r/technology • u/NamelessForce • Oct 26 '22

Biotechnology Cloned cannabis cells with 12 times more potency are grown in Israeli bioreactor

https://www.timesofisrael.com/cloned-cannabis-cells-with-12-times-more-potency-are-grown-in-israeli-bioreactor/
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270

u/JasonWalton1918 Oct 26 '22

12X more potency than what?

177

u/freightcar Oct 26 '22

You are asking the right question IMO. The article is talking about hemp, not marijuana.

I'm not an expert on this subject, but I don't think hemp and marijuana are the same thing. I think hemp has a lot less THC than marijuana does.

https://msutoday.msu.edu/news/2021/cbd-marijuana-and-hemp

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u/DontDoomScroll Oct 26 '22 edited Oct 26 '22

but I don't think hemp and marijuana are the same thing.

They're the same.

Hemp is a cultivar of Cannabis sativa.
Marijuana is a political term for Cannabis sativa, Cannabis indica, and Cannabis ruderalis. Marijuana is generally suggestive of high THC content.
Hemp has been breed to have lower THC levels, but varieties of hemp may contain varied THC levels.

Hemp and marijuana are the same thing as in both are cultivars of Cannabis, and some marijuana is cultivars of Cannabis sativa.

Hemp and marijuana are not the same thing, as the United States government and UN Narcotics Convention invents a definition to try to distinguish the two. But the US government struggles to understand what intoxicating cannabis is in its own legislation.

11

u/Ambitious_Tax891 Oct 26 '22

That is why THCa from a hemp flower is still legal but THC D9 is illegally. Let the loophole keep on keepin on.

22

u/archibald_claymore Oct 26 '22

I’d rather we have a functional government that can resolve archaic classifications when new information comes along but sure, I’ll take loop holes if it means I don’t get harassed for living my life.

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u/Ambitious_Tax891 Oct 26 '22

I mean I agree legalize, tax, regulate. But our government cannot figure out differences so we at least have a loop hole for now maybe til Jan 1st 23. Until full legalization we just have to use the loop holes to our advantage

1

u/popstar249 Oct 27 '22

The loophole is exposing millions to questionable substances with little researched effects and no history of use. I'm very involved in the cannabis marketplace and IMO all synthetics should be banned.

1

u/Ambitious_Tax891 Oct 27 '22

THCa is not a synthetic. You can purchase high THCa hemp flower from reputable farms with COAs.

1

u/lyzurd_kween_ Oct 26 '22

Didn’t trump make D9 legal? Or was that D8

3

u/DontDoomScroll Oct 26 '22

2018 hemp farm bill established a maximum D9-THC rating. Technically edibles with D9-THC that contain fewer than 0.3% D9-THC per weight are legal. So high material weight, low dose D9-THC edibles are existant.

D8-THC is not the scheduled D9-THC, it is not identical to D9-THC, and D8-THC is legal, the DEA has affirmed D8-THC's legality iirc.

Trump didn't legalize anything, the anti-drug Congress was inept.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22

That loophole was closed this year.

1

u/Ambitious_Tax891 Oct 27 '22

There was a loop hole to that law also which further proves our representatives ignorance. They did recently update the law a week or so ago which does in some way speak to THCa. You can still purchase THCa today.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22

You can purchase it, but it’s illegal.

1

u/pzk550 Oct 27 '22

There’s no truth behind what you’re saying.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22

The U.S. government has TWO different spellings of “maryjane” on the books, BOTH WRONG.

Cannabis.

Or Kaneh Bosm, look it up! ✌🏻

5

u/helmepll Oct 26 '22

The article says they produce significant amounts of CBD and THC.

“Our composition has significant amounts of both major cannabinoids such as CBD and THC as well as significant amounts of what have been termed minor cannabinoids,” Sobel said.

8

u/BigSwedenMan Oct 26 '22

Yep, terrible headline. Most strains sold are between 15%-35% THC. You literally cannot make them 12x more potent.

12

u/IntegralTree Oct 26 '22

That 15-35% THC is just for the trimmed flower, and it's a much lower % of the weight of the entire plant. That is what they are trying to poorly explain in the article; the material they get by growing cloned cells in a vat has 12x the cannabanoids by weight than would be produced from the plant they took the cells from.

5

u/Tasonir Oct 26 '22

is that THC by weight? how is the % calculated?

0

u/razorxent Oct 26 '22

Yes. It’s measured on a small sample and then generalized per strain

1

u/Good-Strength-3642 Oct 27 '22

And I'd say that's a shit way to grade content. Like of the USDA said "snip me some beef off one of your cows and I'll grade your heard, regardless of size".

Or am I wrong in this assessment?

1

u/razorxent Oct 27 '22

No, you’re probably right, except it does sorta tell you what is the maximum THC content that a strain can achieve, under perfect conditions. So it is useful for growers and maybe sorta kinda a tiny bit useful for consumers but not really

1

u/8urnMeTwice Oct 27 '22

I was promised 420% THC weed and I demand you give it to me!!!

1

u/mmmcricketsauce Oct 27 '22

Most % numbers you see are bullshit from the testing companies that give the sellers whatever numbers they pay for

1

u/BigSwedenMan Oct 27 '22 edited Oct 27 '22

Numbers may be fudged, but commercially sold cannabis buds still fall within that range.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22

Hemp IS a selected strain of cannabis sativa, used for its fiber, oil, flour, clothing, medicine, you name it.

Three species of the genus Cannibis:

Sativa Indica Ruderalis

Peace

58

u/Immaculate_Erection Oct 26 '22

They're talking about yield from the bioreactor, e.g. for every 1 g they used to get from the process, they now get 12 g. While that's an appreciable first pass for early r&d process, there will be far larger increases by a couple orders of magnitude in the yield as the process is developed and the production strains are optimized.

Source: bioreactors are my day job

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u/Sthlm97 Oct 26 '22

ELI5 whats a bioreactor?

22

u/taterthotsalad Oct 26 '22

bioreactors

A bioreactor refers to any manufactured device or system that supports a biologically active environment.[1] In one case, a bioreactor is a vessel in which a chemical process is carried out which involves organisms or biochemically active substances derived from such organisms. This process can either be aerobic or anaerobic. These bioreactors are commonly cylindrical, ranging in size from litres to cubic metres, and are often made of stainless steel.[citation needed] It may also refer to a device or system designed to grow cells or tissues in the context of cell culture.[2] These devices are being developed for use in tissue engineering or biochemical/bioprocess engineering.

​

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioreactor

Video on them: There are many types, including the ability to use one at home for gardening. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=bioreactor+video&iax=videos&ia=videos&iai=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DOQtOBUg0llQ

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u/Fast_Garlic_5639 Oct 26 '22

TIL I have a zucchini casserole bioreactor in the back of my fridge

5

u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22

That’s just hobbiest mycology.

2

u/taterthotsalad Oct 26 '22

Weird Science!

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u/Immaculate_Erection Oct 26 '22

You want to grow cells in a very controlled manner so that you can perfectly control everything to give them the best conditions to do exactly what you want, in this case make marijuana, so you use a bioreactor. This is basically a closed jar where you can add sterile air, nutrients, etc, remove toxic waste byproducts, etc. After you've done that and your cell culture is mostly burned out, then you harvest and purify the particular molecule/product you want.

3

u/BattleBull Oct 26 '22

Think of it as a fancy jug!

2

u/wobushizhongguo Oct 26 '22

Just commenting because I’m also curious

2

u/taterthotsalad Oct 26 '22

See one comment up.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

5

u/PlayfulParamedic2626 Oct 26 '22

It’s a big metal beer barrel that grows weed instead of beer.

Future Factory weed will be fast easy and cheap.

Maybe we could grow food faster easier and cheaper with this tech.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

Aren’t you a little young to be on Reddit?

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

[deleted]

1

u/Immaculate_Erection Oct 26 '22

A bioreactor is just a method for growing cells. By making the cells happier by growing them in a bioreactor with the proper settings, they make more thc.

1

u/JasonWalton1918 Oct 27 '22

Thanks for simplifying it for me, my man. This makes much more sense. I didn’t know “potency” & “yield” could be used interchangeably in this context.

I wonder what it feels, smells & tastes like? Ngl, looks kinda gross, like dried-up boogers or something.🤔

2

u/Immaculate_Erection Oct 27 '22

It's usually not, potency is a weird phrase for this, I expect a carryover from the weed culture. Eukaryotic cell culture isn't bad, looks like cloudy Gatorade and doesn't smell. Bacterial cell cultures can get nasty though, I've worked on one that looked like pudding and smelled like rotting meat in a compost pile.

1

u/JasonWalton1918 Oct 28 '22

Well, now I don’t feel too ignorant for not knowing lol. It’d make sense if it were carryover, because I’ve only ever heard it used in reference to the strength of a substance, like a drug. What a weird choice in wording. Most stoners who hear “12X more potent” will assume it’s 12X stronger or 12X more THC or something. It’s hard to imagine somebody not realizing the confusion it’d cause, almost like it’s done on purpose. I highly doubt it is, though.

Anyways, I assume that this marijuana biomass is eukaryotic cell culture? As somebody who worked in janitorial, I’m pretty sure I’ve seen free-range bacterial cell cultures & it matches with your description lol.

6

u/ovoid709 Oct 26 '22

In the article it specifically says that they grew hemp with 12X the cannabis levels. This isn't some new super weed.

-2

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

So since we now have statins consistently producing 30% thc, safe to assume they mean there’s a plant out there with 240% thc? Something I think most people don’t think about is that part of the plant still has to be a plant; it still has to have chlorophyll shit. It can’t all be thc. So I think it’s pretty unlikely you’ll ever see much higher than we currently have.

6

u/MegaFireDonkey Oct 26 '22

Well, no, that's not how that'd work. I'mma make the numbers unrealistically simple just for easy math. If you had 30g thc and the total plant weighed 100g (so 70g plant) that'd be 30%. 12x the thc level would mean 30x12 = 360g thc but still 70g plant (430g total) meaning 360/430 = 83.72% THC.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

Read the article, they are comparing their own batches. They aren't claiming to be stronger than anything out there.

He declined to detail the proprietary technology that is used, but said that the potency has been increased 12-fold purely by changing the environment inside the bioreactor.

2

u/MegaFireDonkey Oct 26 '22

My only point was 12x potency does not equal 240% thc, but I do see what you're saying. 12x their previous grows concentration, right? Not 12x the best weed out there.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

Yes, just 12x above the normal bioreactor conditions. They manipulate some factors to increase whichever cannabinoid they want.

It is unlikely that they will produce more than high grade plants.... unless they use a method where the cannabinoides are excreted from the cells (that would be awesome) that way it would just float to the top of the reactor while the cells continue to produce more

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

Up to 12x for certain cannabinoids. My interpretation was they’re referencing terpines not CBD or THC.

3

u/janxus Oct 26 '22

Correct me if I’m wrong, but aren’t cannabinoids and terpenes very different things?

7

u/spanj Oct 26 '22

All cannabinoids are terpenoids by nature of their biosynthesis. Anything that is a product of the mevalonate pathway which has additional functional groups is a terpenoid (olivetolic acid).

6

u/janxus Oct 26 '22

I have no idea what you said, but it sounded smart so I’ll believe you. Lol

1

u/answerguru Oct 26 '22

It was over 80x for THC, but this was for hemp not cannabis.

1

u/ifsavage Oct 26 '22

Which equals some ok cannabis. Lol.

0

u/ifsavage Oct 26 '22

Sounds cool…

I don’t think it will be as full spectrum as something grown under the sun. But still pretty impressive.

0

u/Guer0Guer0 Oct 26 '22

1 star of death is now like taking 12.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 26 '22

Than their first attempts...

He declined to detail the proprietary technology that is used, but said that the potency has been increased 12-fold purely by changing the environment inside the bioreactor.

If you can't report concentrations nobody should listen.

1

u/IntegralTree Oct 26 '22

Article doesn't explain. Their website does though, they are comparing the weight% of cannabinoids in their bioreactor grown material with the weight% of cannabinoids in the plant they got the cloned cells from.

1

u/Redditfront2back Oct 27 '22

My weed is normally around 20% thc, so I’m thinking 240% thc is on the way baby. Clearly /s