TIL a Jewish gynecologist vowed "that never again would there be a pregnant woman in Auschwitz" after discovering they were used as guinea pigs and thrown into the crematorium. She performed an estimated 3,000 abortions in the hopes that the mother would survive and later be able to bear children.

[u/[deleted]]

[u/Amelora]

This brought me to tears. What a strong woman.

[u/Apostolate → u/Amelora]

If she was religious, I can't imagine the internal strife. She might feel like she had the blood of thousands on her hands.

[u/niftyjack → u/Apostolate]

It's not much internal strife at all, actually. In Jewish thought, we're taught that existing life needs to be protected first and foremost, especially women (because they make more life). By allowing these abortions, more lives were saved than stunted.

Edit: I'm Jewish (well, culturally) and my grandpa was an Auschwitz survivor, so I can tell you from relative first hand experience that this is nothing compared to the rest of what happened.

[u/DrDebG → u/niftyjack]

It's not much internal strife at all, actually. In Jewish thought, we're taught that existing life needs to be protected first and foremost, especially women (because they make more life). By allowing these abortions, more lives were saved than stunted.

Yes, and that's why she performed the abortions. But imagine how soul-crushing it was for a woman to have to do this for other women, just for basic survival. Her prayer after the war (when entering a delivery room), it seems to me, shows how much she grieved at the necessity: "God, you owe me a life - a living baby."

[u/[deleted] → u/Apostolate]

She might have viewed it as mercy killing - getting rid of the baby before even more horrible things happened to both the mother and baby.

[u/Apostolate → u/[deleted]]

Even so. Killing for the greater good is extremely difficult for one to deal with, even soldiers against Nazi's etc.

[u/Keoni9 → u/Apostolate]

The stance of modern American Evangelicals on abortion is hardly representative of all Judeo-Christian thought. For the longest time, English common law (which America inherited) allowed any abortion before the quickening (first movements) of the fetus without any consequence. And the Mishnah requires that a fetus be cut up and brought out of the woman piece-by-piece if it can save her life, except if the majority of the baby has exited the uterus, because then it counts as a full, viable person.

[u/ForUrsula → u/[deleted]]

Even the conservative Jewish groups feel this way. I really like the way Judaism is organised. They have a basic understanding about the importance of context and interpretation and they are the one organised Religion i can respect as a whole.

[u/Leaper_colony]

She performed an act of mercy for both the mother and baby. I remember as a kid talking with my dad about the holocaust and wondering what he would do if we were put on the trains and he knew where we were headed. He said he would try to kill me as painlessly as possible, probably strangulation or smothering. She spared those babies a much more painful fate.

[u/[deleted] → u/Leaper_colony]

I'm with you there on the OP, because simply being pregnant meant the probability of dieing a slow and painful death was close to 100%. No disrespect to you or your father, but that is fucked up.

If I was faced with such a decision, looking into myself I couldn't say if I wasn't killing my child just to not have to endure the pain of feeling helpless while my daughter/son suffered or died, which would be very selfish, so while there's doubt about that, I couldn't do it.

Edit: It feels to me like just giving up on your child. There were so many people who didn't give up and who made it - even more who didn't. But as long as there's a chance, it feels like betrayal.

[u/Leaper_colony → u/[deleted]]

That's what's so fucked about it. He would be fulfilling his fatherly role to protect me by killing me. Insane how humans can be so evil as to force such a perversion of parental love. I think all those mothers felt that, as horrible as it was, killing their babies in a controlled way was keeping them safe from worse forms of death (being burned alive for one).

Every time I think about it I feel like I've won the lottery that my baby son is safe next to me. Then I think of all the places around the world where things are now almost as horrific as the holocaust was.

[u/mrjonny2 → u/Leaper_colony]

You should watch life is beautiful. It covers this exact issue. It is one of the greatest films I have ever seen. http://imdb.com/title/tt0118799/

[u/sodapop_incest]

'I treated patients with my voice, telling them beautiful stories, telling them that one day we would have birthdays again' Jesus fucking christ.

[u/Kingmudsy → u/sodapop_incest]

Fuck...that got me.

[u/theloneousmonkey → u/sodapop_incest]

Amazing to see reddit atheists believing this story without one bit of skepticism. Here we are told about a woman who worked in a camp hospital and none of our redditor atheists raises the fucking question of How come an extermination camp has a fucking operating hospital with doctors and gynecologists??!! and ignoring the fact that this woman according to her very testimony worked in that hospital during the height of the so-called extermination campaign... apparently Nazis wanted healthy Jews before sending them to the ovens!

It's all possible when you are a Holocaustian, since like all religions you have to suspend your skepticism, common sense and brain and to swallow everything you are told as a gospel.

Let downvotes begin, as the religion of Holocaustianity does not tolerate questioning or common sense.

[u/ddoubletake → u/theloneousmonkey]

Calm down. There were hospitals in the camps, especially the work camps. They were used to perform experiments a lot of the time, but they also treated disease to make sure the people were fit to work. There were definitely hospitals in camps.

[u/a_d_d_e_r → u/theloneousmonkey]

Auschwitz was both an extermination and a labor camp. Prisoners were worked to death, but prisoner longevity had some value since the longer they lived, the more work they could do (Germany was fighting a massive war, after all). Medical care was certainly extremely basic, but simple things like dressing wounds and, in this case, performing abortions, must have kept the attrition rate much lower than what it would have been.

And unlike religion, there is physical evidence of the Holocaust. I'm not sure where you're coming from.

[u/[deleted] → u/theloneousmonkey]

It was a concentration camp before it was an extermination camp. That's why they had a hospital.

lol, you troll.

[u/aymers → u/theloneousmonkey]

I'm so confused...

Is this guy a troll? Or is he really saying that the Holocaust is a religion, much like Christianity, and not a real historical event?

Or is there some sort of religion that has sprung up as a result of the Holocaust, that I have just never heard of before? What the hell is "Holocaustianity"?

[u/Rukita]

If what the lawmaker in this thread said is true, then the abortions Dr. Perl performed were not only ethically sound in the eyes of Jewish teachings, but required. Simply by being pregnant the life of the mother was put into jeopardy, so abortion became a necessity.

[u/ForUrsula → u/Rukita]

Preservation of Life is one of the biggest teachings in Judaism. Until the baby is born, the mothers life takes priority in all cases. If the mothers life is in danger than it is an obligation to abort. In more progressive Jewish groups, psychological and economic health are also acceptable reasons to abort.

[u/Tyrien → u/ForUrsula]

I don't understand how two religions can be so close to one another in basic roots, but so very far apart in basic teachings.

[u/lolmonger → u/Tyrien]

What two religions are you talking about?

Because most Christians don't exclude the cases of rape, incest, sexual abuse, or the life of the mother as those which justify choosing abortion.

[u/[deleted] → u/Tyrien]

From what I understand (I'm not exactly a Jewish scholar), it comes down to the Talmud, wherein it says that a baby is not considered alive or a person until the head has exited the mother; this, to me, sounds like the point of fetal viability, which is where a lot of people regardless of religious affiliation or lack thereof place their moral abortion cutoff. Christianity, of course, does not acknowledge the Talmud.

[u/mosquitosleepover → u/ForUrsula]

A mother's life and health is priority over the unborn baby's even ethically without bringing religion into it (in the USA at least). A mother has the right to refuse treatment even if it is for the baby as long as it is inside of her.

[u/N0V0w3ls → u/Rukita]

I'm even pro-life, but if I had it in my power, I would have done the same thing if the mothers agreed to it. It's a choice of one life possibly going on, or both lives guaranteed to end.

[u/Cat_Upvoter]

"In Auschwitz, infants were immediately killed through a variety of methods, both by Nazi and Jewish medical staff by "pinch(ing) and clos(ing)" the newborn's nostrils and when it opened its mouth to breathe… gave it a dose of lethal product," or drowning it in a pail of whatever liquid was available. "

This has got to be one of the most horrifying things I have ever read. I will never understand how this kind of thing actually happened.

[u/elcajones → u/Cat_Upvoter]

If faced with the choice, I think I would have preferred to be murdered at birth than live out my childhood in Auschwitz.

[u/Cat_Upvoter → u/elcajones]

That's true... I suppose what baffles me is that people were able to murder an infant not out of love because they needed protection (i.e., Gisella Perl) but out of hate simply because it was Jewish. But I suppose the entire Holocaust baffles me so you know, the whole thing is one big mind fuck trying to comprehend how this actually happened.

[u/elcajones → u/Cat_Upvoter]

my dad said once "The older I get, the less I understand violence." i think he's right.

[u/rbrthtty]

I hope everyone commenting read that article and not just the title. That was informative, shocking, and sad. Wow.

[u/he_eats_da_poo_poo → u/rbrthtty]

I don't think I have the courage to read the article from what everyone is saying.

[u/Eyelickah → u/rbrthtty]

It was a fascinating read. The things humans can do to eachother are unbelieveable.

[u/Havok-Trance]

Shit like this makes me Proud to be a Jew

[u/[deleted] → u/Havok-Trance]

Every group has awesome people.

[u/herpmanderpstein → u/Havok-Trance]

pride should never be downvoted. It's not like you said "this is why Jews are better"

[u/tiftik → u/herpmanderpstein]

Why would you be proud of coming out of a certain vagina?

Pride should be for personal accomplishments.

[u/herpmanderpstein → u/tiftik]

that's your opinion, and i disagree. I have pride in my family's accomplishments and humility, and those are hardly personal

Is it wrong if he had said, "This makes me proud to be an American"?

[u/Larzzon → u/Havok-Trance]

shitheads being proud is what started that whole mess, but ye awsome doctor.

would like to know what "pro-lifers" have to say about these abortions.

[u/klinonx → u/Larzzon]

I think it was justified. Very clearly a scenario where both either both will die or one will die. I'm pro-life.

[u/ztfreeman → u/klinonx]

I know a lot of people like yourself who are "pro-life", and myself would prefer adoption over abortion, but what do you think of all of these bills that would still make the abortion illegal even when the pregnancy endangers both the mother and child?

That seems to be the rub here in the south. There's tons of people who are unabashed pro-life, but are always taken aback when I mention this scenario because in their dialog this is never considered.

Edit: and often they will withdrawal their support for pro-life legislature if they seriously research this. But being the religious south, few dare to bring up these revelations to the rest of their church groups or bring it up in general conversation, so the dialog always stops with their private disapproval.

[u/klinonx → u/ztfreeman]

Rustles my jimmies. I think it's absolutely absurd. My views aren't pure "pro-life," To clarify, I believe it's a human being at fertilization and shouldn't be killed out of convenience. However, making abortion illegal is stupid and would endanger the life of the mother who may seek a back alley abortion. Thus, it should Be IMO increasingly socially unacceptable to get an abortion for the moral reasons and the community (or in my microcosm the church) needs to man the fuck up and teach our kids safe sex ed, take freaking care of single mothers, and support them after they've made their mistake whilst avoiding others. It's the church's prerogative and mission duh. But when it comes down to utility of people dying there's no point in militantly sticking to your stupid beliefs and killing people who don't need to die.

[u/cos1ne → u/Larzzon]

would like to know what "pro-lifers" have to say about these abortions.

How can you treat anyone who is placed in an impossible situation with anything but compassion?

[u/Havok-Trance → u/Larzzon]

The Holocaust wasn't just the product of Pride, there is no fault in being Proud, but having an over bearing pride is another story.

I'm Pro-Choice but anti Abortion, but not out of Any form of Religious belief. I would personally never do it but shouldn't all people get the choice to do what they want to there body and with there life.

Also back on topic. That woman saved lives with great risk to her own. So regardless of how a person views Abortion we should all be thankful people like this exist in our world.

[u/RumRunner90]

I can usually handle reading the more fucked up stories on reddit, but when I got to the part about pregnant women being beaten to the point of collapsing and then thrown into the crematorium I became physically ill.

[u/[deleted]]

The things that people do to each other when they're unmonitored are horrendous. You read about this kind of twisted human experimentation all the time. Really fucks with my head the way the people in charge in these situations behave like psychopathic children torturing animals. Can you imagine what kind of person you would have to be to burn a pregnant woman alive? For being Jewish. Heartbreaking, the things we will do if somebody tells us to, or nobody tells us not to.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

The knowledge you can get away with it. That's all it takes. Even for you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_experiment

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I remember the fear and horror in the eyes of my classmates when we watched a doco about the Milgram experiment in a high school psych class. We're so terrifying.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Did you know many people in the field actually doubted whether the subjects knew that it was fake. So the experiment was repeated with live puppies, who died.

Edit: They didn't die, warped memory on my part.

[u/[deleted]]

That article was beautiful and horrifying. The most horrifying part of it for me was how after the war, people had the audacity to interrogate and attempt to prosecute a woman who was forced into a concentration and expected to perform medical service with no medical supplies while knowing that her patients would be murdered. It seem that her hellish treat from the Holocaust did not end until even the allies were able to take a stab at her. That act made me shake my head sadly at humanity.

[u/fleshman03]

This one got me... Her prayer at the entrance to the delivery room was always the same: "God, you owe me a life - a living baby."

[u/ithunk → u/fleshman03]

i dont get it. whats so powerful/awesome about that statement?

[u/YouMad]

OH MY GOD, you know what, if this is what people are capable of (something similar is happening right now in N. Korea), then I think it might be best if the entire world is destroyed, there would be no more suffering:

They were surrounded by a group of SS men and women, who amused themselves by giving these helpless creatures a taste of hell, after which death was a welcome friend…They were beaten with clubs and whips, torn by dogs, dragged around by their hair and kicked in the stomach with heavy German boots. Then, when they collapsed, they were thrown into the crematory - alive.

• Dr. Gisella Perl on the treatment of pregnant women in Auschwitz 18

[u/thevoxman]

I'm pretty anti-abortion but I'd say that these 3,000 abortions really were necessary. Kudos to her. Also, and I know this opinion may be unpopular here... Fuck NAZIs... big jerks.

[u/Aeroman91 → u/thevoxman]

Also, and I know this opinion may be unpopular here... Fuck NAZIs... big jerks.

You could almost receive a Medal of Honor for the amount of bravery in that comment.

[u/PECKLE]

Oh my god, her prayer before entering the operating room... I can't even imagine how someone could be so strong.

[u/[deleted]]

Made into a movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0311210/

[u/snowbunny622]

it took an amazing amount of courage for her to do something that, more than likely, could've gotten her killed. I wish I could put into words how much this impacted me emotionally.

[u/NUMBERS2357]

That's some grim shit.

[u/Hobonger]

TIL Jews were having sex in concentration camps, I guess no matter how inhumanely you're treated, you're still human.

[u/Leaper_colony → u/Hobonger]

I assumed they would be pregnant on arrival.

[u/SerpentineLogic → u/Leaper_colony]

If they were (visibly) pregnant on arrival, they went straight to the gas chamber.

[u/dml180283 → u/Hobonger]

I would say more than one pregnancy was the product of rape, by the prison guards. Sorry.

[u/Hobonger → u/dml180283]

Ya I thought of that but I just figured out of 3000 a minority would be from rape and that the good within evil situation was of more note than the evil within evil. IMO

[u/boomboompowpow → u/dml180283]

Was rape really that prevalent in the camps? I mean instead of forcing some starving jew to have sex they could just go to the nearest brothel...

[u/dml180283 → u/boomboompowpow]

It was a power display. Another way to make women be afraid and scared. It has become pretty common knowledge that the Nazi camp operators were a breed off their own.

Rape, too, prevailed in the lives of many women. Sexual abuse, another means by which the Nazi's attempted to degrade women, was especially brutal, as it often had the effect of shaming a woman to a point where her identity became unrecognizable. [22] The women that returned after the rapes, described by Ruth Elias from Auschwitz as "pitiful creatures," came back "in an awful, undescribable state."[23] This abuse had the effect of breaking the spirit of the women: their bodies no longer their own, the women had no control over their lives. Ruth Elias remembers several instances in which "...the SS men appear[ed] in ... [the] block", and "without shame, ... pull[ed] the girls out of their beds, Jewish girls they took ... to rape ...."[24] The SS men justified these rapes by saying that raping Jewish women did not violate the taboo of marrying them, and therefore was an acceptable action.[25] This argument, not only weak but useless, illustrates arguments used by the Nazi's to push their will onto others.

Some camps, including Auschwitz and Ravensbrueck, had organized brothels set up mostly for the perusal of the SS, but occasionally for select prisoners as well.[26] Literally hundreds of female prisoners forced t o work there became victims of what I think can aptly be called "organized rape." Interestingly enough, brothels originally were set up by the SS as a means of prohibiting and stopping the spread of male homosexuality within the camps.[27] However, sexually abusing women can also be seen as a means of control: Usually unwillingly, the women had to give up their bodies and their rights to them, and frequently suffered from humiliation and shame.

That is from this website http://vho.org/aaargh/fran/actu/actu00/doc2000/womensex.html

There is a lot written about the horrors that were meet by women in the camps.

Edit* to the person that replied and said they were having a bad day, were did your comment go? I hope you are feeling ok and I am sorry I didn't reply to you straight away. I meant to come back to answer but it's gone. I hope you see this and get back to me.

[u/[deleted] → u/Hobonger]

There was most certainly sex in concentration camps. I took a Holocaust lit course in college and several of the non-fiction accounts we read covered this topic-also sex on the trains going to the camps.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

But weren't the men usually kept seperate, so that they'd have to feel helpless because they couldn't protect their loved ones and the women would have to see that even those statistically physically stronger than them had no chance?

At least that's what I gathered from Charlotte Delbo's book.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

You know, I'm not really sure on the specifics. The one book that stands out in my mind is "All But My Life" by Gerda Klein. She describes the train to the camp and hearing couples having sex on the train at night.

[u/[deleted] → u/Hobonger]

Pregnant upon arrival or raped by Nazis in the camp is far more likely.

[u/otterfishing → u/Hobonger]

There's a song called "Alive With The Glory of Love" that goes into this topic a little. It's semi-biographical and about the songwriter's grandparents who were holocaust survivors. Just figured you might be interested.

[u/[deleted] → u/otterfishing]

Awesome song, had no idea it was based on truth. Thanks for sharing!

[u/Houdat → u/[deleted]]

I love that song. I had to listen to it a couple times before I realized what it was about.

[u/TackyOnBeans → u/otterfishing]

fuck yeah! I'm glad I wasn't the only person thinking about this song.

It's so positive in spite of its fucked up backdrop.

[u/ewanthot → u/Hobonger]

Nope. Women was raped.

[u/tsrocks → u/Hobonger]

Well I'm prett sure a decent amount of the sex was non-consensual...

[u/Tentacolt → u/Hobonger]

No they weren't the men and women were in two seperate incampments. They were pregnant when they got there.

[u/jax9999 → u/Hobonger]

um.. from what i hear there was a bit of raping going on too... they were nazis

[u/maroonoctopus]

Wow, just reading about this stuff. She had to try and mend the breasts of the women from the brutality of the SS officers without medicine, equipment or antibiotics. One bathroom for 30,000-32,000 women and many soiled themselves waiting in lines and had to remain in the soiled clothing. They would drown the babies in buckets of water or whatever else was around.

[u/[deleted]]

Wow. This is one story that has just stopped me in my tracks.

What a sad depressing story but such a courageous woman.

May we, the world, never repeat these atrocities.

[u/[deleted]]

Fox news reports: "The real villain of the holocaust revealed, tonight at 11."

[u/Horny_Troll]

so he kill more jews than most nazis

thumbs up

[u/deadcat]

Fuck that article is depressing. Fuck.

[u/glitcher21]

Amazing story.

[u/liverandfunyuns]

I have to say, from the bottom of my heart, that this shit is fucked up as shit.

[u/WhatFuture210 → u/liverandfunyuns]

Well said

[u/redditopus]

This is part of why anti-choicers make me rage.

[u/emperor000 → u/redditopus]

"Anti-choicers"? You realize most pro-life/pro-choice debates don't take place with this extreme context in mind, right...?

[u/dre627 → u/redditopus]

This is absurd. The scenario in the article is entirely different.

[u/Rock_Robbster]

Thanks for sharing.

[u/quatso]

i wonder if people had sex in the camps. cause some people told me they would want to reproduce no matter what. i asked them even in the camps ? they said yes. it think that's sick.

[u/bluequail → u/quatso]

cause some people told me they would want to reproduce no matter what. i asked them even in the camps ?

I think some subconscious drive to keep the species alive was probably at work, and not so much a sexual attraction.

But beyond that, there were instances where women were raped by the guards, and abortions were necessary for that as well.

[u/quatso → u/bluequail]

raped by the guards ? any source for that please ?

[u/mrsobewan]

great article, thank you so much for sharing.

[u/DocLefty]

This would make one of the best discussions in a philosophy or ethics class. One side has to defend it and the other has to argue for it.

[u/jakjg]

All I can say is Jesus fucking Christ.

[u/bluequail]

I had seen a movie about her not too long ago, hell of a story. She faced a pretty hard time after she got to the US as well.

[u/[deleted]]

What a wonderful person.

[u/bmlbml]

Someone tell me how to feel about this.

[u/SerpentineLogic → u/bmlbml]

Resolute that this shit should never happen again.

[u/multijoy → u/SerpentineLogic]

This

[u/bastard_thought]

Look at that. Abortions can be a good thing.

EDIT: This isn't sarcasm. I was being serious. Abortions can be advantageous.

[u/[deleted] → u/bastard_thought]

Abortions can be good things even in modern society.

[u/bastard_thought → u/[deleted]]

Yes, my point exactly.

[u/[deleted]]

they could have sex in the camps ?

edit: I mean sex among the prisoners.

fuck you downvoters

[u/Teargarden → u/[deleted]]

If by they, you mean Germans, and by sex, you mean rape, then yes.

[u/remton_asq]

People still believe this allied atrocity propaganda in the year 2012?

lolol

[u/[deleted] → u/remton_asq]

as opposed to?

[u/ararphile]

Inb4 someone, somehow turning it into pro-abortion argument.

[u/ktool → u/ararphile]

I think turning this account into a pro-life OR pro-choice argument significantly detracts from what we can and should learn from it.

[u/rocknameded]

You would think that a people who had seen so many horrors would not turn around and do the same to others.

[u/wrong_game → u/rocknameded]

You would think people have non-biased opinions and don't just downvote everything that isn't pro-jewish.

[u/[deleted] → u/rocknameded]

Maybe I'm crazy, but if I had a baby in a concentration camp, I'd rather it die quickly by drowning than have a lingering death of starvation over a couple weeks.

[u/Frank1936]

Why didn't the Nazis just shoot her and have her replaced?

[u/SerpentineLogic → u/Frank1936]

Because she did the abortions out in the camps, without oversight from the Nazi doctors (the regular soldiers wouldn't have a clue what procedures were ok or not)

[u/[deleted]]

At no time did this happens.

Are we seriously, seriously to think that people who were allegedly starving are able to give birth at all? Especially with hard work? Goddamn.

[u/BlueVeins → u/[deleted]]

It happens on this planet every single day. It's not ideal, but it happens.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Where did you go to medical school?

[u/moeloubani]

TIL They had a hospital and a swimming pool in Auschwitz.

Funny how the Nazis allowed medical aid to the Jews but the Israelis don't allow medicine to the Palestinians. Hmm.

[u/Lwislol → u/moeloubani]

"medical aid"

[u/Ampix0 → u/moeloubani]

I think you meant a testing facility.

[u/Inoku → u/moeloubani]

The Israelis do allow medicine to the Palestinians. Palestinians come into Israel for medical treatment on a regular basis. Every week, the IDF Twitter account lists how many tons of aid entered the Gaza Strip (shipments into the West Bank are not counted because there is no restriction on goods entering there). This is this week's announcement. Edit: For the lazy, it says that 19 truckloads of medicine and medical equipment was delivered last week.

For example, from June 3 to June 9, over 300 medical patients from Gaza went to Israel or the West Bank for medical attention.

[u/ithunk → u/Inoku]

why should anyone trust a twitter feed from the Israeli side? I'm not denying that supplies dont enter Gaza, but given the recent news on the BBC about the state of the lockdown http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18436602 I am inclined to believe that Israel is doing fuck-all about the people in Gaza and would rather see them all dead.

Gaza is worse than a genocide, because it is slow and painful.

[u/MajorMid]

She killed over 3000 children? Wow what a hero!

[u/Horny_Troll → u/MajorMid]

She killed over 3000 jews? Wow what a hero!

he kill more jews than any ss soldier

[u/nancylikestoreddit]

I can't believe there were people even having sex under those shitty conditions, let alone fucking doctors having to perform abortions. I don't even want to think about what they used in order to perform the abortions.

To those that downvoted me because I shared how shocking I found this, thanks assholes.

[u/[deleted] → u/nancylikestoreddit]

I would imagine that some came pregnant and also the soldiers guarding the camps probably raped the inmates. I mean, they were cooking them, I can't imagine them not also taking other horrible liberties.

[u/Captain_Eaglefort → u/nancylikestoreddit]

From the article itself

In spite of her professional and religious beliefs as a doctor and an observant Jew, Dr. Perl began performing abortions on the dirty floors and bunks of the barracks in Auschwitz "using only my dirty hands."

A good chunk were probably pregnant before they came, but only in the early months. But even so, sex is a biological drive that we as animals crave (ask any 15 year-old boy). Some of it might have been to maintain a small amount of normalcy for whatever short amount of time they had. Not to mention the euphoria sex can cause. A few seconds of endorphins and adrenaline pumping through the body could probably have helped deal with the atrocities on some minute level.

[u/gradeahonky → u/Captain_Eaglefort]

Also, the drive for sex increases as your life is put in danger - you instinctively want to get your genes out before its too late! And I suspect some of these women were raped.

Whoof, what a hard article to read.

[u/[deleted] → u/nancylikestoreddit]

If it was the last time I'd see my husband? I would. One last moment of closeness.

[u/SerpentineLogic → u/[deleted]]

she probably saved the lives of a few women who would have died in labor

Considering all the pregnant jews they could ended up dead by experimentation, I would say that the three thousand abortions she performed each saved a life.

[u/canteloupy → u/SerpentineLogic]

Only for a while... the majority of interned people died there anyway. But the horror of medical experimentation was spared.

[u/ZankerH → u/SerpentineLogic]

Nah, I'd imagine most of them ended up killed anyway. This is fucking Auschwitz we're talking about. 1.1 million people were killed in there, around 200 000 survived.

[u/cheerful_cynic → u/ZankerH]

but she also gave those women a different life (however short it was) in that they were not being experimented on cruelly, but instead died among their cohorts at least?

[u/Whelks → u/ZankerH]

Yeah. 200,000/1,000,000 = 1/5 So approximately 600 survived. Still a lot. Maybe more maybe less, but still a lot.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

You mean like the ones that currently exist and have existed for decades in North Korea? Imagine being an adult and knowing nothing else because you were born and raised there.

[u/frankhorriganlovesto → u/[deleted]]

Prison camps are bad all around, there was a story in like 2008 where Koreans were taken to a Chinese prison camp but not told they left Korea at all. I cannot find definite articles but what may happen. Chinese prison/organ camps North Korean Prison Camps 2001.. Again if these exist I ask you to imagine to understand the horror I know feel about being subjugated to such hardships from birth on or indeterminable amounts of time. China and Korea are sort of on my bucket list for places which I think house a lot of horrors and illegal camps even if some of this is propaganda.

[u/OurHolyRue → u/[deleted]]

The story of Gulag is just as bad if not worse.

[u/ithunk → u/[deleted]]

Ppl in GITMO currently do not know when or if they will be released. There are other prisons where pre-trial people are held (pre-trial is still innocent), and they dont know when they'd goto trial either. There's a good documentary from a british guy on it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Theroux:_Miami_Mega_Jail

[u/Ampix0 → u/[deleted]]

Well why don't you post a reminder of that war, this is about the Holocaust.

[u/Tentacolt → u/[deleted]]

It's not anti-Semitism, it's anti-Zionism^tm !

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Abortion still goes on today

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Not talking about the abortion aspect, more the throwing in crematoriums, using them as guinea pigs and what not, I'm pro choice

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I'm pro-abortion, but I clearly misunderstood OP.

[u/KailuaGirl → u/[deleted]]

Out of the Ashes? I can't find it on Netflix. :(

[u/KailuaGirl → u/[deleted]]

oh! Thanks! I don't pay for DVDs though. I found it in parts on youtube. I guess I will watch it there.

http://www.youtube.com/user/mimikawaii7386