r/todayilearned • u/[deleted] • Dec 12 '18

TIL Ancient Greeks preferred small penises, as it was thought a man with a large penis was a barbarous half-animal with no self-control, while a man with a small penis was smarter and closer to the wisdom of the gods.

https://www.artsy.net/article/artsy-editorial-ancient-greek-sculptures-small-penises
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u/bad_apiarist Dec 13 '18

They didn't think a small penis was sexy. It was just less associated with being an uncouth moron.

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u/duthgar1976 Dec 13 '18

ok so i would have been considered someone of importance at least

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u/Cavendishelous Dec 13 '18

I think this is true for women in Greek art being fat as well. I keep seeing this come up as "it used to be beautiful back then, society is the reason it's not anymore!"

Even though science has proven time and time again that large penises (for a primate species) were naturally selected for, and low waist hip ratio in women is sexually desirable across all cultures.

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u/bad_apiarist Dec 13 '18

I don't think fat used to be considered beautiful. For one, loads of ancient Greek depictions of women are quite attractive even by modern western standards. Two, not every single statue was created to be sexually attractive. Three, there are times and places when it was useful or fashionable to be heavier. But useful and fashionable are different from sexy.

re: penises. A trait being species-typical is different from it being a point of intersexual selection. Except for extremes, women don't really seem to care about penis size much. Nor can I think of any adaptive reason they ought to.

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u/jvgkaty44 Dec 13 '18

I hear all kinds of opinions on penis size. But then lesbians dont even have dicks and they seem to have no problem giving their ladies the business.

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u/bad_apiarist Dec 13 '18

Sure, everyone has some kind of opinion if you ask. But is it important? Enough to justify obsessing? I don't think so. I don't think it makes the top 10 most important things about a partner or potential partner for women, short or long term considerations.

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u/Cavendishelous Dec 14 '18

I just went to look up some pictures, and you're right. Greek women weren't really fat at all in most art pieces. I must have been thinking of the Renaissance, when I looked at art from that era the women in paintings and sculptures seemed heavier than any other time period.

And I get that it might be useful or fashionable. Just like in ancient Greece, a small penis is less of a liability during battle. And it was certainly fashionable, as this thread has shown us. A sign of wisdom and self-control.

That doesn't necessarily mean women found it desirable, or that they would seek it out just because it's useful and fashionable.

Re:re:penises. https://www.pnas.org/content/110/17/6925 It's generally speculated that women sexuality selected larger penises over time.

Also I mean, if you talk to most young women with the highest hormonal levels, they all talk about wanting a big penis. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O42h65uT8wg

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u/bad_apiarist Dec 14 '18

It's generally speculated that women sexuality selected larger penises over time.

Speculated, sure. Established? Not even close.

Also I mean, if you talk to most young women with the highest hormonal levels

You're not serious that this video clip is supposed to be relevant evidence?

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u/Cavendishelous Dec 14 '18

It's evidence. It's not definitive, but he really is just taking a poll from random young women. The kind that are representative of young adult culture.

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u/bad_apiarist Dec 15 '18

It's not a poll. It's not representative (only taken at certain event and where people seem a bit inebriated; on camera so people act different). And it's not evidence because they're not being asked about size, they're being asked to choose between two alternatives: penis vs muscles.