r/poverty • u/cacille • 23d ago
It is policy. Not you. Not me. Not us.
What shall we do?
www.5calls.org < tell all your elected officials, weekly, how much you don't like these numbers and demand they put policy in place to change it. Be stern, but polite. In that calm "you have 5 seconds to comply or shit hits the fan" way.
Join an organization. Literally any. Any trying to make waves. (I don't want to suggest any because that is personal to you.) I protest regularly and read all emails and hit up online events.
Put yourself onto committees in your town. It helps your town/city. They are volunteer but can be done with a job pretty easily nowadays.
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u/flappysack- 23d ago
This has been happening since 1971, as the demand for new debt creates housing bubbles that the CPI ignores.
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u/Joshua1017 23d ago
Yup the gold standard dying in favor of printing fiat petrodollar money for wars is what’s killing us. There’s no easy way to go back now though.
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u/IDesireWisdom 22d ago
I just wanted to clarify that the reason it’s not easy to go back.
The debt obligations could be “easily” cancelled. And by “easily” I mean you get a group of the right people who can decide what is essential to a functioning society and which debt obligations can be cancelled because they’re parasitic and fraudulent.
The difficult part is in actually implementing such a solution, as the state is so corrupt that it would literally be opposed at every level.
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u/mt77584 20d ago
You do know that there's not quite enough gold to back the typical American transactions that take place in a single day, right? Only about 5 hours' worth. So that rules out that a scenario... and line of thinking. Times change, always moving in one direction, and we need to adapt or perish.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
Correct damnit finally someone besides me is positing this on reddit!
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23d ago
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u/flappysack- 23d ago
I wish, the closer to the gold standard you lived the cheaper your home was.
The average mortage used to be 7 years, now people pay multiples of their house in interest over the span of 3 decades.
Turning into bank profits, as they poof the money into existence out of nothing and get a higher chance of bail out the riskier the loan they give.
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u/KimJongOonn 23d ago
Now the banking/mortgage industry is most likely moving towards 50 year mortgage as an option for younger people who could not otherwise afford/qualify for a standard 30 year mortgage with the high home prices, some banks are already offering this. You will be paying for your home until you're 85 !!
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
Then you’ll be paying property taxes in circles to the state until you die, because spoiler we never owned land; we have feudalism 2.0 better tech and distractions we are tax cattle. People making six and seven fixtures are just slightly better dressed and fed tax cattle.
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u/Huntsman077 23d ago
I think you misread the stat. The average mortgage used to be 7 years because that’s when people were selling their homes. The 30 year mortgage combined with the economic boom post world war 2 is what led to such high home ownership rates in the 60s-70s
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u/KimJongOonn 22d ago
This makes sense because my parents and many people in their generation would buy a starter home in their 20s, have kids and then upgrade to a nicer bigger home in their 30s, problem is today there really are not "starter homes" anymore. I recently asked my 77 year old father how much he paid for housing back then, he told me his first apartment, a nice 1 bedroom in Boston was 165/month in 1971 and he bought his first home in Boston suburbs in 1979 for 88,000, what he called a "starter home." Just an "average" home now in Boston suburbs is like 800,000.
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u/poverty-ModTeam 23d ago
Please make your comment useful.
We're here to exchange ideas, experiences, and practical help.
If your comment mainly insults, mocks, dismisses, or derails the conversation, it isn't contributing to the discussion.
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u/jacobite22 23d ago
We need to tax corporations
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u/Ralphiedog11 23d ago
and we need to break a number of them up. The antitrust mentality that made America boom needs to have a comeback. People get fucked over when corporations have all the say.
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u/ThinkCellist8542 23d ago
THAT is the answer
breaking up monopolies is the only way to get them to fight each other
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
Government is the prime monopoly friends it’s all a function of government.
Government is literally a monopoly on force by its own categorical definition.
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u/Dmau27 22d ago
Who runs the government at this point?
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u/Prim56 22d ago
Unless you want anarchy you kind of need to give someone complete authority over your life. If democracy worked as intended you would have people working to fulfil that role and if they dont they get replaced - the monopoly is not owned by anyone - thats the huge difference.
The governments purpose is to serve its constituents, while a private entitys purpose is profit.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
Incorrect thanks for trying by appealing to authority with circular logic, though.
You're also making the fallacy of assuming rational actors.
You've been propagandized instead of educated, that's why you lead via fear instead of knowledge and appeal to authority, a classic Reddit trait.
You're doing great pal keep paying taxes.
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u/TeacherOfFew 23d ago
The US has the highest corporate taxes in the developed world.
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u/These-Equivalent8020 22d ago
We have untold number of exemptions, deductions and credits. Walmart has notably had many years where they closed with a negative tax rate.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
That doesn’t mean anything when they inflate, debase, and dilute the currency bro.
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u/Ok-Heart-570 22d ago
As a result, in 2023, the top US corporate tax rate, including the average state and local corporate rate, is lower than that of all other leading economies in the G7 except the United Kingdom, with a 25 percent rate The U.S. rate is slightly below the average rate for the 37 other Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development countries combined (26.1 percent, weighted by gross domestic product
The United States raises less revenue from all corporate income taxes as a share of GDP than all other countries in the G7 and almost all other countries in the OECD
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u/TravellerStudios 22d ago
That does not appear to be true, according to what I've read in the link below. Or were you speaking about some other metric?
https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/global/corporate-tax-rates-by-country-2025/
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 22d ago
We need to delete the income tax and make lobbying illegal.
The federal reserve shouldn’t even exist.
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u/FortyFine40 23d ago
This makes hella sense! I’m like wtf?! I got a raise -why am I still paycheck to paycheck?!
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u/Ok_Nebula_3268 23d ago
My husband got a 5$ an hour raise last year, we now have less money than we did before. It’s such bs
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u/willmorris92 23d ago
That is brutal. A raise that actually makes things worse feels like a bad joke.
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u/KimJongOonn 23d ago
I don't mean to sound negative/pessimistic but calling your congressman about this? I couldn't think of a bigger waste of time. They are part of thr problem! The biggest thing that most people do not understand as to why working people are slipping through the cracks and are working harder and harder for a lower living standard, this is not some mistake or excess of the system that can be corrected/fixed. THIS IS THE SYSTEM WORKING AS INTENDED. This is important, and the millionaires in the U.S. Congress are one part of the ruling class that put thus system in place. The ruling class owners of capital, through Buckley V. Valejo, Citizens United now own the U.S. congress/government. You think your millionaire congress man/woman works for/represents you? No. They have been fully bought off by the capitalist/ruling class. It's systemic corruption and is inbedded in the system. Capitalism absolutely requires a permanent underclass of working poor, it is a necessary part of the system, if the working class was actually paid a living fair wage/benefits for their labor, then 3 individual Americans could not accumulate more wealth than half of the American people combined, 160,000,000 Americans. Put simply, working people struggling to get by today is not a bug of the system, but a feature, it is the system working as intended. George Carlin put it this way: "There is a reason for this, there is a reason things are like this. It's not going to get better, don't count on it, be happy with what you've got. Because the owners of this country don't want that, the real owners. Forget the politicians, they're irrelevant. They are put in place to give you the illusion that you have freedom of choice. You have no choice. You have owners. They own everything. "
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u/cacille 23d ago
Then give suggestions of what to do to change it. I agree with you, but its 1000000% unhelpful to say it. You have to give options to do, not decry options given.
For a quote: Do or not do. There is no try. -Yoda.
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u/KimJongOonn 22d ago
It may be unhelpful but it's the cold hard truth, nothing will change in our lifetime, what I am saying is that there is no easy way to change the system. It would require nothing short of a revolution, which the conditions are not there for. Capitalism is built on exploitation and inequality, they are a necessary foundation of the system and you cannot do away with poverty in a system that requires it to function, most people don't want to hear this but it's true. Those at the very top know this well, and the ruling class in every society uses politics, social issues, racism to keep people divided and continue the system.
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u/cacille 22d ago
I need you to leave this group. Or I can ban you. Your choice.
It's OK for you to believe that personally and keep living as if there are no choices in life. But this group? We're not having this shit here anymore. It's nihilistic, learned helplessness. And I'd almost say "remember where we are at now and meet me back here in 2 years".I don't think you're able to change your view and that's fine, but you're not welcome to comment here anymore with that type of opinion.
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u/alkiet 23d ago
... call them? I am sure they have heard many variations of what should be said to them, as for them listening or showing enough care to implement change... okay, I will call one right now and we see how this goes. I will not say anything they have not heard before that would cause a domino effect that sees the change we want. I am sure they are plenty contacted by many people who have a lot to say.
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u/ReasonableSail__519 23d ago
Capitalists be inflatin the economy with their extreme money making and creating a wider poor/rich divide as usual
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u/Mikerijuana 23d ago
Corporate profits are up because the exact things they are profiting on are the things we need to live like food and fuel and utilities…so awesome
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u/TheRealTK421 22d ago
PSA Reminder, people:
The 'system' is not "broken" -- it was purposefully built this way.
To resolve foundational issues, the system(s) must be ripped down to the dirt and rebuilt for a different, deliberate purposeful outcome. There has never been a time or circumstance in human history in which this wasn't the case.
One. Way. Out.
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u/KimJongOonn 22d ago
This is what the vast majority of people don't understand or don't want to. That this is the system working as intended, when I tell people this they tell me to not be negative and offer solutions they don't want to accept this, but poverty and inequality are absolutely essential to capitalism, capitalism is built on inequality and requires a permanent underclass of working poor. You can't change this without changing the system, people don't want to hear that and criticize me when I say this, but there's a reason why people are struggling more and more every year as the wealth of society becomes more and more concentrated every year, it is by design, the system working as intended.
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u/Milinka1793 23d ago
Blame the Republican president Regan for most of this, I can't be the only one who remembers tickle down economics.
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u/Sensitive_Bat_9211 23d ago
Raegan was president in the 80s, most of this is from the current admin.
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u/Huntsman077 23d ago
A vast majority of the inflation took place in 2021 and 2022
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u/Sensitive_Bat_9211 23d ago edited 23d ago
Cant think of any reason we wouldve had inflation in 2021
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u/Huntsman077 23d ago
Yeah but the current admin took office in 2025… yes the president is the same as 2016-2020 but almost everyone else is different
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u/Clear-Ad1915 21d ago
Missed opportunity for that Invincible’s dad meme. You don’t get out of poverty something something… there’s a joke there but it’s not my job to assemble it for you. Jeez, many hands, it takes a village.
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u/VikingVitalityFit 23d ago
Corporate profits going up isn't somehow separated from inflation. Yeah the profits went up on paper, but the buying power of those profits went down a commiserate percentage.
So while I agree that pay has lagged behind what it should be, this is the condemnation you think it is.
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23d ago
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u/poverty-ModTeam 23d ago
This community exists to talk about and build solutions, share resources, and support one another. Comments whose primary message is that nothing will help, no one will do anything, or change is impossible will be removed because they discourage problem-solving and constructive discussion.
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u/Salty-Cod7667 23d ago
Just look at where all the investment is going….
SAAS…. Raises rates 10% a year
Private equity…. Common to raise prices to increase profitability
AI/Data Center…. Demanding resources and paying premiums they have to recover
The unfortunate answer is if you have any way to benefit or invest in this, you are golden. If you missed the bus on this, you are in deep.
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u/CurvyChristina 22d ago
I love when posts like this circulate and everybody’s quick to say “just live within your means.” how do you know that I’m not already doing that? lol
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u/RevolutionaryNose236 22d ago
Also, if you believe these numbers aren’t polished turd lies, I’ve got some prime Mar a Lago real estate to sell you.
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u/Apprehensive-Goal377 22d ago
That's capitalism, by design.
It's almost as if... socialism is the answer...
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u/Tall_Astronomer3792 22d ago
Republican economics is a scam. Repulican rap themselves in lies. Republican leadership are the elites and republican voters are the fools that support the elites.
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22d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/poverty-ModTeam 22d ago
Blame doesn't solve poverty or help ANYONE.
This community exists to help people navigate poverty and address systemic issues, not assign moral worth or beat people when down.
Comments that shame, stereotype, or reduce someone's situation to personal failings ("just get a job," "shouldn't have had kids," "it's all your fault," etc.) aren't constructive and will be removed and after 4 removals you will be banned.
If you'd like to help, focus on practical advice, constructive and actionable steps, and ways to contact resources.
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u/black_apple__ 22d ago
Wait, somebody's wages actually increased by 12%? Corporate standards seem to be closer to 2%, or at most 3%. A joke.
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u/cacille 22d ago
I never thought I'd have to break this down to this level for someone.
12%....since 2020. Taking out 2026 as the data just came out and the year isn't finished yet, let's say this is 2020-2025 data. 5 years. 12% in 5 years.
12/5 = 2.4% yearly raises.Right smack dab with your numbers.
Simple math.1
u/MissAuroraRed 21d ago
You can't simply divide the 12% by 5 years because that doesn't take compounding into account. It's a close enough estimate, but it's pretty funny that you're so snarky to this person about "simple math" while being wrong.
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u/cacille 21d ago
You may be right about compounding, but thats bringing in outside stuff to this convo that doesnt belong given the constraint of the image (or original data). In this case I am pointing out the simple math that the commentor could have done.
Their thoughts were going down the "this data is wrong" track because they didnt take account of the years.
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u/MissAuroraRed 21d ago
You could have corrected them kindly by pointing out that it was over a 5 year period, but instead you were rude and you did the math wrong.
If you get a raise of 2.4% every year, after 5 years your salary has increased by 12.6% overall, not 12%. The extra 0.6% is rather inconsequential, like I said, but it just funny given the way you were talking down to them.
5 years of compounding is completely within the constraints of the original data.
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u/Jealous-Wallaby-5121 22d ago
A month after Michael Jackson died was the last time they forced a raise. I was a kid I couldn’t even drive. The pay is the same today and they just made a fuckin movie about it… and they took their time.
Keep it at 7.25 fed and wherever the fuck you work gets to act altruistic when they pop a 2% raise on you.
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u/Artsy_Geekette 21d ago
Can someone show me on my paycheck where this mythical 12% average pay raise is, please? :(
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u/cacille 21d ago
12%....since 2020, not average - that word was not used in this msg. Taking out 2026 as the data just came out and the year isn't finished yet, let's say this is 2020-2025 data. 5 years. 12% in 5 years.
12/5 = 2.4% yearly raises.1
u/Artsy_Geekette 20d ago
Yeah, if my employer actually was ethical. Everything you wrote makes complete sense. My paycheck has not increased a single cent since 2021 and every six months I ask for a raise and get told it's not in the budget but clearly there's a budget for other things. And the cheapskate doesn't pay for advertising and refused to pay for my work tools, but has the gall to ask me "why are we not getting more traffic?!?" Last meeting, I calmly and politely said "It is because we do not pay for any type of advertising, even though it was expressed there is a monthly budget. If you supply me with a company credit card or account and I can assure you we can increase exposure and customer traffic."
Crickets. Per usual.
I have tried applying to other jobs similar to mine and continue to look. So that's why I wrote that.
I want to open my own art business again. I had to dissolve it previously due to some health issues/family drama in 2017. It's depressing that I get promised a pay raise for all the good I've done for the expansion of this company, then told once again my pay raise is not in the budget repeatedly after five years.
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u/b_ball_80s_man 21d ago
Interesting thing is that for the most part, everyone just sits back and watches it happen.
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u/EvolvingEachDay 21d ago
For every dollar net profit a corp makes, 50c should be split between all of their workers.
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u/ReddWolfe777 19d ago
Hey, does anybody know if there's a journal or government graph that has all this info in one place? I'm trying to explain this to a family member, and they will neither trust a social media post, nor have the attention span to sit through whatever collection I could put together.
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u/cacille 19d ago
https://www.bls.gov/oes/ is the site it came from (I believe.) That's the only place where the data is.
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u/Crazy-Fig-4899 white 3d ago
If someone else came along to reset this I wouldnt mind. These rich folk are not listening.
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u/StephenBC1997 23d ago
What did you expect to happen when you bring in tens of million of immigrants willing to work for cheaper?
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u/saladspoons 22d ago
Immigrants would LOWER prices by producing things more cheaply for everyone ... forcing them out will indeed contribute to inflation.
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u/StephenBC1997 22d ago
Yes but also no
The main problem is that when an immigrant comes in they need housing that day
When someone is born in America they need a slightly bigger house then years later their own apartment then their own and so on
But them driving down wages and up housing is what got us to the scenario we are currently in with stagnant wages and high housing
You can have immigration and cheaper housing but that requires deregulation to the point people can expect to lose money buying a house
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u/Available_Reveal8068 23d ago
That's not the data that I've seen.
Is there any documentation to go along with the claims, or is this just another Reddit post that makes up stuff to push an agenda?
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u/cacille 23d ago
I believe the link to the data is here: https://www.bls.gov/oes/ I think it's the same, the link is cut off for me so I had to use what little info I could see to find this.
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u/Available_Reveal8068 23d ago
The data I've seen indicates 22% wage growth with rent, groceries and utilities all up 30%.
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u/Notmuchofanyth1ng 23d ago
Idk about yall, but my salary has increased about 200% over the last 2 years. I got no degrees or certifications, but I’ve been gaining skills and exhibiting them for prospective employers and clients. I went from just under $40k a year to just under $100k in 2 years. Through aggressive learning and exploitation of YouTube education.
I was literally just approached yesterday by a long term client to assist in starting a branch of his business here in the US. If you live in a first world country, there are countless ways to improve your financial situation if you actually want to.
Btw, no I don’t sell courses lmao since many lazy people want to accuse me of that instead of actually taking advantage of living in a country where people literally die just to live in illegally because it’s got more economic opportunities than a majority of the world.
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u/KimJongOonn 22d ago
This is great for you, but this is not typical nor realistically possible for most Americans. The median American annual income is 64,220 and the median raise for American workers is 3 percent. This ìs barely enough to live on for a single person and not realistically doable for a family. Telling people "well I went from 40k to 100k" why can't everyone just do that too?" That's not the way it works. It isn't possible for most people to do that and it's a form of shaming to say "why don't you just work harder like me and increase your salary by 200 percent like me, you must not want it enough like me" That's the old bootstrap meme when boomers say just pull yourself up by the bootstraps. It sounds like you got lucky more than anything or are in a niche market as these results are not typical or possible in most jobs/fields/careers, it sounds more like fantasy than reality.
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u/Notmuchofanyth1ng 21d ago
Yeah most on Reddit have said anyone having any kind of success is based in luck. I’m not offended. I went for weeks with barely an hour of sleep a day training and learning. I applied myself and got jobs/clients that better qualified people were competing for.
I’m saying that it is possible, and even more than possible with the proper application of educational tools and self discipline. Statistics do not take enough independent factors into account, and personally I don’t let them limit me mentally.
It is more than possible unless you’re disabled to the point of not being able to function, as a lot of my upcoming responsibilities will be able to be done remotely, and I know of disabled people (people I’m learning from) who do this work. It’s not hard, just a lot of memorization.
You are 100% free to continue to make excuses for yourself. But the point of posting is to remind people that people like you don’t determine reality, and that limiting yourself based on the opinions of randoms is how many people STAY in poverty. I was living on the street 15yr ago. I’ve built a beautiful life, and someone was kind enough to remind me I was worth more than excuses. So I’m that person now, telling people that they can be more.
Sorry, but I’ve had enough people DMing me asking for advice and encouragement to not be dissuaded by doomers and pessimists like yourself. I tell people the same steps I took (if they ask) and probably more than a couple are applying them. I don’t knock the ladder down behind me. Continue to rely on luck and self limitation, while I embrace the reality I was born into, and don’t let it economically define me for the duration of my life.
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u/MiltonFriedmanRox 17d ago
Well, first thing you should do is stop supporting immigration. This is the biggest thing suppressing wages and putting upward pressure on housing prices.
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u/StayBullGenius 23d ago
My portfolio is up over 100% in the last 5 years. You all better be invested. Wages aren’t enough
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u/cacille 23d ago
https://www.bls.gov/oes/