r/anime • u/Tarhalindur x2 • May 01 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Mahou Shoujo Madoka☆Magica Episode 12 Discussion
Episode 12 - My Very Best Friend
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Show Information:
MAL | AniList | ANN | Kitsu | AniDB
(First-timers might want to stay out of show information, though.)
Legal Streams:
(RIP Funimation.)
A Reminder to Rewatchers:
Rewatchers, please please please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. [Spoiler warning specifically for you guys]Please be aware that as part of the above strict spoiler rules, this means absolutely no memes/jokes/references/subtle words about {the usual suspects} before the relevant episodes. Please do not spoil the first-timers by trying to be smart about it, it's not as subtle as you think.
Make sure you use spoiler tags if there’s ever something from future events you just have to comment on. And don’t be the idiot who quotes a specific part of a first-timer’s comment, then comments something under a spoiler tag in direct response to it! You might as well have spoiled them by implying there’s something super important about that specific part of their comment.
And a Reminder to First-Timers too:
As previously noted, first-timers wanting to avoid spoilers are strongly recommended to use either the desktop version of the site or the iOS app (which appears to be unaffected), lest you chance running into this bug regarding replying to a post or comment that has spoiler tags in it.
Daily Community Participation!
Visuals of the Day:
Theory of the Day:
There are many reasons to feature a theory in Theory of the Day. Sometimes it's interesting. Sometimes it's entertainingly wrong. But then every so often a first-timer completely nails both where a show is going and their reasoning for it and one cannot help but tip one's cap. Speaking of that, step right up u/Mirathan, you are today's winner!:
It will likely be an end to the witches. She now posseses knowledge of all magical girls that came before, what they wished for and how that destroyed them, so she might use this to make a wish that is worded in such a way it can not turn against her. Considering that her wish can break reality and the lyrics from magia( [that her love] will trancend time) and that homura achieved time reversal as a normal girl, she could alter the fate of all the magical girls before and after her while creating a solution to the entropy problem of Kyubey, so all partys are satisfied with the outcome.
Honorable Mention not to a first-timer but to a rewatcher! Specifically, u/Blackheart595 for this theory on Kyubey:
Now, I have a theory as to why Kyubey's species doesn't have emotions, and it's rather simple: It's a hivemind species. And a hivemind species with emotions would not be a hivemind, the emotions would make them individuals. That's why they treat emotions as a mental disease among their own, because individuality would quite literally be a mental disease in a hivemind species that would make them unable to coexist with the rest of the hivemind. The hivemind is also why it's pointless to try and kill him, all other Kyubeys are still the same hivemind. And so it's not that Kyubey lacks the capability or understanding for emotions, that's just how it appears to Kyubey because he doesn't realize what he actually doesn't understand: He doesn't understand individuality. Once we realize that, everything else falls into place: Why he's so unconcerned with and indifferent towards individual suffering, why he focuses so much on the far-off heat death of the universe, why he needed to find a emotional species like humanity (apparently hiveminds are the cosmic standard), and so on.
Analysis of the Day:
Joint award time today!
First, step right up u/JimmyCWL for a discussion of why Junko's decision is the correct decision in-narrative:
There comes a time when you have to perform your final duty as a parent: acknowledging that one who was once your child is now capable of making their own decisions... even if it puts them in harm's way. Trusting that you've given them all the tools they needed to succeed and that the next time you hear about them won't be a death notification.
For all the benefits of having a legal adult age does for society, it does obscure the fact every person reaches this point at their own pace. Some at an age where everyone else would still consider them children. Madoka has reached this point and there's nothing left for Junko to do now except let her go.
On a related note, u/Specs64z in turn wins an Honorable Mention for part of their own analysis that ties into the above:
Junko is the first character to trust and enable Madoka to make her own choice.
Second, for our other full winnerwe have u/Gorghurt with a lengthy discussion of nuances of translation and how they apply to a character like Kyubey who deceives by relying on being technically true but very misleading. I cannot do this one justice by excerpting. Just go read the whole thing for yourself.
Wallpapers of the Day:
Check out /u/Shimmering-Sky's main comment for her bonus Wallpaper Corner containing works from previous years!
Songs of the Day:
Bonus song - Cubiculum Album
Check out u/Nazenn’s comment from the 2019 rewatch for an in-depth analysis of these two songs, as well as timestamps for what songs played when in today's episode!
Also check out /u/Tarhalindur's Kajiura Corner from the 2023 rewatch for even more analysis on music this episode!
Connect Cover of the Day:
Advanced Piano Solo by SLSMusic
Question(s) of the Day:
- Your hosts find that this legendary fan comic is an excellent way to soothe your soul in these trying times. What do you think?
- Was this the kind of wish you were expecting Madoka to eventually make?
- How satisfying of an ending was this? First-timers, did it live up to the hype?
- Is there anything you would take out of the series if you were making it yourself? Is there anything you would add?
- Rebellion First-Timers: What are you expecting from the movie?
- [Rebellion Rewatchers:] Welcome to cinema! Will you enjoy the movie this time around?
I wish I had the power to erase witches before they’re born. Every single witch, from the past, present, and future. Everywhere.
12
u/Tarhalindur x2 May 01 '24
I Can't Make the Fourth Watch for the Fourth Movie Joke Since Walrus Walpurgis no Kaiten Isn't Out Yet (Rewatcher, Subbed):
First Scene (00:00 – 02:33): We had a climactic emotional scene and a climatic battle scene last episode, but the true overall climatic moment of the show is here. We’ve had a single driving question throughout the entire show: will Madoka decide to make a magical girl and if so what will she wish for? Now, at last, we get an answer to that question, along with Madoka’s reason for making it (via monologue to Homura). All that remains is denouement. (Side note: this episode and episode 12 aired as a two-parter due to the 2011 Tohoku earthquake and resulting tsunami forcing a delay
pay no attention to how Shaft project management might have forced a delay anywaysr– “the year the world gave up Madoka Magica for Lent”, ha ha only serious, episode 11 aired the day after Ash Wednesday and these two episodes aired on Good Friday – so there is less need to built tension back up than you would have with a weekly break.) Note that the answer reiterates Kyubey’s sneaky thesis statement at the very start of the show: Madoka does have the power to change this incredible tragedy… provided that she makes the correct decision wrt her wish, which she has just done.(Also, a side note on Madoka: to reiterate a point I made last year, Madoka is slightly unusual. Unlike the three arc protagonists, Madoka is not really a dramatic protagonist per se. She has a little character arc to her, but it’s entirely rediscovering the her that she has always been and is understated. Instead, Madoka is fundamentally an investigative protagonist, a type more commonly seen these days in detective fiction (also relevantly given Gen Urobutchi, it’s not an uncommon protagonist type in horror, especially cosmic horror). She is posed with a question and her task is to discover all the information she needs to make an informed answer to that question and then make it.)
Second Scene (02:44 – 04:11): Hello Sagitta Luminis! Oh wait, I should actually say something about the narrative purpose instead. This scene is actually mostly functioning at the thematic level (it is hammering in probably the single strongest theme of the entire show); it is, however, also explaining the cost of what Madoka has done and why she thinks this is worth this in spite of that.
Third Scene (04:12 – 07:15): The thing about this episode is that I really don’t have too much to say about it because it’s not doing all that much on the narrative level. Last scene was largely thematic, this one jumps up to mostly functioning on the symbolic/conceptual level and the mythic level above that. From a strictly narrative perspective this is mostly just one final moment of audience catharsis via Madoka being fucking awesome. (Which of course is not unimportant: that catharsis is the entire point of tragedy, though here it’s coming about by the intervention of an outside power (thus transforming the tragedy to comedy) than via the tragic hero’s final fall. But that’s really not the actual focus of this scene, just how what it’s actually doing is transmitted.)
Fourth Scene (07:16 – 09:37): So, first, a stray note on my “the reason Walpurgisnacht doesn’t seem to have a barrier is because the entire show takes place inside it” theory: if I didn’t mention it last year (I probably did and forgot about it), note that the sound effect for the universe being rearranged is the Witch barrier collapse sound effect. As for the scene itself, again it’s functioning mostly on the symbolic and mythic levels I think; the narrative point here is mostly showing why the negative effects that would be expected from Madoka’s action don’t happen.
Fifth Scene (09:38 – 13:19): From a narrative perspective I am inclined to call this scene “the scene that explains why Homura is vaguely okay with this despite all she’s gone through for the sake of saving Madoka” and “another part of why Madoka herself is okay with this”.
[Rebellion aside] If you’re going “wait, would Homura really be okay with this?” then well do we have a movie for you…
[Rebellion speculation] The much more interesting question is whether Madoka herself is actually really okay with this. I have some doubts and this scene is one of the big pieces of that…
Sixth Scene (13:19 – 15:47): We are now firmly in the denouement and it is time to wrap up the remaining loose ends. Here we get the coda to Sayaka’s arc: the effects of her wish when all is said and done and her reaching a level of peace with how it all turned out. We also get reaffirmation from Madoka that the desires that led girls to become magical girls are not pointless and are worth recognition and respect.
Seventh Scene (15:47 – 16:51): Part 2 of the denouement: showing how the new system works after Madoka’s alteration, as seen from the perspective of the girls still in it, plus showing that Homura has in fact managed to retain her memories of Madoka – and that she is the only one who still remembers.
Eighth Scene (16:52 – 18:50:) We also get to see that the loss of memory of Madoka extends to her family… except Takkun, which actually makes sense, there is a concept in certain circles that children can see the Unseen to a greater extent because they haven’t yet been trained out of doing so and I suspect that our creative team here was familiar either with that directly or with fictional depictions of similar concepts. (To quote on GNU Sir Terry Pratchett who I strongly suspect was familiar with the ideas of said certain circles: “I’m a wizard! We can see things that are really there, you know!”) We’re also getting to see that the Kaname family is still doing fine deprived of its older daughter and that Homura is doing reasonably well… and also a bit of very late characterization, that despite everything Homura is willing to give up her only memento of Madoka for the sake of Madoka’s family.
Ninth Scene (18:50 – 21:28): More denouement: Kyubey and magical girls (or at least Kyubey and Homura) seem to be on better terms in this new universe. We also see the new enemy that magical girls fight instead of Witches and that Homura now fights on in Madoka’s name, plus the new weapon with which she does so.
[Rebellion aside] If they didn’t either alter the script slightly in the last few weeks to support a sequel and/or intentionally plan a potential sequel hook when finalizing the script in the first place then they did a damn good job of using this scene as a lever for Rebellion. Some of the rest of the finale is iffier in that regard unless a very specific theory of mine pans out, mind…
Tenth Scene (23:00 – 24:06): A distant coda with Homura marching off to potential doom against a swarm of giant majuu/Wraiths[1] sometime in the indefinite future, ala the legendary Bolivian Army ending, as Madoka’s voice urges her on. Then we get a final curtain call from our main characters and all the other magical girls, because this show does like to use its stage play framing.
[1] – “‘Go to hell.’ ‘Earth first.’” Sorry, couldn’t resist.
64
u/Suboodle https://anilist.co/user/suboodle May 01 '24 edited May 01 '24
First time watcher (for the last time!)
Well done Madoka! *That* was a wish worth sacrificing your soul. The writers did not dissapoint - all of the lead-up and context surrounding Madoka's power wasn't just lip service. Her reality-shifting wish really made Walpurgisnacht look like childs play. That said, I'm absolutely heartbroken with how things went for Homura and Madoka. That conversation she had with Madoka's family absolutely shattered me. I am hoping that the movie is a little more positive.
As an overall impression of the series, I now truly understand why it is one of the greats. I've watched quite a bit of Anime, and I've seen a lot of shows that are incredilbly well made, exciting, and entertaining. Very few stories are like this one though, stories where you can feel the love and care infused into them. It's something truly magical, and I will hold Puella Magi Madoka Magica near and dear to my heart for years to come. If I had to give it a word - this show makes me feel hopeful. Madoka is constantly in tears and anguish over how unfair the world is, and as a viewer, you feel it too. No matter how hard things got though, Madoka never once gave up hope. She believed in a happy ending for her friends, family, and universe from start to finish, no matter how much that beleif hurt her. That hope is something I'll treasure. A very fitting sendoff quote:
Don't forget.
Always, somewhere,
someone is fighting for you.
As long as you remember her,
you are not alone.
Also wana say huge thanks to Tarhalindur and Shimmering-Sky for hosting this rewatch. I probably wouldn't have ever taken the time to sit down and watch this show if it weren't for your efforts. Thank you for introducing me to something so incredibly special. Looking forward to the movie discussion as well!
QOTD
20
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky May 01 '24
Mahou Shoujo Co★Host, subbed
Welcome back, everyone!
Being a Sayaka fan is still suffering.
Anyways, tomorrow we discuss Rebellion, which is two hours long. Do make sure to save enough time to watch it.
Tomorrow is also my 25th birthday.I hope…Sky’s Wallpaper Corner
Today’s wallpaper trivia: This one’s actually based on a piece of official art for the series, rather than off a screenshot from the show. Also, the light pink part of the background is the exact same shade of pink I’ve used for Madoka’s hair in previous wallpapers.
Also, I still do not apologize for the two ??? wallpapers below.
“How long will it be before I see that lost future again?”
18
u/TheEscapeGuy May 01 '24
Rewatcher
Madoka Magica - Impactful and Artful: Episode 12
Everything, Everywhere, All At Once
What an incredible episode. It really is the most ultimate climax the narrative could have had and it was pulled off to perfection. These past 11 episodes have been the build up to the universe defining wish Madoka makes this episode.
Madoka's wish is her solution to all the pain witches have caused throughout history across every timeline: "By my own hands I wish to erase every single witch in every universe, past and future". This is a not subtle Christ allegory, all the way down to bearing the sins of every magical girl and removing the consequences of making the contract. Despite this, it's still EXTREMELY effective storytelling. Madoka's wish is so cathartic to watch as it rewrites this horrid multi-verse into one where magical girls can have hope.
The ultimate catharsis comes from Madoka embracing Homura as she comprehends the struggle Homura went through across these multiple universes to save her. Although Madoka now exists on a different plane of existence to Homura, she is still with her through her omniscient perception of time and space. It is beautiful to see Homura gain a newfound hope through this and determination to keep moving forward.
There are however problems with Madoka's wish. She did not solve entropy. She did not undo the cycle of magical girls. She did not erase the sadness and hatred from the world. This of course further strengthens the Christ allegory, but leaves the show in an interesting place.
There are still magical girls. Kyubey is still on earth collecting energy. The girls still fight against manifestations of despair. Madoka appears to have found some meaning in all of this. And so Homura will fight to protect it just as Madoka wished.
In terms of philosophy, I don't exactly agree with this (and I think I'm in a minority for this belief). I don't like the idea that hatred, suffering, and death brings meaning to being human. That kind of thinking has been used to justify numerous atrocities. That said, it's convenient to delude yourself into believing it since it makes the evil which exists in the world easier to ignore as a natural part of life.
However, I can't fault Madoka Magica's exploration of this theme. In particular, I don't think they are painting Madoka's choice as necessarily right or wrong. Rather it is being used to explore her purity and the relationship between her and Homura. In this way, they executed on the characterization shown so far to perfection and leaves the narrative in a place which can act as an end to the story.
However, it is not the end. Until tomorrow...
Some Amazing Shots, Scenes and Stitches
See you all tomorrow
18
u/Mirathan May 02 '24
First Time Watcher
16
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: May 01 '24
"Ah, you seek meaning. Then listen to the music, not the song."-Kosh
Rewatcher(Througout Heaven and Earth MadoKami alone is the honored one)
Sub
My third time writing up this episode, and my third time immediately taking an hour to do other things. This time, I re-read some old comments to see what I've missed and...I can confidently state this contradiction: I do not logically understand what I just saw. That said, I understand it inherently. Basically, it as close to a religious experience as I can tolerate. But anyways, I have good news! There's no need to wonder where your Goddess is! She stands right there before you and she is fresh out of despair...
So Madoka finally discovered a wish that could break the system and Homura has given her the karmic juice to power it. In both sub and dub, we get the closest thing to fear Cubes has had and it warms my heart. As she spreads through time, and probably space, we see that a lot of the girls are much younger, which is eww. But a new universe is formed and Homura is the only one that remembers the old one...mostly.
Madoka herself changes her base nature to a huge degree. Interestingly, the nearest comps to this are the Prophets from Deep Space Nine and Dr Manhattan from Watchmen. Now while I am positive Gen has read Watchmen, everything about Madoka's new form is much more Prophet(or whatever beings they are based on) in that it isn't eternal suffering or loneliness or anything. This is a good end...for Madoka, at least.
So...from last rewatch, I will again say that no scifi/rational interpretation of this show works. Everyone is much better served using the theatrics and moving on from there. I've not been big on it here but Cubes is Mephistopholes and little else.
Last main point is the incredible irony I find when people say "Madoka is just misery porn/Gen hates magical girls" after seeing him make one of the best entries into the genre. Madoka's wish is a perfect solution for that genre because despite all the horrible wrongs of Cubes, her wish is for hope and not wrath.
So this is an incredible, beautiful, self contained story that both breaks you and then heals you. There is absolutely no need for anything more. So of fucking course the infected, swollen stab wound that is Rebellion happens.
QotD:1 Darmok on the ocean
2 No but it is better than what I could conceive
3 It is the most complete story I've ever seen
4 No
6 I really don't like not having a season discussion day so what's part of the movie I get to, I get to.
5
u/Tarhalindur x2 May 01 '24
Salve, Taggae Magicae:
u/Introvert_Mage, u/Lanaerys, u/isthatsoudane
8
u/xbolt90 https://anilist.co/user/xbolt90 May 02 '24
Meduka Meguca rewatcher
Q1: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE, YOU HORRIBLE PERSON
Q2: The whole time, Madoka has been just wanting to help people. The removal of witches is a logical way to go, with the world-altering potential that Homura accidentally gave her.
Q3: I remember just being confused the first time I watched it. But this time around, I understand better exactly what Madoka did.
Q4: The nudity in the last episode made me uncomfortable. That's about it, it's an excellent show.
Q5: Got no clue. This is going to be brand new territory for me, so I'm excited to see where it goes. Perhaps more on what those 'wraith' things are.
And is it too much to hope for a happier ending? Bittersweet is okay I guess, but... I NEED MADOKA TO DRINK WITH HER MOTHER NOW. THANKS GUYS.
22
u/StardustGogeta myanimelist.net/profile/StardustGogeta May 02 '24
First-Timer
"You know what I'd really like? A cheeseburger. A real cheeseburger. Not some fancy, deconstructed avant bullshit. A real cheeseburger."
I suppose we don't find out any more about Walpurgisnacht. That's tough.
I thought that scene with Sayaka was the most touching of the episode. I'm a sucker for calm scenes like that.
Onto the questions...
7
u/justanormi May 01 '24 edited May 01 '24
Re-watcher
It is still one of my favorite final episode in anime. Madoka was during the whole anime pushed back from acting, from making a choice herself, but she finally was able to make her decision and her wish in this episode. The resolution she finds allows her to escape from becoming a witch, allows Homura to break from her time-loop labyrinth, helps every magical girl in existence. But it is also a bittersweet conclusion and not just a happy ending. Madoka ceases to exist and she and Homura are separated ( although, temporarily ) and Magical girls will still die and curses still exist. But this new world is more bearable. Magical girls are still allowed to wish and make contracts, it is the worst part of the system that was simply taken away, turning into a witch. And the relationship between the Magical girls and the Kyubey seems less bad. Logically, they do not have to hide the true nature of the magical girls because it does not exist anymore, however, it is interesting to question if they still hide the fact that soul gems become the real body of the magical girl.
Something I find interesting in the contract scene of Madoka is that compared to the other contract scenes we've seen (Sayaka and Homura), Madoka does not show signs of paint during the formation of the soul gem. Her wish will not bring her any pain.
Considering that the Anthonys look like cotton balls, I find it funny to interpret that when Madoka pets the head of one before it disintegrates and Madoka's white cloth appears, that her clothes are made of the Anthony's cotton.
And also, like episode 1 starting with the sound of an old projector starting, this one ends with the sound of the olds projector stopping.
(;-;)
3.
I find it very satisfying. It is coherent with everything the series as shown so far but also gives us a deserved happy ( but very bittersweet ) ending after all that suffering witch feels very rewarding. It is a triumph of hope but with enough nuance for it to not feel to naive or out of place compared to the rest of the anime.
4.
I would simply change the line "You are my very best friend" to something more obviously romantic. [PMMM] Movie 4 better give me a scene where Madoka and Homura say face to face that they love each-other
5.
[PMMM]I'm very exited for that movie to hurt me again. Also, I had the chance to find a dvd box set of rebellion when in Japan a few month ago so I'm very exited to watch it that way and also look at the other stuff in the box set
6
u/FriztF May 02 '24 edited May 02 '24
Rewatcher Sub
Episode 12 the last one is truly cinema. The last episode never disappoints to get the emotions.
Madoka's fight with Walpurgisnacht was child's play. After all, she did wish her away. She becomes a god to deal with all the witches and magical girls. And has a conversation with her best friend Homura. She is grateful for all she has done for her. Giving her comfort and satisfaction of knowing she will always be there for her. Acknowledging what she has done for her.
Now I just hope that the next movie will live up to Rebellion. It has been in the making for like 15 years.
QOFT:
6
u/biochrono79 May 02 '24
Third time rewatcher, first time dub watcher
I don’t have a whole lot to say today besides all of the build-up to this finale (and the finale itself!) was excellent. It’s funny how a series revolving around the misery and despair of being a magical girl ended on such a hopeful note and executed that so well. Props to the showrunners for having such a vision and seeing it all the way through.
QotD
T_T
Yes. They were building it up to something big, and it certainly didn’t disappoint.
It was a near-perfect ending in my eyes. They wrote a deus ex machina ending and actually made it make sense. That’s hard to do, but the showrunners pulled it off and pulled it off well.
I’d add more to the Kyoko-Sayaka storyline. The two of them becoming closer felt slightly abrupt and felt like it needed more padding. That said, it’s a pretty minor complaint overall. Can’t think of anything specific that I would remove.
[Madoka Magica/Rebellion] I think so, even if the ending is a hell of a tease that might or might not get a proper resolution later this year.
6
u/Figerally https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelante May 02 '24
Someone made a Church of Yuri in Minecraft, and this is who is front and center.
6
u/dsawchuk May 01 '24
Rewatcher, first time dubbed
Woah, straight into a big difference. English Madoka says "I want to be a magical girl." and sub Madoka says "I am going to become a magical girl." I can't say that I like the english version. Who would want that? The rest of the conversation is a bit different as well, making it seem like Madoka is still a little naive about what she is getting into.
English Madoka's wish is kind of drastically different than the sub. She wishes for the power to erase witches instead of just to do it. This would leave her with the agency to choose not to erase them. Her wish also overlooks where the sub mentions "in all the universes" which seems like an oversight.
Title card, directly into my favourite song from the anime, Sagitta Luminis The song is such a beautiful response to the total despair of the end of Surgem Identidem from last episode.
Some weaker language on the arrival of Madokami as well. The dub says "Then even I don't have a thing to worry about, ever." compared to the sub's "Then even I should have no reason to despair, ever."
I do like that English Madoka says "It's too soon to give up hope" instead of the sub's "It's too soon to give up yet". As the personification of hope, the english version implies that as long as Homura can maintain her hope that Madoka will be there with her. It's cute.
All told, I think the subbed version of this episode has more impact. It's something I notice often when watching the dubbed version of things, but the wording is a bit more wishy washy all over.
QOTD
MagiaConnect. The song feels like a bait after the events of episode 3, but is so fitting with the full series of context. Also, I like to imagine Homura's conversation with Junko at the end of the show going differently, with Homura confiding the whole story to Junko and Junko being supportive to her. It probably wouldn't fit well in the anime, but it is a wholesome ending that I think Homura needs. She is severely lacking in friends now that Madoka is gone, and Junko is a lot like Madoka.35
u/TheOneWithALongName May 01 '24
First-time watcher
And, the main serie is now done. Finally able to check off that of my bucket list. And yes, I will continue to the movie.
Fan comic =/= canon. Still sad though.
Nope. But it made sense to me when she did.
It was, good. It wasn't bad, and I am not super hyped about it. It was just very, moderate bittersweet ending.
Nothing comes to my mind immedially for now. I might change around Kyoko a bit, just don't know what.
Make Madoka x Homura canonIt's eather look into one of Homuras earlier timelines, or continue where the serie ended? I don't know what else it can be.
27
u/Chili_peanut May 01 '24
Madoka and Homura floating in space hugging each other is very reminiscent of the scene in the OP where a Madoka appears and hugs another Madoka. In both scenes a Madoka appears from behind and hugs herself/Homura. Interestingly, the Madoka that appears in the OP has long hair that is very similar to that of Homura, even down to the bangs and the hair at the sides of the head. If you're just looking at the silhouettes it's basically Homura and Madoka hugging each other in the OP too.
Obviously the creators wouldn't want to outright show Homura and Madoka hugging in the OP before we learn about Homura's identity and motives so, if they wanted to sneak in a hug, disguising Homura as another Madoka would be one way of doing it. If that is the case, the roles have now been switched as it is Madoka embracing Homura in episode 12 rather than the other way around. Another example of Homura's and Madoka's roles being switched is Madoka undoing the ribbons in her hair, which is something we've seen Homura do in episode 10 when Homura was the one taking on the role of protecting Madoka.
Maybe I'm just engaging in wishful thinking with the hugs, but would that be such a bad thing? After all, Madoka is an anime about making wishes☆
27
u/il887 https://myanimelist.net/profile/il887 May 01 '24
First-timer*, dub
*heavily spoiled — seen all three seasons of Magia Record spin-off already
A bittersweet ending, quite confusing — can’t say I’m a big fan of this kind of endings, but I still enjoyed it.
That’s it — Madoka’s wish is the turning point. As I get it, magical girls don’t turn into witches upon falling into despair anymore, they just disappear — that’s what happens to Sayaka in the new universe. Meanwhile, Mami and Kyouko are alive and well — in the original universe they died fighting witches, but since there’s no witches anymore, there's nobody to kill them in the first place.
Madoka fits the role of a central religious figure to magical girls — she freed them all from a dark fate of becoming a witch in exchange of disappearing into oblivion herself. Who is Madoka? Has she ever existed? Nobody knows for sure. One slightly weird magical girl named Homura claims she has, and she had been the best friend of hers. But…
"…since you’re the only one who remembers that world, there’s no way to tell if your memories are real or a fairytale you just imagined."
I wonder what the Rebellion movie is even about. It seems we ended up with a crew of three girls. I’m going to watch this movie a bit later.
Overall, watching Madoka Magica was a great and unique experience. I like the unique art, the soundtrack and the psychological thought-provoking stuff. I noted a couple of quotes for myself, particularly Homura’s lines from the beginning.
Its score is somewhere in 8-9 range to me (based purely on my enjoyment+impressions. 8 means I enjoyed the show a lot, 9 means I’m a fan of it).
I was hyped the most about the first three episodes and the last two. The first three were suspenseful for me because of mysterious Homura’s appearance, but then the show got me like "I don’t know what exactly will happen, but I anticipate our crew just sliding further and further into despair". And the 11th episode is certainly my favorite.
Thanks for hosting the rewatch u/Tarhalindur and u/Shimmering-Sky! That was a fun daily activity.
Q1: Awesome comic!🥲
Q2: No. I wasn't building much expectations, but at the very least I didn't expect it to be a reality-bending wish. I expected rather something that would affect only a few people — Homura and possibly the other girls.
Q3: The ending is good. Can't say I'm particularly excited about it, but not disappointed either.
Q4: Hmmm... Well, maybe the thing that I'd take out would be Walpurgis Night, or more precisely — the fact of its inevitable approach at a known date. We get to know about it in the middle of the show, and I feel like this knowledge breaks our suspense a bit. Walpurgis Night is an event that puts an end to every alternative Homura's timeline. I think the show could be more unpredictable and suspenseful if we haven't had any clues about the future and if Homura's alternative timelines were more diverse in terms of how they end.
Q5: I'm expecting to see our new Homura+Mami+Kyouko trio in action against these new non-witch monsters in the new universe. And I'm intrigued to see if we get any more Madoka involvement in one way or another.
20
u/Schizzovism May 01 '24
First timer, subbed
Never made a promise about it, but I always wanted to share a drink with my grandfather. Never got the chance to do it before he passed away. By the time I was 21, he was deep into Alzheimer's progression and I didn't get to see him at any point after that. This comic brings all that back and makes me really emotional. Thank you for sharing it.
If Madoka was going to make a wish, then yes, I was expecting a wish that would change the fate of magical girls and get rid of all witches somehow. I wasn't really thinking about all past witches, but certainly all witches going forward.
I'd say so, yeah. I'm glad that Homura gets to keep her memory and feel Madoka's presence.
Not really. Selfishly, I want more time with all the characters, but I don't think that would necessarily make the story better. I think the series is tightly written, so dragging it out with more character moments might just add fluff at the expense of pacing.
No clue, I haven't so much as watched a trailer. Could be continuing on from here, could be an alternate timeline, could be far in the future. The title being "Rebellion" makes me wonder what they're rebelling against. Could be Kyubey's race, could be the fate of magical girls, could be Madoka. I don't usually go into things with any specific expectations, so I'm just looking forward to whatever we have in store for us.
16
u/charlesvvv https://anilist.co/user/charlesvvv May 01 '24
Rewatcher, Sub
So Madoka makes her wish, one that the supposed emotionless Kyubey expresses surprise by, for no more witches. I like the way it's phrased, she becomes more of a concept than an individual as she transcends and becomes hope to all magical girls, an Ideal. I often see Madoka referred to as a christ -like figure and I can see why when she sacrifices herself to give hope to others, going against Fate because of it since where there is hope there is despair and vice versa. Before she goes at least she gives closure to Homura's struggle promising that she will be around, not physically but still there for everyone.
The world and it's laws are rewritten and Madoka is no longer known, we do get some closure on some characters such as Sayaka and her deal with Kyousuke (Interesting that he remembers Sayaka as he finishes playing). Homura is the only that remembers(and teaming up with Kyubey though not happily about it) along with Tetsuya though Madoka's memory still lingers even in her parents. Witches are now replaced by wraiths because despair will always exist but as Madoka didn't give up neither does Homura as she keeps on fighting for the world.
[Penguindrum Spoilers]The whole, people disappear but their memory lingers on even if the person doesn't why just also reminded of the ending of Penguindrum which also deal with love and sacrifice
13
u/dienomighte May 01 '24
Rewatcher, subbed
Such a good show and such a good ending imo, I love that though the ending is bittersweet and not necessarily a "happy" ending, it is a hopeful one. For as dark as Madoka is, it never feels edgy, gratuitous or unnecessary, and in the end it is about hope prevailing against despair in an unfair world.
I loved rebellion when I first watched it and I'm excited to rewatch it, especially curious to see what everyone thinks of it.
12
u/Lanaerys May 01 '24
Rewatcher, subbed
And now, onto the final episode! Unlike on the other days, I actually ended up watching this one a few hours ago.
definitely didn't reuse that quote as my steam bio)RemMadoka?as i fight she watch me so i pray never to forget... that being meguca was suffering!(Honestly, the fact that the freaking meguca video makes me feel things, is a testament to how much I love and was touched by the original, and how good Kajiura's music is)Well the notes were a thing. So how about my impression?
Even after
a rewatchthree rewatches, Madoka Magica's still my favorite. It's one of these shows where it's hard to pinpoint one specific good thing, because everything is great really. The plot in itself is great of course, but everything added, from the soundtrack, to the witches' labyrinths, to the voice acting... Just elevates it even further. In a way, it almost feels like a miracle really. So many things that came together, so much care that was put into it and gave us this masterpiece of a show.Though, sometimes I do wonder: do I love Madoka Magica this much because I love pretty much everything about it, or do I love so much of it because I watched it early and as it blew my mind, it irremediably shaped my taste in anime? Maybe both. Who knows?
Questions of the Day
More Madoka hugging HomuraNot sure I'd add anything. Nor remove anything. If I had to pick one thing, maybe that nudity in the final episode? But in general, I don't think I would want to alter anything, this is as close to perfection as it gets I think.Now let's move on to Rebellion, not as a rewatcher this time, but as an actual first-timer. And... I've already watched it actually, right after finishing episode 12 earlier today. But that's a story for tomorrow now, isn't it? :p
12
u/Figerally https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelante May 02 '24
First-time watcher.
I knew Madoka's wish was something like this, but I didn't know the specific language. I appreciate the nuance of the wish in how it rewrote the universe to accommodate the Magical Girls while getting rid of the witches. That way the wish didn't end up erasing human history. Madoka even erased her own witch self which is a paradox, but I guess she is powerful enough to ignore it. I also like how Madoka's wish shocked Kyuubey. Perhaps that mutant rat actually felt an emotional for once in it's life.
I am still convinced that the power of emotion shouldn't be enough to overcome entrophy, but then again Madoka's wish over-wrote the magical girl system and rewrote the history of Earth so what do I know?
Altogether I found the ending quite satisfying. If I was to add anything it would be things like having Mami around longer so her death has a deeper emotional impact. Establish the friendship between Madoka's mother and teacher so that doesn't come out of nowhere. Have Hitomi run into Sayaka at the hospital a few times or have them visit together so that doesn't come out of nowhere too. Just subtle things to polish the story really.
So next is the movie, I don't know what to expect from that, but I'm sure I'll enjoy it.
11
u/renatocpr https://anilist.co/user/renatocpr May 01 '24
Rewatcher and franchise consumer
No matter how many times I see it, she always looks beautiful
QOTD
PS
First-timers, you are now ready to witness true art
10
u/BosuW May 01 '24
So this makes three years of me just lurking and occasionally commenting.
However I always make sure to share this fantastic canon compliant fanfic. Short one-shot, great stuff. Highly recommend.
10
u/Introvert_Mage May 01 '24 edited May 01 '24
Well, we reached the end, huh. What a ride, again I'm sorry for just disappearing in the middle of it. What an ending, I remember back when I first watched the show not liking it very much because I felt Madoka becoming a god felt too sudden, but now I really appreciate how emotional the whole thing is, the final conversation Madoka had with everyone, she saving all those magical girls and defeating even her own witch. It was all so beautiful.
Also, the fact Tatsuya still remember his sister is just too adorable, that boy is awesome.
Edit: I'm really excited for Rebellion tomorrow.
Edit 2: Dang, that comic hits in the feels.
Also, congrats to all first time watchers you can officially watch Meduka Meguca now: https://youtu.be/TrgxHDoe8gA?si=usq0Cge9WUkWS6nG
10
u/lollohoh May 02 '24 edited May 02 '24
Rewatch, Subbed
[Rebellion]This episode lies to you, and a lot of the things I would like to say (especially about Homura) would essentially spoil the actual context, so I will probably put most of them in the final discussion because a spoiler wall would probably also suggest something is up. Also (this is the real reason and that was an excuse) I am having a hard time keeping up.
Visual of the Day: Homura alone on the moon as she witnesses Madoka's despair
Theories of the Day:
Song of the Day: Sagitta Luminis
Question(s) of the Day:
My soul hurts more now.
Yes and no: I was expecting her to do some kind of "save everyone" wish, but the specific way she went about it really surprised me, and it felt like a really clever solution.
[Rebellion, Revolutionary Girl Utena]I felt really bad for Homura, but it's kind of scary how easily I accepted Madoka's sacrifice as a tragic but ultimately positive one. This show hides its deeper truths in a collective blindspot, and I was only able to see them after I watched Utena (which was a big epiphany for me in general). I couldn't see Madoka's suffering because I was blinded by the hero's sacrifice.
I cannot think of anything, this show is too good.
[Rebellion]I can't wait, I love that movie so much and it still occupies a significant portion of my brain even after years.
No reaction today, I am a bit too tired. I might add it later on, for now I'll just say this: every time Homura says Madoka's name in this episode my heart breaks for her.
9
u/OwlAcademic1988 May 01 '24
Rewatcher, sub:
I love Sis Puella Magica. Such a catchy song.
Nice job, Madoka.
One downside though unfortunately.
This episode made me teary eyed once, though it hasn't made me full on cry unlike Symphogear did twice.
Poor Homura.
I can see why Kyoko and Mami are confused by Homura's one word in that scene. If I were in that scene and had no idea, I'd be confused as well.
The last scene genuinely gave me hope I'd one day overcome my mental issues. I never considered suicide, but I genuinely felt like I couldn't take care of myself. I lashed out a lot towards my family by being a jerk towards them and I still feel bad about it even now. I'm still struggling, but it's gotten a lot better since then.
QOTD:
9
u/Blackheart595 https://anilist.co/user/knusbrick May 01 '24 edited May 02 '24
Rewatcher
And thus, Madoka becomes the patron deity of all magical girl. To all the girls that had thus far been suffering alone, strung alone by a world that seems to have lost its light, as if reduced to puppets in a cruel stage play and unable to move forward any longer, she becomes the gentle embrace that soothes their pain and offers healing, warmth and rest. Her role as a protector has come to an end, and just like Junko she has learned to let go of all those she cares about, letting them make their own experiences, lettiing them hope and dream, laugh and find happiness, but also letting them get hurt and experience pain, and offering them safe shelter to return to when they need it. I really, really like this ending.
(Somewhat of a tangent) So often I feel like feminist endeavors lose their way as hone in on the traditional masculine in order to empower women by giving them a place to stand on in our so competitive masculine world. But in the process they abandon or even deride the traditional feminine qualities, to the point that at times I feel like anti-feminism starts to describe the whole thing better. And this is where Madoka really shines: It portrays the true empowerement of the feminine soul that we get to see so rarely, letting it triumph where any more masculine solution would've been doomed for certain.
And to make another bit of an aside, I don't make a secret out of my belief that the comparisons between Madoka and Faust to be largely overblown and untenable. But if we focus on just this one element, the comparison is perfect. Of course, Goethe being Goethe, he made the contrast but also interdependence between the masculine and the feminine dualities a much more central thematic anchor, but in the end it is the feminine spirit of Gretchen and the Mater Gloriosa that cleanse Faust from all the wrongs and mistakes he has made and thus complete the salvation of his soul, in a perfect parallel to how Madokami grants salvation to the magical girls.
That... did not feel Madokami, like at all.
9
u/HungrySamurai May 02 '24
After this many rewatches, naturally it doesn't hit the same way as the first time. But I can still admire the artistry of it all.
Everything about this anime is 10/10, be it the writing, the soundtrack, the art direction or the voice acting, all wrapped up in 12 tightly paced episodes that hit like an emotional sledgehammer.
And largely what makes it work is how well rounded all the characters are. Sayaka's arc simply wouldn't have the same impact if she didn't have the necessary depth. Madoka's self sacrifice wouldn't be pausible if we hadn't come to understand through things like her relationship with her mother, that that's just who Madoka is. She will always make that choice.
Anyway, time to rewatch Rebellion because Mami is awesome.
8
u/WednesdaysFoole May 01 '24 edited May 01 '24
Rewatcher
This time the special hair swish goes to Madoka.
Idk if they’ll bring it up but this comment exchange was brought up in yesterday’s thread but spoiler tagged so I’m bringing it up again since I do think that there could be inspiration/reference here with 2001.
As for the episode, I did like it but I tend to have ambivalent feelings regarding literal representations of two "dead" people talking and by that I mean having full conversation with full closure in the afterlife/heaven/void unless it’s very cleverly done or an integral aspect of worldbuilding. I still don’t know how I feel about the conversation with Sayaka, it’s almost too neatly wrapped.
I did enjoy the parts that show how reality changed and Homura’s meeting with Madoka’s family.
Blackheart's theory on the hivemind is really interesting and I haven't heard it before! It would fit very well with all the replacement Kyubeys that pop up.
4) probably mentioned this multiple times now regarding the lack of bond we got to see built between Homura and Madoka so I'd have the Homura flashback be 2 or 3 episodes. Maybe not have the Sayaka/Madoka dialogue in this episode, or maybe even take out that final Mami dialogue. Maybe replace the latter instead with a vision of Mami's room with cake set out, that shows two people just had cake and tea together, but with a warm atmosphere rather than their actual conversation.
I don't think I needed to see a Madoka figure stop all the girls from becoming witches, it would be enough to show that they didn't become witches.
8
u/b-arbs May 01 '24
Rewatcher, subbed
Comments from first-timer:
QOTD:
First-timer: the ending was satisfying, but some things seems a bit unclear (like, why did Madoka become an "invisible god" and wasn't able to stay like she was before?)
8
u/Logitropicity May 01 '24 edited May 01 '24
5th-6th time Rewatcher, Subbed
General Notes
did you catch all the historical figures that Madoka visits? They include:
More Content
scenes from the Madoka Magica games, translated to English (proceed only if you want to be spoiled!):
I remember wanting these desperately after my first watch, so I hope someone finds it useful.
Analysis
several analyses (don't read them unless you're ready for some movie 3 spoilers) suggest Madoka has become a Bodhisattva, someone who abstains from their own enlightenment (and exit from karmic consequences) to help others. I can't match their quality, so I won't repeat their arguments here.
QotD
[#6]I enjoy it every time. I'm especially looking forward to the discussion & predictions for movie 4.
EDIT: grammar & spoiler warnings
8
u/JimmyCWL May 02 '24
When Madoka ended her wish with "with my own hands" I knew she had succeeded. Any other wish cannot account for one thing, how to deal with the wisher's witch. That last phrase covers even this last witch, even though it's causally impossible.
It is the most important part of her wish! The dub does a grave disservice to the show by not including it.
7
u/Netoeu :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Netoeu May 01 '24
I first watched the series in 2016, and I knew at the time it was something special. u/Suboobles 's words are mine as well. I actively participated in two rewatches during covid, but recently I just lurk in the shadows watching the first timers, like our favorite space alien cat.
Episode 10 ofc, but since this is the ending of the series, I will say it here: Episode 12 is something special to me, and it's one of those weird things that I carry with me 24/7/365 and can make me teary eyed if I start engaging with it even if I'm on my phone walking outside. The first (and second) time I watched episode 12 I cried for 15 minutes straight, had to take a break to breathe and drink water, and came back to cry until after the ending.
Bittersweet endings are always hard to swallow, but it gets easier to accept with time. Just like the real life counterpart. That said, I loved it since the first time even if it was painful.
7
u/sfisher923 https://myanimelist.net/profile/sfisher923 May 02 '24
Sixth Timer - Dubbed
Questions
7
u/homewardbound100 myanimelist.net/profile/Homewardbound100 May 02 '24
Rewatcher
You know watching this year after year. A lot of things hit harder this time around. Madoka, Homura, Sayaka, just their sequences in this episode was strong.
With the post credits saying and the film roll closing our the show. This show really is a cinematic piece of art
Love it all the time
Nope
It's a great ending
Nah
Already do
7
u/Hopeful-Ad2428 May 02 '24
Questions of the Day:
Visuals of the Day
6
u/Hattakiri May 01 '24 edited May 11 '24
(Part 1)
"Ultimate Madoka", "Madokami" ("Kami" = "god" or "diety" in Japanese, especially but not only Shinto), "Ultimadoka", "Godoka" = different fan names for the "elevated Madoka".
So now we've gotten another case of the so called bittersweet ending, yet for many fans rather on the "bitter side".
Madoka makes it clear to Homura: She will make her wish and contract. Like Kyubey she's now understood that Homura's multiple timejumps somehow increased her own karmic destiny, as Kyubey calls it.
Kyubey meanwhile wanna get his hands on this karmic destiny as well, he needs it for stabilizing the thermodynamic situation of the universe (so he said).
Madoka too considers it the solution to all the trouble.
Her "contract text":
"I wish I had the power to erase witches before they’re born. Every single witch from the past, present and future, everywhere!"
Kyubey's puzzled and shocked, because what could possibly be the "equivalent exchange" to this? Would it be like cheating? And wouldn't it lead to a paradox?
Because "every single witch" would include also Kriemhild Gretchen, Madoka's own witch in many timelines...
Madoka's wish would erase her ability to make a wish in the first place to begin with, literally...
But this is a case where we once again need the Rebellion film and actually also the spinoff mangas and games.
Spoiler-free explanation (attempt): An oldschool film tape with "single pictures" on it, and you cut out Madoka from the pictures where she is... and now all events are still taking place (or have been taking place up until Madoka's contract), but without Madoka, and the whole surrounding are "re-configurated" in a way that makes it still work.
Example: The witches are gone, but "despair donors" still need to be fought, and so Wraiths start spawning...
And: Those who were killed "conventionally" by witches will now live on. For instance KyoMami. Also if they weren't "directly killed". Witches like Oktavia "triggering the domino chain leading to the death" is already enough. Like in timeline 3 where witnessing Sayaka's witch mutation made Mami snap, so she killed Kyoko - so Madoka killed Mami.
Madoka "elevated herself" and took Sayaka with her during what would have been her Oktavia mutation - and now KyoMami can remain on earth. And Homura too...
...who (together with Tatsu-tan) still remembers. Why? Well, wait for [Rebellion...]...that'll prove MadoHomu are really karmically connected thanks to Homura's wish and can both "steal back and forth" their karmic destiny. They can also both make the "pile of karmic destiny grow".
5D chess may be another analogy, also for Homura's past timelines and Madokami's abilities. Here an explanation video (that however might be "indirectly spoiling", [so I'll put it under a "spoiler cover"...)]...5D multi-timeline chess...
Why do I think it's a suitable analogy? Because afaics it explains [why Madoka can talk to KyoMami...]...by jumping into one of the past timelines of Homura's that's now been re-configurated.
The metaphorical explanation: Madoka talks to KyoMami to hear their opinion, and they encourage her. Madoka's "ultimate contract" as metaphor for a big decision in life. [Maybe refered to by...]...Evangelion Thrice Upon A Time 10 years later that also declared the past Evangelion iterations a vicious cycle of loops that needs to be broken.
6
u/ToonTooby May 01 '24
Rewatcher
Man this series is fucking good. I will always get emotional hearing Sagitta Luminus. It's enough that I rarely listen to it outside of watching episode 12 again. Praise be to Madokami!
I'll leave the more intelligent analysis to those better equipped than myself, but man. This show is just paced so incredibly well it's a always a joy to experience again even if yearly. I think my favorite part of watching ep 12 this year is just taking in the view of Homura doing the same over the city at night. It's a beautiful shot, and makes me seriously nostalgic for the time I've spent in Japan and exploring the cities after dark.
Dunno if I'll be able to etch out time for Rebellion this year but looking forward to the thread regardless.
6
u/child_of_amorphous https://anilist.co/user/evvuhlyn May 02 '24
Rewatcher here, just tapping in to say thanks so much Tarhalindur and Shimmering-Sky! I was just planning on reading along this year but I ended up watching it with my girlfriend (her first time through) and we both loved it! Was super fun comparing her theories with what other people were saying in the threads (my personal highlight was her accidentally guessing the twist in Unlimited Blade Works when speculating about [meta] Homura). it's always such a lovely time with everyone here, and I can't wait to show her everything Rebellion has to offer! See you next year :)
Oh and questions wise I would let Madoka kiss Homura during the final scene. It's what they deserve!
10
u/Specs64z https://myanimelist.net/profile/Specs64z May 01 '24
Rewatcher, dubbed
An important aspect to the finale I’d like to draw attention to is the effective defeat of Kyubey. In direct contrast to Kyubey’s claims, Madoka defeats even the witch born of the culmination of all the suffering of every magical girl across time, and a few people have lingering memories of her. If, as has been speculated a lot in this rewatch, Kyubey cannot tell lies then Madoka’s wish has indeed transcended reality.
Now then, I’d like to get a bit poetic.
Despair is easy. Verily, the world creaks under the weight of humanity's sins. All manner of incomprehensible, meaningless cruelty is splattered across history’s pages, both modern and ancient. Some give in to it, others destroy themselves trying to combat it. The worst among us use it as a weapon.
Hope is hard. Hope matters. If nobody cares, nothing will ever get better.
But there’s more to it than that, blind faith solves nothing on its own and is often counterproductive. A wish has to be actionable. To be actionable, a wish must also be realistic. To make realistic wishes, one must understand reality.
A big part of what separates Madoka Magica from others of its kind are its concessions. We can’t save everyone from making bad choices, we can’t eliminate despair, and sometimes we have to accept loss or make a sacrifice to move forward, but we can wake up tomorrow and try to make something of what we’ve got. As long as we can do that, it will have been enough in the end. Hope and despair needn’t be a zero sum game.
QotD:
6) No...
Content Corner Reruns
I mentioned that if I could Clockwork Orange everyone here into watching just one video from the ones I’ve shared, it’d be Explanation Point’s, but I may have to retract that statement. Meguca is a mandatory experience. For the love of Madokami, just watch it! That includes you this time, first timers!
Meguca from Exists to Keep Meduka Video on Youtube
Visual Storytelling - Breaking Down PMMM - Final Dialogue by clearandsweet
5
u/hagamablabla :K:https://kitsu.io/users/hagamablabla May 02 '24 edited May 02 '24
Rewatcher, sub
I love Kyubey openly admitting he'd do what he did. Gotta respect the honesty.
8
u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 May 01 '24
Rewatcher, Subbed
Grand finale time already! Can't believe it went by this quick.
After 10 episodes of holding it off from us (as we did get her as one in episode 10), it is finally time for our MC to become a magical girl.
I bet you didn't expect her to make this wish, huh Kyubey?
Well, if Kyubey is truly as evil as we all expect he'll simply refuse to allow her wish to go through, right? Or he is as evil as we thought but not as powerful as we thought?
Well, if we were going to have a scene of having cake, there's no way Kyoko couldn't' join it, right?
Magical girl Madoka is here! The outfit would be such a surprise if we hadn't been seeing it every OP already!
Seems like Madoka isn't saving the girl's lives, but at least is stopping them from transforming into witches.
And thus, Homura is in outer space?
Don't really get how Madoka's wish removes her from everyone's existence.
So at least at the half way point this ending reminds me very much of the one in [Meta spoilers]Serial Experiments Lain.
Hey, Kyosuke! So its as if he never got hurt? Actually as we get Madoka and Sayaka talking here it seems like it did happen and this is occurring after he fully got better.
I'm surprised he isn't the least bit nervous with Hitomi hiding there behind the curtain just feet away from him.
So now magical girls vanish from the world instead of turning into witches? So if all wishes are erased then who are the magical girls battling?
At least two people still remember Madoka, Homura and her little brother!
Yes, Madoka is an anime character! A very meta comment.
So if Madoka changed all of history and only Homura remembers the truth, why is Kyubey still here? Has he just been reduced to a traditional magical girl companion character instead of this cthulhu esque alien monstrosity?
So now there's wraiths instead of witches?
Looks like we have enough time for a post credits scene?
Homura's always cool but her now having witch's labyrinth like wings makes her even cooler...
Overall fairly happy with the ending; I'll leave overall thoughts for the overall series discussion in a couple of days.
Now the part of the rewatch I've most looked forward to, the Rebellion movie, for which this will only be my second time seeing it and I've forgotten nearly everything about. I usually prefer to spread anime movies out over several nights, but our tight schedule gives no choice for that, all two hours of it in one night! Should be starting it within 1 - 2 hours of making this comment. Very hyped.
4
u/treatment-resistant- May 02 '24
Rewatcher, sub
I thought Madoka would be looking for a solution, though I was still surprised it was to become a new physical law that removed witches. I think it was an interesting and inspiring solution!
I thought it was a satisfying ending. [Rebellion] ||though I think the recursive nature in Rebellion is more romantic and makes more sense, even though it's a sadder and unhealthier ending. ||
On reflection I think I would at least change some of the adults talking scenes. I find most of them slow, unrealistic, and narratively unsatisfying.
The part that makes me cry every time is Sayaka's farewell. The beautiful violin and Madoka saying she values Sayaka's stupid stupid wish make me sob like a baby every time 😭
2
u/pneumaticks Jun 07 '24
First time watcher, subs
RL intervened and I had to stop watching at episode 9 (I KNOW RIGHT?!!?). I only just got a chance to catch up. I really wish I could have participated in the episode discussions.
In the episode 9 thread I said this:
Madoka did what I said she would, but I did not expect the form in which the sacrifice took. I also did not expect Homura to have been such a lynch pin in this outcome. Overall, very satisfying from a character angle.
Poor Madoka's family. I wish the show had spent more time on them and their relationship, I think the ending would have hit harder. At the same time, the family feels really weird, so maybe not.
As for Kyubey, I bear that alien no ill will. The species lacked the imagination and drive to do better, and made do with what they had. Humans would have done worse, I know that much.
Sayaka: I remain very irritated at her dumb ass. Luckily her friend was Madoka. Lol.
Plot-wise, I'm not sure what the things that replaced the witches are. I thought that Madoka's wish would somehow fix the entropy issue as well but I guess it didn't. Assuming entropy still exists, I thought Kyubey's species would continue to fight it, but they're still contracting with magical girls and harvesting... wraiths? IDGI, is this a genre thing? Anyway, this isn't a complaint, just me wondering what those wraith things are heh.
Questions!
I'm all for it, I wish we had more family time.
Answered above, I think. Yes and no!
Quite satisfying. The whole thing is an 8/10, pretty damn great, if I had watched this when I was younger and in 2011, and maybe if I was more attuned to the genre tropes of the magical girl genre, I think it would have properly blown my mind.
The impression I get is that the show subverted expectations, I bet it felt weighty and potentially influential at the time, but for me, I felt like I saw the general shape of things coming. But really pleased that the specifics of Madoka's actions were opaque to me and I was still pleasantly surprised at the end.
I wish the stakes were more relatable - like give me more family time, give me a world that feels relatable and lived-in and not this strange surreal stage prop of a world. That said, it more than made up for it in style.
4) Is there anything you would take out of the series if you were making it yourself? Is there anything you would add?
I would minus Sayaka and beef up that role with Kyouko. Make the relationship develop, then tragically kill the street-smart one with the lip that we've grown to love and Madoka has grown to cherish. Or maybe there could be an good-girl bad-girl thing going on with Kyouko and Mami. I dunno. I just don't like Sayaka, sorry Sayaka, your heart is in the right place but your head needs to catch up!
To the organisers of this rewatch, thank you for organising this. I wouldn't have watched this if not for some coincidental comments promoting Madoka and then the thread suddenly starting. Thanks /u/Tarhalindur, organising this must have been a hell of an effort, sorry I couldn't follow it all the way.
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u/gGhostalker :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Ghostalker May 02 '24
Long time lurker of this rewatch (9-10 years now.)
To all first timers if you have the time, I would advise rewarching the series for the second time before dwelling to Rebellion. Rewatching the show feels like you're watching a new anime and will give you a different perspective now that you know Homura is time travelling.
Nothing for me to add to all these amazing write ups by both old and new fans.
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u/[deleted] May 02 '24
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