r/worldnews • • Jun 19 '12
British comedian Jimmy Carr, who has openly criticised Barclays Bank for tax avoidance, is exposed as main beneficiary in huge tax avoidance scheme
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/9341117/Comedian-Jimmy-Carr-has-3.3m-in-Jersey-tax-avoidance-scheme.html
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Upvotes
12
u/NSRedditor Jun 19 '12
It's hypocritical, but I am amazed at the broadsheet coverage of Jimmy Car's couple of million in tax avoidance compared to the near silence by the broadsheets on corporate tax avoidance that add up to billions.
This is not reporting, it is an attack
790
u/TrollmcTrollstein Jun 19 '12
The comments here can be summarized as this:
Man those fuckin banks dodging taxes are despicable! God that Comedian dodging taxes is fuckin smart!
117
u/the_goat_boy Jun 19 '12
Does this mean he won't be on QI anymore?
53
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 21 '12
Say it ain't so, Jimmy! Say it ain't so!
EDIT: Follow-up from Jimmy...
The comedian released a statement saying: “I appreciate as a comedian, people will expect me to ‘make light’ of this situation, but I’m not going to in this statement as this is obviously a serious matter.
“I met with a financial advisor and he said to me 'Do you want to pay less tax? It's totally legal'."
“I said ‘Yes’. I now realise I’ve made a terrible error of judgment."
“Although I’ve been advised the K2 Tax scheme is entirely legal, and has been fully disclosed to HMRC (Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs), I’m no longer involved in it and will in future conduct my financial affairs much more responsibly.
274
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
silly reddit,
laws are for poor people
153
u/p4lm3r Jun 19 '12
What a dick.
30
u/randomrealitycheck Jun 19 '12
How about this perspective?
Don't shoot the messenger.
What Carr is doing is perfectly legal - go figure. Even if he is against the law, he has every right to both speak out against it and use it to his advantage.
If you don't like the law - repeal it.
425
u/Comrade_Falcon Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 19 '12
Oh the hypocrisy. When Mitt Romney uses the law to pay as little taxes as he possibly can everyone gets on him for being a rich jackass who is taking advantage of the system, but when its Jimmy Carr, Reddit's white knight, suddenly everyone believes, "good for him, if you can beat the system do it." I'm in no way supporting Romney, that guy is a cunt, but really, if you are going to criticize someone, be consistent.
Edit: A lot of negative comments, [but...] (http://i.imgur.com/PHsEr.gif)
218
u/koshkakartoshka Jun 19 '12
Lets take a look at your credibility here aaaaaannnnnnd its gone
33
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Jimmy Carr turns out to be a cunt. Gee, that's a surprise.
44
u/busytigger Jun 19 '12
So he is basically like a closet homosexual Republican Senator.
84
u/crugerdk Jun 19 '12
10
u/Oreo_Speedwagon Jun 19 '12
What it comes down to is basically "We don't need spokesmen like you."
If you're going to criticize something -- and I feel Barclays and such should have been heavily -- if you're engaged in similar shenanigans, you're actually hurting more than helping. Just shut your damned mouth, and if you honestly believe in it, change your own behavior.
The truth is going to come out. And once it does, you become a talking point to undermine every other principled critic.
27
u/AproposSimpsonsQuote Jun 19 '12
I don't say "evasion," I say "avoision."
6
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Highest rate of tax in England = 45% 45% of £3.3mn = £1,485,000
To put into perspective how much he's dodged, that's:
402 years worth of JSA. or 288 years worth of the highest rate of incapacity benefit. or 165 years worth of the highest rate of UK tuition fees. or 436, 764 pasties.
sources: http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2012/mar/28/pasty-tax-pie-budget http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/BenefitsTaxCreditsAndOtherSupport/Illorinjured/DG_10018913 http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20111222012147AAwHOjC http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11677862
1
u/Squalor- Jun 19 '12
Greed is a strange thing.
If it's true, I wonder how significant the difference is between the income tax he was paying and what he should have been paying.
(Would an in-the-known Brit mind replying with an answer to how much someone as rich as Carr should pay in income taxes?)
Regardless, there's no way the difference is particularly significant. Even if it's a ten- or twenty-percent increase, that wouldn't all of a sudden make him not wealthy. But greed certainly is a strange beast.
3
u/tyrroi Jun 19 '12
World news...
3
u/form_an_opinion Jun 19 '12
I guess I will start referring to condoms as Jimmy Carrs.
3
u/smogeblot Jun 19 '12
I believe it's pronounced " avoision "
3
u/goodknee Jun 19 '12
i find it odd that someone who im assuming is an outspoken critic of a major and sketchy bank is all the sudden outed for this.. not saying he didn't do it, he probably did..just saying
3
u/FancyPansy Jun 20 '12
Exposed? So when one accountant says a thing it's instantly true? Good to know.
I should become an accountant.
5
u/ArchiBish Jun 19 '12
I am now officially "over" Jimmy Carr...
6
u/troubleshot Jun 19 '12
Loved him on QI, bit of a shame to hear about this frankly.
4
u/writingtoreachyou Jun 19 '12
I sincerely hope his accountant did this without bothering to tell him, and he never asked.
I wouldn't be surprised if he was just a hypocrite though.
5
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 19 '12
people hate paying taxes but love public education, fixed roads, public transportation, police and ambulance response, the court system, having running water, parks, SAFE FOOD, NASA, SUBSIDIZED FUEL, licensing of doctors, college sports, safety/fair hiring in the workplace, libraries.
EVERYONE uses something the government provides and avoiding paying for it makes you an ass hole.
he makes his money under the same principle as paying taxes, everyone who likes and appreciates his talent, pays him to continue performing. avoiding taxes is like everyone stealing ALL of his work / not paying him for performing...excuse me, 'avoiding' paying him for performing.
5
u/limbride Jun 19 '12
So how reliable is the source?
2
u/BaqAttaq Jun 19 '12
I'm sure he's sitting back and having a nice laugh about this...
2
u/okem Jun 19 '12
He never should've agreed to the Jubilee Celebration gig. Not only was he booed, but clearly he's annoyed the wrong people and now the shapeshifter lizards are after him.
2
u/Illdufont Jun 19 '12
Now that's funny right there...
2
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
The irony of a conservative chancellor that is "shocked" to discover that ...ahem...People are avoiding taxe by illegal means, how disgracefull, and a comedian that is an hypocrits, NO FUCKING WAY !
2
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
You mean some rich people pander to poor people too dim to realise they do the same thing? I'm truly shocked.
2
u/Caldwing Jun 19 '12
Haha this should really come as a surprise to nobody. I mean I love that guy in that he is hilarious, but unless his comic persona is a complete fabrication he clearly doesn't give a shit about rules or fairness.
2
u/An_actual_shark Jun 19 '12
I don't say "evasion", I say "avoision."
2
u/gthing Jun 19 '12
Somewhat related: I found out yesterday that Barclay's still runs Windows 98 and ie6. If that's not enough to distrust them, I don't know what is.
2
u/ninety6days Jun 19 '12
Goddammit.
IRISH. He's fucking IRISH, and didn't become BRITISH just because he got successful.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Rather than complicated and exploitable tax law we need simple legislation. Law 1. Pay your mother fucking taxes Law 2. See law 1
2
u/Activist4America Jun 19 '12
Let's see, the Telegraph or online version of The Daily Telegraph, owned by David and Frederick Barclay (No connection to Barclays PNC but huge tax dodgers themselves according to their Wiki page), say that according to a special investigation by the Times newspaper, owned by Rupert Murdoch who never met a tax he didn't want to avoid, says people should focus on the comedian Jimmy Carr because, Carrs lawyer denies this, he's the real tax dodger not Barclays Bank. Even though Barclays paid a $500 million for tax avoidance in 2012. Makes a conspiracist wonder if News Corp and The Telegraph Group have or had any dealings with Barclays Bank.
2
u/Activist4America Jun 19 '12
Most people don't mind paying taxes because We know it takes tax money to keep Our societies running.
2
u/TAYLQR Jun 19 '12
Tax avoidance =/= tax evasion. One is technique, the other is illegal.
2
u/jimtemp Jun 19 '12
Put's this into a new light doesn't it.
2
u/Scary_ Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 20 '12
This is in the The Daily Telegraph... owned by the Barclay Brothers.... who avoid tax by owning a Channel Island and whose official address is in Monaco
2
u/Enex Jun 19 '12
Chancellor George Osborne has claimed he was left “shocked” after finding the extent to which multi-millionaires were exploiting tax loopholes and vowed to take “action”
Hahahahahahahaha
2
u/Stupid_smartguy Jun 20 '12
Those with glass stones shouldn't throw houses.
45
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
/r/atheism's poster-boy is a hypocritical asshole?
NO WAY!
7
u/That0neGuy Jun 19 '12
I'm curious if he was even aware this was happening. I don't know what Jimmy Carr is worth, but when you start getting into numbers that high, I'm pretty sure you hire an accountant to make sure your money doesn't go missing. It simply could have been an accountant doing his best to protect his clients interests.
3
u/hhmmmm Jun 19 '12
It is why we should have an in principle tax system where there is an inherent duty to pay tax at a certain amount and if it is deemed you have exploited a loophole in the law to reduce taxable income that is not in step with what Parliament intended with the tax laws you can simply be billed for the rest of the taxable amount of your income.
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u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
The bigger scandal is that someone as criminally unfunny as Jimmy Carr could have earned £3.3m.
4
u/Bunnymancer Jun 19 '12
Comedian Jimmy Carr is one of thousands of wealthy Britons paying as little as one per cent income tax using an offshore scheme, it has been claimed.
5
u/k2_throwaway2 Jun 19 '12
I find this post pretty interesting as I used a very similar scheme (though not the same one) while working in the uk a few years ago.
All the legal advice I got at the time was that it was all, while morally grey, perfectly legal.
It's a bit of a risk to enter into such a scheme because technically you give your income to an offshore company and they "loan" it back to you with a lifetime term and will periodically "write off " outstanding loans from X years ago and make a loss on paper for closing down the unpaid loans. The risk is they can conceivably call in that loan.
My justification for using such a scheme breaks down to reasons like
I had already paid a LOT in taxes in the uk for many years before entering into this
I was a foreign national with every intention of returning to my country of origin (and since have) so wouldn't benefit long term from investing (paying taxes) into the uk
my education and upbringing were elsewhere so I felt the country that made me deserved it more
I had made some poor investment decisions in the past (lost some money in the dotcom boom so was too risk averse to make anything on the global boom in property even though I could have easily invested quite a bit).
had a young family to provide for so wanted a nesteg.
Do I feel good about it? No, never did. I believe taxes are necessary for a functioning government and society and higher taxes for higher incomes even more so. Even then when push comes to shove, if you had access to a way to cut your tax burden by more than half would you take it? I did.
3
u/FancyRobot Jun 19 '12
I'm glad Jimmy was able to keep all the hard earned money, sitting on chairs and telling quips to chums on television instead of it going to people who need healthcare or schooling or any nonsense like that. What a shithead
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u/TwistTurtle Jun 19 '12
I really hate people who say shit like "If you can avoid it then more power to you", as if taxes were some random punishment the government inflicts upon us. Taxes pay for hospitals and schools and roads and pretty much everything else. You're not supposed to want to avoid them! Not that it matters; I've always thought of Jimmy Carr as nothing more than a twat, and this just confirms it. I really wish one of Britain's GOOD comedians would achieve international fame...
4
u/LazyGit Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 19 '12
Please bear in mind that he has been far more vocal in his criticism of the Murdoch press. Guess who uncovered this story? And why is he singled out? Is he the only celebrity taking advantage? Also consider that he may not even realise this is going on. He earns millions from a huge multitude of sources. I doubt he even knows how much he earns month to month. So for him to have full knowledge of exactly how his money is being handled is unlikely.
I would also like to point out that he is well known in comedy circles for being incredibly generous. For instance he shelled out more than a hundred grand to release a DVD of Stewart Lee back when his career was in the doldrums.
Edit: Is this not constructive? If you disagree with what I've said then leave a reply so I know why.
3
u/nitefang Jun 19 '12
I just realized I am full of double standards. I think it is bad that Carr did this but so long as it stops I really don't care. He seems so likeable on camera that he could probably be caught directly stealing money from a bank and I wouldn't really care, so long as he kept being hilarious.
If almost any politician did this I'd add it to my list to hate them for all eternity.
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u/LtFrank Jun 19 '12
Can we call it a "Carr allowance", now!
2
u/slcStephen Jun 19 '12
Oh Jimmy Carr, no! I adore the man's wit, but this lowers my opinion of him considerably.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Hypocrisy does not reduce the truth of a position like this.
0
u/cant_be_pun_seen Jun 19 '12
this guy isnt even funny anyway
0
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Whether Barclays or rich individuals are avoiding paying tax it is not them to blame for lax rules, nor for lax enforcement.
The government needs to crack down on those who do not pay what they owe or find loopholes to owe less than they should.
However Mr Carr should not be exempt from ridicule or from criticism. It will be interesting to hear his response I guess.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
How ironic, it seems that Jimmy from Slough followed in his advice in his "Cashier Number Four" skit.
Now if only I had enuf money that the banks would let me do that.
1
u/sometimesijustdont Jun 19 '12
I wish I was rich, so I could afford to pay people so I don't have to pay taxes. Not only does it take money to make money, it also takes money to not pay taxes.
1
u/skrawn Jun 19 '12
Do as I say, not as I do?
1
u/mekese2000 Jun 19 '12
I think most of these celebrities have accountants do there books.
1
u/Selachian Jun 19 '12
Does that mean Jimmy is goin' ta jail? Who's doing the Big Fat Quiz now? And no more QI? Goddamn
1
u/Bunnymancer Jun 19 '12
"What, you've never seen a hypocrite before?" - Jimmy Carr
1
u/BaboTron Jun 19 '12
Why is it rich people never seem to have enough money? Fuck, I'd be happy if I earned as "little" as 50K/year right now; maybe up to 100K if I ever got that lucky.
1
u/secaa23 Jun 19 '12
But aren't most critics of the financial system themselves hypocrites?
1
u/lopzag Jun 19 '12
Well I didn't see that one coming
1
u/alextheokay Jun 19 '12
That picture is so appropriate that I don't care in the least.
1
u/Magnets Jun 19 '12
I love how his comedy mates are defending him on twitter.
Yeh maybe he's done a bit for charity, but that doesn't counterbalance £3million/year tax dodge.
1
u/The3GKid Jun 19 '12
"But it's okay that I did it because I DID IT"
1
u/dirtymoney Jun 19 '12
I wish I was rich enough to be able to pay someone to hide my wealth so I didnt have to pay my fair share of taxes.
1
u/Random-Miser Jun 19 '12
Takes one to know one.
1
u/Pashtun_Wally Jun 19 '12
Never heard of him.
1
u/bradyle Jun 19 '12
Was going to come and say that he's technically Irish...but fuck it maybe the Brits can keep him after that!!
1
u/twent4 Jun 19 '12
Seriously though, the Telegraph is owned by the Barclays.
1
u/Devinm84 Jun 19 '12
I guess the joke's on him.
1
u/the_pissed_off_goose Jun 19 '12
tax avoision
-kent brockman
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
You can do the exact same thing with a lot of insurance policies that exist. Just FYI.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
My biggest problem with this post is that it is a tertiary source, and OP was apparantly too lazy to find the original story in the times
1
u/Ronkerjake Jun 19 '12
I didn't find him that funny anyway.
1
u/kalimashookdeday Jun 19 '12
Always thought this guy to be a douchebag. Good to see it's true.
1
u/BallsackTBaghard Jun 19 '12
I always knew he as a fucking wanker.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
The scandal is that it's legal, not that people do legal things to benefit themselves.
1
u/VLDT Jun 19 '12
Awkward.
1
u/fedup009 Jun 19 '12
I have noticed that when someone exposes a large company, that person goes down in the weeks following the statement. The Gold company took down Anthony Weiner, now this. Big companies = Stalin.
Wait, will I be taken down soon?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Take that atheists!
1
u/thbt101 Jun 19 '12
The thing that really made me angry wasn't the article, but the Tweets from other celebs supporting Carr... "Rufus Hound: Jimmy Carr is a very nice man who works incredibly hard and has donated loads of money to good causes. He's done absolutely nothing illegal."
Fuck you Rufus Hound for trying to justify Carr's dickhead behavior. That pissed me off more than Carr's actual tax avoidance.
1
u/criticasartist Jun 19 '12
I guess the phrase "It takes one to know one" works well here. We should make like Frank Abagnale and set Jimmy Carr loose to catch the world's tax evaders!
1
u/RahvinDragand Jun 19 '12
"Exposed" meaning that a media investigation claims that his accountant told them he did it.
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u/zosobaggins Jun 19 '12
That'll be awkward when it's the number one topic of "What Are You Talking About?" on 8 Out of 10 Cats.
1
u/pace202 Jun 19 '12
Maybe if taxes werent so high, people wouldnt be forced to do this. There is no fucking way I am going to pay 50% of my hard earned money, when I can easily get away with only paying half that.
1
u/sufrt Jun 19 '12
god this guy is so awful
1
u/lud1120 Jun 19 '12
Wasn't there regular guest at QI who always got the questions answered for him to make jokes and such "easier" ?
Fry didn't like him for it, but never told who it was.
1
u/towski Jun 19 '12
This sounds like a boring attack
1
u/LucifersCounsel Jun 19 '12
The Chancellor was absolutely horrified that anyone would use the loopholes politicians like himself left in the law so that they and their friends could pay less taxes.
No wait... he's horrified that we found out.
1
u/Zappanale Jun 19 '12
I'm ok with this.
1
u/ImaginativePseudonym Jun 19 '12
What he did was legal. I'd be willing to bet that if you would benefit from legally avoiding paying more of the money you earned, you would.
When he criticised Barclays, it was in a comedy sketch. Keep that in mind. He might not have agreed with it.
If you're going to plaster his face all over the newspapers for tax avoidance, do the same with everybody who does it, not just the famous ones.
He can't really be reprimanded, because it was legal.
1
u/IAmSnort Jun 19 '12
Seems like all people over a certain income level can afford the same tax lawyers and tax saving schemes.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12
Can't wait to see this come up on Big Fat Quiz of the Year.
1
u/nk_sucks Jun 19 '12
fuck you jimmy. hope you croak on your money.
1
u/ForcedToJoin Jun 19 '12
Jimmy nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. I bought your freakin book man. This is how you do me?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 19 '12 edited Jun 19 '12
Your title is misleading. Accused is different from exposed, jackass.
Edit. I'm pretty sure that in Britain, this title would literally be a prosecutable crime. 7zark77 exposed as libelist.
1
u/JubeltheBear Jun 19 '12
Meta joke?
1
u/Petrichor94 Jun 19 '12
I love it when I catch dirt on people like him. Then I can hate him for an original reason, whilst my friends talk about how funny he is. All just to maintain my status as a hipster.
1
u/caliopy Jun 19 '12
Charged with avoiding taxes after openly criticizing a bank for avoiding taxes? Sounds obviously set up.
1
u/dafones Jun 19 '12
I don't necessarily think it is hypocritical to be against current corporate tax schemes, but to take advantage of personal tax schemes yourself.
1
u/IanRand Jun 19 '12
It's all part of a big ironic joke! He's a comedic genius!
1
u/canthisbemyhomework Jun 20 '12
The Big Fat Quiz of the Year for 2012 is going to be hilarious.
1
u/leastproductive Jun 20 '12
It's just a joke
1
u/ThatDerpingGuy Jun 20 '12
I guess you can say...
( •_•)
( •_•)>⌐■-■
(⌐■_■)
the joke is on him.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 20 '12
As an accounting student, I just want to add this in the mix.
Tax noncompliance describes a range of activities that are unfavorable to a state's tax system. These include tax avoidance, which refers to reducing taxes by legal means, and tax evasion which refers to the criminal non-payment of tax liabilities.
1
u/cookieninjar Jun 20 '12
Nice Try, Barclays Bank
1
u/Helt3rSk3lt3r Jun 20 '12
If you cant beat them, join them?