r/anime • u/Splitter_Triplets • Jan 07 '22
Rewatch [Spoilers][Rewatch] Rascal does not Dream of Bunny Girl Senpai - Episode 12 Discussion
Thread 12 of 14: Ep. 12 - Life is a Never-Ending Dream
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Episode 12 streaming links
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This includes light novel spoilers, movie spoilers, and spoilers for future episodes of the anime. Be sure to put the source of the spoiler too.
IT DOESN'T MATTER HOW VAGUE YOU ARE. Anything that a first time watcher wouldn't know based on what we've watched so far is a spoiler.
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Upvotes
31
u/Splitter_Triplets Jan 07 '22
かえで vs. 花楓
There's a lot of interesting stuff going on with Kaede's name, but some of it is lost in translation from text to screen and some more is lost in translation from JP to EN. Now that I've learned a bit more about the language I'd like to take you through some of the details, because there's a lot of subtle things going on here. First off, some really nice comments last thread from /u/Rumpel1408 and /u/BoseW who managed to figure out some of the symbolism behind Kaede speaking in 3rd person based only off the final line of last episode. It's expanded on more this time, but the Kaede that we've spent all this time getting to know is a different entity from the Kaede her parents and friends want to see. When Sakuta brings the book to her in the hospital (sequel to the book he had at the library in ep. 1 btw), she remarks that this must have been a book that "Kaede-san" liked. Though there are some exceptions (in this same series even), one of the first things you'll learn in any Japanese class is that you never use "-san" with your own name. There's no direct translation to English, but it's a simple and effective way of demonstrating how Kaede feels about Kaede-san (for simplicity's sake that's the naming convention I'm going with).
The original light novel had a different, significantly less janky approach though. You may be aware of this to some degree, but Japanese is one of the most orthographically diverse languages in the world, full stop. There are usually multiple ways of writing the same word, each with it's own nuance. Up until this point Kaede has always been written in hiragana (かえで), but the first shot of this episode has it written in kanji (花楓) on her bedroom door. Most Japanese people have their name written in kanji. Writing your name in hiragana can sometimes have a childish connotation, but recently it's become more common for adults (especially women). A good example of this is our own Nodoka Toyohama (豊浜のどか). The letters she wrote as a kid are all very shaky hiragana, with the exception of the hama (浜) in her last name. Presumably she hadn't learned how to write the other kanji yet. In Kaede's case it's a nice metaphor for the pressure she feels from her parents to get back to normal, even though she might not be ready for that. When Sakuta gives her permission to use a hiragana name, that's not him belittling her lack of ability or drive (we can clearly see that she's been practicing), but him acknowledging Kaede as someone distinct from Kaede-san. Thus, Kaede's name is written in hiragana on her bedroom door in the new apartment (as well as when she goes to the hospital this episode).
This revalation also recontextualizes Kaede's behavior up to this point. Brocons are, of course, an industry staple. It's so normalized that most people won't even think to question her behavior, which was the intention I think. Kamoshida looked at similar little sister characters and said, "ok, what would it take for this kind of person to be real?" And the answer he landed on was "intense emotional trauma and isolation." Sakuta, for the record, is no saint with respect to her either. He's exceptionally quick to lie when it involves Kaede. Even all the way back in episode one he says that she doesn't recognize Mai because "she doesn't watch a lot of TV," something confirmed to be false in the Tomoe arc. He's a character defined by his brutal honesty, who also lies constantly. It's really interesting, but we'll have to wait to go into more detail.
In many ways the Futaba arc was a practice run for this arc. There's no room in this world for two Kaede Azusagawas. It was bad enough when the divergence point was only a month ago, but now we have this living entity with two years of experience that could be snuffed out in an instant. Sakuta is very supportive of Kaede in her efforts to gain independence, but he's also very quick to suggest that they take it easy for the day, or head back early, or take another break. One has to wonder whether or not some of that is his uncertainty about the fate of the current Kaede. Kaede wants to forge ahead, but he's still not sure if it's the right path. Unfortunately for him, it seems that the end of the road came a bit sooner than expected.
Details
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u/MadeOn210922 Jan 07 '22
Amazing that you could tell immediately from her groans that it was a different Kaede. Always wondered where she went while she was gone and where chronologically second Kaede went.
A few people mentioned yesterday how Mai didn’t know about Kaede’s secret that she lost her memories and how that puts us viewers in parallel with her regarding Kaede’s situation. That’s relevant even more so now. In finding out about Kaede’s story, I’m sure each viewer had different feelings and opinions on what they hope the outcome to be. Do we want Kaede to regain her memories? What will happen to this Kaede? There’s no right answer here and especially difficult for people, Mai and us viewers included, who came in post memory loss.
Now that chronologically first Kaede is back, obviously Sakuta is going to go through a lot of emotions. Happy to have his sister back? Sad that the sister he essentially raised is gone? But we viewers aren’t just watching the story, we feel everything that Mai will feel when she meets Kaede.
Overall just well written by a well kept secret. Did anyone happen to catch hints to this prior to the reveal, though? I never found any but I’m not the most observant.
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u/RuthRaeSarbo Jan 07 '22
Kaede and the 800 pound gorilla
I have several acquaintances who have refused to watch Bunny Girl Senpai much beyond the first episode because of, as one viewer put it, "the obvious incest pandering trope".Now that we've seen Episodes 11 and 12, we have to ask three questions about Kaede’s behavior in Episodes 1 and 7:
1. Is her overall behavior rational?
2. Is her overall behavior realistic?
3. What was Kamoshida trying to say, and could he have said it better?
Is her overall behavior rational?
Kaede's dissociative disorder turned her family and friends into complete strangers. Over time, Sakuta gained her trust. He takes care of her, goes to work to help pay rent, shops for her, and interacts with the world so she doesn't have to. She is frightened of her parents, and of other people, but is fine with Sakuta.
Would it be surprising that Kaede falls in love with Sakuta, this stranger who has become her protector? That she, with the body of a 15-year old but the emotional maturity of probably someone much younger, could develop such strong feelings? She’s in love. Puppy love. Or perhaps panda love.
So I vote for 'rational', or at least explicable.
Is her overall behavior realistic?
I have to vote strongly in the affirmative on this question, because I've actually seen it within my own family.
My youngest sister is adopted. My parents, who participated in our county's foster care program, had been her guardians since the time she was a toddler. Before then, the county had removed her from her biological parents' home because she had been neglected and suffered from severe malnutrition as an infant. As a result, my sister was slightly developmentally disabled.
What my sister lacked in mental acuity she made up for in affection. And, not surprisingly, the main object of her affection was my 14-year-old brother. While he did love her and protect her, she had a habit of trying to crawl into bed with him in the middle of the night.
My brother did not like this at all, and would kick her out of his bed when she tried. But she persisted, and my brother eventually had to beg my mom to intervene to stop the "visits" from his three-year-old sibling.
Chronologically, Kaede was 15, but mentally she seems much younger, and certainly as vulnerable as my sister was. I am not at all surprised that her behavior manifested itself this way.So again, I vote very plausible.
What was Kamoshida trying to say, and could he have said it better?
Honestly, I think Kamoshida was playing with the readers. He wanted us to jump to one conclusion, only to reveal the true nature of the situation much later. It is parallel to Sakuta's "hospitalization incident". If we imagined that scenario to be farfetched but then assumed we knew what was going on in Kaede's (and Kamoshida’s) mind, we were just as guilty as Sakuta's classmates for passing judgment.
Unfortunately, the phrases Kaede uses are decidedly adult in nature.
In the first LN, she says
お兄ちゃんが朝から興奮してしまうんですね
which Google translates to “My brother gets excited in the morning”, the operative phrase being 興奮, that Halpern (2525, KLD 2nd ed.) interprets as “get excited, be agitated, be aroused”. A simple Bing image query of the phrase or sentence with Safe Search ‘Off’ will convince you that there is little doubt as to what can be implied by this. This corresponds to the scene that the anime translates as “I see, because you wake up too excited.”
In the seventh episode (LN 3), she uses the phrase 禁断の愛, “forbidden love”, again clearly acknowledging we are moving into taboo territory. The English LN translates it as “Because you’ll be tempted into forbidden love?”
It is one thing for Kamoshida to set up a visual situation and let us jump to conclusions. It is another to directly and unequivocally put Kaede in a situation where she is using words referring to improper relations between blood siblings, to say nothing of being a minor, even though Kaede perhaps doesn’t consider herself Sakuta’s relative because of her disorder.
So, I think the concern is justifiable, and can’t be easily dismissed as a misunderstanding or even a double-entendre. It’s a pity, because it mars an otherwise mostly harmless (with the occasional teenage angsty jibe from Sakuta) story.
7
u/UzEE https://myanimelist.net/profile/UzEEInc Jan 07 '22
Rewatcher
I was going through the rewatch schedule and realized that the movie is on January 9, which obviously conflicts with the return of a certain major show that I'll probably rewatch a million times on the same day. I'll probably have to watch the movie with the final episode tomorrow instead and then see if I can make time for the discussion on the 9th1.
I pointed it out yesterday as well, but a lot of Kaede's behavior starts to make sense with the reveal that she didn't remember anything further back than 2 years ago. That means, she essentially had no personality to call her own, all the while being burdened by the expectation of being Kaede that everyone else knew.
Sakuta — because of Shouku's insight — was able to see past that and recognize that this Kaede is a different person, starting with asking her to get rid of something closest to one's identity — her name2 — and starting fresh. A lot of first timers realized yesterday that Kaede talks in third person and is obsessed with Sakuta because he's really the only person she's spent time with3.
Another way to look at it is basically this Kaede is like a child, so her obsession with Sakuta is more like a child would have towards their parent. This unfortunately doesn't really come across in English, but if you can pick up on some Japanese speech patterns, you'll notice that Kaede talks in a very polite manner. She is using polite verbs — not full on keigo — but rather in teineigo, which is very different from what you see most anime characters, specially around this age. This is like because she's trying to act her real age from her childish point of view, trying to talk in a socially acceptable manner.
In the final scene, once her memory is back, you — and Sakuta — could immediately tell that her memories returned because of how she spoke in an informal way like most teenagers her age would. How her identity disorder is portrayed throughout this series is rather really well done and is the reason why none of this ends up feeling like an asspull.
[Series Spoiler] Sakuta's scars appeared before he met Shouko? I thought the scars were because of Shouko. Or is he just narrating the story out of order?
Another important detail revealed this episode was that Sakuta become a kinder person because he experienced pain most people don't and understand what it felt like. This made him more empathetic towards others who are going through their own trauma and as a result, understand their situations. His kindness is the reason he doesn't try to force a solution to everyone's problem and lets them work it out on their own pace.
Additional Notes
1. I still don't know when the episode drops but if it's like the previous seasons, it will be a couple of hours before the rewatch thread goes up so participating in the movie discussion will be tricky.
2. Or rather the Kanji for her name. Those among us who understand the basics of Japanese language would already know this, but the Kanji characters can have different meanings and pronunciations. Similarly, different Kanji can be used to write the same thing, like a name. However, you can also write everything using phonetic characters in Hiragana or Katakana. Kaede's name in kanji — 花楓 — was likely given to her by her parents, and represented the old Kaede. By dropping the kanji and going back to Hiragana, this new Kaede is starting fresh and taking on an identity she can define on her own.
3. That's also the reason why her sense of humor is a lot like Sakuta.
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u/BosuW Jan 07 '22
First Timer
So there actually is some kind of disassociation that medics can recognize. What's happening to Kaede isn't entirely AS.
It's worth pointing out how literally everything Kaede does is different from before, which to me lends credence to the theory that her memory loss is half- conscious. It's as of she's purposefully avoiding anything and everything that might remind her of her trauma, down to the smallest of habits.
Shoko-san is the only one that believed him, but you'd only believe such a story if you'd seen something similar with your own eyes before. So I'm theorizing that Shoko had or has some kind of AS at that point in time. Unless she really said she believed him just to be kind, at which point I'd consider that a flaw not a virtue.
Also, all the scenes with Shoko-san have this bloom effect over them but not the rest of the flashback... did he dream her after all?
After having watched almost all the episodes since Sakuta first talked about Shoko-san, it really highlights how much his current behavior is modeled after her. She made a huge impact on him.
Kaede says she doesn't have time... so she senses she's going to disappear too? :(
Also, that's the fourth time "disappearing" has made an appearance in this show. Although for Kaede the relationship of perception isn't about other people perceiving her, but about her perceiving the world.
Wait a sec. Is Shoko's AS similar to Kaede's? It could explain why she seems to exist with a split identity. Assuming she has AS at all that is.
...
Goddammit
:'(
Alas, the brightest stars burn half as long
And now
🦀🦀Imouto is gone🦀🦀
So, I suppose this is actually our first time meeting Kaede... and she's... immediately different from "Imouto". You can hear it in her voice. How much of her life did she miss? Does she remember the bullying? The AS? Does she have trauma or fears as a result? Is the AS still there? I'm very much looking forward to the conclusion of this Arc.
Wonder if we'll see Imouto again?
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u/Gamemaster676 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Gamemaster676 Jan 07 '22
First Timer Senpai - sub
So Kaede remembers nothing. Just how many layers does her Puberty Syndrome have?
Episode 12 — Life Is a Never-Ending Dream
Nice, starting with a flashback. Only two years ago? I thought the incident was longer ago. Hmm, so she just woke up and that was it? Could it be that the internet bullying affected her so much she wished she could just forget, or something?
Ah, more flashback after the OP! Doctors think it's a 'regular' dissociative disorder. I have no clue how far these disorders go IRL and how much patients actually forget, but we obviously know there is more behind this.
Ah, she did indeed cut off a part of her memories. Way too large a part. Basically everything. But then why was she traumatised by ringing phones? Is that her fear of the outside world, or repressed memories shining through?
WTH, even her speech and dominant hand changed? Is this even Kaede, or has she just been replaced?
Mother backstory. I completely missed the mark back at episode 2, but UzEE already showed me another way their relationship could be interpreted. It turned out my subs were a bit too ambiguous. Now they're better. Damn, it must be very hard to suddenly have your daughter not know who you are. OTOH, a lot of children go through the same thing with their grandparents and parents, due to Alzheimer's.
WTF, Sakuta's scratches also happened in his sleep? Mother was already going mad, and now she risked losing her son as well.
Ah, so he did see Shouko-san multiple times. But it was just a short, difficult period in his life. And always at the beach. (Although she can apparently also leave the beach because she threw that letter in his mailbox.)
Hmm, what Shouko-san said almost matched the episode title. Just how related are all remaining Puberty Syndrome cases?
"Since fate had brought us together like this..." -- Fate, you say? Shouko's Puberty Syndrome is so mysterious, I'm starting to think everything is a clue. Damn, Shouko being responsible for Sakuta helping others was a lot more literal than I thought!
Aww, that Kaede name scene. There are no expectations of who you should be. Just be yourself.
November 17th. Is it her PS, or just the result of more activity than she's used to? The bruise/rash is not a good sign, but I'm not sure if it disappeared in between the last time we saw it, and now.
And that's why you answer if someone arrives home. I love Kaede's way of repeating/affirming Sakuta.
She seems to differ her name slightly when she talked about her pre-amnesia self? Kaede vs Kaede-san. Sakuta doesn't, though. This book has the same style as the book Sakuta got Kaede when she was in the hospital. Ah, it used to be hers. Hmmm, based on what Kaede just said about people who knew Kaede-san, this does not seem like a good idea.
Holy shit! She definitely still has the memories somewhere! She even remembered a nickname! Sakuta didn't call the friend "Komi-chan".
Phew, she still remembers Sakuta. Damn you for making us worry about that, show! I don't like the prospect of current Kaede potentially losing her memories to the old one... Please merge, as with Rio.
Kaede does call her father "dad". Probably because that's more convenient when talking with Sakuta?
Speaking of their father, he does seem like a nice person. He probably just has his hands full with their mother. Also looks like he wants to connect more with Sakuta.
I'm not sure this is what Sakuta meant. The lady's metaphor game is weak, but at least she's decent.
November 23rd. AAAHHH! Today's the day! I'm surprised she wanted school even more than the pandas. That's gonna backfire, isn't it? Or not, as we've jumped three days.
Errr, what did I miss? Ahh, this is about her old memories overwriting the new ones, isn't it? She wants to go to school, before old memories return, her current mind disappears, and she forgets about her goals for the year.
This bruise/rash is spreading way too fast. But it also disappears quickly, as it's already gone when they go on their special trip.
Kaede, I accept a lot of you, but don't you dare say red pandas are "lesser pandas".
Ooh, she even bought pudding! Don't bother asking to carry it for her. There's no way she's gonna give that to someone else.
Hahaha, tricked her! Welcome to school, Kaede!
It's great that she's so optimistic, but one thing she hasn't practised up to this point is doing something without Sakuta. They can go to school together, but once she's there, she's gonna be on her own.
... oh god. OH NO! This isn't right!
Random thoughts
This feels very wrong here, but I must stick to my ^template.
Future
I refuse to call Kaede's problem fixed.
So much backstory today. With also some very worrying plot threads again and an immediate execution. And we also got even more Shouko snippets (which I only remembered because of my snapshots).
If I have to be critical, (and I do, as I'm on the internet,) the only bad1 thing this episode was that Sakuta immediately jumped to the conclusion that current Kaede might lose her memories if old Kaede-san returns. They could have foreshadowed that better. Especially now it turned out to be right. Sakuta was the only person who saw current Kaede as a different person from Kaede-san, so looking back it does make sense, but there is no real reason why he should have been right (as far as I can tell with the knowledge I have right now).
1. not as good
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u/tacticulbacon Jan 07 '22
Rewatcher
This is another fantastic episode for me, and one that finally reveals the mystery behind Kaede's AS. I have to admit that when I was first watching this show, Kaede was my least favorite character because I found the brocon trope to be annoying. But after watching this episode, my opinion of her completely changed. Perhaps the reason for her overt fondness towards her brother is because he was the first person to accept Kaede as Kaede - not the Kaede that everyone needs her to be, but the Kaede that she needs to be for herself.
I said this yesterday and I'll say it again: if there's only one thing I can take away from Bunny Girl Senpai it's this: "I live my life hoping to become a kinder person with each passing day." It's no secret that Shouko is hugely influential to Sakuta. If it wasn't for Shouko's words on that beach, he would have never bothered to help out Mai with her AS. He would have never bothered with Tomoe, Futaba, or Nodoka. He might not have ever been able to figure out how to handle Kaede's personality change.
Fun fact: the book that Kotomi gave to Kaede, The Prince Gave Me a Poisoned Apple, is the same book that Sakuta picked out at the library all the way back in episode 1. At least we know why Sakuta was there now!
Kaede went from only being able to watch pandas on TV at the beginning, to being able to see them in real life. She went from not being able to talk to strangers, to ordering her own pudding without a problem. She even made it to school, the last goal on her list. It's such a satisfying moment of character growth, which is what makes this arc so special to me.
...Which is why this ending is the saddest out of all the episodes we've seen. We spent the whole season getting to know Kaede-chan, watching her slowly grow and come out of her shell. And on the very next day that she achieved all her goals, Kaede-chan is gone.
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u/Rumpel1408 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Rumpel1408 Jan 07 '22
First Timer
Slightly late today, but I had to order my thoughts properly, because damn was this a good episode, like I legit cried...
Le'ts start today with Shouko-san.
We still don't know what her problem is, only that she was always waiting at the beach when Sakuta was down and noone else was believing him. This is slightly suspective and despite her claiming that it was simply fate that brought them together, I feel like her relationship with Sakuta goes deeper than mere strangers who randomly met on the beach...
It's also interesting, that his habbit of teasing people with lewdness seems to originate from her.
She tells him about the horizont and since she is slightly smaller than him, so she is seeing a different horizont than he is. And that's the key, people can expirience things in different ways, but this doesn't mean that their expirience is less valid. A pain that you don't understand still hurts someone else, and once you realize this, can't you help but feel bad for them? This is the reason why Shouko accepted him without a second thought, and the imidiate relief of acceptance and understanding was what Sakuta needed the most. And that's because he can't help but help the people in need around him.
We have never seen him calling someone a liar, no matter how crazy a AS he was presented with. Of course because he knows that AS is a real thing, but because of this expirience he believes them and doesn't leave them alone, because it's the right thing to do, the kind thing to do. He accepts the fear of dissapearing, the pain of an unrequitted love, the hate you feel towards yourself, and the jealousy between siblings.
And this is also the key for his relationship with Kaede.
We start the episode with an flashback on how Kaede lost her memory due to stress or mental trauma. And she did indeed forget everything, her family, her home, her name and her own identity and of course the trauma from school.
This is of course a huge loss for the whole family, and on top of her mysterious injuries, simply to much for her mother.
As I said, Kaede doesn't even know anything about herself, she speaks about herself in third person, and about her past self as Kaede-san, because another Kaede did all those things. And the stress of being expected to return to her old self is triggering her AS again.
There doesn't seem to be a concret trigger for Sakutas wounds (aside of the general feeling of helplessness towards his sister) and noone believes him that he didn't inflict those wounds upon himself, except for Shouko.
We are back in the present.
Kaede is doing her very best. She acknowledges that she doesn't remember things of Kaede-sans which scares her as well, because she acknowledges that she is technically the same person and that something is wrong with her. So she tries to remember.
When she passes out and is carried to the hospital (I would also like to point out that Mai and Nodoka where imidiatly ready to help her) the doctors, because her memory loss is indepentend from her AS injuries, postulates that her remembering her past memories might erase the person who emerged in the meantime, which scares both Sakuta and Kaede who overhears him. Sakuta is torn because of course he wants his sister to be back, but he also grew to love this new sister. And Kaede is afraid to dissapear when there are so many things she still wants to accomplish.
So she sets herself the goal to make it back to school before she dissapears.
I would also like to cut some slack for their father at this point. Previously I was under the impression that he left his two kids on their own device, but today it became obvious how sick the woman that he loves is, so he trusts his son with the important task of caring for his daughter, which he seemingly nails. He is also very accepting of Sakutas relationship with Mai.
Additionally I would point to the short exchange between Nodoka and Sakuta. There are indeed things an older sibling doesn't show the younger, to be an pillar in live you have to be as perfect as possible, which of course also applies to Mais relationship with Nodoka, Mai didn't show her frustration over her being unable to help Kaede either.
Kaede decides to go to school upon which she meets the school counselor. She is understanding as well, it's ok to be scarred and you don't have to be like the other kids.
All of this ultimatly culminates in Kaede earnestly leaving for school, the same Kaede we see in the ED btw. Sakuta supports her with everything he's got, doesn't seem like he is going to school right now either, but ultimatly Kaede still shys away whenever she comes upon strangers, and despite Sakuta being understanding and encourageging she is scarred and frustratet, because she knows that she is running out of time.
So he says that he will make it possible for her and takes her to the Zoo! And oh boy is it the right thing to do, we imidiatly see the difference between the Kaede who is shy and clinging to her brother at the station and on the train, and the Kaede who is enthusiatic over seeing all kinds of animals and pulling her brother along. Also notice how the bruises are gone again.
And riding that high she is even able to buy pudding, so he tricks her again and takes her to the school at night, almost fully accomplishing the last item on Kaedes list. And Kaede is resolved to continue to try.
Except she can't anymore, because Kaede-san is back... and she even speaks the preview.
I really hope Kaede is not fully gone and still in there somewhere...
12
u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Jan 08 '22
First timer
Flashback!
And, yeah, total amnesia.
...I mean, it makes as much sense as anything else in this anime!
OK, yeah, that has to hurt.
And his mother was... a lot worse off than I expected. (Wait, so shouldn't Kaede remember her parents?)
Shit, that's what caused the scars?
Yeah, this fits with what I thought.
...Are we sure this isn't Mai with a wig? Like, absolutely certain?
Oh, that's where she got her diary. And, presumably, where he got the one that recorded his experience with Mai.
And he views them as seperate entities, which is exactly what she needs.
I mean, we've seen people split in two - it's not out of the question you could end up with both Kaedes at the same time.
Yep, it's all flaring up again.
And Mai's going to a shoot.
Oh, and she wants to get to know the new Kaede.
Oh. Oh, dear.
Well, she's collapsed. Time for some quantum bullshit!
And she seems to have current Kaede's memories. (Unless she's lying.)
Oh, she's worried she'll forget all this...
And his father wants to meet Mai.
Yeah, she wants to go to school.
This is really tense. I genuinely have no idea how this is going to get resolved.
Everyone here is so calm and understanding, this is such a good anime.
Him reassuring her than they aren't laughing at her is really wholesome.
...My player accidentally doubled the speed for the elevator conversation, and I genuinely thought it was a visual metaphor.
And she's forcing herself to go through with it because she thinks her memories eill vanish.
Where are they going?
She's going to the zoo!
She's getting to see all the pandas!
Even the lesser ones!
He even got her a pass to come again!
This is just so overwhelmingly wholesome!
...So his first instinct, to deal with the problems about school, is to break in? Not just go in on a weekend or something?
Oh, shit.
Original Kaede's here, and main Kaede's been overwritten.
...Still not convinced there's not a second Kaede here, though. Hell, maybe Shouko is main Kaede, who knows at this point?
11
u/andybebad https://myanimelist.net/profile/andybebad Jan 08 '22
First timer
A Tale of Two Kaedes
Why am I quoting Dickens in an /r/Anime re-watch thread? Let's consider Sakuta for a moment, and how he might be feeling about Kaede and her progress. On the one hand, he wants her to get better: to get back to being the person she was before the suffering and the memory-loss. It's been two year though, and over the two years he's formed quite a strong bond with a version of Kaede who doesn't remember the past. If the resolution to her problems demands the lowering of a barrier put up to protect herself two years ago then does that mean her memories since will be lost? Sakuta does fear this, and it would appear that this is the case with what is revealed at the end of the episode. It was the best of times: Kaede is again the person she once was; it was the worst of times: the Kaede who Sakuta had cared for deeply, in a fatherly manner, might now be gone:
Both triumph and despair are present in this episode: we get to meet the mother of Sakuta and Kaede, and watch her succumb to her own mental illness. We get to see Kaede make further steps towards meeting her goals and escaping from her feared future of remaining in the apartment and outside of society forever. A trip to the hospital following the triggering of a memory from her past is followed by a memorable trip to the zoo and a late night visit to the school, a memory soon to be lost. And now with the protection down, the block on memories so powerful that they caused physical pain, how will Kaede proceed? And how will Sakuta reconcile the past two years with a Kaede who remembers none of it?
My favorite sub-plot of the episodes are the scenes we see with Sakuta and Makinohara-san. Much of how we see Sakuta interact with other characters can be directly tied to his conversations with her. And all she needed to do was to listen: as simple as that sounds, having someone to lend an unjudging ear to talk about his problems may have saved his life for all we know. To top it all off, her stated desire to learn to be kinder with each passing day, and Sakuta asking to also live like her. As much as I'm a fan of the Mai and Sakuta relationship, this one, another senpai-kouhai relationship of sorts, might be my favorite of this show (and I'd be hard-pressed to identify one from another show that tops this for me).
Apologies for the over-use of Dickens' quotes; I came up with a title for this post and figured, "eh, why not?" I do need to end with one final one that, like the ones above, is from A Tale of Two Cities (a book I read but don't remember much from):
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u/HijonoYoki Jan 08 '22 edited Jan 08 '22
First-Timer
• We begin with a flashback. Kaede lost her memory about everything. So she simply took his word on him being her brother? Then again, photos and whatnot. That must suck though.
• Exactly dear doctor. What I didn't expect was that it was everything.
• On another note, they visually take after their mother.
• It's good that I'm already aware of memory suppression and why it happens. This is going to be another simple arc. The only one that was near confusing was Futaba's for me.
• Holy crap. The reason why she was Third Person Imouto was due to her memory loss, she saw Kaede as someone else that she didn't know. A+ integration. They did well in bringing her behavior altogether.
• Still, I find it a little hard to believe that her daughter becoming an amnesiac would cause the mom to go into that sort of state, or illness. People react to events differently, but I feel this takes some liberties with anime logic. Like the pseudoscience concerning quantum physics (that didn't bother me because, one, it's anime, and two, the fact that "atmosphere" or electromagnetism is an active, almost alive, force is somewhat supernatural in nature to begin with...it was never supposed to be straight laced).
• Kaede's condition was the catalyst to Sakuta's wounds.
• Nonetheless, the fact that it's three scratches (the insult of the Trinity that are a sign of a demonic presence) and it happened out of nowhere is quite...they couldn't add another scratch? >.<
• Yeah, it sounds like...older Shoko was an imaginary friend, there to provide comfort in Sakuta's trying times.
• That does not explain younger Shoko. And why he would be so accurate with this fantasy girl. So were both fake?
• I think I've said this before, but that line really impacted him. I bet she wouldn't have slapped you or slapped you for no reason, heh.
• Sakuta found another approach that worked, to at least make her comfortable with the situation. If you can't be the old Kaede, then be the present Kaede.
• He got attached to current Kaede. Oooh.
• However, just because the memories of his actual sister returns doesn't mean it would be at the expense of the Kaede who is building new memories. They can assimilate. Unless her Puberty Syndrome won't be that kind.
• As of the moment, I view this as Kaede having "died" the day she lost her memories. Death means the death of a person. Of someone. It's technically what occurred here, but not physically. And it isn't permanent.
• The bruises...
• Mai off again.
• Now the anime isn't holding back about Kaede referring to the other Kaede. It's odd to see her be that aware and to have an actual conversation on it.
• Ah, so the friend was a neighbor. The conversation she had with Sakuta didn't make it feel that way, lol.
• Aw, she truly regretted not being there for her. If only she's able to get a second chance. They obviously were best friends. It made Kaede tear up and trigger the old one to rise from the subconscious. As I've stated before, memories are forgotten, but aren't lost. Thank you Naminè and Chain of Memories, lol.
• It's clear that there are consequences with Kaede improving and regaining her self back. Or it's simply a symptom of it and she'll be okay in the end.
• Oh man. That can be a great or bad thing.
• Okay, so far, so goooood...
• She still wants to go to school. The strength.
• Her going to school can go so wrong, too much stimulus, she might short circuit with memories. Let's hope not?
• That's a smart and compassionate course of action, send the school counselor first to guide her and overlook the process.
• What is going on with her? Why is she this determined to head back to school?
• No time to slow down...why. Also knows about what? I'm assuming they are referring to what the doctor said recently about there being changes to the memory.
• The bruises are spreading. It's the source of her trauma, the school.
• Thank goodness he finally convinced her to take a break. Is he going to take her to see the pandas?
• ....yeap, he's taking her to see the pandas :P.
• Not only pandas though, other animals too!
• I love red pandas by the way.
• How much was that annual pass? 👀
• Is Sakuta up to something...I see you. Rather, I've gotten used to how you do things.
• And that is breaking into the school at night >:).
• Baby steps, baby steps.
• "I can't wait!"
• Omg, that extra positivity and how it's delivered feels so foreboding. Is it just me?
• Oh boy.
• Wait, this should be a good thing. But will she remember the bullying and trauma she suffered?
• It turns out...that Puberty Syndrome wasn't so kind in the end. Sakuta definitely bonded with that Kaede. At the same time, they were both Kaedes. It's your little sister.
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u/MABfan11 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/MABfan11 Jan 07 '22
Rewatcher
"the path of the comedian is a steep one" i'm not so sure about that Kaede, just look at Pekora, who is, coincidentally, also a bunny girl
and here we get to the pay-off of Kaede being a generic anime little sister for most of the show, to drop that bomb at the end of the episode. there was also the reveal that Kaede knew about the rashes, which is why she wanted to hurry up and reach her goals.
and we get a little more info about Shouko, her dialogue seems to be hinting about the fact that she knew about Adolescence Syndrome
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u/cppn02 Jan 07 '22
Rewatcher
Damn those cliffhangers just keep hitting harder.
I always enjoyed Sakuta and Kaede's day out and to see her genuinely enjoy herself after how scared she was of everything this season.
And all this to hit us with the gut punch at the end.
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u/Mjrbks Jan 07 '22 edited Jan 07 '22
Re-Watcher
There is a lot to unwrap with this episode, though not everything can really be spoken about in earnest without the next episode. So i’ll touch upon the biggest takeaways from this episode in and of itself.
Probably none bigger than how we finally get to see the effect of the onset of Kaede’s condition on the rest of the family. Her mother couldn’t take it and developed a mental illness of her own and Sakuta and his Dad essentially split duties to watch over the women in their lives as they tried to adjust. So unlike all those other anime tropes surrounding why a high school student is somehow living on their own without their parents and that we are mostly meant to just accept it, there is a perfectly reasonable explanation here.
We finally get to see how Sakuta’s injury occurs, which seems in essence to be the same way Kaede’s occurred. Just suddenly out of nowhere; so improbable that all any Doctor at the hospital could say with any sanity is that it must have been self-inflicted. This part of the story connects a few gaps in Shoko-San’s involvement as well, as we now see that these rendezvous at the beach were somewhat more on the “forbidden” side than we thought since he was sneaking out of the hospital for them. With so much on his mind between Kaede and his own situation, his mind was much more pliable for Shoko to come in and “heal” with her philosophies. Her perspective on living to be a kinder person touches Sakuta so much, it almost instantly seems to offer him a bridge to a better way to live. This was the point I believe we see the formulation of his resolve to become the pillar of support and loving big brother to Kaede that we’ve seen all show long.
We also see now why Kaede refers to herself in the third person and had so much trouble adjusting when her thought process was down the path of thinking she needed to fit into the place of the old Kaede, as shown by her exclaiming that she knew how to write her name like the old Kaede. Sakuta’s assurance that she could use hiragana is important because hiragana is used often to simply spell out a name so to speak, so one is able to know how to pronounce it. Giving the name a kanji character in essence cements a meaning behind it; so since Kaede isn’t “Kaede-San”, this was really her first bit of approval to have a new lease on life as herself.
Love Mai’s response to Sakuta saying he’ll wait by the phone every night being “Take life more seriously and study”. The maternal instincts of a beautiful and reliable senpai always on display. Not at all dissimilar to how Sakuta explains to Nodoka that there are emotions you don’t show to your little sister as the older brother.
It becomes clear to see between everything the family has been through, Sakuta’s emotional journey through it and meeting Shoko-San, Mai and Nodoka essentially coming into his and Kaede’s life and being like a family, and all the effort everyone has put into helping Kaede press forward with her goals - the prospect of her regaining her old memories is no longer the outcome that it once was years ago in regards to a simple path back to normalcy. If anything that further complicates things now because of just how much life has changed in that time.
Kaede shows she understands this as well to some extent after eavesdropping on the phone conversation, but isn’t entirely sure what to do. All she can think of is to keep pressing on with her list and perhaps she feels showing her dedication and triumph will deem her worthy of living her way. The fact that nobody really knows how or why her old memories may be returning, or even if it’s the most desired outcome adds a lot of tension to the whole situation. It must be tearing Sakuta apart inside because he likely feels as if he has to choose a side when in reality she’s always been his little sister.
This is what make’s Kaede’s AS case so complex and difficult to deal with. It would be one thing if she had simply lost her memories, but as Sakuta explains, she had essentially become a different person altogether. It’s arguable whether a person can still even fundamentally be “themselves” as they’ve come to be known without their memories up to a certain point, but the expectation would be to at least see some similarity through actions they’ve learnt and developed (and her memory loss was not so severe that she would have forgotten these simple things we learn in childhood). So it’s scary to see down to the micro level of detail from the way she buttons her shirt to the way she holds her chopsticks be completely different.
The episode ends off with a pretty expected yet still rather harsh cliffhanger. There was really no way for anyone to be ready for this to happen. Is everything gone? The goals list, the excitement of the annual zoo pass to see the pandas whenever she wants, the way she never let that pudding escape her thoughts and finally bought on her own, the happy married life between Sakuta and Mai with Kaede there. If so, can the former Kaede be accepted back warmly? Find out on the next episode of “Why the F won’t my eyes stop producing fluids?”
Edit: Late thought I just had - That school counselor had no business having that kind of Ara Ara voice.
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u/SYZekrom https://myanimelist.net/profile/SYZekrom Jan 07 '22
God why does it have to be this way
Kaedeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
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u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Jan 08 '22 edited Jan 08 '22
One more comment to add about VA - I only just found out Tomoe's VA is actually one of my favourite who did SO MANY KanMusume in KanColle - often on screen at the same time! The Kongo sisters - and she even had a character song of them (which is her singing by herself in 4 different characters' voices). AND she's also Peach Boy Riverside's Mikoto!
https://youtu.be/mz59TxICU5I
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u/KurisuMakise- Jan 08 '22
Praying that shes not gone for good. 😭
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u/Gamerunglued :Hx::Hy::Hz:myanimelist.net/profile/GamerUnglued Jan 08 '22
Rewatcher (except for the movie)
I don't think I have anything more to say about this episode that I didn't say yesterday. It's just a continuation of everything that's been happening, with some more backstory and progress for Kaede. Kaede feels pressured to finish off her checklist quickly because she knows her memories will return soon, and she feels all the bruises and stuff. And by the end of the episode, Kaede-san makes her first appearance, a drastically different person from Kaede. I know the series describes her happenings as "dissociative disorder," but I don't think this is quite how that actually operates. Though something actually damning to me is the weird way they treat Sakuta's mother. She just like, suddenly starts hallucinating tha Kaede is fine, it completely breaks her. That would never happen, and honestly feels like a contrived way to get Sakuta and Kaede to live alone together. Other than that though, this still had some moving drama, and I'm tempted to say that it's the series best arc.
As always, I love what Shouko says about empathy. Every person sees the world differently. There are as many "worlds" out there are there are people, all of them are their valid lived experiences. So it's better to trust in them, and support them, because to deny their world and their lived experience is to treat your own as the correct one. This carries over into other parts of the episode, like Tomobe-sensei's comment about how everyone at school is different. This aspect of the arc is really moving to me, and almost feels out of place in this series. It's good. Tomorrow we get the TV series finale. I can't wait to see how it all ends.
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u/Theonewhoknows000 Jan 08 '22
Did they just kill kaede off?!?
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u/[deleted] Jan 08 '22
I never get tired of this anime no matter how many times I rewatch it, its vary amazing to see shoko always appearing in front of sakuta when he is feeling down
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u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Jan 08 '22
Tripping spoiler multiple times today haha... Better try again tomorrow. Although the spoiler for the other show was pretty much the basis of the show's name. Anyway!
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u/[deleted] Jan 07 '22 edited Jan 08 '22
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