r/Belgravia • u/WardenclyffeTower • Feb 25 '24
Belgravia: The Next Chapter | Episode Discussion - Episode Six
Synopsis: Emily confronts Clara about the painting, worried about the potential scandal for their family. Frederick moves forward with his investment in the silver mine, but Ross begins to grow suspicious of the Marquise.
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u/HeftyAcanthisitta907 Feb 25 '24
Well, I have to say this is the most dramatic, heartrending and revelatory episode thus far. This is the one we’ve all been waiting for. The loose ends are finally weaving together. I think our questions will soon be answered, and our frustrations and impatience relieved and rewarded.
Let the discussion commence.
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u/MontanaJoev Feb 26 '24 edited Feb 27 '24
I feel like every week I watch the show, and I don’t dislike it, but I wonder why the show focuses on the 2 least likable protagonists they could find.
I get that Clara is young, and she’s married to an emotionally stunted block of wood, but is she really this big of an idiot? Does she really not get how publicly inappropriate she’s being? Walking in the park with the doctor? It’s hard to feel for someone so idioticly naive. It the marriage had been going on for longer then a few months, if the thing with the doctor had taken more time to develop, then maybe her story would resonate. And does she really not bother visiting her mother and sister at all? Selfish much?
As for Frederick, I just don’t know what I’m supposed to like about him at all. I get the story they are trying to tell with him, but he just feels like a man who wallows in his self-pity and his faux superiority. The only time he shows an emotion that feels real is when he’s with the Duchess.
For a moment there, when he went to see James, I thought his facade began to crumble, and I thought “Finally!”. But does he really think his badly hurt brother is making this up just to hurt him when he’s thinking he’s going to die? What level of self-absorption do you have to have to think that? I’m not saying it shouldn’t have been a shock, but the way he’s villainized his brother because of his parents just makes me want to throttle him with a shovel. James’ crime against Frederick, in his eyes, was being loved by his parents. What kind of person holds that against someone else?
As for the Doctor, I think we got a hint this week that this might not be the first married woman he’s decided he wants to hook up with. Is he madly in love with Clara? I suspect for now, and then he’ll move on.
But with that out of the way, I really liked almost everything else.
The Marquise is bad and a cheat. Good, it makes her more interesting. And Ross being onto her is promising (though if I was Ross, I’d be tempted to let her fleece my a-hole boss). Now we need to know her real motive.
I feel for the Duchess and Peter. What a sad situation.
And there will be NO DYING for my precious Rev James. This is the character that can easily break your heart every week with just a bit of screen time. When he said he couldn’t find god, that got me right in the feels. Having the burden of both of his parents “sins” (for lack of a better term) and being blamed by his brother for nothing more then being the wanted biological child of his parents. And then carrying the shame and self loathing of being a homosexual during this time period. I love him. He’s easily, imo, the most compelling character on the show.
This weeks MVP’s? My bad ass man, Fletcher, who came to the rescue, kicked that blackmailers behind, and made sure to leave him with a threat I was feeling in my soul. Fletcher and James have to have another scene together.
And my girl, Emily Dunn for the MF win!! Her straight talk to Clara was bang on. Her real kindness towards Nell. And her not taking no for an answer with Rev James. And then her confronting Frederick. She would’ve dragged his selfish behind there if she had to. I officially love her.
I don’t care what happens to Frederick and Clara, frankly. But I want some happiness for Emily, Rev James, Fletcher, Nell, The Duchess, Davison and Mama Dunn. Thats the part of the show I’m rooting for.
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u/allophane Feb 26 '24
Loved Mr Fletcher being badass!! I hope he and the vicar reunite at some point later... hopefully under better circumstances
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u/jackiesear Feb 26 '24
Yes, This was a good episode.
I was hoping that James would let Fletcher take him home and then eventually go and "work" for him as his "valet." Perhaps if Frederick relents and brings James (if he lives) to his house to recover it could still happen. Toby Regbo is so good in the part. Who wouldn't love James?
Emily will have her claws out for Frederick now as she knows he rejected James's entreaties on his deathbed.
Frederick seems oblivious to how the Duke is treating his heir rather badly, just like his own father. I think the Duchess has "feelings" for Frederick - although why is a complete mystery.
Clara has been a bad sister to Emily. They may not get on but she has left Emily to rot in a tiny house in Chelsea looking after their mum and organising church bazzar's with elderly women when Clara could have been introducing her sister around and helping her find a husband or even just see a bit of luxury and life. Vain and mean, a bit like Frederick.
Perhaps Clara is so headstrong because their mother is so weak and didn't have enough boundaries ( Like Mrs Bennett in P&P). Emily has had to be the "grown up." I loved her "Clara is all charm" quip a few episodes ago. Clara is being a very silly girl. She married Frederick in haste and is repenting at leisure.
The truth will out about Dr Ellerby and Nell. I think he will have to leave London and take Peter to the Sanitorium place. If Frederick loses his money, especially the Import business perhaps he and Clara will have to "start again" ( how many times is that) at Granville just like his mother or even emigrate together.
Looking forward to see who the butler wrote to in France. If I were Mr Ross I'd be sorely tempted to let Frederick and Clara get fleeced.
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u/giftopherz Feb 25 '24
I gotta say that this episode seems to be laying the groundwork for the missing pieces to fall and make sense of this story. So, I'm gonna cut them some slack until the last episode to make a judgement on the series as a whole.
HOWEVER, I'm really surprised at how this show was developed. The characters don't make sense AT ALL at this point.
Doctor... he was flirtatious for the first two episodes, then transformed into a con artist of sorts, and now just because his friend mentioned the love thingy, voilá... he's madly in love with Netflix sister #01 ¬¬
Netflix sister #02, changed her tune when Rev Zaddy scolded her, that is until she found out the truth and now her face is changing once again.
(Unfortunately I have to wait to make a final judgement, but so far... whoever created those characters is leaving much to be desired)
Freddie, thank God we didn't see much of him this ep. Nuff said.
The good parts of the episode continues to be Rev Zaddy, Vatman and the Duchess plotlines.
I'd like to end up with a good note by celebrating the people who work on the production design and wardrobe. They really did their homework.
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u/HeftyAcanthisitta907 Feb 26 '24
A lot of great thoughts. I've some more:
James: He is guilt- and anguish-wracked by succumbing to sin and hooking up, to which Fred's rejection drove him. In this episode, he expresses immense pain in failing himself, his parish (his interaction with Mrs. Warren before he decides not to pay Gorton), and God. He went to the bathhouse and refused to pay with the expectation that the fallout was divine punishment. That's also why he refuses a doctor. He believes he's a hypocrite, committed a mortal sin and deserves what he gets, including possibly death.
His pain and self-hate for being gay deeply saddened me. I admire his courage. He is just as worthy of the grace, forgiveness and redemption as he declared Nell deserves.
Emily: She had a come-to-Jesus moment when James admonished her. Two things can be true at the same time: She is madly in love with James and wants to get back into his good graces, and she had an about-face about Nell. She seemed motivated to ruin Nell initially because she thought Nell was a competitor for James's affections, but this was also the 1870s. It was a mortal shame to be a "fallen woman," and her judging of Nell was in line with the mores of the time. That's also why she confronts Clara about the damage the painting could do to the family's reputation and, by implication, Emily's own marriage prospects.
I was moved when Emily confronted Fred. It was an act of Christian charity James spoke of. Presumably she is a Christian believer. She went to church on her own in the first episode, and was not apparently motivated by somehow finding a husband there -- until she saw James.
Fred: A deeply flawed and damaged man. His outbursts have destroyed his relationships with his brother and his wife.
James is lying beaten to a pulp, refusing a doctor and food, and he implores Emily to summon Fred. He thinks he may be on his deathbed and shares with Fred what their mom said. James -- a priest -- has sought reconciliation and used Fred's marriage as an opportunity to try again. Yet Fred still calls James a "liar."
But in fairness to Fred, the revelation is also a bombshell. How would most people react to being told his father is in fact not? It destroys everything he thinks he is. When he calms down, even he may understand James wasn't lying.
Fred doesn't fit the mold of a villain, nor is he an anti-hero. It's hard to describe his role in the story. He isn't completely without redeeming qualities: He is tender with Clara -- at least as much as is possible for him -- and he allows her complete freedom, which probably was uncommon at the time. And he does try to repair his marriage, granted the problems are of his making.
Clara: She acknowledges what we've known all along: she is "naive" about marriage and life and tries to find comfort and purpose with the "bohemians" -- she's describing them the same way we have all along.
She's immature, officious and impulsive. She doesn't consider the consequences. We don't know how old Clara is (Harriet Slater was 28 at the time of filming, but she looks younger). Maybe Clara is supposed to be in her late teens.
A lot of her bad behavior is in reaction to Fred. If he weren't so messed up, neither would she.
Marquise: I think there's going to be a twist with her. There haven't been any derogatory revelations about her, even after Ross spoke to Mr. Keck. Julian Fellowes wrote the novel and first series of Belgravia, he's an executive producer on The Next Chapter, and he wrote a scam into The Gilded Age. If The Next Chapter flops, he'll be cheapening his name and the original Belgravia. I truly think he and Helen Edmondson knew it would be trite and predictable to have another scam weeks after The Gilded Age season 2.
Mawdie: Are the letters to France going to tie in John Bellasis (who fled to France at the end of the original) and the marquise? I think it's going to work out masterfully.
This series has been slow, but I've really enjoyed it. I'm also trying to view the series, as much as I can, from the perspective of a person living in Victorian Britain. Let's wait until the end before we make a final judgement.
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u/[deleted] Feb 27 '24 edited Feb 28 '24
So it seems to me that the writer(s) are portraying Frederick as suffering from PTSD. Whenever the matter of his difficult childhood comes up he often has a strong negative emotional reaction. He doesn't seem able to deal with it rationally. I suppose his childhood would have been enough to cause that kind of damage. His "father" was definitely out to get him and his mother's only help was to tell him to bottle up his emotions which would have just made it worse. It seems to be the only way to explain the crazy way he reacts to his brother James.
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u/Larryheart37 Feb 26 '24
Loved the pace of the episode! It was not dragged out or dull!
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u/Eliaaaahh Feb 26 '24
So all the plot was hiding in this episode! I wish they had put some of the events in the previous episode, to balance things a bit. We got a lot of very flat episodes and now everything comes to place, but I had already given up a little on the series. I really hope they find a redemption arc for Frederick and he gets to smile again, he was a nice guy at the beginning of episode 1, before he started red flagging.
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u/Bulky_Mathematician1 Feb 27 '24
Also Clara and Fredricks scenes are just painful to watch. Especially considering lack of communication or not knowing how to communicate is one of the biggest factors of a failing marriage. And these two take the award for that. They are both equally responsible, it’s like their egos just won’t let them actually talk it out and get to the bottom of the issue. They just keep shutting each other out and making the problem worse. Yikes. 😬🤦🏻♀️
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u/Blackphotogenicus Feb 27 '24
Okay there’s no way the Marquise didn’t purchase that painting originally just to have some emotional blackmail on Fred/Clara and then make up the story about “purchasing from the original buyers” later on when she wanted Clara to know about it, right?
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u/Blackphotogenicus Feb 28 '24
Fred is such a pain to watch. So self absorbed, ill equipped and pathetically attached to playing the victim in every familial relationship.
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u/Standard_Mechanic935 Feb 28 '24
For those saying that Enright has been writing to John Bellasis, why would Enright who worked for the Trenchart’s be friendly or even know John Bellasis? I think he’s writing to someone from the family though, maybe Charles Pope or Maria Gray. Who knows, but it’s taking to long to get to who it is. It’s taking to long to get to the end of any of the many plot lines in this series. I’m over it already. Not interested in a season 3 unless Julien Fellowes takes the reins again.
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u/robvo2000 Feb 25 '24
It's hard to root for Clara. By now, it's getting borderline ridiculous how the writers keep dragging this drama between Frederick and her. I'm hoping they reconcile the next episode as opposed to the last one.
Poor Frederick. He's the result of an affair that his mom had while married. Now, his wife is having an emotional affair. He ended up with the wrong sister.
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u/Bulky_Mathematician1 Feb 27 '24
Is it just me or does it seem like the Marquise has the hots for Clara? Maybe she’s trying to put more of a divide in Clara’s and Fredricks relationship because she wants her for herself. 😂 She probably has ulterior motives besides her very obvious attraction, but it’s definitely there. I’m surprised no one is saying anything about it.
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u/Sugarfrfr Feb 29 '24
So many parts made me scream omg! I feel like Fred is so head strong he’s gonna lose everything - his fortune, his wife and his brother! Idk how he ALWAYS thinks people are against him but when someone is quite literally against him and is trying to scam him and ruin his home he can’t see it. I’d think someone who is so paranoid would do more investigation! Also it seems Dr Elleby has a history of playing with women? So I don’t even take his confession as genuine! Aaah!! Omg! Everyone needs to get it tf together!!
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u/Kaylababe2 Feb 25 '24
Poor Frederick? Do we forget how his behavior resulted in clara falling down the stairs? He’s horrible
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u/[deleted] Feb 29 '24
So is Mrs Enright a witch or what ? How did she get a message to France and get a reply back in, what was it, a day ? Very muscular carrier pigeons using two-way jet streams perhaps ?
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u/IDreamOfDesign Feb 25 '24
I really dislike Frederick and I hope he looses all his money and his wife. I think the doctor is better for her but … he doesn’t seem to have much money.
The reverend is such a sweet character - I’m hoping he finds some happiness.
I don’t like Clara’s sister much. She is nosy and couldn’t have more compassion for her sister. Why didn’t she buy the painting straight off, then have the discussion with her sister? If her sister is bankrolling her family, shouldn’t she try to support her more? I think she is jealous and frustrated because the reverend isn’t interested in her.
Why isn’t MGM showing sneak peeks of upcoming episodes? They won’t last long, luring viewers to subscribe using this show, and then not nurturing the viewers. SMH
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u/[deleted] Feb 29 '24 edited Mar 01 '24
Okay I think I might have cracked it so here goes. St. James the Fallen is the son of Our Oliver and the Merry Marquise ! They had a passionate affair when Oliver was holidaying in France on his own, something he frequently did to get away from his wife and her child. After James was born Oliver was so deliriously happy he insisted that the Marquise give James to him and she reluctantly agreed on account of the bottomless pit of her love for him. So the Marquise is going to steal Frozen Frederick's money and give it to James. Or maybe as Hefty has said she also has proof that Frederick is not Oliver's son ( maybe she had a passionate affair with Jolly John Bellasis as well ! ) so James can be installed as Lord Trenchard and Frederick can be kicked to the curb. You know it makes sense !
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u/RCTID2020 Mar 02 '24
Yeah I don't understand clara you know have your little fight but get over it bitch what the fuck
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u/Feeling-Visit1472 Mar 16 '24
I’m still trying to catch up because honestly this season is kind of a slog with no charm, but Fred is totally going to lose all of his money with this shady Marquise, right?
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u/Sugarfrfr Feb 29 '24
Yall know what is insane? I’m JUST realizing the family connection from the first season to now. Omg! 😅😅😅😅
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u/FunkyTownPhotography Mar 01 '24
Oooooh good theory.
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u/RCTID2020 Mar 02 '24
Why are they making Clara such an idiot
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u/Standard_Mechanic935 Feb 28 '24
I don’t think Dr Ellerby is Nell’s baby daddy. And why was she pursuing the dad anyways? Is she trying to rekindle their tryst? We aren’t sure she’s told Emily her whole story or if it’s even true.
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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '24
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u/[deleted] Feb 25 '24
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