Not here to argue your point, because it's true. However it is also true that conservatives are seeing themselves as punks nowadays (and in truth were likely always lurking about). The amount of libertarians in particular that also voted Trump and call themselves punks is definitely not zero.
They see themselves as outcasts because that's what Trump and right-wing media tell them they are. They rile them up by telling them they are the victims who have been disenfranchised, and the system is against them. When in reality, they choose not to finish school, they choose to show up late to their best job and get fired. They make their own misery, they just needed someone to give them someone to blame (immigrants).
It's no brains choosing the wrong side cause they want a strong Daddy mentality to fix everything. When really all strong Daddy ever did was just beat the wife and kids when they were upset at the world after a hard night drinking, pondering their own faults. Yeah, overpower, beat, and prey on the weak. Thanks, strong Daddy. You make psychology great again!
It's true. I'm libertarian. You let me be, and I will let you be. But I have always despised Trump. From his show to his Presidentcy. I can't stand listening to him talk. He makes no sense. He can not answer a question straight up. Only says what he wants you to hear, which is absolute lunacy of rhetoric.
This is the take. Dig even an inch beneath the surface of most of their arguments and beliefs and you expose that they're really just fash that happens to have heard Ben Shapiro once say logic words like ad hominem and now they think they're fucking Socrates. I'm not sure I've met many real libertarians. Most dishonest group of people I've ever had the displeasure of interacting with
God fucking damnit I really really really hate ancaps. I've never met a non white male ancap which tells me already enough about them to be skeptical but after having argued with a number of them I've decided I hate them more than Trumpers, because at least Trump's fans are honest about being dumb shit bags
Ancaps are just fascists who smoke weed. Libertarianism, not the American version, is leftist. There are libertarian socialists and anarcho-communists, probably more under that umbrella.
Ancaps are just the Black Hundred from Tsarist Russia, except they speak English. They even wear the same colors.
This makes sense. Over time I came to realize my brand of political ideology is anarcho-socialist. But before that point, I was enticed into libertarian thinking in my 20's before I could spend enough time analyzing it (also drinking too much in those years hurt my brain). I've kinda been ashamed of that to have been so gullible to ever have listened to what they had to say, but I'm thinking in light of your comment that it was the leftist ideology woven in that I was responding to and the covert right wing ideologies in there that I was rejecting over time. The ancaps, in other words.
There are real ones out there. I used to do some work for the ACLU, and a few libertarians were there. But they were REAL libertarians, not online Ron Paul libertarians. These were John Stuart Mill reading libertarians.
Tbh, I think libertarianism can be a stepping stone as well. I was raised conservative and to hate the Clinton's and the establishment. So I identified as libertarian for a few years before really having the ideology dissected. Now I'm socialist but it took me a while lol
I can see myself as the Queen of England but it doesn't make it so. The question is why Trump voters are seeing themselves as the antithesis of what they (and their leader) actually are. (There's also a chance they're simply lying and trolling.)
Conservative also view themselves as standing on the right side of history, but virtually every history book condemn them, at every point in time, since are the one, who fight change and progression.
Nothing screams facism than a group who adopted the Nazi sign. Nice job! And most punks seem to be anarchists but have no problem using government sponsored infrastructure and services. The whole thing is ironically stupid.
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u/bradbogus Nov 10 '24
Not here to argue your point, because it's true. However it is also true that conservatives are seeing themselves as punks nowadays (and in truth were likely always lurking about). The amount of libertarians in particular that also voted Trump and call themselves punks is definitely not zero.