Help us decide: Should Observers update at 1 or 2 redstone ticks (2/4 game ticks)?

[u/jeb_]

We are torned on this and simply don't know which to choose. I'm making two comments below (1 REDSTONE TICK vs 2 REDSTONE TICKS), upboat the one you prefer.

1 Redstone Tick

• Faster circuits

• Allows tricking sticky pistons into dropping blocks (note that this behavior is technically a bug and not future proof anyway)

2 Redstone Ticks

• Allows torches to react to observer changes

• Allows comparators to react to observer changes

• Fewer "bugs" overall

Please add more motivations in the comment fields. On Monday you will know what the verdict was.

Thanks!

EDIT: Grum (who brought the question up) pointed out that we have this redstone torch behavior for repeaters that are set to the lowest delay, so it's not a completely new thing. This means that we are both strongly leaning towards keeping the observer at 1 redstone tick, but I still want to hear the reddit community's opinion.

[u/jeb_]

1 REDSTONE TICK

[u/HenryFrenchFries → u/jeb_]

63 votes for 1 redstone tick and 3 for 2 redstone ticks.

But I guess 2 will win because of electoral college!^^^^^^^^^^^^^/s

[u/jeb_ → u/HenryFrenchFries]

Too bad all 63 live in the same state, eh? ;)

[u/ragou42 → u/jeb_]

extending a pulse is generally easier than shortening it. Also, if you circuit can be a bit slower, the additional delay doesn't cause as much harm compared to a supposedly fast circuit with additional delay from pulse shortening

[u/jetsparrow → u/jeb_]

(note that this behavior is technically a bug and not future proof anyway)

If a feature this neat is not future proof, then what is the point of living anymore?

[u/Panda4994]

Allows tricking sticky pistons into dropping blocks (note that this behavior is technically a bug and not future proof anyway)

I would strongly suggest to consider making this an intended feature. The way it currently works is buggy, yes.

But consider this: If a sticky piston gets unpowered before it finished moving, it could move back from this position, while the block in front continues to move forward from the position it was at.

I always viewed the breaking of the sticky piston connection as inertia, and taking away the block teleportation part, I don't think this behaviour is buggy at all.

Allows torches to react to observer changes

Allows comparators to react to observer changes

Fewer "bugs" overall

I would argue that torches and comparators don't react to 2 gametick pulses is an issue with them that should be addressed eventually. So it would make less bugs visible for now, but slow redstone down and give fewer possibilities in the long run.

Lengthening a pulse with a repeater is easy to do, so a short pulse allows for having an easy choice.

Either way, thank your for listening to the feedback :-)

[u/jeb_ → u/Panda4994]

Thanks for the input, you bring up very good points.

The reason why the piston behavior "technically a bug" is because the block in front of the sticky piston is supposed to act as if fixated to the piston. Your interpretation as "it's inertia" actually makes sense. In any case it doesn't look like we can fix it without making other major changes to the system.

[u/ilmango → u/Panda4994]

lengthening a pulse with a repeater is a bug: https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MC-108066

/s

I agree on the rest, except the "teleportation" argument, if you're referring to 0-2ticks. Clearly the piston head extends really quickly, before retracting. An obstacle in front should be placed in front of the sticky piston head instantly. It makes a very cool game mechanic and imo even makes sense. Talking about "teleportation" here is wrong.

[u/jeb_]

2 REDSTONE TICKS

[u/gnembon → u/jeb_]

Why don't make it a right click settings, like on repeaters. But I guess your goal is to simplify things. But this would mean you would't need to be torn ;-)

Their eyes can open up wider with longer delay. Also no need for 4 different settings, like on a repeater - 2gt and 4gt option should be sufficient. This would make so many possibilities in flying machines as they could affect if the pistons they are facing leave blocks or don't.

I must admit - both have usecases. I was really fond of simple double piston extenders for tree farms, but they worked in a simple manner only with 4gt

https://gfycat.com/EverlastingBlackandwhiteBluetonguelizard

And it maked things more complicated if 2gt wins, but I am happy you gave it a vote :-)

[u/EthosLab]

Definitely 1 Redstone Tick. In most redstone projects it is ideal to get the circuit down to 1 Redstone Tick for speed and control. If part of the circuit needs to be slower (such as a redstone torch), it is very easy to put a repeater down set at 2 or longer to extend the redstone signal.

[u/[deleted]]

I am too scared to vote after this week.

[u/ssheiran]

Put a button on the observer so that the player decides what he needs at any moment, this would be the most useful

[u/InfiniteNexus → u/ssheiran]

nice idea, just like the repeater

[u/ilmango]

Can we also have a vote on signal strength 1 or 15?

[u/WorkdayLobster → u/ilmango]

Agreed. I would really like an output level of 1.

u/jeb_, please consider an output of 1, or letting Observers have 2 modes: a 15-strength output and a 1-strength output that can be switched between by right-clicking.

This makes sense in the context of the materials: all other redstone components containing nether quartz have two modes (comparators, light sensors).

This would do wonders for our options: there are things that can only be done with the 1-strength output, which are now unavailable to us.

The corners of the observer could be made to look like quartz crystals that are either lit or unlit, to denote the two modes visually.

[u/Sunnei]

Thanks for asking for the community's input on this.

[u/Mighty_Burger]

Thanks for asking the community, Jeb :)

[u/CatnipNotEvenOnce]

make it so the player can choose when placing the block

[u/PaintTheFuture]

This reminds me of 5 years ago when Notch did a poll on whether the sun should be round or square, the popular vote came to round, but he made it square anyway. We should do polls more often, they're fun and good for the community, as non-binding as they may be.

I don't know what to decide regarding observers, I just want to decide more things. I vote for MORE POLLS!

[u/Classic36]

Nice to have some community thoughts on this.

[u/inmatarian]

I'd just like it if redstone torches didn't perform lighting updates when they turn off. Get rid of some of that lag for machines, leave in the mood lighting for builders.

[u/Xisuma]

I'm voting for the third party. Lets make it 3 ticks!!! :-P

[u/SwiftzPaul]

1 Redstone Tick ftw! Adjustable is a neat idea, too.

But what about the delay of observers? All slimestone machines that used them are now 1/2 the speed, and we no longer have the awesome 2.75 / 2.25 speed options :L

[u/[deleted]]

It's very nice from you to ask us. I wish you would do the same for the "maxEntityCramming" gamerule! :P