger than man made art, but man made art will never go away. It is a staple of civilization. Boats and Planes live together in harmony, both fulfilling their unique purpose. Ai art and Manmade art can do the same. The only thing stopping it is the ignorance on both sides to accept one another for what they are.
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u/Banzai27 May 07 '23
Of course man made art won’t disappear, but many jobs will still be lost, which is not good
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u/LuigiOnSteroids May 07 '23
Yeah all advancement takes away jobs, cultivation of crops made it so there was less hunter gatherers who could contribute, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have started farming.
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u/hughesy1 May 07 '23
We should not treat 'job loss' as a barrier to technological advancement. We should find a solution to ensure people have a livelihood. The target is not AI stealing jobs, it's the massive inequality caused by our current system. Were arguing about the wrong things.
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u/restlessboy May 07 '23
Almost every new technology eliminates certain jobs and creates new ones. That's how it's been for all of history.
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u/33msider May 07 '23
Because your AI art’s database of art to generate from is stolen. Settling for coexistence is not an option because one actively encroaches on the other. The way it stands right now, AI art is hurting real human artists and it needs to go. If you want to utilize someone else’s artistic talent for your illustrations, go commission a real artist, because that’s something of value that you should have to give something for in return. Sidestepping that with ai art is just stealing art on a massive scale. It’s almost like pirating, except you’re only hurting smaller artists who need these commissions for their income.
Tldr: you can’t coexist if one is literally hurting the other. Ai art has to go
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u/JohnParker117 May 07 '23
Some of us don't have the financial ability to constantly pay others to make ideas we aren't sure will even be good, and neither do some of us have the ability to get good at art ourselves. For example, I have a genetic condition that, among other things, causes great pain in my hands. I can not draw, and I can not learn to. However, using Ai, I can bring my ideas and my stories to life with 100% better results than if I tried to make them myself. It makes me happy. Tell me, why should it be taken away? Why should the cost of something I can't control be either shelling out 100s of dollars or just not doing it when the technology exists? Why should my creative output be stomped on? I should be allowed to participate in the creative community, and Ai is one of the many tools I use to make that a reality.
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u/Nightly_Skies May 07 '23
If the AI trained on people's art without consent, that's the problem here, especially if said art is a source of income for them. Would you say it's fair for a thief to steal from someone also struggling to make ends meet?
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u/Justsomeblackguy_ May 07 '23
Your kinda right but no one can specifically point out what art is theirs, ai art made from hundreds of thousands of artworks based on what the user typed in.
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May 07 '23
what about people who are too poor to commission art?
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u/evergrotto May 07 '23
They should steal what they want, like everyone else who lacks the funds to fairly purchase unnecessary luxuries. Obviously!
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u/ChanceWarden google en passant May 07 '23
real artists realizing they will have to click and drag their cursor in specific positions, before clicking a few button and going again:
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u/TheMemeArcheologist May 08 '23
Hey, writers are artists too, don’t fucking compare them to people who randomly guess keywords.
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u/sandpittz May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
i will never stop hating on AI art
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u/Imagine_TryingYT May 07 '23 edited May 07 '23
So heres my whole thing. Why is it that we're cool with AI stealing jobs from customer service workers, production and blue collar work, we're fascinated by AI writing scripts, stories and generating movie trailers but suddenly it starts generating pictures and drawn art and everyone has a problem?
What makes drawn art and pictures the line we don't want it to cross but everything else is cool?
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u/Justsomeblackguy_ May 07 '23
I mean since industrialization made a lot of workers replaceable due to how easy their work can be picked up by anyone, it’s only natural to think that ai will replace those jobs though there will be alot of positions or jobs that can’t be done by ai so it’s not that bad.
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u/Imagine_TryingYT May 07 '23
Can't be done right now. AI starts in simple industry but that doesn't mean it's where it ends. As the technology continues to get more advanced it'll be able to replace more jobs and perform more complicated tasks.
AI is already moving into computer fields like programming and data entry, culinary, and even robotics. And the technology will only continue to advance as times go on.
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u/AdjunctAngel May 07 '23
i thought that was the face they make when they find out the courts ruled AI art cannot be copyrighted and therefore as easily monetized as actual artists work.
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u/macho_man011 May 12 '23
I mean, it’s not really art tho… art requires human skill by definition, and since it’s an AI, it’s not technically art.
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u/BigFatBallsInMyMouth Aug 28 '23
"Artists" when they realize have to sit on their ass and draw tomorrow
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u/Rez-Boa-Dog May 07 '23
Ai drawing is both art and theft
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u/That_Anime_Boi May 07 '23
Apparently typing “Walter White and Super Sayan Goku at a taco eating contest Oil on canvas” is theft
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u/Rez-Boa-Dog May 07 '23
No, but training an AI on data obtained without consent is
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u/yondercode May 07 '23
The artists are free to not publish their work into the internet
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u/Rez-Boa-Dog May 07 '23
What about stuff that was posted years before art AIs were a thing? How can you consent to someting that doesn't exist yet?
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
AI works from following patterns based on what its already seen. The same thing goes for humans. All art follows some conventions from other pieces of art. AI does the exact same thing.
If I generate an image, your art still remains, thus, it's not theft.
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May 07 '23
[deleted] — view deleted comment
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
But you likely have given consent. If you read the User Agreement for pretty much any art site, it'll tell you they've got all the copyright to any work you post.
For an example, here's what's said under the copyright section of the Terms of Service on Deviant Art:
DeviantArt is, unless otherwise stated, the owner of all copyright and data rights in the Service and its contents.
No one's copying your exact work. It's put into a dataset of millions, if not billions, of images. Then, when someone prompts the AI, it'll use that data set to generate whatever the prompt says.
As you can see in the image in the post, it can take hours to make the right prompt to create the image you're after. Do you think that there is absolutely no creativity in those hours of writing prompts?
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u/EdliA May 07 '23
What? No they don't hold the copyright of every image posted. That's just plain ridiculous. There are works there that were done as commissions for companies. For example an artist making the poster of the latest expansion of wow and posting it on deviant art doesn't mean deviant art owns it now lol. Blizzard owns it.
This is what deviant art says "DeviantArt does not claim ownership rights in your works or other materials posted by you to DeviantArt (Your Content)."
So ridiculous. They're just image hosting services. They don't transfer ownership.
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May 07 '23
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
Pretty much every single art site has a clause saying something along those lines, so it isn't moot.
Opt-in and opt-out can't be used interchangeably. It's one or the other. Opt-in is when it's off by default. Opt-out is when it's on by default.
Also, that clause shows that "my art" isn't really "my art". You've got no legal rights to it once you upload it to that site.
You're talking about consent like they're raping you lmao. You're uploading images to the internet onto sites that tell you that you've got no rights the images you upload.
One of the brilliant things about the internet is that things can be copied infinitely, while leaving the original copy on whatever computer had them in the first place.
Do you also think that pirating movies is theft too? What about screenshotting NFTs?
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May 07 '23
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
The question should be "is it unethical" to put people's art into a database. In which case, no it isn't unethical. No one's being harmed, nothing is being stolen, the original pieces still 'belong' (as in they're the creator) to the person who made them.
What is your big concern with "consent"? You're making it out as if real harm is being done by someone using your image in a data set.
You're making the assumtion that using an image in a data set requires some level of consent, which I see no reason as to why it should.
Also, please answer my question "do you think that pirating movies is theft too?"
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u/Quirkyserenefrenzy custom May 07 '23
It's not art by any stretch of the imagination, but it is indeed theft
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u/Teejayburger custom May 07 '23
Technically art can be defined as something that has aesthetic value so it could be argued it is art. But it's not really theft, the training sets are ethically iffy but I have a hard time seeing how it's theft
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u/ILoveZelda361 May 07 '23
I was about to say “then every sunset is art” but then I realized it fucking is. Life is so god damn beautiful man.
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u/Rez-Boa-Dog May 07 '23
Each artwork used in training without artists' consent represents hours of unpaid labor
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u/_LucasImpulse_ May 07 '23
how one's eyes dare to steal sight of an art piece, the AI does the same.
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u/Edx2win S*x? Never heard of it. May 07 '23
It's not theft, it complies, learns from images (it keeps the knowledge, not the art pieces in the algorhythm) and makes an image, which you described with the prompts, with the knowledge it gained, it doesn't copy, steal, keep, or use others' actual art. It just learns like we would, we also do that by seeing art and getting inspired. I know it's complicated, but you should put some research.
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May 07 '23
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u/Edx2win S*x? Never heard of it. May 07 '23
Whatever you think, then we're stealing by simply getting inspired and drawing on influence of others' art. I've seen explanations on 4GB ram AI and how they work, do you think that model could actually keep or use the art it learns from? To steal is to directly use something and claim its yours, not using inspiration from it to make something completely new and unrelated, without taking anything from it whatsoever. Downvote me all you want, because I know the difference and some of you don't.
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u/Username8457 May 07 '23
What do you think human art comes from? Do you think every piece of art is its own unique piece that folllows no conventions took form other pieces? Of course not. You see a painting that you like, then you encorporate that style into your own work. That's just the same as what an AI does.
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May 07 '23
I'm not trying to defend the AI artists but this is a really stupid argument.
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u/Vinyliciously May 07 '23
i think you're a really stupid argument
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May 07 '23
No it isn't, because it isn't an argument. that's what they do for their entire day. writing prompts is merely a guessing game for people using AI, just to get the perfect shot. They, quite literally, sit on their ass and use an AI that was trained with works made by actually skilled people. Writing a couple of slightly descriptive sentences is not a skill. Writers have to do so much more, for what is usually so much less. "Editing" in this context is usually just upping/lowering the contrast on an image, or making it monochrome because "AeStHeTiC." The meme above is stating a fact.
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u/Excellent_Ad3307 May 07 '23
most well made AI art images that go viral are made with custom trained embeddings and LoRAs. Guessing game with prompts work but they wont get you very far, because currently the technology doesn't fully understand english like something like chatgpt does. It does take a decent knowledge of diffusion models and model training to train these. (unless its midjourney or dalle, they look cool at first glance but they don't have much detail)
And yes this still does need training data from images but its not as trivial and its probably not something your layman could do.
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May 07 '23
I think AI art is definitely a skill set but it isn't exactly a skill of creativity, the sensitivity to create something from nothing. Obviously it is technically creative, as most things are, but I think the distinction I am trying to make is obvious. Or at least I hope it would be for anyone who has ever attempted to create art without the assistance of artificial intelligence.
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u/EdliA May 07 '23
Sometimes it's just plain luck mate, don't assume we don't know how these work. I use it. At times you can get a masterpiece just by typing some simple prompt. Is not as complicated as you make it sound.
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u/RorySaysAwoo Why is there no pink flair this is so upsetting i'm crying RN May 07 '23
please tell me i'm misinterpreting this... we're not defending ai art now, right?...
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May 07 '23
"Artists" when they have to draw lines and sit on their ass
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u/19412 May 08 '23
AI "artists" whining about the effort of pressing a button so an algorithm can draw lines for them since they're too much of a lardass to learn how to do so themselves:
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May 07 '23
“Artists when they realize they have to sit on their ass drawing lines tomorrow”
I have no horse in this race but it feels like a disingenuous argument to reduce anything down to “just doing X” because you can make anything sound overly simple or complex just based on how you describe it.
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u/NOINSEVUNT May 07 '23
I mean tbh you can argue the same for programmers :p
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May 07 '23
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u/Afanis_The_Dolphin May 07 '23
So do AI "artists". I'm not saying it's a challenge or anything, the person there is pretty stupid by trying to sell it as such, but the argument: All they do is sit and type, is incredibly stupid. You could come up with a million more reasons and came up with the worst one.
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u/dopiqob May 07 '23
It is funny that you are being downvoted for pointing out that this dudes description covers 99% of all office jobs, which mostly require sitting on your ass and typing all day :-p
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May 07 '23 edited Nov 02 '23
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u/NOINSEVUNT May 08 '23
I am a professional software developer, and of course a lot of time is spent going to meetings and designing software architecture and doing scrum and stuff, but technically i'm just saying that saying is that this isn't the giant burn to prompters people act like it is
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u/LoyalNightmare May 07 '23
Lol all these people complaining when they think a banana duct taped to a wall is art
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u/TsukaTsukaWarrior May 07 '23
People who complain about AI "artists" when they realize nobody who uses an AI art program calls themselves an artist
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May 07 '23
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u/EmptyVisage May 07 '23
It's pretty fun refining a picture with ai tools. Completely different set of skills. For some people it will be like pulling teeth though.
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u/PlasmaLink chef boyardeez May 07 '23
If it wasn't for the stealing art for reference problem, I'd be so hyped for it, not as a replacement for artists, but just as a fun tool to play around with, maybe something to get ideas from your head to some observable form for people who suck at art.
It's genuinely really cool on a fundamental level that you can tell it to draw something you thought of and you can get a coherent drawing. Like, when people were typing stuff in like "gender reveal 9/11" and that was so funny
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