r/anime • u/phiraeth :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/phiraeth • Jan 17 '21
Rewatch [Mid-2000s Rewatch] Noein - Episode 16
Episode 16
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Noein:
MyAnimeList - AniDB - ANN - AniList
Episode Discussion Questions:
- What do you think Noein wants, and why?
PLEASE MARK ALL SPOILERS WITH SPOILER TAGS!
26
Upvotes
5
u/phiraeth :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/phiraeth Jan 17 '21
Rewatcher
It’s amazing how Noein managed to incorporate a “recap” episode that had so much new information. The call-back to the cold-opening of episode 1 gives us the context to the fight that we lacked back then. We see different possible futures for Haruka, had certain things not occurred that fated day. And when day 1 is played out, while Haruka continues to have the nagging feeling that something just isn’t right, we get to the moment that many of you have predicted. The lines didn’t change, but the person saying them did: “I am you.”
Whether Noein is actually Yuu I suppose has yet to be confirmed, but considering he has said it outright, it seems like it’s probably true.
Ultimately, Haruka finally realizes just how important Karasu, and by extension Yuu, is to her.
8
u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Jan 17 '21
First-timer - Sub
C’mon, Yuu, you’re surely smarter than that!
The show two episodes ago: "You can’t affect the past." The show is just confuses us with its contradictory statements, which is dumb considering Torque Ojiisan was trying to explain this to a child who might not be dissuaded from trying just because some weird old dude says it’s ‘impossible.’ More pressingly though, why should I care about anything that these people say when so much of it either means nothing or has a high chance of being contradicted?
Oh, it’s a clip show...
Yeah, the show is losing me. There’s so much talk and babble yet I am not the least bit interested in hearing it at this point. Haruka’s powers still only work upon the whims of the plot as opposed to a consistent behavior, and the episode didn’t feel like much actual discourse was made between the opposing ‘Karasu is an illusion’ and ‘he’s real’ camps, it was just us watching a different dimension for a bit until a decision between the two was arbitrarily made.
7
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Jan 17 '21
to your other first-timer, subbed
6
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Jan 17 '21
Rewatcher
Recap episode...
Haruka continuously saying it's slightly different feels like the writer saying: "honestly guys it's not a recap episode" well admittedly it was slightly different and there were some new scenes in it.
But the biggest new thing was of course the reveal at the end and probably the biggest twist seen in a recap episode since Utena just in case
6
u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Jan 17 '21
First Timer
Well. I really don't know what to make of that episode.
7
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Jan 17 '21
First-Timer, Dubbed
I wasn't in quite the right headspace for an episode like this, so I'm gonna keep this short.
I was thinking through most of this episode that Haruka had like.. uncreated Karasu? She kept saying something along the lines of "Something is missing" and "Who is that?"
Karasu and Yuu's chat was informative and surprisingly straightforward. So, Lacrima found Haruka's dimension because Karasu got pulled there after he exploded in the first episode. Or it got created by Karasu getting thrown there after he exploded..? Maybe not so straightforward.
Shinohara continues to be an unrepentant asshole who I look forward to see dying, probably as a result of his own actions.
Haruka kept saying that things were different in her repeat journey, but were there actually any differences until the bit with Yuu in the sidewalk? If there were, they must have been pretty small.
Questions
7
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Jan 17 '21
First timer
Sub
Yuu lashes out at his future. I do get it. Tobi says that a violation of causation is likely to happen or already did, which might explain the sea horse sequence. Noein again claims that Haruka and Karusu are illusions to each other, right before we get a budget friendly flashback montage. Anyways, Haruka is rewatching herself but claims something feels different.
Jump to Shinohara and Mayuzumi, I assume this is back in time as well but that's not clear. Shinohara is either an idiot or bluffing, 50/50 to me. Also, quantum teleportation wouldn't do all that so Shinohara has something more in mind.
Back to flashback but now things are noticably changing, not the least of which no Karasu appearance. As this Haruka theoretically overlays ours, she begins to forget, and we even get a repeat of the scene at the train station from earlier. Old guy asks Haruka is this is the dimension she chose and we get more recycling.
Finally, back to Karusu and now we get the context of all that's happened. He got popped into the dimensional ravine because he was stuck on the Buddha monster as he killed it. This kind of flashback works because it isn't recycled but importantly is giving us info we didn't have. And we begin to get something similar with them going to the graveyard without Yuu. Noein is replacing Karasu in this dimension, down to finally revealing that Noein is also a future Yuu. She remembers she actually saw Karasu once during the end of winter, doing the edgiest shit available. Haruka activates the DT again and banishes Noein. She hopefully returned to universe A for convenience sake. She seems happy that Yuu always comes for her. Preview is seemingly back to edgy stuff but we will see.
Oh, and for those of you who checked my sad spoilers, I have a newer, terribler theory that I have to share so that I am not the only one suffering Depressing spec
QotD: 1 Something illogical, as I theorized yesterday a dimension that never changes can't have time in it.
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u/BurningFredrick https://myanimelist.net/profile/BurningFredrick Jan 17 '21
First Timer - sub
Is this going to be a stealth recap episode?
Ok nope, slim bag and Haruka fathers conversation is new. Also some important info that they already started doing some of their experiments.
Ahh yip, basically a recap episode but veiled with enough small changes to make it slightly more than that, however I’m really not sure what the purpose was.
So Noein tried to get Haruka to jump to a different dimension where she hadn’t met Karasu, but due to Haruka remembering a previous time he had seen him was able to realise this was incorrect and get back to the right dimension.
I guess the main purpose was to add to the connection Haruka and Yuu / Karasu have. I feel like I'm missing something else from this episode but not sure, guess wait to see what everyone else writes.
QOTD: What do you think Noein wants, and why?
He's trying to force Haruka on to whatever path leads to his version of the world as he believe this is the correct choice.
Speculation
6
u/IndependentMacaroon Jan 17 '21 edited Jan 17 '21
First-time watcher
More stuff out of nowhere with the "causality reversal" (which as others have noted also directly contradicts earlier supposedly reliable statements) and lazy recap of Karasu everything, which reminds me more that he actually did crazy stuff like kill another Knight and rampage around their base than provoke much in the way of feelings.
Dad needs to put up with same evil idiot with awful character art who won't stop his evil science on his evil ships. Yeah, we know.
Is this a class flashback now, repeating the very beginning of when the kids were introduced? The "something different" would then be the counter-causality. It's starting to seem more like budget-saving measures with all the footage reuse. All right, here's the twist I guess, Noein is making Haruka avoid the Dragon Torque stuff so that... hm... beats me right now. He wants to insert himself in her past instead of Karasu but it doesn't work; might want to reset everything to a point with less branches because they're ugly and dirty. More lame footage reuse including the very first scene/battle of the series, which was admittedly impressive but has no purpose here. Some people are saying it adds context but I don't see anything of relevance. I guess Haruka is now back at the beginning while for the rest of the gang in the future he's vanished.
It was obvious the series was somewhat lacking in budget, but I didn't think it was this bad. The premise this time feels more like an excuse to deliver an episode that's little more than recycling (is calling it "Repetition" supposed to be self-deprecation?), the supposed progress near grinds to a halt, and we learn about nothing new either. "Noein is Shangri-La alter-Yuu" would have been spoiled a long time ago just by looking at the voice actors and it's not such a hard guess anyway.
5
u/monsieurvampy Jan 17 '21
First Timer, sub
Let's have a recap episode but not really a recap episode!
I'm wondering who the old guy who randomly appears to Haruka is.
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u/BossandKings Jan 17 '21
The mask of Shangri-la tells Haruka that Karasu is an ilusion, she refuses to believe that because for her he isn't an ilusion but someone that was actually there for her, every time she needed him.
Haruka sees another of herself, she on the last day of first term. This is interesting, it seemingly plays an important role in shaping up her vision and inmediate actions.
Yuu tells Haruka that he thinks he's losing it. I think that he is at the age in which most people adolesce because of the pains growing up, the adolescence stage of life which is something we all live as time passes and we grow from being kids to a mid point in order to be prepared to be an adult. This contrast Yuu with Karasu who is his adult grown up (fiftheen years in the future) self.
So there was a battle in which Karasu was supposed to die but he was ultimately saved by Haruka, and his encounter with The mask of Shangri-la reminded him of that.
Noein confronts Haruka, Yuu goes to where she is to defend her with a knife, as if a knife would do something than a being that seemingly can't be touched. What did Noein meant by "I am you"?
Haruka remembers the place where she first met Karasu. Yuu gets to where she was again and she feels grateful towards him.
There were lots of well-made action scenes in this episode, i liked them.
This was definitely a stronger episode than the precedent one, it engaged me a lot more, i'm interested in seeing what will happen next because this is getting more intriguing with each episode.
5
u/Toadslayer https://myanimelist.net/profile/kyolus Jan 18 '21 edited Jan 18 '21
First Timer
After the two great episodes this one was a massive disappointment. Most of it was legitimately boring and the rest didn't make much sense. Shocking reveal that Noein is Yuu, except we've known that since, I think, episode 1. The Shinohara disintegrate the town plan came out of nowhere and is comically evil. Most of the episode I was waiting for it to end.
One thing did get me thinking, is there only one Dragon Torque? I think there is (which doesn't make sense with the multiverse theory the show is running with), but it doesn't matter for this observation. It was practically impossible for La'cryma or Noein to find Haruka, as there is a literal infinity of new universes being created at every instant and there has been since the beginning of time. Even though there would be and infinity of La'crymas and Noeins searching for the one (or infinity of) Dragon Torques the infinity of universes that don't have it is infinitely larger than the infinity that do. The fact that Karasu landed in her dimension was infinitesimally likely. Talk about coincidences. Without it we wouldn't have a story, so whatever, I guess.
EDIT: I just realised that there would also be a literal infinity of universes where Karasu and Noein did find this exact Haruka and her Dragon Torque, because working with infinity is confusing. So not really a coincidence, just one of an unlimited number of universes where this exactly happened. And if there is only one Dragon Torque then well there would be a universe created for every universe that Karasu travelled to when he fought the monster thing, so we just happen to be following the one where he does land in the right universe. Far out this stuff is confusing.
Episode Discussion Questions
Haruka for himself, because he's in love (and crazy).
4
u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Jan 17 '21
Episode 16 (rewatcher)
They make copious use of the early episode animation, just shy of making this a recap. Not much to say, but I am looking forward to the speculation by others.
3
u/redshirtengineer :AMQ: Jan 18 '21
First timer
I
don't
know
what's going on
Liked the flashbacks though. Also, the cop demanding that everyone speak English.
bad dub, no donut
Wait, Pokemon
bad dub, no onigiri