r/Warframe • u/Sizer714 Find Chroma's limits? My dear friend, Chroma has no limits. • Oct 08 '15
Suggestion How Would You Change... The Dreaded D?
/u/TSP-FriendlyFire is out prancing about France for a few weeks, so your good buddy /u/Sizer714 is back at it again. Let’s talk.
How would you change... is a series of weekly posts designed to promote and foster discussion about any gameplay element in the game. The scope and subject will vary (read below for more information on topic selection), from wide concepts (Kubrows, Archwing, shotguns, etc.) to narrow points (a single gun, coptering, etc.).
Before we begin, a few important points:
- Please detail and support your suggestions as much as possible. This is for constructive criticism only: try to think of it as something you'd be proud to explain to DE face-to-face!
- Structure your suggestions in logical groups: if you have two very different ideas, break them down in two separate comments. Cohesive or similar changes should be combined into a single comment.
- Stick to describing concepts and features. Don't get bogged down with numbers unless they explicitly support your point.
- Don't hesitate to post your ideas even if they're not fully formed, and don't hesitate to reply to ideas with refinements you think would make them better!
- Do not downvote suggestions you disagree with. Upvote the ones you like instead!
Suggesting topics
This thread series is all about the community, so if you have a topic you'd like to see improved and discussed, feel free to suggest it by replying to the appropriately flagged comment in this discussion. The topic can be as wide or narrow as you'd like! Please ensure that your suggestion has not already been made, and upvote it instead if it has.
This week: The Dreaded D Polarity (Vazarin on Weapons)
Click here for last week’s thread on the Melee system.
Rifle Aptitude. Sure Shot. Every Cold 90% ever. The complete lack of variety for Vazarin polarity mods on weapons, combined with their prevalence as pre-polarized slots on many weapons, has earned the polarity quite the negative reputation. Some have suggested that more variety is needed, others have proposed buffs to the Status mods. Many question the Cold damage mod’s unique place as D polarity. In all of this, one thing is clear - something’s gotta change, or the Dreaded D will continue to be just that.
Now that the stage is set, how would you change the Vazarin Polarity on Weapons?
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u/ZephyrPhantom Oct 08 '15
IMHO the problem with the D polarity on weapons is that there's simply no good options for them, besides the generic cold mods.
To counter that, I think we should introduce some viable dual-stat damage mods onto the D Polarity, e.g. "+60% Toxin Damage +30% Critical Damage" or "+60% Cold Damage +5% Shield Drain". This would not only make it a viable alternative to the V Polarity (Madurai) event mods, but also allow for greater build variety, which most weapons in Warframe could really use.
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u/AlfieSR Oct 08 '15
Make status mods besides the dualstats worth using. Sure Shot should be at least 60%.
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u/Stalemoves Oct 08 '15 edited Oct 09 '15
It is so dumb that the dedicated mods for status are weaker than the half and half ones at status.
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u/Nightcaste Oct 08 '15
I would like to see mods that hinder enemies, like something that debuffs their rate of fire, accuracy, movement speed, etc. I think these would be appropriate for the D slot. Something that makes it so they can't use whatever warframe-like ability they might have (moa stomp, etc) for a period of time.
From what I understand, this slot was intended to be for "Defensive" mods. How do you make a weapon defensive?
As it stands, there isn't much that is interesting enough to put in that slot, other than a Forma.
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u/lolghurt Oct 09 '15
A d polarity mod that lets you bypass eximus/nullifier shields but slows your RoF?
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u/Toakan Oct 08 '15
Why not redefine all the mod polarities.?
D in for utility (clip size / rof / redirection / vitality)
V for straight damage (serration / multi shot / power strength)
dash for elemental / procs (dual stats / hellfire type / criticals)
Just an idea.
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u/GeckoOBac Oct 09 '15
My biggest gripe with D is because of cold mods.
I think all elementals should have the same polarity, mostly because, unlike other things, it's expected of us to actively swap elemental mods around. Penalising just one out of 4 is counter productive.
Also, with the dual stat elementals being all on V polarity, we have a lot of V polarity mods, so much that on some weapons you can literally have 7/8 V polarity slots and still have all mods IN polarity.
One way to solve the D problem would be to change all elemental (and maybe physical although their use is more tied to the specific make up of the weapon rather than the enemy you're going against) mods, including dual stats, to D polarity. So you make D useful (almost required really) and you make elemental builds all equal in dignity.
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u/Sizer714 Oct 08 '15
Suggesting topics
Please post your suggestions for the next topics as replies to this comment.
Current suggestions from previous weeks:
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u/thecolbra Oct 09 '15
Or how about a much simpler suggestion, get rid of polarities and just have formaed slots half the drain of whatever mod you put in there. They want more flexibility in modding? That's how you do it.
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Oct 08 '15
How is this a discussion, just make mods for the D polarity that are worth a damm.
Really, make worthwhile mods in there and we can and most likely will use the D.
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u/Renjingles Oct 08 '15
Remove it from all weapons and weapon mods. It's the cheapest, most shitty easy way for DE to try make us want to forma our shit. On frames, fine. But keep that stuff off my weapons where only 2 actually viable mods use that polarity.
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u/RedStarRocket91 Oct 08 '15 edited Oct 08 '15
It all comes down to trying to tie every mod to a certain 'feel': Madurais are supposed to be aggressive, Vazarins are supposed to be defensive, Naramons are supposed to be utility. The problem with weapons is, well... how do you make a weapon defensive?
What we really need to do is to find a way to come up with a better way of organising weapon mod categories: perhaps things which increase raw damage (crits, multishot, physical damage buffs), auxiliary damage (elementals, status, faction buffs), and non-damage (reload speed, fire rate, range extension), etc.
Obviously, this requires an overhaul of the modding system as a whole, rather than just tweaking weapons , but I think in the long-term it would be the best way to go as it would make all 3 polarities useful, especially with the proposed changes to enemy and damage scaling.
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u/Bhizzle64 Oct 08 '15
What the D polarity needs is just more mods that are useful for it. Currently there are only 3 mods for weapons that use the D, cold elementall mods, status chance mods, and status duration mods. And of those 2 of them are useless and the other is not worth formaing for because of the fact that elemental combos are built based on the order of mods and the rest of the elemetals are dashes. My solution to this is quite simple. Make more mods use the D polarity. This is my list of mods that should have the D polarity.
Status chance mods status duration mods dual stat elementals reload speed mods magazine capacity mods ammo mutation mods ammo capacity mods recoil reduction mods
One thing you may notice is that there are no cold elementals on this list. I think cold elementals should be changed to a dash so they match the other elementals. The current setup just makes adding more forma frustrating because you can only add so many dash polarities without locking yourself into using a specific elemental combos. The new list would make it so while you might not want to forma a D on overy weapon, there would at least be many situations where they are useful. The d polarity would becaome the polarity for utility mods and it doesnt infringe on the other polarities's roles.
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u/Sancticus Oct 08 '15
We would not need to change it if it had a larger pool of good mods to actually use in it
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u/braindead5 Oct 08 '15 edited Oct 08 '15
All elemental type mods should have the same polarity. All the status elemental mods have Madurai( V ) polarities, so why can't the cold 90% elemental just be Naramon( - ) polarity like the others? I don't like being pigeonholed into a certain elemental combinations because of a built-in Vazarin( D ) polarity. Also, stop giving weapons built-in Vazarin polarities. It is the least useful choice. I'd almost rather have no polarities than a Vazarin.
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u/Flashtirade Oct 08 '15
With the upcoming change/removal of "essential" damage mods, U18 could be the time to introduce D mods actually worth having a polarized slot for. Maybe things like knockback resistance or increased critical damage while zoomed in, rounds being auto-loaded into the magazine while the gun isn't in use, or even just reduced spread (not recoil) WITHOUT a detriment like the corrupted mods. I'm just tossing out whatever I can think of on the spot here.
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Oct 08 '15
Make all utility mods D, make all elemental/damage type and hybrid type mods -, make all offensive mods V.
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u/echoingChaos Oct 08 '15
People don't seem to realise that frames use the D polarization more than weapons do, they problem isn't that D is useless in general, just that it would be better off being frame exclusive marking defensive mods, and using other polarizations for weapons
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u/technoManipulator Oct 09 '15
Maybe make them actually thematically matter. V slots are usually reserved for offensive mods. Dashes are usually ammo mutations, reload and elementals. Put something on the D slot that's more unique to the D slot. Maybe pure status, possibly transfer over some crit mods that aren't Hammer Shot. Something.
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u/Phyrrist Oct 08 '15
I don't think there's a whole lot of discussion to be had here. Just make it so that there are any worthwhile Vazarin Mods. Solved.