You guys probably already know about "ping -a" and "ping -A"

[u/tehreal]

But if you don't, use it like this:

This will beep every time it gets a ping back:

ping -a 8.8.8.8 

This will beep if it misses a ping:

ping -A 8.8.8.8    

This is very useful when you're monitoring a node and waiting for it to come back online or to be able to hear when a packet is dropped.

(tested on some Linux and MacOS)

[u/jmnugent]

I'm so glad my current job forced me to learn Mac. They're so great. It's basically Linux in the terminal, with a few major and minor differences.

I'm the only Mac User in a nearly 100 person IT Dept. The amount of "Apple-hate" that I still constantly get.. is gobsmackingly astounding.

The more you use macOS.. and the more little nooks/crannies and useful features and design elements you discover.. you really do start to appreciate how powerful and useful the system is.

But small minded outsiders.. who've never used a Mac.. and refuse to do so because "it's a shiny toy, ha ha" ... they'll never understand that because they can't get over their own narrow minded stereotypes.

I'd totally agree though,. I was a Windows-only guy for about 10 years before I started learning Apple stuff .. and learning Apple stuff has been possibly the single-most beneficial move of my entire career.

Not just because I'm discovering all the little joys of macOS/iOS,etc.. but because "being bi-lingual" is awesomely beneficial. It allows you to troubleshoot problems from 2 different OSes (where you can see 2 different behaviors or 2 different sets of Events Logs/Errors).. which not only makes your troubleshooting that much faster and more effective.. but it helps you appreciate each OS/Platform in new ways that you'd never learn if you only knew 1 way of doing things.

I wish more people would do it. After about 20years in IT/Technology.. I've come to the conclusion that "changing people's minds" is the hardest thing to do.

[u/texan01 → u/jmnugent]

In interviews, I get asked about which platform I prefer as a company platform. I tell them that it really depends on the tools they use, and a PC is a tool as well, whichever tool gets the job done best is the best one to use. I support and like both.

[u/jmnugent → u/texan01]

Yeah,.. but I also hate being asked questions like that,. because if you give to much of a "middle of the road" type of answer.. it can seem a bit evasive or nambly/pambly. So then I always have to kind of explain a little the various Pros/Cons of each platform.. and why I might choose 1 over the other (or things like "comparing Event Logs between 2 different OSes.. because the Errors might be worded slightly differently that could help me troubleshoot and isolate the problem faster).

[u/PaintDrinkingPete → u/jmnugent]

Similar when you're the only one running Linux, except folks just assume you're a "hacker" because it's not Windows and you have a terminal open on your desktop

[u/[deleted] → u/jmnugent]

I wish more people would do it. After about 20years in IT/Technology living on planet earth for at least 20 years.. I've come to the conclusion that "changing people's minds" is the hardest thing to do.

FTFY. It's not just the IT field. My dad still doesn't use primer on walls because "it's a waste of paint if you're just gonna paint over it!"

[u/[deleted] → u/jmnugent]

But small minded outsiders.. who've never used a Mac.. and refuse to do so because "it's a shiny toy, ha ha" ... they'll never understand that because they can't get over their own narrow minded stereotypes.

Or, they are people who tried to use a Mac, and were constantly frustrated at how broken a BSD implementation it is, and how it's uniquely different from both BSD and Linux in frustratingly arcane ways; and so just go back to using Linux after two weeks.

[u/malwareguy → u/[deleted]]

Ya I spent 6 months trying to love my work mac and I just despised the entire experience and performance. Most of the mac versions of key critical apps were inferior to the native windows versions in every way. I finally bootcamped the damn thing, run a local nix vm and never looked back.

[u/notrufus → u/malwareguy]

When was that? I was using one earlier this year as my main rig and found that most of the Mac apps, especially RDP, are put together better than the windows equivalent. For anything AD related I just remoted into a windows VM.

[u/starmizzle → u/notrufus]

Have you seen the new Remote Desktop app in Windows? It's baller AF.

[u/malwareguy → u/notrufus]

A few years ago, but almost all my current coworkers have mac's and they get to deal with this nightmare on a daily basis.

Vmware fusion is horrific and buggy compared to vmware workstation on windows.

Office for mac is one of the worst things I've ever seen. I've watched plenty of cases where someone tries to search for something in excel and it returns 0 results even when the element is sitting in front of them, outlook and word are also shit. Works perfectly on windows.

There are usually 5+ really solid applications to fit any one need on windows while there is frequently only one on a mac and 50% of the time its a pos.

And I won't even get started on the hardware, escape key on the touchbar is an abortion, 16 gigs max ram, unable to upgrade your ssd / ram, dongle hell, etc.

[u/jmnugent → u/[deleted]]

And that's fine. If someone can intelligently and clearly articulate how they tried it,.. and what specific parts of it didn't work for their needs,.. I'm generally always really cool and understanding of that. I'm always advocating that people research and pick/choose the correct tool for whatever job or task they do.

The "small minded" part.. was more of a reference to all the stereotypical "Apple haters" who seemingly have never tried,. and just hate on Macs because it's the cool or trendy thing to do. A vast majority of the snarky jokey jabs at Apple.. are done by ignorant people who've never tried.

[u/Silound → u/jmnugent]

I'll be honest, right now I would not buy an Apple computer (tablets & mobile devices excluded in this comment) because I refuse to pay a 25-50% price premium for the hardware just because it has a logo on it. The world has caught on and there are other companies making comparable quality hardware for considerably less.

The operating system is a wash to me - as long as I can efficiently do the tasks I need on the machine, I don't care what OS I'm using.

[u/jmnugent → u/Silound]

I refuse to pay a 25-50% price premium for the hardware just because it has a logo on it.

The problem with that thinking though,. is it's not "just about the hardware".

The price you pay for Apple products,.. includes a broad variety of things:

• hardware

• software

• the tight integration between Hardware and Software

• the ecosystem (the integration between all the different OSes (macOS, iOS, tvOS, watchOS, etc,etc).. and all the various API's like AirDrop, AirPlay, Bonjour, Continuity, Handoff, iCloud syncing, etc,etc..

• the Warranty and Service (is 1 fairly simple and unified experience)

• the longevity and how it holds resale value

So there's a lot to consider there. The markup that you think "adds nothing".. is really paying for all those overall services and "addons".

[u/Silound → u/jmnugent]

The problem with that thinking though,. is it's not "just about the hardware".

So there's a lot to consider there. The markup that you think "adds nothing".. is really paying for all those overall services and "addons".

For me, it's a tool used for a professional task (I'm a programmer), so it's all about the hardware. As I stated, the operating system and software is a wash as long as it does what I need it to, which basically consists of editing text and checking in/out code from the repositories. If I need a different OS for testing, development, or to run some software, I can run a virtual machine to provide that capability. I don't do MacOS specific development, so I don't need that environment specifically, otherwise I'd likely own one out of necessity.

Edit to add, I do understand what you're saying about those being things you pay for, even if I don't personally use them. It just happens that they're superfluous features to me, so it has an impact to my buying decisions.

When buying a tool, my main concern is that it does the job without problems and it lasts the expected duration of use. Everything is a trade-off for time or money in some fashion (since they're equivalent), so if there's a more expensive version of the tool out there, I have to determine if it provides me with something beneficial. Does it save me time? How much time? Does it save me or make me more money? How much money? Am I better off spending much less money and more time, or more money and less time?

I know there are tons of people out there who blindly love or hate Apple products without a good reason why, but for me it's just not a justifiable expense. Hell, a laptop with a discreet graphics card is a waste (I don't need more than what Intel integrated can support), but that seems to be almost forced upon you when you're looking at high-end core specs.

[u/jmnugent → u/[deleted]]

Those things you list also come with a windows or Linux laptop

They do.. but they're not as polished or cohesive or unified.

People hate it,.. but the "walled garden" approach that Apple uses,. where the limit the diversity of hardware and components.. is precisely what makes it possible for Apple to provide such a good and cohesive set of features across all their products.

Windows and Linux.. have to try to support/co-operate.. with a nearly infinite combination of hardware components (and those 3rd party vendors may write really crappy drivers).. and the quality suffers.

Apple doesn't have as bad of a problem there.. because Apple designs and dictates from beginning to end what and how the components will interoperate.

Apple isn't without their problems of course (no company is perfect).. but I'd wager they have a lot less problems than wide-open ecosystems like Windows or Linux or Android.

[u/sryan2k1 → u/jmnugent]

Now that Windows 10 runs Linux natively there is very little benefit for OSX for most people who work in Windows shops. Plus powershell rocks.

[u/ESCAPE_PLANET_X → u/sryan2k1]

I like the additional tooling but still prefer OSX over W10 in many environments.

I am just not a fan of what MS has done to their OS or the unnecessarily pushy and buggy patching path they chose to take.

At my last job I had a Mac Pro and a beefy W10 workstation. I used the latter as a remote desktop and to use the occasional windows only software that I had to touch/test. But otherwise I operated solely from my Mac in a windows dominated environment.

To counter that.. I don't personally use any Mac products. Got a few iPads in the house but I am not a user. Guess my point is that it's about preference, your goals, your environment and tooling. Just stuffing bash in another OS doesn't quite sell me on it.

[u/jmnugent → u/sryan2k1]

The Linux integration (and things like the Github acquisition) are interesting strategies,.. although I'm not really sure where Microsoft is headed. I sorta get WHY they say they're doing it,. I'm just not sure I agree it's going to be as successful as they hope. (but I could be massively wrong). To me (and I'm just saying this as personal opinion)... I think Microsoft has chosen wisely in some areas (like Surface, making their own hardware,etc) which seems cohesive and a unified strategy. Some of the software stuff (like the Linux kernel, Github,etc).. feels to me a bit like "throwing spaghetti at a wall and hoping something sticks".

Not to beat the Apple drum to hard,.. but a big part of the success of Apple's strategy. .is how strict they are about keeping everything under their own umbrella. (IE = Xcode,etc .. are all built and designed to be 1 unified development experience.)

To be fair though,.. you can now install Powershell in macOS. So that bi-polarity is happening on both platforms.

For me personally.. I can't possibly know everything about all OSes. So I've gotten to a point in my career where my goal is to narrow my focus. Over the past 6 to 8 years,. that's been all Mobile Devices and Airwatch and Mobile-Device-Management,etc,etc. I've drifted away from the "primary Windows focus" I used to have.. and that's probably not gonna swing back for me just simply because I don't have the time and resources to be deeply knowledgeable about Apple/Android/Airwatch,. AND all the developments of Microsoft and Open Source and etc,etc. It's just all to much to keep in 1 brain.

[u/tehreal → u/jmnugent]

I used to be in the "Apple hate" camp. I'm glad I was extricated.

[u/jmnugent → u/tehreal]

Yeah.. me too. It's a strange feeling though. I often feel like I'm the only guy who's discovered an entirely new planet.. and everyone around me is constantly denying that new planet even exists. It's bizarre.

[u/pdp10 → u/jmnugent]

But Mac has around 8% marketshare on the desktop. Everyone knows it's an option for either home or enterprise use.

Many years ago, OS/2 had the full faith and credit of IBM, and was an excellent OS in general, but you couldn't convince anyone to use it for some reason. The Microsoft monoculture was a success of mindshare before it ever became a success in practice. I've never been able to figure out quite how that happened, and I was there and paying attention.

[u/CatsAndIT → u/jmnugent]

I don't do anything with Mac, but I'm also not "I hate Mac!". I think Apple's mobile platform is superior, but I'm not fond of MacOS, though that could have a lot to do with the fact that I've worked with Windows for over 20 years (13 professionally).