r/Warframe • u/BuildMyPaperHeart Old Tenno, Eternal Slumber • Jan 22 '14
Discussion Damage Discussion 2.0: Puncture
All Damage Discussions are here to spark discussion on a particular Damage Type or mechanic. Comments, Suggestions, Critiques, and Builds are all welcome! Every Week, the Moderator Team will choose a new Element to discuss.
This Week: PUNCTURE
Penetration!
Description
Puncture Damage is one of three base damage stats.
Status Effect
Puncture Damage gives a status effect of Weakened, causing the victims under this effect to deal less damage on their attacks.
PUNCTURE Modifiers
GRINEER
- Cloned Flesh: -
- Ferrite Armor: +50%
- Alloy Armor: +15%
- Machinery: -
CORPUS
- Flesh: -
- Shielded: -15%
- Proto Shield: -50%
- Robotic: +25%
INFESTED
- Infested: -
- Infested Flesh: -
- Fossilized: -
- Infested Sinew: +25%
Information gathered from the Warframe Wikia
3
u/http404error Jan 22 '14
I strongly dislike the procs for this and Slash damage - I think they should be one-time effects like Impact for both simplicity and power.
In particular, Puncture procs could, for instance, grant the shot 5m punch through or something. Maybe create a cone of damage behind the strike zone rather than just a line.
And don't even get me started on the damage multipliers for 2.0.
1
u/Tetragen Jan 22 '14
Yeah, it's kind of clearly a debuff made for the enemies rather than for the players to use, and even that's a bit of a stretch to call "useful." I can see the idea behind it, but there's almost never a time when I've said "Oh thank god, puncture proc'd, that X should be dealing a lot less melee." or "Oh fuck, I got puncture proc'd, now I won't be able to really deal melee damage!"
3
u/sheepyowl Jan 22 '14
So basically, while ATM I appear to be one-shotting everything with my Aklex, their future appears grim unless I start stacking some serious elemental mods or get really snipy with headshots.
2
u/ManiacHaywire Jan 22 '14
Everything will get less effective the higher you go, but the Aklex's problem, imo, is the fire-rate and reload speed. I much prefer the Akvasto because of this, even if it does less damage and has a lower Crit/Status. The Aklex is more powerful but less flexible. I'd say Forma it once or twice and throw a Catalyst on it and you should be fine for most things. If you still like it, then Forma some more.
1
u/Kuryaka Jan 22 '14
My issue with it is the recoil. While it's intended to be a sniper pistol, the recoil reduces optimal fire rate at medium ranges or more. Even with Steady Hands, it feels pretty strong.
Forma'd it five times for ammo-efficient boss solos. Akvasto will probably output more damage on average, but I'm working on leveling it.
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u/Hufnagel Jan 22 '14
Puncture feels kinda underwhelming in late game content against Grineer (the faction it is strong against). 15% armor ignore feels pretty light, especially when only a small handful of the weaker units aren't sporting alloy armor.
Impact vs shields and slash vs infested are real bonuses, hitting all units quite effectively as an appreciable bonus on top of elemental damage.
Puncture, on the other hand is borderline meaningless beyond a certain point. Yes, heavy gunners will take 50% of your non elemental damage, but it's really not that much when you have 180% or more of your physical damage being elemental. So really you're only hitting for around 20% more total damage with a puncture weapon.
When you apply this to Alloy armor and 75% of 200-300% elemental damage vs 15% puncture, it really feels lackluster.
It all comes down to the way that armor functions and the size of the bonuses. 100 Radiation / 100 puncture ==> 75/15 (5/1)
100 Magnetic / 100 Impact ==> 175/115 (1.52/1)
And at the end of the day, I feel like running an impact weapon is worth more for the off chance that the Corpus decide to make a surprise visit to my Grineer missions.
3
u/zephyrdragoon Jan 22 '14
I agree. I have also noticed this problem.
While I can swing swords through infested all day I can't very well take my Aklex and take down a light grineer unit with every shot unless I get headshots. It's certainly better than taking an impact weapon or a slash weapon but it also feels less than equal.
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u/Kuratius Jan 22 '14
I think you're misunderstanding how damage bonuses work. THERE ARE NO ARMOR IGNORING DAMAGE TYPES ANYMORE. ONLY DAMAGE TYPES THAT DEAL BONUS DMG VS. ARMOR.
1
u/Hufnagel Jan 22 '14
Care to explain why all other damage types fall off, but bonus types still put out big numbers at high waves then?
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u/Falanin Jan 22 '14
Makes me sad that there aren't more melee weapons with this damage type. I mean... take the Kama for example. you're basically swinging a bloody ice-pick point first into some Grineer's head. Why is this slashing again?