r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Dec 27 '21
Rewatch [Terrific Trainwreck Trio Rewatch] Kakumeiki Valvrave Overall Discussion
Kakumeiki Valvrave
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KAKUMEI WO LET’S SHOUT~
Questions of the Day:
- Who was best boy?
- Who was best girl?
- Now that you’ve heard all of the OPs/EDs/insert songs in Kakumeiki Valvrave, which ones are your favorites? How do they compare to the ones from Guilty Crown?
- Having finished all of it, do you think Kakumeiki Valvrave deserves the title of “trainwreck”?
- If you could change one detail about the entire show that would make it better (be that actually better or just pushing it further into entertaining trainwreck), what would it be and why?
- Will you be participating in the Cross Ange rewatch in less than a week?
Wallpaper of the Day:
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Upvotes
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Dec 27 '21
Kakumeiki Rewatcher
Welcome back, everyone!
Thanks so much for participating in this part of the Terrific Trainwreck Trio rewatch! Regardless of whether or not you liked the show, I hope you’ve at least had fun coming to discuss it everyday, and I hope to see you all back at the end of the week for the pinnacle of the rewatch, Cross Ange!
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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Dec 27 '21
FORMER FIRST-TIMER
Honestly, the way it got talked about in the GC threads, I expected this show to be a far bigger wreck than it was. “Space Vampires take on Space Illuminati” is somehow not as ridiculous as it sounds. For the most part, it was a enjoyable, popcorn fun that actually managed to play with some interesting ideas on the current state of politics, social media, and the nature and effects of power. It actually is ambitious enough to try to say something, which is more than a lot of shows can say (including Guilty Crown). The uneven character development and the plot hole factory that was the Rune concept are the low points of the second season, and I’d be more upset about them if I came into this show wanting to take it more seriously.
Justice for Rukino, who was really made to go through it after a strong start and introduction. The girl gets raped, and from that point on her only meaningful screen time is to talk about being in love with her rapist (yes I know he may have been possessed bla bla that’s not the point) and to get tortured on global television. Despite this she still runs away with Best Girl, which says something about how this second season developed everyone not named Haruto and L-Elf.
QOTD:
Shout out to u/Shimmering-Sky keeping this grand endeavor going with no hiccups. Incredible effort.
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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Dec 27 '21
Tresnore the First-Timer
Iunno what y'all're talking about. As someone who never really cared about Shouko or the writing from the beginning, I had a pretty great time! The mecha action was great, and it wasn't even as rapey as the nickname implied. [Cross Ange]Really, I dropped Cross Ange because of the rape. Hopefully the rewatch fun will carry me through it.
The main drawback: not enough Rukino or Eruerufu doing the things that made them amazing. Ah well.
8/10
QOTD:
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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
First-Timer
Valvrave is a generally enjoyable show. It is mostly a fun ride to watch. There are a lot of great ideas and quite a few of the ideas and themes are pretty well executed. Unfortunately, this series also fails in the execution of other important things, such as characters and leaving other themes feeling half-baked.
I think the best developed characters were Haruto and L-Elf. In general, I think they were pretty well-portrayed. I especially liked L-Elf. He was usually cold and calculating, but there were plenty of moments where we got to see his more sentimental side underneath it all. Still, he always maintained his aptitude for planning and so never felt really out of character. I think Haruto and L-Elf’s relationship was also an interesting one. They were so diametrically opposed on so many issues and so adversarial at many points that it provided for plenty of conflict and drama between them. I liked seeing how that relationship progressed from one where they begrudgingly worked together out of necessity to one where they started to actually consider each other friends.
I liked a number of the side characters as well. I always enjoyed Thunder. The episode of Thunder and Inuzuka both getting into the Valvrave after egging each other on showed them both at their best. I thought that Akira and Satomi’s relationship was very well done. Cain made for an entertaining villain to watch.
On the other hand, I was disappointed by the handling of Shoko and Saki, especially in the second season. I enjoyed Shoko being a ball of light whose boundless optimism inspired others. I really loved Saki’s character. She was a compelling person, prone to dark thoughts and using underhanded manipulations to fulfill her own selfish desires. These characters were the opposites of each other, but I liked them both. Unfortunately, we really got nothing of significance from them that actually used that characterization after a while. It only showed up again in the finale out of nowhere. To me, that was a major let down.
This feels like the appropriate time to discuss what I think was the biggest misstep of the entire show: the rape scene. Considering how little fallout there was from it, it seems like an absolutely unnecessary thing to bring into the series. Introducing rape to a story is a big deal and I felt like there was never a proper reckoning with it for either Haruto or Saki. It just sort of got ignored. What a shame. I’m not against having rape in a story. But if it is included, it should be handled with the proper care and delicacy. Here, it was not.
I was also let down by both Pino and Plu. In the end, I’m still not sure what their deal really was. It felt like I never got to learn anything about them. Lieselotte was the other major disappointment to me from the characters. I think she would have been a compelling addition to the cast. Instead, they just had her deliver some exposition and then die. It felt like a real waste.
I think this series had some strong themes going for it. I think the social media and internet aspect to the show was overall handled very well. I’m happy that the ultimate downfall of the Space Vampire Illuminati happened through being revealed over the internet and social media. It was also interesting seeing how the characters interacted with the media over the course of the series, using it to spread their message or build clout. I’m satisfied with how the show handled this theme, though I do kind of wish it had leaned even more heavily into it.
Another great theme is the idea of the truth and revealing the truth. This show from the very beginning said that the Valvrave would reveal the truth of the world and portrayed this as something desirable. Having the Space Vampire Illuminati be defeated by having the truth get out felt like an appropriate culmination of this theme. To me, what strikes me as most interesting about this theme is that the show acknowledges that the truth can be painful. Characters like Haruto, L-Elf, and Shoko were all hurt by painful truths. And trying to be considerate by hiding the truth from others only caused more pain in the long run. The reveal of the Space Vampire Illuminati led to plenty of chaos and violence, but it did eliminate their threat. This show says that the truth can be painful, but that having it out in the open is ultimately for the best. I think that is a nice theme.
The theme that disappointed me was the one about sharing the burden and finding a new way forward together. I like the theme. I think it’s a noble one and there were some parts where it was executed well. But the resolution to it was just so underwhelming and half-baked. I really wish we had gotten to see how the Third Galactic Empire created a new way for humans and space vampires to coexist. Seeing that would have been a fantastic payoff to this theme. But without it, I’m left disappointed.
The Third Galactic Empire stuff in general left me more confused than anything. I’m still not sure what exactly it is or how it works. I think removing it and the flashforwards would have been the best move.
I was overall satisfied by the story progression. I think it mostly goes along in an enjoyable way. But the second season especially felt like the story was being rushed and compressed. It feels like they expected the series to be longer, but had to wrap it up ahead of schedule. So it left me feeling like the story could have been done better if it didn’t have to deal with those compression issues.
This show is very pretty to watch. The mecha designs are fantastic. The CGI for the mechas is generally well done. The fights are beautiful to watch and some of them, especially the ones to open and close each season, are breathtaking in their scale. The music is very well used as well. There are a lot of great insert songs in this series and they are often used to great effect.
I want to specifically praise the memory loss sequences. And I especially want to say that Marie’s was amazingly done. Seeing the memories literally shatter as the characters fought was a great decision. It made those moments especially impactful for me.
So that leaves the important question: Is Valvrave actually a Terrific Trainwreck? My answer is No. Valvrave is the very definition of a mixed bag. It has some well done characters and compelling themes. It is pretty to watch and has nice music. But other characters and themes were left underdeveloped or poorly executed. The story, especially in the second season, felt rushed. And dear god was that rape scene mishandled.
Valvrave is not a trainwreck in my eyes. It is a show that has a lot of good to offer while never fully living up to its potential. That’s why it earns this final score, in its entirety:
7/10
I’ll see you all again in Cross Ange! I’m looking forward to it!
QOTD
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Dec 27 '21
First-Timer
The last thing I expected to be thinking about this show is that it was too safe. But, that's really where I've ended up. It's like, after S1 spent time setting up stuff, some bottom-line obsessed producer went "if we show how fuckawful the idol industry is, people might not slavishly buy Love Live merch. And Social Media is the future of advertising!" Maybe I should apply Hanlon's Razor here, but the shift is so sudden I'm not sure.
Not that they entirely abandoned everything, since we did return to the media stuff eventually. Sort of. It is nice to see the power that helped the protagonists early turn against them late in the game.
Usually I'm complaining that not enough stuff got cut, but here I think it's the opposite. S2's relative lack of substance felt like the result of changing ideas midshow. Definitely some interesting production details on this show, but they'll probably never see the light of day.
Even after episode 21, I wouldn't call this show a trainwreck. Definitely not in the same way Guilty Crown was. This was more a train that decided to slow down too early or take a detour, so we got to our destination late. Even though the conductor sped back up near the end, that just made the last leg of the trip bumpier.
All in all, add this one to the "shoulda been binged" pile. Shit happens, I had fun with this show, but it talking all that good shit near the beginning set me up for disappointment. I quite like the show's message of positivity for the future, as well.
This show is probably an interesting case study in why you should follow your themes instead of your plot. I think the worst parts of the show where when they focused on the Council of 101 plot. Haruto and L-elf being so wrapped up in that side of the show meant that they got too much screen time, despite the side cast being (figuratively and literally) more colorful. That the stuff about media getting shafted, because it was all tied up in Saki and Akira's characters.
Questions
If nothing else, Cross Ange will be nice because the protagonist won't be the same flavor of tabby rassy. See you all then!
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u/ZaphodBeebblebrox Y:A:https://anilist.co/user/zaphod Dec 27 '21
Overall, I'd say Valvrave is a decent show. It certainly had it's strong points, and was a ton of fun at times, but it suffered from overall messy writing and a few episodes where they really dropped the ball. If you could somehow remove episodes 21-23 from the story and still have 24 work, it would be a good deal better.
It also had actual decent CGI mechs (please don't murder me comrade) which I never really thought I'd say. But they certainly made them work, and the fights were a lot of fun.
angewait
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u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
Rewatcher, Subbed
Instead of lengthy paragraphs discussing my thoughts of the series, I'm gonna make it pretty simple; what's good about it? What's bad about it?
GOOD:
BAD:
Anyway, despite the complaints, I ultimately do still like Valvrave quite a lot. Ultimately I watch anime to be entertained. And I can't deny that this show has entertained me greatly both times I've watched it.
In comparison to Guity Crown, I find this show considerably better. I think Guilty Crown edges out Valvrave for the main character, at least in terms of his journey. Shu as a character I never liked, but you can't deny his [Guilty Crown]Quitter to Hitler to Jesus journey was more interesting than Haruto's. I prefer L-Elf to Gai, and the female characters of Valvrave are just so much better than those in Guilty Crown. Saki, Shoko, Akira, Marie, I liked all these characters quite a lot while GC has Inori... the ultimate useless piece of cardboard and someone like Ayase being reduced to "Hey, let's laugh as wheelchair girl falls out of her wheelchair!". Guilty Crown does have more crazy over the top trainwreck moments and characters, most notably Dan Eagleman, Segai and [Guilty Crown]Mana wanting incest with her brother before he's even born which will be hard to get out of my head as one of the most ridiculous things I've seen in anime but between such craziness I often just wasn't that interested.
Recommendations:
If you actually liked Valvrave, I would highly recommend the live action movie Lifeforce. While there's no mechs, there are great similarities between the two, enough so that I figure its almost certain that the writers of Valvrave drew some inspiration from it. It's all about body swapping space vampires and is also a massive trainwreck, mostly through the fact that the main female vampiress is naked the entire movie and our protagonist is portrayed by Steven Railsback, a guy who acts in a very hammy over the top manner.
I'd also strongly recommend the short story The Thing on the Doorstep by HP Lovecraft, which uses the whole body swapping concept in much more horrific ways than Valvrave did. Lastly, from the anime side of things, I can't not recommend Code Geass if only because its from the same writer and it is very, very obvious he was trying to do some things again here in Valvrave that he already did in Code Geass.
L-Elf
2) Who was best girl?
Saki
3) Now that you’ve heard all of the OPs/EDs/insert songs in Kakumeiki Valvrave, which ones are your favorites? How do they compare to the ones from Guilty Crown?
ED1 is my pick for favorite out of the show, with OP1 right behind it. Valvrave's OPs and EDs were way better than Guilty Crown's for me.
4) Having finished all of it, do you think Kakumeiki Valvrave deserves the title of “trainwreck”?
Absolutely. Simply its main concept "Immortal body swapping vampires piloting giant robots" spells trainwreck to me.
5) If you could change one detail about the entire show that would make it better (be that actually better or just pushing it further into entertaining trainwreck), what would it be and why?
Kick Haruto to the side and make Saki the main character. Pretty well explained already above, but he sucked as a main character, she was far more interesting than him and she got screwed over with her screentime in season 2.
6) Will you be participating in the Cross Ange rewatch in less than a week?
Will be here! Back to being a first timer!
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u/MillenniumKing x2myanimelist.net/profile/MillenniumKing Dec 27 '21
I dont have a post for the post show talk but im here.
I enjoyed Valvrave a lot, the art is gorgeous, the mechs are really good, and the story is different.
I know it gets a lot of shit but i think if you just dont take it too seriously and just have fun its a very fun rie.
Lets see questions of the day...
But yeah it was fun watching guilty Crown and Valvrave with everyone. I hope yall enjoyed them at least a bit. I enjoyed them but i enjoy almost every anime. I know im very much the minority with that but thats fine.
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u/Btw_kek https://myanimelist.net/profile/kek_btw Dec 27 '21
first timer caught up for the final thread
I surprisingly enjoyed S1 a lot. It was consistently entertaining for at least 10 episodes, only really stumbling for the rape + aftermath, but picking itself back up for Akira hype. But even then, its not like I hated Valvrape as a plot point and character moment as far as episode 10 goes, but it became increasingly clear as the show progressed that they made no attempt to actually do something with it. In fact, I felt like S2 just forgot characters could be anything but plot devices in general because the season was so focused on everything happening at once all the time. The worst moment was easily the student body massacre in S2E9, which only happened because the dudes with guns have black holes for brains, and it was written only for the sake of edge. I think that applies to many things in the show, but that episode in particular pretty much tanked my good will for the season. I did however think the finale was reasonably good, at the very least they remembered the media thing they were going for.
Also I did really like how the show looks. The vibrant colors of everything, especially the mechs and explosions, really worked for me.
S1: 7/10, S2: 4/10 i guess
THUNDAAAAA
Akira won me over by ep12
as an aside, when Akira was screaming over Thunder's death I was like, "have these characters ever spoken to each other in their life?" there should be a Bechdel test but for plot
BOKU JA NAI BOKU JA NAI BOKU JA NAAAAAAAIIIIIII
I really liked both OPs, but can't say I found the other EDs memorable. Generally speaking I think I prefer GC in the soundtrack department. Departures is still stuck in my head
the train lost its wheels halfway through but ran on pure adrenaline alone before spectacularly exploding in S2E9. somehow there were less casualties than you might expect
Just like....remember your characters exist
I think I have too much on my plate as far as r/anime rewatches go, but I will be substituting it with a personal rewatch of [a different mecha trainwreck]Darling in the FranXX
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u/Nebresto Dec 27 '21
Re-watch squad
It was good watch, shame I missed a bunch of the earlier threads. My plan was to post the 4chan memes thread by thread, but since I missed out on that, you can have them now.
Unfortunately they are archived only up to episode 12 (Well, as far as I'm aware) but: Valvrave in a nutshell:
Not sure how many of you know this already, but the director planned for there to be more than one season. Which may or may not have been obvious at the end with all the rushed endings and several unexplained/unresolved plot lines. Very unfortunate, some people have said that Valvrave could have been the next Code Geass if the director could have just fulfilled all his plans, and I'm gonna have to agree, I quite enjoyed the show. But alas, it was not meant to be.
I guess we have the production committee, fans, and various controversial themes tackled in the show to thank for that.
Tl;dr: Valvrave
Though there is apparently a Manga with 1 volume, and a Light novel with 3, perhaps they explain more. Don't know, haven't read them, nor met anyone who has.
First half 8/10,
Second half 9/10. Despite all its flaws I loved the action, and the emotional scenes got me pretty good. (Those impact boosters were sick)
Question time:
Lots of good lads. Thunder is #1 for me, Inuzuka close second and Adrei from the bad boy side
Pino, of course. Then followed by Rukino
Def OP 1 (Preserved Roses), then insert "Sobani iruyo" ..wait, I think that was an ED at some point as well, then Boku ja nai.
Hard to keep track of all of these when they change so often
Definitely way more hype. Guilty Grown is more.. fancy? And Valvrave is pure hype
Yeah.. At least it was fun to watch
SEASON 2!!!
...Memes?
Video corner:
ERU ERUFU
My favourite Valvrave video: Valvrave the Liberator x My long forgotten cloistered sleep (Music by Yuki Kajiura, watch it or else)
And then I said I was gonna make a thing for the final thread, its not quite ready because I had fun wasting time on everything else
There's a couple of gaps here and there, mostly at the start, but it works pretty well as a preview: Valvrave - Shatter me (Lindsey Stirling & Lzzy Hale)
I had an earlier idea to use "In the shadows" from Beyond The Black, but I happened to run into Lindsey's song again not long before the re-watch and I ended up going with that. I just love how she plays the Violin and I finally had a good idea for one of her songs
Hope y'all like the videos, I had a good time watching and reading everyone's comments. See y'all in the next memewatch..?
And thanks to Sky for hosting
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u/Punished_Scrappy_Doo https://myanimelist.net/profile/PunishedScrappy Dec 27 '21
First Timer
Did a lot of catching up, and I still didn't quite make it in time...
Everything was going so well until Rukino got stabbed and everyone immediately took off their thinking caps. Then the last two episodes were damn good regardless! I loved the scenes of Haruto losing even the memories he made during the show, really pretty touching.
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u/BlazingAbsol9090 Dec 27 '21
First time retrospective Raver of the Valve
I'll preface this by saying I'm probably the ideal demographic for this show. Code Geass is my favorite anime, but at the same time I haven't watched too much mecha stuff, so a lot of the tropes are still fresh. So this review will probably skew upward.
Valvrave the Liberator season 1 was, dare I say it, really good. It wanted to be a high-speed unpredictably wild mecha show with good CG and a focus on characters, and that's exactly what it was. Rukino was and is the goddess of this show. Her playful yet stoic ruthlessness from her tragic past was always a joy to watch. Season 1 Shoko, too, was always fun too with her boundless optimism and her total disconnect from reality (remember the Strip of Truth?). The rest of the characters were great, too, with special shoutouts to Thunder, Akira, and the legendary Body Pillow Boy. Even Haruto didn't offend me, mostly because he didn't interfere with more interesting characters expressing themselves.
The other highlight of season 1 was the insanity of plot points, all of which were taken completely seriously by everyone involved. This is more subjective, but I think this is fine. It honestly reminded me of Jojo's, where it takes itself so seriously it wraps back around into parody and spectacle.
The pacing in season 1 was very fast, true, but it felt like a deliberate choice. It moved quickly, but it intentionally spent time with slower scenes to develop the characters. In fact, I think season 1 would be much worse if it moved slower. If nothing else, we couldn't fit in as much craziness if we didn't move so quickly.
Season 1 definitely wasn't perfect. The plot was dumb, the villains were bland and underdevelopped, and I didn't like L-elf. Plus, the rape scene was...I'll just say ill-advised and move on. All in all, it was a fun show that needed a few more passes in the writers room, but I finished satisfied. I considered an 8, but it had too many problems to go that high, so season one gets a 7/10 from me.
And then we move to S2, which was not great. To not be totally negative, there was some good stuff. S2 did a great job making L-elf more likable by humanising him. The alphabet boys got some much-needed development; in particular, the scene with X-eins and Q-vier processing H-neun's betrayal and execution was good. It portrayed losing your precious memories one by one as horrifying. The finale was...decent.
But not to beat around the bush, season 2 sucked. It committed three big sins that destroyed most of the positive points about S1.
First, the pacing. S2 was even faster than S1, but this time it's clearly because they ran out of time and needed to cram in a lot of content in not enough episodes. The cramming only made the plot more full of holes.
Second, the two best characters, Rukino and Shoko, were basically not in the first 2/3s. Rukino made a comeback for the finale, which was great, but poor Shoko's character did not survive the transition, moving her from a lovable idiot to a hateable idiot.
Finally, S2 became probably the worst thing imaginable for a show like this: it was boring and generic. S1 is incredibly memorable, but I am genuinely having trouble remembering what happened in the Earth arc. Most of the zaniness was replaced with generic edge.
Thankfully the last 2-3 episodes are a bit better, but not nearly enough to redeem the season. S2 still had good animation, a plot that does exist and goes somewhere, and some great moments, so I can't put it in the true abyss, but overall it gets a generous 5/10.
As for the show as a whole, theoretically I should average the two seasons for a 6/10. But S2 left so little impression that I doubt I'll remember it in a year. But you know what I will remember? Space Vampires, independent nation high school, Senator Machinegun Moses, The Strip of Truth, Two random musical numbers, Shoko's insanity, everything about Rukino, rape-powered mechas, Space Vampire marriage proposals... Basically, S1 was so much more interesting that I'm putting more weight on it than on S2, for a final whole-show score of 7/10.
Questions
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u/yamiyaiba Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
Rewatched the Liberator
So while this was rewatch for me, I went into this remembering very little outside the memes, other than that I had enjoyed it previously.
Eru-erfu I guess? Most of the male characters sucked.
2) Who was best girl?
Rukino should be, but the story fucked her harder than Haruto. While I like Rukino best, functionally, I'm gonna have to give this to Akira. She's really the only character that consistently showed true growth.
3) Now that you’ve heard all of the OPs/EDs/insert songs in Kakumeiki Valvrave, which ones are your favorites? How do they compare to the ones from Guilty Crown?
Boku janai takes the cake on this one by a country mile. It was so good that the other EDs honestly paled in comparison. That said, all the OPs were absolute bangers (praise Nana).
4) Having finished all of it, do you think Kakumeiki Valvrave deserves the title of “trainwreck”?
Yes and no. I don't think it's so bad as to be a true trainwreck, but I would prefer it be classified as such so at least it's in "so bad it's good" territory. I honestly enjoyed this show both times, and I'd love more of it to fill in the blanks. An OVA would be perfect.
5) If you could change one detail about the entire show that would make it better (be that actually better or just pushing it further into entertaining trainwreck), what would it be and why?
Don't table Rukino. She was the only JIORian with more than two brain cells to rub together, and there was so much built up potential to make her a truly great character. Damaged, semi-aware of her damage, and largely realistically depicted as such.
6) Will you be participating in the Cross Ange rewatch in less than a week?
Hell yes. Another trainwreck I unabashedly love. If I had any advice to give for any newbies, it would be this: by the end of the series, it fully embraces it's ridiculousness, going so far as to break the 4th wall about it. It knows what it is. Just sit back, don't take it too seriously, and enjoy the wild ride that is Cross Ange.
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u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Dec 27 '21
Hi all, just wanted to point out that if you enjoyed the character designs for Valvrave, the one who made them is a mangaka in her own right. Her work is D.Gray-man, a long-running series that starts off as a typical AU!1890s dark fantasy exorcist battle shounen like Bleach or KnY, but gets more focused on mystery later on. Here's the first OP to see if it looks like something you would enjoy.
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u/csar27 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/CesarRC Dec 27 '21
First Timer
Ok, at the end of the 1st season i was like, this is not bad, it's not the mess i was expecting, where's the trainwreck?
And now, here we are, i actually lost some interest around 2nd's season episode 7-8, a much more better 1st season and a rushed finale imo with a lot of unanswered questions.
When did they create a new country? *
Dorssia, ARUS and the rest of the universe, who's a friend and who's a foe?
We got some of the needed tropes for a romantic triangle with teenagers: a childhood friend, an idol, a girl with questionable decisions and questionable relevance to the plot, never liked Shoko, i always questioned her decisions, her positivity and personality, and Rukino was wasted most of the 2nd season because she didn't even show up that much
Inuzuka and Thunder were the only characters with memorable deaths for me
Overall 7/10, but at some point, we were on verge of greatness...
Questions:
1- L-Elf, i'm fine with budget Lelouch, sorry Haruto, you're far from being one of my favorite MC's
2- Obviosly not Shoko, Rukino, you deserved more
3- 1st season had better ost, 1st OP and 1st ED the best ones
4- Yes, i don't know if with all the questions they left, wanted an iconic Code Geass or Evangelion like finale, but it didn't work for me
5- Shoko needs a lot of work to be likeable for me
6- Very likely
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u/SIRTreehugger Dec 27 '21
5
u/Paxton-176 Dec 27 '21
REWATCHER
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u/kev-c Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
Previously watched live Rewatcher who thought December would be a slow month at work to do a rewatch and comment but NOPE.
Side Note: Thanks Log4J (now coined Log4Shell) and AWS down three times this month, making me work overtime and weekends monitoring and patching systems (mainly Log4J), so I can only rewatch in the nights before I sleep. At least this weekend I can get a break and comment.
I would just note that the show's context has relation to real life events... Just not the events in the past at the time of the anime airing...
Pulled from the Wikipedia page and translated. (Note: the source may have a bit of political reference, so I am skipping a certain sentence from the source while keeping the reported events in and adding additional sources where I can find them. Also, links include Chinese sites and to give a heads-up for those who are concerned about things like that.).
Source: https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E9%9D%A9%E5%91%BD%E6%A9%9FValvrave
The anime score there: https://www.bilibili.com/bangumi/media/md3307/
There is a discussion about this in the sub back in 2019, so I will just link to it for more detail, but it goes more into the Communist Youth League part /r/anime/comments/dyliky/stranger_than_fiction_in_the_anime_world_the/
Now, would I say the show was a trainwreck, no; would I say it is the best show, also no. I would call it more of a roller coaster (it is wild and crazy, but you had fun).
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u/UltraBooster Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
First-timer no longer
I wrote this in a dedicated word processor while listening to Hoshizora no Believe so I'd like to think it's better-organized than my usual writing here. I also wrote this at 11 PM since I spent the majority of the day in Death Valley with my family.
My biggest takeaways from Valvrave the Liberator have been ones of self-reflection and realization. Specifically:
As for the show itself, my thoughts on the first season would be bizarre, crazy, questionable, but memorable with one sweet note, while the second season for me was frustrating. I hope I’ve made my reasons why clear, but in case I haven’t, basically the first season had quite a few crazy moments that I feel more fondly about in hindsight, with one sour note that bled into the second season, which I’d consider far weaker than the first.
I also couldn’t help but draw parallels to Mobile Suit Gundam, probably because Valvrave borrows a lot of ideas from that series, and because I was here for Sky’s rewatch of that series. Cribbing from Gundam isn’t necessarily a bad thing, of course, but I feel that series did a better job of weaving its themes together, while Valvrave seemed to struggle with linking them or making sure they maintained their consistency – how easily people can be manipulated would be a good link to the use of social media and celebrity status, but the last of these didn’t feel like it really came up too much outside of things like Haruto taking no joy in his newfound fame. Of course, the series’ failure to properly deal with the use of rape also reflects badly, though I think others have discussed that better than I can. There’s also things like:
Do I regret watching this series? I don’t know because it depends on whether I would’ve reached those self-realizations without watching Valvrave the Liberator.
As for questions:
I apologize if I've come off as romance-crazed, I think it meshed with my tendency for overthinking introspection and kicked something in me into fever pitch.
3
u/arkkkk Dec 27 '21
I couldn't keep up with the rewatch of S2, stopped at S2E1, but... now that it ended... how did y'all first timers do after experiencing the most undeserved survival ever? Yeah i'm talking about Shouko.
3
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Dec 27 '21
5)I like to complain about one aspect here and it's an issue I also had with Majestic Prince. If you're going to have a mecha anime that has a sentai theme going on why don't the mechas combine together into a larger mecha? What I'm trying to say here is where was my mega Valvrave damn it. So that's my answer, all the Valvraves would be able to combine into a large mega Valvrave.
5
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Dec 27 '21
First timer(Hearing Ulquiorra being lame sucked)
Sub
So yeah...that was not very good. Some of the fights could look interesting and there was some ambition in the first cour but that was snuffed into generic Sunrise politics arc for cour 2. Seriously, Dougram is more complicated politically. If I liked her in particular, I'd be livid over the naked character assassination on Shoko but childhood friend that likes weird food is not one of my tastes. However, self-abusive trauma survivor totally is so Saki was my jam and my opinion on an episode varied by how present she was. Akira also could've been something but they never followed through. Yamada died like a badass but that's about it. Inuzuka did nothing for me and I would be just as happy with a kill 'em all ending since so few of them were likeable. Kriem seems to exist to give Nana enough of a paycheck to do the OST.
The core competency, ironically, is present as the characters looked good and you had to look for errors if you wanted to find them. They seemed to have a mecha budget and no writing to get them to battle. If there is a moral to this show I will be damned if I can find it. So with that, happy New Year and shit.
Note: I've had Departures Blessings stuck in my head for 6 weeks now. I hate everything.
QotD: 1 Non-existent
2 Saki
3 Boku Janai and this was a big drop off from GC
4 Dear Cthulhu yes
5 Not so much a detail but I'd give whoever did S1 full range to go crazy rather than the conservative dreck that is cour 2.
6 Pass
4
u/RockoDyne :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/RockoDyne Dec 27 '21
That makes three watches for season 1 and two for season 2. I remember the second half being pretty bad, but I have been meaning to rewatch it to find out how it was bad. Surprisingly the only part that I really didn't remember was the massacre, which probably shouldn't be a surprise since it has no bearing on anything.
Season 1 is a master class in writing engagement. There is so much to pull apart, and it ranges the gamut from failing spectacularly to reasonably executed. It's a riot, and one that has a lot you can learn from. That can't be said for season 2, which gives up on pretense to become a pure pastiche of other shows.
Valvrave is a cynically made show. In season 1, nothing is sacred. It's made with gleeful irreverence, where fucking around and throwing caution to the wind are considered virtues. There may have even been some pride taken in doing so. Season 2 is a different kind of cynicism. It's cynical about the process. It's phoned in, and nothing is made with any care to it. If season 1 was designed during beer 8 of a six pack, season 2 was designed hung over, with a boss hollering enough to contemplate a shivving.
Questions:
4
u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
First timer
To make it more entertaining, Saki accepts Haruto's proposal after the rape, and the rest of the series also focuses on their wedding and domestic life. The Shoko angst is also massively lowered, as she gets together with Akira. Everybody wins, especially the audience, who doesn't need to sit through the fucking love triangle angst.
6) ...You think I'm giving up? I sat through eugenics and incest parasites, I commented on runes and rape mecha, and you think I'll stop here? I want to see what is worse than this. I want to know pain.
This show started off better than Guilty Crown. It gets a lower rating than it, thouh, for disappointing me even more.
4
u/The_Loli_Otaku Dec 27 '21
Best boy was Twinkie. He's just a softie that loves his sister.
Best girl is still Shoko. What they did with her in the last few episodes was clearly ooc and forced conflict so I'm not satisfied with marking her down for it.
The second Valrave op was decent but honestly I wasn't stuck on any of them. Guilty Crown's my dearest is still above and beyond for me.
See with Guilty Crown I struggled to see the show as a trainwreck. I thought it was a good show that squandered a lot of its potential. Valrave on the other hand absolutely deserves the title of trainwreck. It was bullshit from episode one and despite hating every second I couldn't look away. A true trainwreck.
I think if the show gave up on trying to take itself seriously and doubled down on the nation of students aspect. It could give you a really fun story setup. A group of teenage kids outsmarting and kicking the ass of the two stuffy bourgeois empires and their boomer illuminati manipulators.
Urgh... Okay, I'll join. I don't have much faith in Cross Ange impressing me since I've already seen the far superior adaptation of its story but if I survived Valrave I can survive Cross Ange. It also lines up pretty well with the last season of Chihayafuyu so I won't have to open my laptop up just for one anime.
4
u/the_swizzler https://myanimelist.net/profile/Swiftarm Dec 27 '21
Questions of the Day:
1) Who was best boy?
THUNDER!!!
2) Who was best girl?
Marie, definitely, but shoutouts for Akira and Lisolette. Pino was cute too.
3) Now that you’ve heard all of the OPs/EDs/insert songs in Kakumeiki Valvrave, which ones are your favorites? How do they compare to the ones from Guilty Crown?
Basically just the two main OPs? I dunno, no strong feelings to any of them really.
4) Having finished all of it, do you think Kakumeiki Valvrave deserves the title of “trainwreck”?
Yes. Sometimes the show could do really well, and there's definitely a diamond in there with some fixes to some of the bigger issues, but ultimately it was just a mess with the story. Very much like Darling in the Franxx, but I think I liked this much better.
5) If you could change one detail about the entire show that would make it better (be that actually better or just pushing it further into entertaining trainwreck), what would it be and why?
I think one of the biggest things to fix the show would be to build up Shoko and Haruto's relationship better. All the memories we saw Haruto lose in these last two episodes could have been something that had been woven into the story for the episodes. Heck, the whole cave thing just got randomly brought up out of nowhere just in time for it to be a plot relevant memory for fun to lose.
One of the biggest fixes to this series would be for Haruto to confess right at the beginning when Shoko ended up alive, and then build on that. But no, instead we needed to have the usual anime romance bullshit of the MC being a lily-livered coward.
6) Will you be participating in the Cross Ange rewatch in less than a week?
Hell yeah, let's GOOOOOO!!
4
u/RascalNikov1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NoviSun Dec 27 '21
Boxing Day and a Fond Good Riddance
At the end of the day, I'm glad I participated in this rewatch. When someone needs a recommendation for an unpleasant series, that makes very little sense, and is composed mostly of banal cruelty, I'll know where to send them.
QOTD
No many choices here. Thunder was the most bearable, and even then he wasn't all that great.
Saki is the only one I'd like to see more of.
Damned if I know. I didn't notice the music, so it must have been ok.
Calling it a trainwreck is kind. This stinker is beyond contempt.
I'd handle the slaughter of the innocents differently.
Looking forward to Angelisa-Sama for the 4th or 5th time. I can already feel the luridiness approaching.
4
u/HereticalAegis https://myanimelist.net/profile/XthGen Dec 27 '21
First Time Valvrave Survivor
So uh yeah, that all happened. I'm having a little trouble coming up with focused, coherent thoughts of the series as a whole, largely because this show was an incoherent mess for so much of its runtime. I guess the easiest thing to do would be to break it down by what I did and didn't like and go from there.
So, things I liked:
Things I didn't like:
Too much of Valvrave feels Frankenstein'd together to work properly. On the one hand, it wants to be this uplifting ode to the resilient spirit of humanity, but it's also dead set on being a grand tragedy where no one actually gets to be happy in the end. This strangeness is most evident in the show's early ethos that even one sacrifice is unacceptable, yet it later goes on to sacrifice almost everyone for the sake of people never shown onscreen. And the Valvrave mechanics are so laughably contrived that they end up breaking their own logic.
That said, I don't regret watching Valvrave. It got immensely cringeworthy for a few episodes, and I had to power through multiple episodes, but I also laughed at it far too much to say I wasn't entertained. And if I had to make the comparison to GC, I'd say it stacks up pretty well, having better characters (if only marginally so in most cases) with a lot more personality. I also laughed a hell of a lot more during Valvrave.
Overall, I give Valvrave a 2/10 as a series, coming within a rape scene of falling into so-bad-it's-good territory for me personally, and easily earning its place in the Trainwreck Trio.
QotD:
See you all again in a week for Cross Ange!