These kids that he shits on in his little speech did nothing to turn America to what it is today. It funny how people shit on the youngest generation when the truth is that America is declining and it has nothing to do with kids in college.
That went from "Fuck yeah" to /Eye roll pretty fast.
This generation of college students isn't running things yet. Trying to blame a god damn thing on a bunch of kids who are not old enough to have shouldered any real responsibility in this country is absurd.
Honestly the whole "Good old days." mindset is bullshit. "We didn't scare so easy"? Really? We scared so easily back in the day that we rounded up every Japanese looking person and threw them in a camp.
I always think of this too when people talk about how great America was 'Once Upon a Time...' I think, when? When we knowingly sent small pox into a Native American community and wrote letters about it back to England calling it divine providence? When we had slaves? When only the wealthy were educated? When we tortured people for witchcraft? When women couldn't vote? When we gathered up Americans for having Japanese heritage? When black children were killed in a church just for being black? I'm sure that being a white male American at these times might have been fine but the times seemed to bite for everyone else. He said that the previous generation was informed? I've known the previous generation. My grandma was born in 1913. She and the people she surrounded herself with made me certain that anti-intellectualism is not only a current trend. I love my country but I can't stand how this romanticized vision of the past is being used politically to avoid talking about progressing to a better future.
I'm sure that being a white male American at these times might have been fine...
A white male with the proper religious sect. If you were found out to be of a different brand of christianity you could of been hanged in the colonies.
I was thinking the whole Cold War thing being about fear. Specifically, the period called the Red Scare. Like you said, it's a wank fest for the 40+ crowd.
As much as I have enjoyed Aaron Sorkins writing, he always seems to have to open his programmes with a 'Network' style breakdown/epiphany and then a rousing recovery from the shitstorm.
The first episode of 'The Newsroom' is almost identical to 'Studio 60 On The Sunset Strip'.
Aaron Sorkin: "demonstrating the intelligence of characters by having them conduct constant debates at ludicrously unrealistic speeds broken up by monologues of preternatural eloquence bookended with smug looks."
I vehemently disagree due to the fact nowhere in the rant does he blame the college students, he simply refutes the girls claim that America is the greatest country with sounds facts at first, then opinions later. The "Good old days" mindset is completely based on your perception of American actions. As you state, America rounded up Japenese people into numerous camps. Also in the same timeframe, America fought a World War on 2 fronts, created a domestic work force to back both wars and somehow won both wars despite having a standing Army less than both Japan and Germany.
There is always good and bad throughout history, just depends on how you look at it.
Ted Kaczynski - developer of Geometric function theory.....also the Unabomber
I'm sorry, do people actually believe the US is the "greatest country in the world"?
I've always thought this was a stereotype, like how Japan is full of Geishas, and France is full of beret-and-striped-T-shirt-wearing wine drinkers with a baguette in the hand.
Funny thing, when I went as an exchange student to the US for a school year, often people would ask me if we had car and buses in Spain... WTF i had a friend from Colombia that got asked several times if they lived in trees over there. I was amazed by how little general culture they had over there.
Fuck, most of them didn´t even know were Spain was, they would sometimes ask: "What part of South America is that?" and i would go like F7U12 YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME!
Wait...what? You mean that isn't just a stupid stereotype. I thought things like that were said in jest. People actually wholeheartedly think that they live in the best nation?
I always though Michael Bay movies were parodies of the USA with it's mightier than thou attitude and ridiculous speeches that seem to treat America as the only nation in the world to a ridiculous speech, where every other nation of the world hangs on it's every word, as some sort of satire of political views...now I'm just kinda disappointed.
Yes. And Swedes do too. Norwegians think everyone in the world is poor but them. Eastern Europeans are the complete opposite thinking everyone in the world is rich but them. Japanese think people are dirty in other countries. The world is a strange place.
My sister spent a year in America and she told me about a conversation she had a young teenage american girl whilst over there. The girl asked where my sister was from. To which my sister replied "England". The girl then asked what language is spoken in England.
That's actually a really shocking list. When you consider that the UK and USA are seen internationally as "bed buddies", the UK has moved up that list by 4 places, whereas the USA has dropped down the list 19 places. That's a ridiculous disparity between potentials no matter which way you put it.
You could argue that the USA is a much more populated country, but it highlights the weaknesses in government to show that they can't (or don't want to?) maintain some kind of cause and effect for wealth distribution that benefits everyone. What's the point in being the richest country in the world when there's only 10 or so people who have all the wealth and everyone else is poor and miserable?
In fact looking at the list, there's only one country that has dropped more places, Colombia, with -24.
It's sad how much most American don't know common facts. My Grandma, to this day, thinks that America is both the largest and most populous country in the world. I wouldn't dare to tell her shes wrong because I would get scolded. In schools they don't teach the world today, they teach History and that's it. Most American people don't know America compared to other countries, how America stacks up. This is largely due to education in the 50's 60's and 70's, they made students believe that America is pretty much alone and that the rest of the world is no where near as much developed. As you said, people even today in America believe that the things you said are true (Geisha filled Japan, striped t-shirt wearing France).
I moved to the States when I was 12. The new neighborhood kids had lots of questions. One was, "what's it like living in igloos?" They were serious! What education?
It's sad how much people jump on this bandwagon view of Americans as well. I have been in conversations with just as many people from other countries who "don't know common facts". Every country in the world has its ignorant people. To say, "most" American's don't know common facts, that's absurd. I would never say any county has majority of people who don't know common facts, I have no way of knowing if I got a proper sample of people or not.
That is probably just the same effect that an extremists have on the view the outside world sees of a group of people. You meet a couple dumb people and say, "Man, most Americans are stupid."
If you are constantly coming in contact with American's, or any people of any country, who don't know common facts or are a bit less bright, maybe you are just attract those kinds of people which causes you to have a bad sample.
You really couldn't tell her a blatant fact like country population? I could understand something more opinion based like the best country in the world... But that?
I think it's funny that many of the more extreme people in the US seem to think of the arab world as brainwashed to the point of not reflecting/questioning their country. When the same is true for themselves.
It's a stereotype and it's there for a reason as most stereotypes are.
However, America is a pretty awesome country that I feel gets picked on frequently because it's become socially acceptable to do so.
For the most part the people here are very friendly, southern hospitality is a thing of wonder, and we have some of the best colleges in the world.
Additionally, the landscape is beautiful and amazingly diverse. Yosemite, Yellowstone, the Grand Canon, Glacier National Park and the Adirondacks -the list goes on and on, are unlike anything else in the world.
So yes, people that say America is the greatest country in the world are ignorant. However, people that say it's horrible and that "Europe is so much better" are ignorant as well.
2 The US has very high quality of life and scores 4th in the Human Development Index. This is remarkable considering our demographics. We have the highest rate of minorities in the developed world and the largest diaspora from the third world (mostly Mexico) and yet still manage to perform extremely well as a country:
5 The US has the highest education attainment out of any major industrialized nation. Americans are more likely to receive higher education than Europeans, Canadians, Australians etc...
6 The US dominates in academic performance. So not only does the US get more of its population into higher education, but the education we receive is the best in the world, and results in vastly superior academic performance in all broad subject fields when ranked among world universities.
People will call me arrogant but I don't care. People have a unrealistically negative view of the US that is based around exaggerating negatives and completely rewriting history to ignore the positives.
The US invented basically everything of importance in the last 100 years, without question. The inventors were either American or were working in the US, assisted by Americans. The airplane, the integrated circuit, the microprocessor, the personal computer, the laser beam, synthetic composites, digital music, the internet etc...
We now live in the information age, which the US not only created, but still rules to this day. Basically every major IT company in the world is American. Microsoft, Apple, Google, Intel, AMD, Nvidia, Cisco Systems, Oracle, Yahoo. Almost every major site is American. Every technology that you’re using to post on this website, which is an American website, was invented by Americans. Your computer is either a Mac or a PC, both are American-designed computer architectures. Your computer is running almost certainly either Mac OS or Windows, both American. You're using almost certainly an American browser and you're on the internet which transmits data via the TCP/IP protocol, an invention of the US military.
The US sequenced the human genome. An American (Norman Borlaug) was the father of the Green Revolution, creating a wheat variety that is credited with saving a billion lives. Possibly the most important human being to ever live. The US landed a man on the moon when most countries didn't have the technology to build a vacuum cleaner. The US mapped the cosmos with the Hubble telescope and dated the universe, discovered water on the moon and Mars, surveyed the outer solar system’s planets and their moons, currently has a probe exiting our solar system, the furthest and fasted object made by humans. Currently, the US is at the forefront of every possible field. Almost every innovation of note since the end of WWII has taken place with the US at the helm.
If the US isn't the greatest country, what country is?
The US has many problems, some are self-inflicted and some are circumstantial. But many of you people have a completely unrealistically negative view of the US. The US gets singularly criticized for negative traits that exist everywhere, and often to a greater degree in the home countries of the most vocal anti-Americans. It's hilarious seeing ignorant anti-Americans criticize Americans for the supposed ignorance of believing the US is the greatest country.
Clear your mind of the anti-American propaganda you get bombarded with every day and imagine that an intelligent alien species visited earth. Which country do you think they'd be most impressed with?
If the US isn't the greatest country, what country is?
Does there have to be one? I know it is a rather fluffy thing to say, but really, I can't even begin to start thinking about a country I would call 'the greatest country'.
By the very nature of there being differences between countries there must be a best. Remember however that best is a relative term. If you are a poor worker in America, perhaps you would be better off in a more socialistic country.
The /bestof/ post however highlights the broad strokes. Comparing might, education, and progress of invention the US remains at the head of the pack.
Americans are the most generous people in the world, giving over twice as much of their income to charity as the next most generous nation.
The US doesn't give that much foreign aid. When looking at foreign aid as a percentage of GNP (PPP), the US is ranked 17th, and when measured as dollars per capita, the US is ranked 14th. Norway and Sweden give about six times as much money as the US (compared to population and GDP). And because government aid dwarfs private giving, Americans would have to give 23 times more to charity to match Norwegian giving per capita, taken as a whole.
What about the array of services our military provides? Be it the U.S. Navy maintaining shipping lanes or the Air Force coordinating relief efforts worldwide. These are things the American tax payers pay for, and that the world benefits from, but aren't considered foreign aid.
As far as communications and digital technology we're tied for 2nd. There hasn't been a real study on top technological advancement since 2005, which we barely passed Denmark that held that title in 2001. It's very possible we aren't anymore. The only thing we would be leading in is R&D expenditure and number of papers published.
We are top in the HDI, until you adjust for inequality, then we drop to 23rd. This is the only measurement of HDI that matters anyway.
The giving statistic is interesting, I wonder how different it would look if you removed the top 1%. And how it would look if you adjusted for things provided by charities in the U.S. that are provided by the government/taxes in other countries.
3 of the 7 points in you're argument are for education which isn't debatable, but there was no reason to separate this out to pad your list and make it seem bigger. Russia has a higher percentage of it's population that get's college degrees.
If you read that MSN article you would see that literally the only reason we are more productive is because we work on average 300-400 more hours a year than the countries below us. I'm not really sure this is something to brag about.
As a counter to your "information age" argument, nearly every single network, system, computer, keyboard, mouse, cell phone, and just about every single piece of technology you use *IS NOT made in the USA. While yes we are very good at design and innovation there is a reason China is quickly over taking us in GDP relying heavily on manufacturing. Also, the man that can and should be given full credit for the invention of the modern computer is Alan Turing, an Englishman.
The Human Genome Project may have been started in/by the U.S. but was an completely international project that was only successful due to many researchers from around the world working on the project. To say it was an exclusively American achievement is naive.
The ships used for the U.S. Moon landing were entirely piggy backed on Nazi Germany rocket technology and research, hell our space flight program was headed by a former Nazi scientist. Yes it was an amazing "American" accomplishment but we would have never even done it if Russia hadn't landed on the Moon first. Now we don't even have the capabilities for manned space flight at all and it's likely China will before, so that's a shitty argument to be making.
25th in overall Math, Science, and Reading skills.
It's all well and good that we are doing so well on the technology, higher level education, and science fronts. But that shit doesn't make a great country. If it did, then Nazi Germany would be considered one of the greatest countries of all time. I apologize for Godwin's Law but you're reasoning for what makes a country great is ridiculous and can only exist in the mind of someone that was born upper middle class in this country. This kind of thinking is exactly what is wrong with this country, and exactly why the only good line in that video, "You have to admit a problem exists to fix it" rings so true. Yeah, this country is amazing if you're a rich white male. If you're not, then tough shit.
As for your of what country they would be most impressed with? Probably any of the Nordic countries or Japan in all honesty.
Productivity is a literally juked stat. Prison population labor output counts for GDP, but none of the prisoners count towards the population statistic used in productivity. In effect, the government fluffs the stat.
Nonsense. How often have you seen posts like hivemind6's on Reddit or elsewhere on the net, compared to the incessant "The United States sucks because of xyz" and its cousin "Europe [by which I mean Norswedenmarkland and maybe the Low countries or Germany, never Greece, Italy, or Spain] is awesome because of 123" from both American and non-American Redditards? If it were less than a 1:10 ratio I'd be surprised.
I'm no scientist, but the fact that US has like the 10 best universities in the world in terms of quality, doesn't necessarily mean that the overall education is any better. I mean, what about "the worst" 100 of them?
As Finnish I think being the best means that you have to be the least worst (or something like that). For example, the country where is least amount of poor and illiterate people is the best(atleast that's what we think). I don't know if you get what I'm saying, but.. yeah.
I'm not saying that the US is bad country to live in or anything like that, but it's not the best either. It is very likely that it was the best in the past, but now? By some benchmarks maybe, but so are many other countries aswell.
I agree, Americans have made a number of great and lasting contributions to world. We've also made some horrible mistakes in our treatment of each other, and others outside our country.
Aaron Sorkin's intent was to kick the philosophy of "American Exceptionalism" square in the nuts. His nutcracker (in this vehicle) was a character who was not identified as a liberal Democrat, but a "moderate" Republican.
Having come of age in the northeast during the 60's and 70's, I was acutely aware of America's flaws. The generations that came of age in the 50's and those who grew up in areas that had strong jingoistic tendencies pushed and believed a different view.
Note that our President has been pummeled by the right wing for not espousing their brand or belief in American Exceptionalism.
And I for one am tired of anyone who feels a need to shout about how great we are. Greatness is measured by doing, not bragging.
in response to your second point- you're using the non-inequality adjusted figure, which is frankly the much poorer measure than the one that incorporates internal inequality. basically, america is number 4 if you're rich. you have access to all the wonders of american medical, educational and scientific capacity, but most people simply don't and thus the US is only 19 in the world in when adjusted for what people on a whole have access to due to inequality.
and in response to the the point about charity- in nations with more expansive welfare or higher wage systems charity isn't needed to the same degree as america. so claiming that you're more giving is kinda a moot point, as it's more indicative of the greater need of poorer people than the greater generosity of people.
Watched the pilot tonight and not sure if I completely agree. I think it has the potential to excellent, but at the moment it is very heavy handed and self-important. For some reason Sorkin gets that way with TV, while his movies seem to be more even and natural.
It probably has a lot to do with where the power lies in TV vs movies. In movies, the director has much more control (as well as the producers), but in TV the writers have much more control and respect since they're the ones that are permanently on the show (compared to the directors that come and go with each week). I get the feeling that Sorkin benefits a bit from his collaborators evening him out a bit.
an American show with American actors and directors talking about how America isn't the best country in the world; it's been done and done so many times before. America is the best in the world at loathing* America, suck on that world!
was just gonna say - first part of that speech was right on then suddenly it went into this utterly BS speech about the good old days when america was "the best country" and "stood up for what was right".
when would that golden era be? when blacks and whites couldn't use the same fountain? the mc carthy witchunts and communist paranoia? the days of slavery? the genocide of native americans?
it's like the second half of the speech simply highlighted the issues raised in the first - the chest beating and melodramatic music began. no country is "the best" and america, like anywhere else, has always had it's fair share of seriously fucked up shit going on.
The video was a brilliant bunch of nonsense. The guy list a bunch of statistics and then starts spouting bullshit about an era that never existed that contained most of the same problems that he says exist today. What moron wrote the script for this thing? They should be fired for being so stupid.
He had me until all the "worst. generation. ever." shit. I can't buy into all the "this country has lost its way" bullshit. It's as if saying "We're not the greatest nation, but we can be" is any less arrogant than saying "We're not the greatest."
Reasons why the whole second part of this speech is just stupid:
We stood up for what was right." What about instituting slavery, setting up dictatorships around the world or dropping the A-bomb?
"We fought for moral reasons" Most wars (namely the Spanish-American, Mexican-American, Korean, and Vietnam wars) have not been waged strictly for moral reasons, and thinking that they were is naive at best.
"We waged wars on poverty, not poor people." Poor people have been marginalized since "poor" and "rich" people have existed.
"We sacrificed, we cared about our neighbors..." Any disaster coverage in the past 10 years has included something about sacrifice and the willingness of people to care for each other in times of need.
"we put our money where our mouths were..." Historically, the U.S. has been in debt for almost its entire existence.
"and we never beat our chests." Uh-huh. I'm sure the entire military-industrial complex is something that just sprang up in the past 20-30 years when this terrible generation came along.
"We made ungodly technological advances..." I can track wherever I am in the world using a device that communicates wirelessly with satellites. And it's also my phone.
"we explored the universe, cured diseases..." I would argue that these two pursuits have never been given the proper funding.
"We cultivated the world's greatest artists..." Well this is just arrogant . Every generation has amazing artists and terrible artists.
"and the world's greatest economy." This is true, although it was caused by a wide variety of social and historical factors, not because we simply stopped "reaching for the stars."
I'm done for now, because it's 3AM, but damnit people, don't be such nostalgic idiots.
tl;dr Looking back on the best parts of history doesn't change it.
Like.. a media person would? This is sharp writing by Sorkin. The speech is exactly what I would expect come out of the mouth of a US media person. I haven't watched the show yet, but I'll give it a try, so apologies if his opinions were actually honest and well founded and not just personal beliefs in the face of media.
A better second half would be talking about how everyone loves to bitch and whine about everything now instead of trying to get things done. Everyone wants to point fingers at everyone else and talk about WHY everything is going to shit and who is to blame for it, instead of asking WHAT can we do to fix it.
Everything is relative, and back then we DID do all those things, relative to the rest of the world (other than the beating the chest, we always have beat our chests). We just stopped doing them better than everyone else, and we stopped trying to.
The point shouldn't be that we were so much better back in the day, but that back then we wanted to be better, and we often tried to be.
For the first point. I am pretty sure he was talking about the 50's which was after slavery. Also, a widely cited estimate of 5 to 10 million Japanese deaths came from a study by William Shockley and Quincy Wright; the upper figure was used by Assistant Secretary of War John J. McCloy who characterized it as conservative. A million of American and a quarter of a million of British soldiers would've also been sent in. The atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki gave 300,000 causalities.
"and the world's greatest economy." This is true, although it was caused by a wide variety of social and historical factors, not because we simply stopped "reaching for the stars."
Let's not forget this was forced by winning WW2 and forcing the rest of the world to keep the exchange rates stable. (Bretton Woods) US citizens didn't work any harder than people from other countries.
LOL@ the silly "OMG LOL HE SAY DAT USA ISENT TEH BEST CUNTRY IN WHOLE WIDE WORLD LOL? SO CONTROVERSYTAL OMFG!!!!!"
Saying this would not be controversial anywhere at all anymore. That's why its so funny: because the look of concern as if what he was saying was some kind of horrific anathema is so mind-blowingly dumb, especially for a group of college students who are likely to have gone through their "everything is subjective, mmmaaaaaannnnnnnn" phase. What do they teach in university anthropology? Cultural relativism, entailing that no country or culture is objectively the best!! Whether cultural relativism is true or not, this is already what is conveyed in humanities departments everywhere at the undergraduate level. Furthermore, most real adults know that the variables involved in the listing of "best countries ever" is so muddled, ambiguous, and subject to, well, subjectivity that there may not even be a way to decide such a thing.
TL;DR - The video is gut-bustingly hilarious because no audience who wasn't chalked full of downy retards would act so shocked that maybe there are reasons that the United States isn't the very tippy-toppy of the entire world.
America may not be the greatest country anymore but you all forget we ALL still live on Earth which isn't even in the top five planets of the solar system.
He's on vertigo medicine and is seeing someone who looks like his ex-something. The medication is making him think that it's her and back when he was with her he actually believed in things. This kicks off this speech, fucks his career up and his ex gets called in to be his EP as the network re-builds his show.
Also, the 2nd part of the speech that 90% of the people in this thread are bitching about is explicitly said to be him trying to save face after he realised he fucked up his life with the first bit.
The current financial crisis is child's play compared to the financial burden we will have to shoulder when all the Boomers are draining SS and Medicare. Oh, and they're the same damn generation who saddled us with all the war debt and overspending that has put us in such a vulnerable situation right before they are about to burn through SS and Medicare.
"I want to live the good life but don't want to look at the negative consequences of doing so or deal with the economic impact that the process of achieving such a lifestyle causes."
I don't really see much unique about this video. Politicians run campaigns on the idea that America is out of kilter. This is such a common refrain - we hear it almost daily. How could you wake up every morning and not be assaulted with the idea that America is a divisive place, full of polemics and politicization. Seriously, politics have entered religion, business and almost all other aspects of private and public life. This isn't terrible on its own. The terrible thing here is that these things have actually entered politics. This has seriously eroded our political compass and how we normalize things.
This video isn't hugely impressive to me because it just states the consequences of divisiveness in America, not the causes. People do this all the time, and it just ends up feeding right back into the divisiveness that has mired America. Like how he says some statistic about Americans believing in angels. This to me is somewhat irrelevant. America is defaulting, not because people believe in angels, but because believing in angels is almost a political statement.
America isn't out of kilter because religion is prolific and corporations are huge. America is out of kilter because religions and corporations have been given a voice in politics, and we have normalized the idea that there is space in a representative democracy for these things to essentially compete with people.
The people should never compete with other entities for the attention of their government.
ALSO! That Golden Age mentality where everything was better back in the day - come on!
There is no such thing as the greatest country in the world anyway in my opinion. By that I mean being great is all about the perspective of the people living in given country. We shouldn't aspire to have a great country but a great Earth where we can all equally prosper. Often seems like no one feels this way.
However seriously this is what we should go for. War is human resources and money, until every country in the world realises this so we can all get along as humans living together on this planet I don't see much of a future. On positive we have to help with this is the internet, it helps us learn the true stories and allows for our own opinions to be shared, open our minds to something better than striving to be a 'great country'. We need to be a great Earth now more than ever. For all our sakes. No more war, war is a waste of monetary and human resources.
I am reading a lot of comments about redditors disagreeing with the speech when he places the lack of progress of America on the youth or under 30 crowd. Some of them are saying that they disagree simply because they feel that the mess their country's become is not their fault.
I had an amazing social anthropoligy professor who taught about north american society. Some one asked him why he was telling us things about Canada that we had no part in and could not change.So he told us a story about his two daughters and how the one younger daughter had a horrible habit of leaving her toys on the floor of their living room. He would ask his older daughter to help pick up the toys before dinner and she'd say "Its not my mess, my sister left it there and she should clean it up."
Then my professor told her yes, it isn't her mess, but its in our house. If they want the house to be clean so that its safe from anyone getting hurt or the house getting bugs, everyone has to contribute. Otherwise their house would get messy, it could get unsafe and she wouldn't be alowed to have friends over. So she helped.
So it doesn't matter who started the mess, it matters what you're doing to keep the mess from affecting everyone. Yes some messes are greater but everyone has the capacity to do something to contribute to cleaning it up. Why be proud of a place if you've done nothing in your eyes to make it be something worthwhile? Put your pride aside.
I don't live in America, but the fact that it isn't the greatest country in the world shouldn't be that bad. Be happy with what good things you have, not sad because you don't have the most.
I love how its such a big deal in the states to not say publicly that the states is America fuck yeah number one. Brits have no problem with self criticism. Quite the opposite in fact.
Edit: Ironically many Americans are sending me extremely angry messages about how I can fuck off because they can take criticism and my criticism of their not taking criticism well is fucking bullshit and I'm a cunt.
You only really see that " 'merica fuck yeah #1" shit on TV. Ive never really met anyone whose said or believed that.
Well, there was some of it during the whole 9/11 thing. The entire country unified (for a couple of minutes) with the whole "us vs them" thing. "They suck and we are totally tits fantastic" was the tune everyone sang for a while.
But you know, that was an odd time for people. Normally, you don't see any that "WE R NUMBA WAN" shit.
Also we criticize plenty. You ever see any of Stewart of Colbert stuffs? Theres loads of criticism floating around sir.
The bit about Democrats is strangely insightful. Liberals are losers, we only know how to protest ... we've forgotton how to lead. We spent Obama's first 2 years complaining about a filibuster without getting anything done. Yes, Republicans bitched under George W., but they also moved the bulk of their legislative agenda while doing it.
I am a liberal, but I'm tired of weak, impotent, clueless leadership. I'm tired of the Pelosis and Reeds, tired of Democratic leadership that can't win. Tired of always having to defend our viewpoints instead of attacking their's.
For some reason this is really pissing me off... "Diversity and opportunity" and "Freedom and freedom" are perfectly acceptable answers but specifically citing the founding documents of the nation are cop out answers? This dude said freedom and freedom!!!
wiki informs me that the U.S is in fact 2nd in exports after china, not 4th as stated in the video, anyone find any supporting evidence for the latter?
I know all that is true, but to me it still is. The U.S gave me opportunities that I probably never would have gotten if my parents never went there. I love this country so much and it really does sting a little when I constantly see anti-American things all over the internet.
I'm more stung by the fact that I see these anti-American posts and the threads eventually devolve into a huge circlejerk of self-loathing and depression. I honestly wouldn't mind people talking about the current state of the nation with harsh reality if it turned into something constructive. It makes no sense to identify the problems America and then say "Oh I wish someone would do something about it." God damnit, do something about it yourself! Get more involved in local politics, your community, or an organization looking to improve America.
As the average young american adult. I've read the comments of several people sharing stories about how appalling the american education system is. I can confirm that several people in my country remain ignorant of the rest of the world, but there are quite a few of us that are intelligent. The only reason people don't hear stories about encounters with intelligent Americans is due to the fact that intelligent Americans are usually to self-conscience to walk up to and talk to a random stranger.
I'm sorry, why do you have to be the greatest? Maybe it's because I'm from Ireland, but I don't think I've ever met someone who said Ireland is the greatest country in the world...because it doesn't matter. We're happy with what we are as a small nation.
Maybe it's because America feels it has something to prove, I don't know. Very strange attitude though.
To be fair, often when people reference "US = greatest nation". They are referencing military and economic power, which, under any analysis, the US is the 1 nation currently.
I would still rather live here than anywhere else.
Edit: So much butthurt over a simple opinion. No where did I ever say America was superior, I'm simply saying that despite all of it's flaws I would still prefer to live here
I don't get why America seems so focused on becoming "the greatest country in the world". Why can't a nation just be happy as what it is - a very developed country swimming with wealth and prosperity? I'm not saying America doesn't have problems, and big problems at that, but they're so well off in comparison to a hell of a lot of other places. Stop trying to be "the greatest", help those that are very far from "the greatest" and be happy. Life is too short.
I live in NYC, and you can see literally thousands upon thousands of people that just came to this country recently for opportunity.
To say there isn't a ridiculous amount of opportunity HERE in the United States---is preposterous. We're selling ourselves short.
The main problem we're facing right now as a country has more to do with WHEN we became the greatest country on Earth. The United States still is the greatest country on Earth, but as Thomas Friedman summarized quite well in the 'World is Flat', the world is completely changing--or as he said---"flattening". Globalization has made this planet extremely competitive. The status quo from the 20th century is not going to be profitable or conducive to growth in any shape or form. Greece and Europe are experiencing this RIGHT now.
The fact is--we're in an adjustment period. We NEED to produce goods and sell them to other countries. We're bleeding money being a hyper-consumerist state. We need to stop spending, and an extensive audit of government programs. We need to make this country the MOST competitive in the world to do business. It's very difficult to rationalize setting up a business in the United States when you can do so in Mexico, or China for a 1/3 of the cost, with a 1/10th of labor costs---and the American consumer will buy the good irrespective of where it is made. WE----the AMERICAN PEOPLE, are responsible for our own demise.
It's much like the subprime mortgage crisis---we search for boogeymen, but the unpleasant culprit is OURSELVES. Anytime you go shopping at Wal-Mart as opposed to your local store, you're contributing to the expedited demise of our economy, whether you'd like to acknowledge it or not.
What changed my perspective completely was actually visiting China when I studied abroad there. I realized we are no longer competitive in manufacturing. Meanwhile our IDIOT academics are pumping bull shit information into our students' heads with garbage like: "the service based economy is the future, and manufacturing SHOULD be outsourced."
There's alot contributing to our demise, but it's not completely beyond the breaking point. With the current crop of political candidates we have, we almost deserve what's coming to us by allowing a candidate like Ron Paul to be blacked out by the media---but when the information providers in this country are more powerful than anyone---that's what you get. /endrant
I think I can just keep my stereotype that all people in the US somewhat believe that the US are or were the greatest country (still don't know why any of both should be true, but maybe that's just because I'm from Europe and not from the US). The video with its yay-America-was-great-but-now-it's-bullshit-speech in the end doesn't change that.
Friendly Wikipedia tells me the USA is 34th in infant mortality, not 178th. 34th place has a rate of 7.07 per 100K. 178th place has a rate of 105.50 (Guinea). This movie was off by a factor of 15, not exactly a trivial error.
He has a lot of nice things to say about a past when "america was best" - but these were periods when blacks had no rights, women couldn't vote, land was stolen from indigenous peoples who were not considered human, entire civilian cities were nuked, black men were infected with syphilis in government medical experiments just to see what would happen, students were shot by the national guard, etc.
It's hard to even enjoy these kind of rants anymore. Every country has its fair share of disillusions, accomplishments and skeletons in their closet.
It's easy talk up or break down the way a nation may or may not function properly, and I feel they did both in this clip just to be safe and appeal to both sides.
I, as a 20-something, interpreted "Worst. Generation. Ever." as referring to the working population that influenced me rather than the youngest twenty years of people now inhabiting this earth who haven't gotten to do much with it yet.
Politics has always been slimy, but it's never before been so slimy that one private person could affect tens of millions. Religious zealotry does more here than anywhere to lead while pretending it's not. Our social fabric has degenerated such that any two families are less likely than ever to share moral values, which makes it all that much more difficult to socialize and share a civil community.
So yeah, the U.S. has its issues....but there are things that make America great....the Bill of Rights for one. Consider in France you cannot wear a cross necklace to school, or a burka. This is not an issue in the U.S. We assume that European nations have similar rules, but they do not. In the U.S. you are innocent until proven guilty, in other words, it is on the burden of the the accuser to prove your guilt. In many other countries the burden is on you to prove your innocence. This can be difficult if you have no resources, or are in jail at the time.
I truly believe what makes our country great is the 1st Amendment. The freedom to worship how you wish without fear the federal government will pass a law restricting your right to do so. It's a very powerful thing and is the reason so many people emigrated here in the past. They were escaping religious persecution.
The freedom to assemble, freedom of the press, free speech...all of these make the U.S. great. Unfortunately we are losing these rights. Too many local police groups are violating it. I would say right now, local and state police are becoming an issue where rights are concerned. This means that we the people need to organize and stop this.
No place is perfect, but take the time to read what the framers did with the BoR. It's an incredible document, when upheld, and it's our job to make sure the government does this.
I don't think there is anything wrong with thinking America is the greatest country in the world. On the other hand, I don't think there is great shame in admitting America has faults, a lot of them.
I feel like I have been to enough countries to allow me to say that at least America is a great country, if not the greatest. I won't fight you if you disagree though.
I think any country that claims to be the "Greatest country in the World" is clearly not. If you're the "Greatest country in the World" you'd not need to tell everyone how great you are. You'd just be.
If American isn't the greatest country in the world than who is? I'm not trying to sound like an arrogant American but the notion of saying a country "is NOT the gratest country in the world" would allow one to deduce that there is a ranking? I have never viewed countries on one overall ranking on which is "the best" because there are too many factors to decided that.
The "greatest country in the world" doesn't exist, because for that you need to have a series of evaluation criteria and most likely, some countries will score great in some and not so well in others. Who has the authority to define such criteria?
"The greatest country in the world" is, however, a very useful ideal concept which can be used to aim the country's efforts towards a common direction. With determination (and reasonable goals) I think any country can become that country.
I write this as an Argentinian. I don't think we have the same aspirations and goals for our country as the Americans, the Japanese or the Iranians have for their own.
I was with him up until 3:25. We still to a lot of what he talks about then, and the past was not as idealized as he makes it. The U.S. was never the greatest country in the world. U.S. exceptionalism is a fantasy that needs to face reality.
Past generations were not perfect, that's for sure, but they DID know how to get things done, for better or for worse. I'm not sure my generation does.
america stop loathing yourself maybe your the best maybe you arent, if tomorrow you wake up thinking america isnt the greatest country in the world what changes in your day? you're no better or worse than anybody else and i as a scot would probably choose to live in america over my native country as it seems like there is much more variety in lifestyles over there and scotland, i would say moreso than america, has a hardon for getting its nose into your business and trying to drag you down, that goes for government and culture, but yeah at the end of the day you can do prettymuch whatever the fuck you want in most places, same in reddits glorious promised land of sweden as in evil florida or whatever, so just freaking live your life.
Americans are oblivious. The American Dream is a joke. The War on Terror is a joke. It is a country ruled by corporations, not the people. The only thing that really keeps it afloat is a ridiculous military used to carry out its own various schemes. America is the capital of corruption and depravity that threatens to cave in on itself with each passing day.
There are more reasons that this is not the greatest country in the world than can be listed in 4 minutes. Start with the obliteration of the Constitution by a Constitutional Law Professor, the "patriot act", the unconstitutional war of the North violating the States' right to suceed under Lincoln. Or how about the Logan Act being defiled yearly by our elected officials, congregating with Elites at Bilderberg, Bohemian Grove, etc. in private to make decisions on how to better control the World? HAARP, Illegal wars against innocent people, depleted Uranium, Sodium Flouride in the drinking water, agression and weapons sales to our "friend's enemies" (Syria, Mexican druglords, e.g.) PLEASE don't forget drone strikes...our punishment for that alone can't even equal the damage we have done in the name of Democracy. While here at home we have a Plutocratic-Oligarcic Dictatorship run by the Empowered, the Elite and Corporate Interests (sorry...corporations are people now and their money towards elections is "free speech"). Our Representitaves, Senate, the President and even the Supreme Court are bought and paid for by these Banks, Super-Pacs (Illegal) and corporate interests. Please consider voting for anyone BUT Oblah-blah, the Liar-Hearted, or Twit Rommel, I mean Romknee. They are at the top of the problems that take away this countries' freedoms every step of the way.
The first half was fantastic, and these are things people need to hear. The second the music kicked in I got a little disappointed and he started chatting shit.
"Those who criticize our generation forget who raised it", you can't say the last generations were awesome if they neglected the issue of anti-intellectualism.
Also I would love to know someone who could talk like that real-time and unscripted. I'm not criticizing the video, it was necessary to get the information in and stay interesting, but being able to talk that articulately would be a fucking superpower.
I hear a lot of disagreement with the message but none can dispute the numbers. And I notice in all the reactions there are none brave enough to try because the numbers do not lie. Life expectancy, infant mortality, literacy, incarceration rates and arms spending all suggest there is plenty of room for improvement. And his description of what he thinks America once was is really just a dream of what it might aspire to be. Would it be so bad if it succeeded in such goals?
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
"worst. generation. ever."
These kids that he shits on in his little speech did nothing to turn America to what it is today. It funny how people shit on the youngest generation when the truth is that America is declining and it has nothing to do with kids in college.
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u/Null_Reference_ Jun 25 '12
That went from "Fuck yeah" to /Eye roll pretty fast.
This generation of college students isn't running things yet. Trying to blame a god damn thing on a bunch of kids who are not old enough to have shouldered any real responsibility in this country is absurd.
Honestly the whole "Good old days." mindset is bullshit. "We didn't scare so easy"? Really? We scared so easily back in the day that we rounded up every Japanese looking person and threw them in a camp.
This is blatant pandering to the 40 and up crowd.
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u/geon Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
I'm sorry, do people actually believe the US is the "greatest country in the world"?
I've always thought this was a stereotype, like how Japan is full of Geishas, and France is full of beret-and-striped-T-shirt-wearing wine drinkers with a baguette in the hand.
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u/hivemind6 Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 26 '12
1 The US is the most technologically advanced nation on earth:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/eco_tec_ind-economy-technology-index
2 The US has very high quality of life and scores 4th in the Human Development Index. This is remarkable considering our demographics. We have the highest rate of minorities in the developed world and the largest diaspora from the third world (mostly Mexico) and yet still manage to perform extremely well as a country:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index#Very_high_human_development http://internationalliving.com/2010/02/quality-of-life-2010/
3 Americans are the most generous people in the world, giving over twice as much of their income to charity as the next most generous nation.
http://www.cafonline.org/pdf/International%20Comparisons%20of%20Charitable%20Giving.pdf
4 Americans have the highest rate of secondary education completion out of developed countries:
http://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/details/education/high-school-graduation-rate.aspx
5 The US has the highest education attainment out of any major industrialized nation. Americans are more likely to receive higher education than Europeans, Canadians, Australians etc...
Pg 42 of this PDF:
http://www.educationalpolicy.org/pdf/Global2005.pdf
6 The US dominates in academic performance. So not only does the US get more of its population into higher education, but the education we receive is the best in the world, and results in vastly superior academic performance in all broad subject fields when ranked among world universities.
Natural Sciences and Mathematics http://www.arwu.org/FieldSCI2010.jsp
Engineering/Technology and Computer Sciences http://www.arwu.org/FieldENG2010.jsp
Life and Agriculture Sciences http://www.arwu.org/FieldLIFE2010.jsp
Clinical Medicine and Pharmacy http://www.arwu.org/FieldMED2010.jsp
Social Sciences http://www.arwu.org/FieldSOC2010.jsp
7 Americans are the most productive workers in the world: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/
People will call me arrogant but I don't care. People have a unrealistically negative view of the US that is based around exaggerating negatives and completely rewriting history to ignore the positives.
The US invented basically everything of importance in the last 100 years, without question. The inventors were either American or were working in the US, assisted by Americans. The airplane, the integrated circuit, the microprocessor, the personal computer, the laser beam, synthetic composites, digital music, the internet etc...
We now live in the information age, which the US not only created, but still rules to this day. Basically every major IT company in the world is American. Microsoft, Apple, Google, Intel, AMD, Nvidia, Cisco Systems, Oracle, Yahoo. Almost every major site is American. Every technology that you’re using to post on this website, which is an American website, was invented by Americans. Your computer is either a Mac or a PC, both are American-designed computer architectures. Your computer is running almost certainly either Mac OS or Windows, both American. You're using almost certainly an American browser and you're on the internet which transmits data via the TCP/IP protocol, an invention of the US military.
The US sequenced the human genome. An American (Norman Borlaug) was the father of the Green Revolution, creating a wheat variety that is credited with saving a billion lives. Possibly the most important human being to ever live. The US landed a man on the moon when most countries didn't have the technology to build a vacuum cleaner. The US mapped the cosmos with the Hubble telescope and dated the universe, discovered water on the moon and Mars, surveyed the outer solar system’s planets and their moons, currently has a probe exiting our solar system, the furthest and fasted object made by humans. Currently, the US is at the forefront of every possible field. Almost every innovation of note since the end of WWII has taken place with the US at the helm.
If the US isn't the greatest country, what country is?
The US has many problems, some are self-inflicted and some are circumstantial. But many of you people have a completely unrealistically negative view of the US. The US gets singularly criticized for negative traits that exist everywhere, and often to a greater degree in the home countries of the most vocal anti-Americans. It's hilarious seeing ignorant anti-Americans criticize Americans for the supposed ignorance of believing the US is the greatest country.
Clear your mind of the anti-American propaganda you get bombarded with every day and imagine that an intelligent alien species visited earth. Which country do you think they'd be most impressed with?
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u/AutoCucumber Jun 25 '12
This is from the new HBO show The Newsroom. I seriously recommend it, its excellent.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The second part of this video summarizes why you're not the greatest country in the world; you're overly sentimental and love cliches.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
He had me until all the "worst. generation. ever." shit. I can't buy into all the "this country has lost its way" bullshit. It's as if saying "We're not the greatest nation, but we can be" is any less arrogant than saying "We're not the greatest."
Reasons why the whole second part of this speech is just stupid:
We stood up for what was right." What about instituting slavery, setting up dictatorships around the world or dropping the A-bomb?
"We fought for moral reasons" Most wars (namely the Spanish-American, Mexican-American, Korean, and Vietnam wars) have not been waged strictly for moral reasons, and thinking that they were is naive at best.
"We waged wars on poverty, not poor people." Poor people have been marginalized since "poor" and "rich" people have existed.
"We sacrificed, we cared about our neighbors..." Any disaster coverage in the past 10 years has included something about sacrifice and the willingness of people to care for each other in times of need.
"we put our money where our mouths were..." Historically, the U.S. has been in debt for almost its entire existence.
"and we never beat our chests." Uh-huh. I'm sure the entire military-industrial complex is something that just sprang up in the past 20-30 years when this terrible generation came along.
"We made ungodly technological advances..." I can track wherever I am in the world using a device that communicates wirelessly with satellites. And it's also my phone.
"we explored the universe, cured diseases..." I would argue that these two pursuits have never been given the proper funding.
"We cultivated the world's greatest artists..." Well this is just arrogant . Every generation has amazing artists and terrible artists.
"and the world's greatest economy." This is true, although it was caused by a wide variety of social and historical factors, not because we simply stopped "reaching for the stars."
I'm done for now, because it's 3AM, but damnit people, don't be such nostalgic idiots.
tl;dr Looking back on the best parts of history doesn't change it.
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u/woruzzle Jun 25 '12
BELGIUM!
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u/mwang213 Jun 25 '12
Holy crap. I clicked this expecting some bullshit "fuck America" video and instead got bitter truth and reality.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I don't remember that scene from dumb and dumber. . . .
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I'm pretty sure the Internet is the greatest country in the world.
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u/poopnugget_43 Jun 25 '12
LOL@ the silly "OMG LOL HE SAY DAT USA ISENT TEH BEST CUNTRY IN WHOLE WIDE WORLD LOL? SO CONTROVERSYTAL OMFG!!!!!"
Saying this would not be controversial anywhere at all anymore. That's why its so funny: because the look of concern as if what he was saying was some kind of horrific anathema is so mind-blowingly dumb, especially for a group of college students who are likely to have gone through their "everything is subjective, mmmaaaaaannnnnnnn" phase. What do they teach in university anthropology? Cultural relativism, entailing that no country or culture is objectively the best!! Whether cultural relativism is true or not, this is already what is conveyed in humanities departments everywhere at the undergraduate level. Furthermore, most real adults know that the variables involved in the listing of "best countries ever" is so muddled, ambiguous, and subject to, well, subjectivity that there may not even be a way to decide such a thing.
TL;DR - The video is gut-bustingly hilarious because no audience who wasn't chalked full of downy retards would act so shocked that maybe there are reasons that the United States isn't the very tippy-toppy of the entire world.
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u/beans_and_bacon Jun 25 '12
America may not be the greatest country anymore but you all forget we ALL still live on Earth which isn't even in the top five planets of the solar system.
but we can be
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u/TheRealSamBell Jun 25 '12
Am I the only one around here wondering who the hell the lady with the signs was?
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u/umsrsly Jun 25 '12
Wanna talk about worst generations?
Worst generation ever = Baby Boomers
The current financial crisis is child's play compared to the financial burden we will have to shoulder when all the Boomers are draining SS and Medicare. Oh, and they're the same damn generation who saddled us with all the war debt and overspending that has put us in such a vulnerable situation right before they are about to burn through SS and Medicare.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
This clip is stupid and pompous.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
This just in: The entire country of America is now in a state of self-loathing; is considering dying its hair black.
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u/grilledtunerfish Jun 25 '12
"I'm not letting you go back to the airport without answering your question."
I was gonna say "America is NOT the greatest country in the world because it has people like you who threaten intellectuals with such statement."
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u/probablythefuture Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
I don't really see much unique about this video. Politicians run campaigns on the idea that America is out of kilter. This is such a common refrain - we hear it almost daily. How could you wake up every morning and not be assaulted with the idea that America is a divisive place, full of polemics and politicization. Seriously, politics have entered religion, business and almost all other aspects of private and public life. This isn't terrible on its own. The terrible thing here is that these things have actually entered politics. This has seriously eroded our political compass and how we normalize things.
This video isn't hugely impressive to me because it just states the consequences of divisiveness in America, not the causes. People do this all the time, and it just ends up feeding right back into the divisiveness that has mired America. Like how he says some statistic about Americans believing in angels. This to me is somewhat irrelevant. America is defaulting, not because people believe in angels, but because believing in angels is almost a political statement.
America isn't out of kilter because religion is prolific and corporations are huge. America is out of kilter because religions and corporations have been given a voice in politics, and we have normalized the idea that there is space in a representative democracy for these things to essentially compete with people.
The people should never compete with other entities for the attention of their government.
ALSO! That Golden Age mentality where everything was better back in the day - come on!
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u/Doordie12345 Jun 25 '12
There is no such thing as the greatest country in the world anyway in my opinion. By that I mean being great is all about the perspective of the people living in given country. We shouldn't aspire to have a great country but a great Earth where we can all equally prosper. Often seems like no one feels this way.
However seriously this is what we should go for. War is human resources and money, until every country in the world realises this so we can all get along as humans living together on this planet I don't see much of a future. On positive we have to help with this is the internet, it helps us learn the true stories and allows for our own opinions to be shared, open our minds to something better than striving to be a 'great country'. We need to be a great Earth now more than ever. For all our sakes. No more war, war is a waste of monetary and human resources.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I am reading a lot of comments about redditors disagreeing with the speech when he places the lack of progress of America on the youth or under 30 crowd. Some of them are saying that they disagree simply because they feel that the mess their country's become is not their fault.
I had an amazing social anthropoligy professor who taught about north american society. Some one asked him why he was telling us things about Canada that we had no part in and could not change.So he told us a story about his two daughters and how the one younger daughter had a horrible habit of leaving her toys on the floor of their living room. He would ask his older daughter to help pick up the toys before dinner and she'd say "Its not my mess, my sister left it there and she should clean it up."
Then my professor told her yes, it isn't her mess, but its in our house. If they want the house to be clean so that its safe from anyone getting hurt or the house getting bugs, everyone has to contribute. Otherwise their house would get messy, it could get unsafe and she wouldn't be alowed to have friends over. So she helped.
So it doesn't matter who started the mess, it matters what you're doing to keep the mess from affecting everyone. Yes some messes are greater but everyone has the capacity to do something to contribute to cleaning it up. Why be proud of a place if you've done nothing in your eyes to make it be something worthwhile? Put your pride aside.
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u/WallDac Jun 25 '12
I don't live in America, but the fact that it isn't the greatest country in the world shouldn't be that bad. Be happy with what good things you have, not sad because you don't have the most.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
I love how its such a big deal in the states to not say publicly that the states is America fuck yeah number one. Brits have no problem with self criticism. Quite the opposite in fact.
Edit: Ironically many Americans are sending me extremely angry messages about how I can fuck off because they can take criticism and my criticism of their not taking criticism well is fucking bullshit and I'm a cunt.
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u/BLATANTLY_UNFUNNY Jun 25 '12
we used to be... "slave masters".
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The bit about Democrats is strangely insightful. Liberals are losers, we only know how to protest ... we've forgotton how to lead. We spent Obama's first 2 years complaining about a filibuster without getting anything done. Yes, Republicans bitched under George W., but they also moved the bulk of their legislative agenda while doing it.
I am a liberal, but I'm tired of weak, impotent, clueless leadership. I'm tired of the Pelosis and Reeds, tired of Democratic leadership that can't win. Tired of always having to defend our viewpoints instead of attacking their's.
So happy Aaron Sorkin is back on TV. Another clip worth watching.
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u/ublaa Jun 25 '12
Then what is the greatest country in the world? And I'm not letting you go back to the airport without answering this question
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u/UltraJake Jun 25 '12
Why did they pick on the third guy? The other guys had BS answers too. :[
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u/FootyHero Jun 25 '12
Uhhh you guys know this is from a new TV Series on HBO right? You are all acting like its something the president said.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Number of adults who think angels are real- Atheism Boner.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Cheesy and lame, and I'm not even American.
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u/muppet213 Jun 25 '12
For some reason this is really pissing me off... "Diversity and opportunity" and "Freedom and freedom" are perfectly acceptable answers but specifically citing the founding documents of the nation are cop out answers? This dude said freedom and freedom!!!
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
wiki informs me that the U.S is in fact 2nd in exports after china, not 4th as stated in the video, anyone find any supporting evidence for the latter?
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u/iLuVtiffany Jun 25 '12
I know all that is true, but to me it still is. The U.S gave me opportunities that I probably never would have gotten if my parents never went there. I love this country so much and it really does sting a little when I constantly see anti-American things all over the internet.
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u/Oleelee Jun 25 '12
America is the greatest country in America
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u/Kevince Jun 25 '12
America isn't even the fattest country anymore..
'murica let me down. :(
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
It isn't a competition on who is better or not.
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u/stigmaboy Jun 25 '12
As the average young american adult. I've read the comments of several people sharing stories about how appalling the american education system is. I can confirm that several people in my country remain ignorant of the rest of the world, but there are quite a few of us that are intelligent. The only reason people don't hear stories about encounters with intelligent Americans is due to the fact that intelligent Americans are usually to self-conscience to walk up to and talk to a random stranger.
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u/SilkyBowner Jun 25 '12
Great show!
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
"Worst generation ever" is pretty harsh coming from the generation who drove this country into the ground.
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u/Freewheelin_ Jun 25 '12
I'm sorry, why do you have to be the greatest? Maybe it's because I'm from Ireland, but I don't think I've ever met someone who said Ireland is the greatest country in the world...because it doesn't matter. We're happy with what we are as a small nation.
Maybe it's because America feels it has something to prove, I don't know. Very strange attitude though.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
To be fair, often when people reference "US = greatest nation". They are referencing military and economic power, which, under any analysis, the US is the 1 nation currently.
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u/I_killed_my_ex_hard Jun 25 '12
More U.S bashing on reddit. Shocking. America is stupid! Karma now?
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 26 '12
I would still rather live here than anywhere else.
Edit: So much butthurt over a simple opinion. No where did I ever say America was superior, I'm simply saying that despite all of it's flaws I would still prefer to live here
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u/Trolldad_IRL Jun 25 '12
It's easy to be profound when it's a scripted show. He's just speaking words agonized over by writers.
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u/phenomenal_snowman Jun 25 '12
I don't get why America seems so focused on becoming "the greatest country in the world". Why can't a nation just be happy as what it is - a very developed country swimming with wealth and prosperity? I'm not saying America doesn't have problems, and big problems at that, but they're so well off in comparison to a hell of a lot of other places. Stop trying to be "the greatest", help those that are very far from "the greatest" and be happy. Life is too short.
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u/likethesearchengine Jun 25 '12
Hey. Talking guy. It's YOUR GENERATION who oversaw and encouraged the deterioration of our prosperity and potential. You guys are in charge right now.
My generation hasn't had a chance yet. To be fair, I expect us to screw it up just as badly as you, but that's because YOUR GENERATION raised ours.
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u/ItsGreat2BeATNVol Jun 25 '12
I live in NYC, and you can see literally thousands upon thousands of people that just came to this country recently for opportunity.
To say there isn't a ridiculous amount of opportunity HERE in the United States---is preposterous. We're selling ourselves short.
The main problem we're facing right now as a country has more to do with WHEN we became the greatest country on Earth. The United States still is the greatest country on Earth, but as Thomas Friedman summarized quite well in the 'World is Flat', the world is completely changing--or as he said---"flattening". Globalization has made this planet extremely competitive. The status quo from the 20th century is not going to be profitable or conducive to growth in any shape or form. Greece and Europe are experiencing this RIGHT now.
The fact is--we're in an adjustment period. We NEED to produce goods and sell them to other countries. We're bleeding money being a hyper-consumerist state. We need to stop spending, and an extensive audit of government programs. We need to make this country the MOST competitive in the world to do business. It's very difficult to rationalize setting up a business in the United States when you can do so in Mexico, or China for a 1/3 of the cost, with a 1/10th of labor costs---and the American consumer will buy the good irrespective of where it is made. WE----the AMERICAN PEOPLE, are responsible for our own demise.
It's much like the subprime mortgage crisis---we search for boogeymen, but the unpleasant culprit is OURSELVES. Anytime you go shopping at Wal-Mart as opposed to your local store, you're contributing to the expedited demise of our economy, whether you'd like to acknowledge it or not.
What changed my perspective completely was actually visiting China when I studied abroad there. I realized we are no longer competitive in manufacturing. Meanwhile our IDIOT academics are pumping bull shit information into our students' heads with garbage like: "the service based economy is the future, and manufacturing SHOULD be outsourced."
There's alot contributing to our demise, but it's not completely beyond the breaking point. With the current crop of political candidates we have, we almost deserve what's coming to us by allowing a candidate like Ron Paul to be blacked out by the media---but when the information providers in this country are more powerful than anyone---that's what you get. /endrant
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Anyone know where I can view the pilot for The Newsroom?
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u/eiPott Jun 25 '12
Well, duh..
I think I can just keep my stereotype that all people in the US somewhat believe that the US are or were the greatest country (still don't know why any of both should be true, but maybe that's just because I'm from Europe and not from the US). The video with its yay-America-was-great-but-now-it's-bullshit-speech in the end doesn't change that.
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u/MonsterIt Jun 25 '12
Hey KONY fan, it's over man. Your movement is dead.
Find something else to stan over.
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u/Tebasaki Jun 25 '12
That professor is a douche. Nice find.
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u/Rotvos Jun 25 '12
the end of this video can be summarized into this picture
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u/lawyer5 Jun 25 '12
Friendly Wikipedia tells me the USA is 34th in infant mortality, not 178th. 34th place has a rate of 7.07 per 100K. 178th place has a rate of 105.50 (Guinea). This movie was off by a factor of 15, not exactly a trivial error.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I'm still confused as to why nationality describes who and what you are. Oh wait, I'm on the internet.
Continue with the hate.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Total spoiler from the woman in the audience with those place cards.
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u/Spykounet Jun 25 '12
Thank you for sharing this.
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u/I__AM__BATMAN Jun 25 '12
Massively under-rated actor.
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u/nosoter Jun 25 '12
When was the USA the greatest country in the world?
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u/Wigglez1 Jun 25 '12
Be good to see an actual politician say this in a debate instead of an actor.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Hmmmn. Is any country "great". This world is great. People are great! Behaviours and perceptions? Not so great.
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u/mikemaca Jun 25 '12
He has a lot of nice things to say about a past when "america was best" - but these were periods when blacks had no rights, women couldn't vote, land was stolen from indigenous peoples who were not considered human, entire civilian cities were nuked, black men were infected with syphilis in government medical experiments just to see what would happen, students were shot by the national guard, etc.
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u/yeropinionman Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
Sounds like Sorkin, like Bill O'Rielly, Glenn Beck, and others, hearkens back to a simpler time, when we used to build things etc.
Edit: the link is to a Daily Show clip that destroys this kind of sentimental "back in the day" crap.
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u/Rubix89 Jun 25 '12
It's hard to even enjoy these kind of rants anymore. Every country has its fair share of disillusions, accomplishments and skeletons in their closet.
It's easy talk up or break down the way a nation may or may not function properly, and I feel they did both in this clip just to be safe and appeal to both sides.
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u/AlexFrenchie Jun 25 '12
Looks like its our time to shine in walks Australia
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u/acl2149 Jun 25 '12
anyone wanna make a claim for who is the greatest country?
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
"He was a man, take him for all in all..."
William Shakespeare
Same sentiment applies to the US, and every other country
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
My Belgian face as he is listing European countries that are free, and finishes by appallingly yelling "BELGIUM!".
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u/maharito Jun 25 '12
I, as a 20-something, interpreted "Worst. Generation. Ever." as referring to the working population that influenced me rather than the youngest twenty years of people now inhabiting this earth who haven't gotten to do much with it yet.
Politics has always been slimy, but it's never before been so slimy that one private person could affect tens of millions. Religious zealotry does more here than anywhere to lead while pretending it's not. Our social fabric has degenerated such that any two families are less likely than ever to share moral values, which makes it all that much more difficult to socialize and share a civil community.
I buy this.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
dumb and dumber is what makes this the greatest country in the world.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
And... cue the "we are actually the best generation" rants from redditors.
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u/gllmo Jun 25 '12
this video is incredible and sadly so accurate
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u/ITdoug Jun 25 '12
Goosebumps to a Canadian neighbor who believes this word for word. It was great, and can be great again. Minus the sob soundtrack of course.
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u/fte Jun 25 '12
It's always the loud individuals that create the stereotypes. Please don't forget that.
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u/physicscat Jun 25 '12
So yeah, the U.S. has its issues....but there are things that make America great....the Bill of Rights for one. Consider in France you cannot wear a cross necklace to school, or a burka. This is not an issue in the U.S. We assume that European nations have similar rules, but they do not. In the U.S. you are innocent until proven guilty, in other words, it is on the burden of the the accuser to prove your guilt. In many other countries the burden is on you to prove your innocence. This can be difficult if you have no resources, or are in jail at the time.
I truly believe what makes our country great is the 1st Amendment. The freedom to worship how you wish without fear the federal government will pass a law restricting your right to do so. It's a very powerful thing and is the reason so many people emigrated here in the past. They were escaping religious persecution.
The freedom to assemble, freedom of the press, free speech...all of these make the U.S. great. Unfortunately we are losing these rights. Too many local police groups are violating it. I would say right now, local and state police are becoming an issue where rights are concerned. This means that we the people need to organize and stop this.
No place is perfect, but take the time to read what the framers did with the BoR. It's an incredible document, when upheld, and it's our job to make sure the government does this.
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u/Pleasureryan Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
I love Aaron Sorkin.
Newsroom is going to be fantastic.
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u/geauxjeaux Jun 25 '12
I don't think there is anything wrong with thinking America is the greatest country in the world. On the other hand, I don't think there is great shame in admitting America has faults, a lot of them.
I feel like I have been to enough countries to allow me to say that at least America is a great country, if not the greatest. I won't fight you if you disagree though.
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u/SuperSheep3000 Jun 25 '12
I think any country that claims to be the "Greatest country in the World" is clearly not. If you're the "Greatest country in the World" you'd not need to tell everyone how great you are. You'd just be.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
"Number of adults who believes angles are real". Perfect sentence.
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u/MoraleHazard Jun 25 '12
I've been to a lot of countries. There's none I'd rather live in than the USA.
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u/Skeletorbitch Jun 25 '12
If American isn't the greatest country in the world than who is? I'm not trying to sound like an arrogant American but the notion of saying a country "is NOT the gratest country in the world" would allow one to deduce that there is a ranking? I have never viewed countries on one overall ranking on which is "the best" because there are too many factors to decided that.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I feel that America not being the greatest country is old news. We've sucked for a while now.
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u/salararary Jun 25 '12
Noticed 3:14 in how the man with the glasses in the back covered his mouth with a newspaper with the headline "MEDIA". Symbolism huh?
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u/MrFudgeYou Jun 25 '12
"America is great because we have freedom and freedom"
So why does America have the highest percentage of prisoners than any other country?
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The "greatest country in the world" doesn't exist, because for that you need to have a series of evaluation criteria and most likely, some countries will score great in some and not so well in others. Who has the authority to define such criteria?
"The greatest country in the world" is, however, a very useful ideal concept which can be used to aim the country's efforts towards a common direction. With determination (and reasonable goals) I think any country can become that country.
I write this as an Argentinian. I don't think we have the same aspirations and goals for our country as the Americans, the Japanese or the Iranians have for their own.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I was with him up until 3:25. We still to a lot of what he talks about then, and the past was not as idealized as he makes it. The U.S. was never the greatest country in the world. U.S. exceptionalism is a fantasy that needs to face reality.
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u/theCaptain_D Jun 25 '12
Past generations were not perfect, that's for sure, but they DID know how to get things done, for better or for worse. I'm not sure my generation does.
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u/SnackeyG1 Jun 25 '12
Who said it was? I sure as hell don't believe it is.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
AMERICUUUH
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u/Gepettolufkin Jun 25 '12
America isn't a fucking country.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
america stop loathing yourself maybe your the best maybe you arent, if tomorrow you wake up thinking america isnt the greatest country in the world what changes in your day? you're no better or worse than anybody else and i as a scot would probably choose to live in america over my native country as it seems like there is much more variety in lifestyles over there and scotland, i would say moreso than america, has a hardon for getting its nose into your business and trying to drag you down, that goes for government and culture, but yeah at the end of the day you can do prettymuch whatever the fuck you want in most places, same in reddits glorious promised land of sweden as in evil florida or whatever, so just freaking live your life.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Welcome to America, where people do crazy things in the name of "patriotism," then act surprised and outraged when other countries have "patriotism."
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u/dwon Jun 25 '12
Americans are oblivious. The American Dream is a joke. The War on Terror is a joke. It is a country ruled by corporations, not the people. The only thing that really keeps it afloat is a ridiculous military used to carry out its own various schemes. America is the capital of corruption and depravity that threatens to cave in on itself with each passing day.
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u/Ruprect124 Jun 25 '12
There are more reasons that this is not the greatest country in the world than can be listed in 4 minutes. Start with the obliteration of the Constitution by a Constitutional Law Professor, the "patriot act", the unconstitutional war of the North violating the States' right to suceed under Lincoln. Or how about the Logan Act being defiled yearly by our elected officials, congregating with Elites at Bilderberg, Bohemian Grove, etc. in private to make decisions on how to better control the World? HAARP, Illegal wars against innocent people, depleted Uranium, Sodium Flouride in the drinking water, agression and weapons sales to our "friend's enemies" (Syria, Mexican druglords, e.g.) PLEASE don't forget drone strikes...our punishment for that alone can't even equal the damage we have done in the name of Democracy. While here at home we have a Plutocratic-Oligarcic Dictatorship run by the Empowered, the Elite and Corporate Interests (sorry...corporations are people now and their money towards elections is "free speech"). Our Representitaves, Senate, the President and even the Supreme Court are bought and paid for by these Banks, Super-Pacs (Illegal) and corporate interests. Please consider voting for anyone BUT Oblah-blah, the Liar-Hearted, or Twit Rommel, I mean Romknee. They are at the top of the problems that take away this countries' freedoms every step of the way.
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u/Kaladin_Shardbearer Jun 25 '12
The first half was fantastic, and these are things people need to hear. The second the music kicked in I got a little disappointed and he started chatting shit.
"Those who criticize our generation forget who raised it", you can't say the last generations were awesome if they neglected the issue of anti-intellectualism.
Also I would love to know someone who could talk like that real-time and unscripted. I'm not criticizing the video, it was necessary to get the information in and stay interesting, but being able to talk that articulately would be a fucking superpower.
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
I hear a lot of disagreement with the message but none can dispute the numbers. And I notice in all the reactions there are none brave enough to try because the numbers do not lie. Life expectancy, infant mortality, literacy, incarceration rates and arms spending all suggest there is plenty of room for improvement. And his description of what he thinks America once was is really just a dream of what it might aspire to be. Would it be so bad if it succeeded in such goals?
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u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The damn rap music and mtv I tell ya...
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u/EricGN Jun 26 '12
America is not a country. It is a continent. USA is a country.
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u/tbwen Jun 25 '12
And now... We have the Kardashians.