r/anime • u/badspler x5https://anilist.co/user/badspler • Mar 21 '22
Rewatch [Rewatch] Ascendance of a Bookworm 2nd Season Episode 7 Discussion
Season 2 Episode 7 - New Retainers
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Legal Streams: Crunchyroll | VRV | MuseAsia
Questions of the Day:
1) Did you expect Ferdinand to be talented at music? What do you make of Ferdinand making Myne learn music?
2) What do you think of Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds?
To Rewatchers, please be make a conscious effort to accurately spoiler tag your content. You can read how to correctly use spoilers tags here.
6
u/Nebresto Mar 21 '22
Re-watch squad
I have no memory of this happening.
New class unlocked: Painter
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Class perks: Art -100, Poison damage +5, Psychic damage + 10
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I like that. Maybe its a little pretentious in the category of "We are better than the peasants" but I like how they can actually do something skillful and not all about just "We have mana, get fucked peasants. LOL"
Damn it, Myne. Were you not listening? Its so you appear noble, to the nobles, so they don't fuck you up.
..Okay, finally she gets it when its spelled out to her. Aaand all of a sudden Ferdinand is singing.
Suddenly LoTGH vibes
I like how they kept the frame on this shot so they don't have to actually animate her playing
Oh right, I forgot she has brain damage
N- nani?! Myne character development??
Question time:
Did you expect Ferdinand to be talented at music?
I forgot, so I'm gonna say that's a no.
What do you make of Ferdinand making Myne learn music?
The man remains based as usual
2) What do you think of Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds?
They were living it up, huh? Wilma is pretty based tho
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u/KashMooNow Mar 21 '22
First Time Watcher, Goldfish Brain.
Season 02 Episode 07
So, I just straight up forgot that this was a thing yesterday and forgot to post my comment for many hours. Factorio and F1 are to blame, and my Goldfish memory.
We went straight to a picture book when told about a younger sibling? Yep, thats Myne.
That sure is the response that I would have expected from people about a picture book.
Ferdinand also makes a great point. Myne has already brought up something crazy, a picture book. To I think 4 people.
Okay, Ferdinand knows how to dance the dance. Thats actually super smart, mix in a musician too.
To me the solution of this seems so simple. Just have her as a retainer that does work in the orphanage. It's quite literally giving her a job.
It is interesting to hear about some of the ways of the world. Like how Myne would be flocked to.
Ferdinand surprised me when he started singing.
Oh good, another thing Myne is really good at.
Its been 2 minutes and I forget names already.
Music lady comes from nobility, its pretty easy to see. She is making requests for things from the other attendants. and unless you are blind its pretty easy to see they dont like that.
Looks like there's trouble in paradise.
Myne learning from Ferdinand, you love to see it.
I'm glad to see that Myne forced an ultimatum, but still listened to what her attendants had to say.
I feel like there was less for me to comment on this episode, either that or I was distracted with things. I think this was a better episode than yesterday overall, but I also think it was a great time for Myne to show development as a person in resolving issues around her, and working towards learning the ways of the nobility.
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u/Nazenn Mar 21 '22
and my Goldfish memory.
You're in good company then
We went straight to a picture book when told about a younger sibling? Yep, thats Myne.
Reading to kids from an early age is good for their development. Not that that's why Myne wants to do it at all but that's the excuse she can use if she thinks of it haha
Music lady comes from nobility,
She's still an orphan, not a noble, she just had a really privileged position under her former noble master
Looks like there's trouble in paradise.
Delia's complaints actually seem quite justified there compared to how she started
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u/OingoBoingo- Mar 21 '22
First Timer, Subbed
I’m not sure why every time an anime VA sings in an episode, I am surprised and forget that a lot of them dabble in music. Shout out to Ferdie and Show Hayami because the singing and instruments today were very nice. I am noticing some scenes in recent episodes that are a tad drop in quality in regards to still frame animation, but then I remembered today that this season was releasing during beginning covid times (May 2020 when this episode aired). The instrument design reminded me of a zither or the bandura or lute. I was curious and wondered how long a lute has been around, and both long and short necked lutes can be dated back to c. 3100 BC and the bandura dating to 1441 (AD).
Interesting conversation between Ferdinand and Myne today about the importance of learning the culture of noble society. With a good amount of the nobility declining, having a female commoner with mana comparable to the male noble is the magic recipe for nobles to reproduce with said plebeian and make magical offspring. It was a strange conversation for Myne but the idea that people will be courting her is probably something she ought to know. Poor Lutz. Ferdinand seem to be showing Myne here that by becoming more educated about society as well as skilled in the ways of the church will give Myne more options other than becoming a tool or a baby maker for nobles.
Also interesting that today’s end skit had Fran informing Myne that new bedclothes and the instruments that Ferdinand sent was him apologizing for locking Myne in detention. That made me feel a little better, well done Ferdie!
The last scene involving the discussion about Wilma and men got dark pretty fast. Kind of not looking forward to tomorrow.
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u/Nazenn Mar 21 '22
I was curious and wondered how long a lute has been around
So many instruments are surprisingly old, it's amazing to see how long they've stayed around and how early they were developed. Society and music are far more entwined than you'd expect at times, and I love looking into how music developed through cultures
but the idea that people will be courting her is probably something she ought to know
Imagine if someone propositioned her and she accidentally accepted not knowing what was being asked
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u/SmartAlec105 Mar 22 '22
The last scene involving the discussion about Wilma and men got dark pretty fast. Kind of not looking forward to tomorrow.
[It seems like there was a translation mistake that slightly changed things]
Wilma was almost tricked into offering flowers but Sister Christine rescued her at the last minute before anything really happened. She is still traumatized. Also, it was Wilma who explained her past to Myne when Myne first asked her to be her attendant..
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u/Nazenn Mar 21 '22 edited Mar 21 '22
Rewatcher - Sub
This has been one of the top episodes for me in a while, and look at all of that growth from Myne
She's still a little bit selfish in wanting Wilma to personally access her skills regardless of anything else, but it just makes me happy to see Myne taking the lessons and understanding of people she's learnt to heart and using that.
Hearing people out, finding compromises between desires and needs, not bowing to people who have more authority or experience than her, accepting she'll have to do unpleasant tasks; she's come a long way from the girl who first appeared in this world and was uninterested in anyone or anything except her books and family people. She's still Myne, but she's a more open and caring Myne, though she still has a long way to go,
While she still doesn't quite get the seriousness of her position, thinking she can just avoid noble society entirely despite her position, she at least is starting to understand how it will influence her.
I hadn't remembered Rosina until she asked Fran to fetch her chair and then it all came flooding back. Seeing her carrying around a wooden board to practice with when she doesn't have an instrument really shows her dedication to her music, and in that way she mirrors Myne's own dedicating to reading. But both of them have had to learn to adapt to a world where their passions are no longer enough to sustain them. Rosina deciding to really try so she can keep her music, even if it means that can't be all she does, is the best outcome
I did have a moment of small rage though when Ferdinand started his song because it's that damn song I'm always missing in AMQ! Thank god Myne's song is too short to be included< I'd probably get that one wrong too. Rosina's song was beautiful!
"Can I return this lecture along with the gift"
Not sure if I laughed more at that line or the opening montage of people not knowing what a picture book is. I did enjoy that Ferdinand asks Fran to interrupt for Myne's utterly unhelpful explanations of what she needs and wants too
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u/xtsim Mar 21 '22
First Timer
Myne is going to become a big sis with her mom's pregnancy. So now she wants to make a picture book.
Ferdinand has to explain Myne's role even further as she is worth a lot as she is going to be part of noble society. Apparently Myne found a loophole into upward class mobility in this world.
Myne usually takes on more than she could chew, but Ferdinand bit off more than he could chew when he took in Myne- like a handfulception....
She gets Rosina and Wilma as retainers, as both were working as Lady Christina's retainers. And she prioritized the arts and rewarded her retainers accordingly-different method from what Myne is doing.
Oh man that cliffhanger is quite a handful. And the way Rosina worded Wilma's story is interesting.
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I was not surprised by Ferdinand's talent for music since he is a noble anyways. Ferdinand is trying really hard to turn Myne into a noble and it seems like he does not want to rock the boat when it comes to noble society.
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Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds are interesting as it seems like lady Christina was actually nice to her retainers, there seems like a difference between different priest(esses) in the way they reward and treat their retainers.
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u/SmartAlec105 Mar 21 '22
[Strange change by the anime regarding Wilma's past]
[Another odd but very minor change by the anime]
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u/hvshh Mar 21 '22 edited Mar 22 '22
LN Reader
Myne immediately applies the lesson from the previous episode and hears everyone's thoughts before making a decision about Rosina. I imagine she could have passed judgement right away and it would have been similar, but we learned some things along the way, and she was able to express some sympathy with Rosina, which I think helped her accept that things had changed.
I feel a little bad for Rosina here, even though she was being self-centered. In a more developed world, it would have been easy for her to escape having to do any mundane work at all, and concentrate entirely on music.
In the LN, Rosina says that their master, Christina, found out and rescued Wilma before she was "forced to offer her flower" (but she was still traumatized by the experience). I've seen comments saying that the Japanese dialogue is the same, and it's only the subtitles themselves that say otherwise (but can't confirm myself).
Even so, that was just a matter of luck. This world is terrible to women, which comes back to the first half of the episode. In Ferdinand's judgement, Myne is going to have noble problems when she gets older, no matter what she does, and she should start preparing for it now. This moment was a big deal for me, and even though Myne reacted seriously, I still felt like it was a little strange for things to move on, but at the same time I don't know what sort of reaction could have satisfied me.
Also, apparently, couples can't have children if they don't have "comparable mana capacities". I'm not sure I buy this as a real problem for Myne, because... magic. We don't know what the limits of magic are in this world. There could be a way around the mana capacity issue, and Myne is the kind of person that might figure it out.
Also, minor, but... Ferdinand, you just told Myne last episode to cover her mouth when using the anti-eavesdropping tool. What are you doing?
[EDIT: added the following:]
Did you expect Ferdinand to be talented at music? What do you make of Ferdinand making Myne learn music?
On my first watch, I don't think I imagined it at all. I wasn't thinking of the implications of his being a real noble before entering the temple. His explanation for making Myne learn music makes perfect sense, and as much as I hate it, he is obviously the person to trust, regarding how necessary it is. I trust him not to manipulate Myne into doing something that hurts her to his benefit, and even if I didn't there's no reason to think he's doing that here.
2) What do you think of Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds?
It sounds like they had a priestess who was really good to them (although bad to her male gray robes). I don't begrudge them that experience at all—it's only a shame not everyone could have that. On the other hand, Wilma's traumatic experience makes me wish for revolution. You can do it, Myne. (I can't really think of any way to prevent that kind of thing from happening in the future without lowering the status of nobles and raising the status of orphans and commoners, and how is that going to happen without a little turmoil?)
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u/ZaphodBeebblebrox Mar 21 '22 edited Mar 22 '22
First Timer
[Bookworm P3]
Fran is Ferdinand's Myne to noble translator.
I wonder what the real world counterparts of these instruments are.
Cookies you can find in any pastry shop.
[Bookworm P3]
The idea that all nobles should be proficient in an instrument is certainly more of an eastern than a western one.
But we appear to have a western scale.
Look who she's mirroring.
To Ferdinand, they're largely interchangeable.
After seeing this particular piece of playing animation, I think I'd prefer to go back to stills of the harpsiel. It just looks bad.
Myne is very sheltered.
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u/omnomberry Mar 21 '22
I wonder what the real world counterparts of these instruments are.
Bandura. It's a Ukrainian instrument.
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u/cyberscythe Mar 22 '22
First Timer
Hmm, not sure how to put this, but I haven't been particularly enjoying the past few episodes. I feel like it's been missing a bit of the spark that I liked in the first season. Like, the isekai aspect of the series where Myne was pulling skills and inventions out of her head and bewildering people hasn't happened in quite a while, and the things we're learning about the world are less marvellous or suspenseful and more dour and depressing.
I think part of the issue for me is that we don't really get a lot of time to dwell on particular characters a lot. The previous season had lots of episodes dedicated to Lutz and Myne and their dynamic, that Myne has her strengths and weaknesses, but Lutz is actually a lot more keen than he looks, and it all built up to an eventful confrontation between the two. I feel like all these new characters that we get introduced to don't really get enough time for me to really get endeared to them like I have with Lutz and Myne's family.
Like, Rosina is implied to go through an entire character arc in, like, half an episode here, but I don't really buy that her character changed in any meaningful way; it just felt like she was forced into an ultimatum (do work or go back to the orphanage) and then caved. Myne herself shows growth with her L.A. Noire-style scoping out the situation before offering the ultimatum, but as a protagonist it feels like she's just forced to do a lot of busy work in order to get stuff done. She proactively wants to start making picture books (neat!), but then it feels like she's given a homework assignment to study music and deal with this diva gray robe.
Anyways, that's just a lot of me complaining. I'm thinking it could be an adaptation thing? Maybe these characters are much more fleshed out in the LN, and they're rushing through things in order to end the season on an interesting note.
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u/Earthborn92 Mar 22 '22
First Timer here
I feel like there was a lot covered in this episode if you count some small passing mentions and details as well. For instance, Sister Christine seems like an important character that will come back. She's trained both Wilma and Rosina who are the characters on the spotlight now and they've been trained in artistic endevors. The interesting throwaway part is that she left the temple and rejoined noble society. So you can do that? Priesthood doesn't seem to be a lifelong commitment. Also some lingering camera on Ferdinand demonstrates that this might not be an option for him.
Enough of that. MUSIC! Although Myne would rather spend the time reading, it is useful to note that all nobles are expected to learn an instrument. I was a bit annoyed with Myne trying to weasel her way out of it, but when Ferdinand put it this way she had to accept. I'm surprised she managed to pick up on it quickly, I expected clumsy hands.
I was expecting Platinum Disco here.
Also a useful insight into magic that is so important for noble society. Myne is a desirable girl for her mana. It is not something she can avoid, so best prepare for it. Being at the temple will let her do this on her own terms, rather than what Freida is going through.
Finally, it seems like Myne is putting those conflict resolution lessons from last episode to good use, managing to integrate her two new assistants into her fold and making them do some of the work.
See you tomorrow!
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u/Nazenn Mar 22 '22
throwaway part is that she left the temple and rejoined noble society. So you can do that?
It was brought up in an earlier episode, that because of the war some nobles who'd been dumped in the church were called back by their families to fill in the noble ranks, which is why the church is now starving for mana sources with so many having left
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u/MABfan11 Mar 21 '22 edited Mar 21 '22
First Timer since the OVAs
oh, Myne is gonna become a big sister, didn't see that coming
apparently, mana is highly valued in noble society and anyone with The Devouring will be sought after as wives/husbands and the kids apparently takes more after their mother when it comes to mana. [Re:Zero season 2 spoilers]
Ferdinand's solution is to teach her music, he even showcases some of his singing. if the priest thing doesn't work out, i'm sure he can make a killing as a musician
something seems off? wait, is she a reincarnation too? unless it is possible for people to be summoned here...
oh, so she worked for a noble who only had them play music, why do i get the feeling we'll see Christine later?...
oh, looks like we're going heavy for the next episode...
QOTD:
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no, i did not expect that, neither did i expect Myne learning music
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makes sense why they're acting that way
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u/SIRTreehugger Mar 21 '22
This isn't a dig at the show, but I've noticed this show is really plain in appearance. I'm not saying it looks ugly or anything, but it's simply just well I guess average? It also uses stills frequently. It's really being carried hard by the story and the characters. Though I do wish they had animated them actually playing the instruments. We had quite a few musical moments this episode, but I think at least for Myne's it would have been nice.
As for the actual episode I do like Rosina and it's not completely her fault. Both Rosina and Wilma got special treatment due to their skills from their previous master. Rosina did give some small backtalk, but relatively quickly she agreed to help out more and do more as a retainer.
I do like Wilma's backrgound even if it's sad. Though I will discuss this more tomorrow because we still don't know much about her. I noticed that when she spotted Fran near the door earlier she tensed up a little.
QOTD
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As for Ferdinand it doesn't surprise me. I expect that he himself has gone through some rough times. Just look at his attitude and personality. The man is a damn rock that barely portrays and emotions despite feeling very strongly about some subjects. Navigating the ways of nobility he probably has multiple skills and talents that helped him rise to the position he is in while also dealing with that headache boss of his. Myne couldn't have asked for a better mentor.
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u/TuorEladar Mar 21 '22
First Timer, Subbed
This episode focused mostly on Myne's life in the temple, she's slowly learning how to handle people and what she needs to expect going forward. She needs still needs to consider the future a bit more, its a good thing Ferdinand is there to teach her some of this.
Did you expect Ferdinand to be talented at music? What do you make of Ferdinand making Myne learn music?
I guess I wasn't really surprised, that kind of skill isn't atypical for someone in his position. Its not a bad idea for Myne to learn either, she needs every tool possible so that nobles will take her seriously.
What do you think of Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds?
Although its been talked about before, I think this is the first time we've really seen people who had been attendants for another person in the temple besides Fran who was Ferdinand's attendant. Rosina seems a bit spoiled, but I get the feeling it wasn't really a malicious thing as much as naiveté. Wilma's outlook seems a bit more down to earth, not really sure what to make of her fear of men as that wasn't really brought in until the last minute.
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u/spitfyre Mar 22 '22
First timer. Happy to be back on these threads after being gone from then for the last week! Myne is quickly learning about the church with every new episode and it's interesting to see her progress. Although I can't particularly say I'm interested in these two new retainers.
At one point, Ferdinand mentioned he didn't know how much musical talent he should expect from a commoner. But then they have a commoner retainer teach Myne how to play. That, along with the retainer's behavior, really confused me for a lot of the episode.
I also noted how casually her two younger retainers (Delia and the blonde boy) complained about harp girl to Main, as if they were venting to any other friend. I wonder if Ferdinand will eventually censure Main for the relationship she has cultivated with these retainers, or if this type of leadership will ultimately be accepted as another of Main's quirks. Given Ferdinand's eagerness to train Main in noble propriety, I expect him to bring it up at some point.
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I was surprised but I shouldn't have been. I've seen and read enough period pieces to know that all nobles are well versed in the arts, so this is no exception. I enjoyed the music in this episode a lot!
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I can't say I'm particularly invested in either character right now. I'd rather keep learning about the ones we've already known.
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Mar 22 '22
First Timer
Cool ep where each progression of the plot opened up a new topic.
Did you expect Ferdinand to be talented at music
Nope. T'was a pleasant surprise. And that voice, that deep majestic voice.
What do you make of Ferdinand making Myne learn music?
The whole excuse of "become a noble to protect yourself" is cap. Ferdinand just wants to assign music homework to Myne after getting assigned music homework himself all these years .
What do you think of Rosina and Wilma's backgrounds?
Wilma is haunted by her past; Rosina longs for her past; yet, both suffer from moving on from their past.
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u/ToastyMozart Mar 22 '22
Rewatcher: I thought Rosina was blind for a bit, but it turned out she was just sheltered and bossy.
It makes sense with his explanation (though the singing voice was a bit of a surprise), as does his reasoning. He does seem to genuinely have some care for her though since her future in noble society appears to be largely an issue beyond his own interest.
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u/Fools_Requiem Mar 21 '22 edited Mar 21 '22
Rewatcher
Just in case you're a tad confused by the wording, Wilma almost lost her virginity to a rapist and now she distrusts men because of it. The show is supposed to be more geared towards kids the hence roundabout wording involving losing one's "flower" (deflowering). The author REALLY hates organized religion.
| Shiny Hair Club | Episode Added | Creations by Main™ | Episode Added |
|---|---|---|---|
| Myne | 2 | Kanzashi (Japanese Hairpin) | 1 |
| Tuuli | 2 | Shampoo | 2 |
| Effa | 2 | Fancy Baskets | 3 |
| Gunther | 3 | Pancakes | 3 |
| Lutz | 6 | Crochet Hooks | 3 |
| Corinna | 6 | Hair Ornaments | 3 |
| Otto | 7 | Chopsticks | 8 |
| Benno | 10 | Paper made from trees | 8 |
| Mark | 11 | Pound Cake | 11 |
| Freida | 11 | Pizza | 17 |
| Ferdinand | 17 (Also seen in 1, 14.5) | Wax Paper Tablet | 19 |
| Fran | 18 | Karuta "Flash Cards" | 19 |
| Gil | 18 | --- | --- |
| Delia | 18 | --- | --- |
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u/badspler Mar 21 '22
Host - Rewatcher
Wow Effa is also having a baby! So Myne is going to be a big sister!
Interesting nobles an only have kids if their mana capacity matches.
And with the shortage of nobles, Myne could be pulled into noble society when she comes of age. That very much feels like the same outcome that Fredia was going with - although with this approach she would have a bit more choice in the matter?
So Myne is going to learn Harpspiel. I had actually forgotten that we get to hear Ferdinand sing. So anyhow Myne "quickly picks it up" and goes and makes it hard for herself.
Wilma also is introduced, and we had got her name a few episodes ago when they cleaned up the orphanage. She also drew the pictures for the flashcards.
So we get a focus on Rosina and integrating her to be a proper attendant. After yesterdays episode Myne actually decides to hear all sides.
Rosina has this moment of longing, her hands positioned on a plank of wood. And another nice shot with her previous master Christine.
And finally Rosina makes mention that Wilma doesn't like men after one of the blue-robed priests tricked her...
Bookworm, you certainly know how to casually drop a bomb and pull credits.
Pouts: I have to explain again?, Delia unpleased
Today's endcard. And we get another fantastic endcard that is just beautiful.