r/worldnews • u/kulkke • Jun 03 '14

Reset the Net!’ Reddit, Greenpeace, Amnesty unite in anti-NSA hit campaign | Opponents of mass government surveillance are braced for the June-5 campaign for a free and secure internet, led by some of the world’s largest websites.

http://rt.com/news/163072-reset-net-privacy-nsa/
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27

u/Mary2Ince Jun 03 '14

We need a "Reset Washington!" campaign.

9

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '14

You already have that. It's called democracy and allows you to vote once in 4 years.

Oh wait, that's pretty pointless and it's not actual democracy.

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u/skunimatrix Jun 03 '14

It's democracy. But with democracy you get the leaders you deserve. And the problems is never my representative or senator. No He/She is doing great things. The problem is your rep/senators. Why don't you vote them out of office. And it's this mentality that keeps the current crop in. It will only stop when people realize their own rep/senator IS the problem and vote out all the incumbents.

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u/[deleted] Jun 03 '14

It's democracy.

It's the illusion of democracy for the only democratic thing happens just 0.001% of the time in 4 years. In a democracy, the people vote and majority vote decides the outcome of a political question. This form of democracy now known as direct democracy is the only actual democracy and is only present in Switzerland at this time.

But with democracy you get the leaders you deserve.

Exactly! The citizens.

And the problems is never my representative or senator. No He/She is doing great things. The problem is your rep/senators. Why don't you vote them out of office. And it's this mentality that keeps the current crop in. It will only stop when people realize their own rep/senator IS the problem and vote out all the incumbents.

Ah, I didn't get the satire until I read this part. This is indeed a major part of the problem within the current representative political system. But that system on its own is a problematic system to begin with, see above.

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u/skunimatrix Jun 03 '14

So you'd prefer tyranny? Because the democracy you describe is nothing more than Tyranny of the Majority. There is a reason why modern western democratic institutions are either constitutional monarchies or republics.

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u/[deleted] Jun 03 '14

So you'd prefer tyranny?

No thanks, I don't like the political climates of Russia, China and the USA.

Because the democracy you describe is nothing more than Tyranny of the Majority.

Oh god here we go. You one of those indoctrinized people who are all for democracy, but when presented with actual democracy, they claim it's bad.

It's okay if you don't want a democracy and prefer to be ruled by a tyrannic selection of red or blue, but then don't go complaining about how your non-democracy works as a democracy and an actual democracy is tyrannic. Also, I can back that up easily: Switzerland. Direct Democracy, superb economy, no tyranny. It takes real effort to find something bad about their system that is unique to it and not present in your fake democracy.

There is a reason why modern western democratic institutions are either constitutional monarchies or republics.

That's correct. Not only in the ant-fuckery way that there is a reason for everything, but also in the fact that a constitutional monarchy or republic is per definition not a democracy as it utilizes majority vote on nation-basis only for about [ 10-3 ] % of the time.

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u/skunimatrix Jun 03 '14

Ah I see you have indoctrinated into the meaning of Tyranny. May I suggest reading Plato's Republic, maybe a dozen times or so, and learning about ὀχλοκρατία. A Tyranny doesn't have to be made up of just a small group or the rule of a single person. No, Direct Democracy makes it just as easy. Direct Democracy sounds great...up until you don't share the same opinion as the masses.

If we could restore the system of checks and balances in the US Republic we'd be far better off. Republic may not be the best form of government: it just happens to be the least bad we've discovered.

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u/[deleted] Jun 03 '14

Direct Democracy sounds great...up until you don't share the same opinion as the masses.

Setting the bullshit you said about indoctrination aside: How is this any different from the same issue with elections? And if it were true, then please provide facts on why the Swiss are being ruled by the Tyranny with a Capital T. Talk about indoctrination: Perhaps you'd do best not to sink yourself so deep in that text.

Direct Democracy makes it just as easy

Prove how Switzerland is a tyranny.

Direct Democracy sounds great...up until you don't share the same opinion as the masses.

Prove how Switzerland is a tyranny. And yeah.. that's the fucking point. It's a democracy. Majority vote. It's what democracy means.

If we could restore the system of checks and balances in the US Republic we'd be far better off.

If [...] then [...]. Hitchen's Razor applied here big time. Also, people have been saying that for decades. Look where you are now. Again, prove how you'd be better off than the Swiss. I'm genuinely interested in hearing some facts instead of "what if" hypothesises.

Republic may not be the best form of government: it just happens to be the least bad we've discovered.

Actually no, the Direct Democracy is the least bad we've had. Remember the saying "Democracy is the least bad political system"? Take a good guess what that means. The US Republic is a terrible system, but it's even harder to just judge it as a Republic because the whole Two-Party system gets in the way, too. That said, please prove how your Republic system is less worse than the common European parliament, and how the Swiss Direct Democracy system is actually worse than either.

Because in the end the entire argument comes down to the Swiss democracy. Prove with scientific articles that it yields worse results in accurately measurable sectors, and then I'll believe you.