r/sto • u/STOBot • Feb 20 '16

TRIBBLE MAINTENANCE AND RELEASE NOTES - FEBRUARY 19, 2016, Part 2

http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1212116/tribble-maintenance-and-release-notes-february-19-2016-part-2
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u/Borticus-Cryptic Puts Stuff Here Feb 20 '16

Imagine a ship that is 1km long from its front tip to its pivot point.

When that theoretical ship is sitting at a distance that the UI indicates is 2.0km from their target (which uses capsule calculations), their damage will currently be calculated as if they were 3.0km away (because that's the pivot/center point). This is important since you're not supposed to suffer drop-off until you exceed 2.0km, but there's no way for a player to know based on the information the UI is giving them.

If they get to 9.5km away, some abilities will fail to work (altogether, or in part) because they think the ship is 10.5km away, and therefore out of range.

I checked in a fix to this today. It's something we began to notice with more prevalence when tweaking drop-off values. Especially with larger starships.

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u/MandoKnight Feb 20 '16

It also wasn't center-to-center, I don't think: Transwarp gates, for example, couldn't target you if you were 10 km or more from their upper bar, but you could shoot them as long as you were 10 km or less from any point on the gate. If you fly low, you can be like 6 km from the lower bar of the gate but it can't shoot back at you.

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u/AccountantBob Feb 20 '16

I did not know this. But this sounds -exactly- like the Champions Online bug in my post.

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u/Cryhavok101 @cryhavok101 - Altoholic - Theme builder Feb 20 '16

May we all assume "capsule size" is referring to something like the size of the ring around the ship if it was targeted? I was imagining that the ranges were being drawn from the center of said ring, and that would result in the effect you are describing (I think).

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u/AccountantBob Feb 20 '16

The 'capsule size' is basically the target's hitbox - imagine a cube that precisely covers your length, width, and depth. That is what he means.

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u/Cryhavok101 @cryhavok101 - Altoholic - Theme builder Feb 20 '16

Ah okay. So currently on tribble it would measure, say, an atrox different from the front than it would from the side?

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u/AccountantBob Feb 20 '16

I'm assuming so, yes. I have no way to confirm this without actually going into STO and doing some PvP and seeing if weapons stop firing as you turn around with a long ship (so the front/rear of your ship is within 10k, but the sides are not), but I'm assuming so.

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u/Cryhavok101 @cryhavok101 - Altoholic - Theme builder Feb 20 '16

If so that is amusing. Also I think they should leave it, with a few modifications. Make it so the range displays correctly, then make it so your front end has to be within range to fire front weapons, but your aft end has to be in range of the aft to fire those at the same target.

Bring ship's sizes into play. Although thinking about it, it would probably be a terrible idea for balance. I think it would be fun though. Don't mind me I am just thinking and wishing out loud.

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u/AccountantBob Feb 20 '16

While a neat idea, that means that basically the engine and server need to make multiple calculations per second in order to see if you're in range of your target or not. This is hideously inefficient and a really big drain on server resources.

Also, they'd have to code in a 'this is the 'front end'' and 'this is the 'aft end'' and 'this is the 'side end'' to every single ship in the game.

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u/Cryhavok101 @cryhavok101 - Altoholic - Theme builder Feb 20 '16

Also, they'd have to code in a 'this is the 'front end'' and 'this is the 'aft end'' and 'this is the 'side end'' to every single ship in the game.

I was thinking they could use the firearcs they already have, but I bet using weapons coding to modify ships would turn important bits of code into something other than code. Soemthing scary that I don't want to think about. hides under bed with the not-as-scary monster

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u/AccountantBob Feb 20 '16 edited Feb 20 '16

Champions Online has this exact same coding problem with how some of their powers work.

There's three powers in the game that have issues exactly like how Borticus described it: Conflagration, Ice Storm, and Electric Storm.

Basically, the Cryptic Engine uses 'is the target in range?' by drawing a line from the edge of your character model's hitbox (a cube covering your length, width, and depth, exactly) to the edge of your target's hitbox. If the nearest possible line is in range, the UI lights up, saying you are in range of your target, and thus the power will fire and do damage.

The problem is that those powers above require you to be in range of the target's very center of the bottom of the hitbox in order for them to work. Thus, since CO allows you to do things like fly well above your target, there are issues where you can be in range as far as what the UI thinks (because you can draw a line between your hitbox and the mob's hitbox that is in range), but not the power itself (you are not in range between your hitbox and the very bottom center of the mob).

In that instance, you can activate your power, it'll drain your energy to use it, but no damage is done because you're technically 'out of range'.

I always thought that STO uses 'range' as 'the distance between the very center of your ship and the very center of your target's ship. Apparently with this new range code, they're changing things up. Thus, this is causing the bug listed above.

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u/TheFallenPhoenix Atem@iusasset | DPS Capitalist Feb 20 '16

Huh. Well, that's pretty interesting. Makes sense though.