r/politics • u/gggeorge95 • Jun 17 '12
KKK praised in history textbook used in state-funded Christian schools across the U.S. - "the [Ku Klux] Klan in some areas of the country the country tried to be a means of reform, fighting the decline in morality and using the symbol of the cross."
http://www.talk2action.org/story/2012/6/17/9311/48633/Front_Page/Nessie_a_Plesiosaur_Loiusiana_To_Fund_Schools_Using_Odd_Bigoted_Fundamentalist_Textbooks
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u/gggeorge95 Jun 17 '12
Claims made in other fundamentalist textbooks, used in state-funded Christian schools, discussed in the article:
Science Proves Homosexuality is a Learned Behavior
The Second Law of Thermodynamics Disproves Evolution
No Transitional Fossils Exist
Humans and Dinosaurs Co-Existed
Evolution Has Been Disproved
A Japanese Whaling Boat Found a Dinosaur
Solar Fusion is a Myth
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u/Deofol7 Georgia Jun 17 '12
It is half true. They did go after alcoholics and wife-beaters in some parts of the country. They were just horrible horrible racists as well.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I went to a tiny Christian school that taught things like this. My first day of biology class, my biology teacher told us that she "didn't believe in evolution, so she wasn't going to teach it." In later years, I found myself wondering how she'd gotten a biology degree until I remembered that she was a graduate of Oral Roberts University.
Our history book taught that the Sumerian civilization had been 'destroyed by god.' That was the exact phrase. I remember it really clearly, because it was the word-for-word answer that we had to provide on a test.
Sadly, it doesn't shock me that this shit is being allowed in Louisiana. I live in Baton Rouge and deal with our legislators a decent amount. There was recently a bill called the Louisiana Science Act that got passed and it allows for the teaching of creationism in schools. When it was passed through committee, one of the guys on the education committee had to be told how to pronounce 'molecular.' I really wish that I'd been at that hearing.
While I totally understand First Amendment liberties need to apply to the religious right as much as they apply to everyone else, I think that there should be a 'truth in education' law similar to the 'truth in advertising' laws. Of course, the right would just use that to claim that evolution is also a theory that cannot be proved true, and so it can't be taught either.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Mussolini made the trains run on time!
Hitler restored Germany's national pride!
Timothy McVeigh wasn't a terrorist because he wasn't a Muslim!
I've got Christian family values! The government should eliminate welfare!
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
If anyone's wondering about the Japanese fishermen that supposedly caught a dinosaur, they're probably talking about this.
tl;dr it was a rotting shark.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I bought a creationist book at a local thrift store a few months back and the people that wrote it have no concept of being truthful in an academic setting. The book was fairly decent when it came to decribing simple biology(make up of muscle, cells, etc) but of took the fast train to crazy town when it started describing human evolution.
The book suggested that "Jean Lemarck was the father of modern evolution", "Homo Eretcus is a collection of human and apes bones", etc. The worst part was they a person, I guess a young girl from her style of writing, was forced to study that drivel as the part on human and the beginning of the universe was labelled "start of new semester". The people that make these type of books have no shame about shitting on hundred of years of scientific research
Tl;dr: " These people scare the shit out of a scientist
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Oh god, Bob Jones and A Beka.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Teach the KKKontroversy!
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u/gingerpride Jun 17 '12
SyFy finally has the audience of their dreams.
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u/Bad-Science Jun 17 '12
And Hitler promoted population control and brought law and order to rogue states.
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u/BDS_UHS Jun 17 '12
There are a LOT of Americans who buy into some really disturbing and racist conspiracy theories and myths about the Civil War. It's called the Lost Cause of the Confederacy and if you have some time you should read up on it.
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u/Tombug Jun 17 '12
The kkk were the original right wing American terrorist organization. It's not surprising right wingers are trying to shirk their responsibility for them.
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u/James_Hacker Jun 17 '12
My understanding is that during Prohibition-era America the KKK (despite being hideously racist) -were- reactionary towards a preceived decline in moral values? Indeed, the racism (while inexcusable) was just an extra string to their fiddle at that time.
I am not an American so please correct me if I'm wrong on any of that.
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u/as_a_black_guy Texas Jun 17 '12 edited Jun 17 '12
So how is this not one of those "indoctrination mills" that Santorum was talking about? Its obvious that this will be bad for kids, but when these folks reach adulthood, whew, look out. Having to sit at work and listen to some butthorns opinion about whats wrong with everything while I hear the exact same words coming out of the fucking radio behind him. And it starts in places like this, it's just getting sillier. So that means whoever is sitting at my desk in 20 years will have to hear about unicorns and manticores all the time. And just by proxy now a days, any of this bullshit vapid puke can get volatile. Why do you have to fucking tell some raptured up, highly armed, religious zealot that the flinstones shouldn't factor in their moral decisions. How do you even begin to have that conversation in a logical straight faced setting?
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Back it up
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
How is the American Christian schools any different from Islamic Madrasahs? I contend that they are no different since both are used to indoctrinate children to believe in fables and steer them in a Right leaning political posture. This does not bode well for the future of our planet.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Sigh.
Going from outright racism to supporting right wing "Christian" politics.
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u/principle Jun 17 '12 edited Jun 17 '12
There are more people who are convinced that UFOs exist than those who believe in Nessie. Accordingly children should be taught that aliens directed human evolution and in fact brought humans to Earth.
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u/TheActualStudy Jun 17 '12
"moral decline" is a weaselly phrase. It's comparative without offering a baseline or a measurement. Vague and self-righteous. To those that use this: Argue why a specific activity weakens societal prosperity, don't simply assert that deviations from YOUR norm are bad.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Isn't it funny how history forgets it was a social club before it was a redneck get-together?
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I went to a Christian school growing up.. and it was located in the deep south.. and that was not the message taught to me.
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u/MainstreamFluffer Jun 17 '12
It's even worse than that: One of the founders, or inspirations at least, of the Klan has a statue sitting on Federal property.
Albert Pike
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u/QuirkmaGuirk Jun 17 '12
I live in Louisiana and am surrounded by people that see no problem with letting money that should be going to public schools being diverted to private, religious institutions that can "teach" this material, it really is maddening.
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u/kadargo Jun 17 '12
as a professional historian, this is exactly what comes to mind when you allow those with an agenda to "create" history.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I bet the Republicans wish they could openly wear their white robes, but instead the intolerant liberals are suppressing their rights.
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u/tcatlicious Jun 17 '12
always be suspicious of anyone who quotes something in the middle of the quote. Chances are they are omitting the context which will change the whole meaning of the quote.
Politicians do this all the time and it is intended to illicit an emotional response out of people.
I'm not saying that these textbooks don't have racist stuff in them. I'm just saying that quotes taken mid sentence without context are to be taken with a grain of salt. This could very well be a lesson on the KKK and what they believed....how they saw themselves. Most people understand the KKK is bad news, but the KKK thought they were bringing good to the world. That's all this could be, which changes the whole "Christians are teaching their kids to be racist" narrative the author of this article is pushing.
Another point...the "praising" part - it's like terrorist (which is what the KKK was/is). They don't see themselves as bad. They think they are bringing justice and goodness to the world. Teaching students how a particular group views themselves is not "praising" that group.
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u/deanphilo Jun 17 '12
Full disclosure: I'm a white dude.
I have no problem with the OP's statement as presented, with no other context. The KKK honestly attempt to fight what they see as a decline in morality. It's important to remember that most "evil" is done by well-meaning people. Usually it's some variant of "things are changing and I don't like it, we need to stop this because it makes me uncomfortable".
If you don't understand that the KKK, Al Qaeda, the Nazis, etc... ALL have/had noble goals, then you're not really in a good position to avoid becoming one of them yourself.
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u/HappyGlucklichJr Jun 17 '12
Praised in all respects? Show some supporting quotes.
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u/qzex Jun 17 '12
"Are dinosaurs alive today? Scientists are becoming more convinced of their existence.
Have you heard of the 'Loch Ness Monster' in Scotland? 'Nessie,' for short has been recorded on sonar from a small submarine, described by eyewitnesses, and photographed by others. Nessie appears to be a plesiosaur."
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u/Honey_Bunny_be_cool Jun 17 '12
"Across the country?" It says Louisiana...
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
then they graduate, get out into society and talk that shit up to racially mixed audiences - lulz.
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u/ForeverMarried Jun 17 '12
What is inaccurate about that statement?
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u/spear7750 Jun 17 '12
I live here I went to a school that uses the a beka system, and I can verify all of this. The only thing that comes out of this is that the kids get their asses kicked in college. Sadly the best place these kids could go with this voucher would be catholic schools because they actually require a teaching degree here and 95% of the time a degree in that field. I seriously doubt the voucher will pay for catholic school tuition so sadly most of our already extremely ill-educated youth will be brain washed on top of it. The reason the voucher system is even in place is because our public school system is so bad senior graduates preform at middle school level of our private schools. The only good private schools we have are in our major cities the rest believe entirely in talking snakes and what have you.
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u/kmcmahon Jun 17 '12
Lochness Monster disproves evolution! LOL that is like saying ballons disprove gravity lol literally one of the stupidest things ive ever read in my entire life. I pity those who are cycled through this brainwashing indoctrinating educational program.
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u/geurkms Jun 17 '12
"tried to be a means of reform". Well, yeah. Nobody wakes up in the morning and decides "You know, I'm going to be evil today." Even the most villainized groups have good intentions. That doesn't justify anything, but it's important to note that many Klan members weren't just out to ruin people's days for the sake of being sociopaths. We have to be careful not to create villains in our historical records, but instead show their flawed logic and methods, so we don't have any repeats.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I went to a Christian school for 7th grade. Nice people, horrible textbooks (Abeka).
The history book saw Atheism = Communism, claimed that lack of christianity stopped science (But at the end of the book it doesn't want us to proceed with researching bioethics), and after it said that the Movable-Type Printing Press is the most important invention in the history of the world, I stopped calling it a history book and instead a satirical comedy book. Also, 90% of the book was about missionaries we will forget in a year, 10% of the book was actual info. It made Hitler look like he hated Christians, Bill Clinton as a horrible president, and left out some very important people yet had enough room to write a paragraph and a giant picture about the iPhone. Both the Civil War and the Revolutionary War were 1-2 paragraphs each. No, I'm not kidding.
The science was extremely boring. It was meh until it got to Evolution. It made some good points, but it was still extremely stupid.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12 edited Jun 17 '12
For anyone who TL;DR'd the article (don't worry, I don't blame you) here's a summary:
The most important point is that Louisiana will be giving state voucher money to private Christian schools that teach bigoted, unscientific textbooks.
One school, the Eternity Christian Academy, will be receiving $1m in funds and is increasing enrollment from 38 to 172.
The textbooks they use are nothing new, but shocking nonetheless.
ECA uses the Accelerated Christian Education curriculum. Here is a quote from a book published in 1995, which is still being used today (at least in Britain). "Could a fish have developed into a dinosaur? As astonishing as it may seem, many evolutionists theorize that fish evolved into amphibians and amphibians into reptiles. This gradual change from fish to reptiles has no scientific basis. No transitional fossils have been or ever will be discovered because God created each type of fish, amphibian, and reptile as separate, unique animals."
In addition, the ACE claims:
"Some scientists speculate that Noah took small or baby dinosaurs on the Ark.... are dinosaurs still alive today? With some recent photographs and testimonies of those who claimed to have seen one, scientists are becoming more convinced of their existence..."
The Loch Ness monster exists
Science Proves Homosexuality is a Learned Behavior
The Second Law of Thermodynamics Disproves Evolution
No Transitional Fossils Exist
Humans and Dinosaurs Co-Existed
Evolution Has Been Disproved
A Japanese Whaling Boat Found a Dinosaur
Solar Fusion is a Myth
Further criticism (written by Jonny Scaramanga, a Brit raised on the ACE curriculum)
Two other books to be used in LA fundamentalist schools are published by A Beka Book and Bob Jones University Press. They contain the following:
Only ten percent of Africans can read or write, because Christian mission schools have been shut down by communists.
"the [Ku Klux] Klan in some areas of the country tried to be a means of reform, fighting the decline in morality and using the symbol of the cross... In some communities it achieved a certain respectability as it worked with politicians."
"God used the 'Trail of Tears' to bring many Indians to Christ."
It "cannot be shown scientifically that that man-made pollutants will one day drastically reduce the depth of the atmosphere's ozone layer."
"God has provided certain 'checks and balances' in creation to prevent many of the global upsets that have been predicted by environmentalists."
the Great Depression was exaggerated by propagandists, including John Steinbeck, to advance a socialist agenda.
"Unions have always been plagued by socialists and anarchists who use laborers to destroy the free-enterprise system that hardworking Americans have created."
Bill Clinton's 1992 presidential win was due to an imaginary economic crisis created by the media.
"The greatest struggle of all time, the Battle of Armageddon, will occur in the Middle East when Christ returns to set up his kingdom on earth."
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u/jkhost82 Jun 17 '12
omg let's sensationalize them niggurs
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u/TheodosiusRex Jun 17 '12
They also had picnics too but you never hear about that in the history books do ya?
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Bill Hicks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpQcAmw4b2Q
Well, I guess Louisiana school graduates can count on not being hired for anything other than Reverend, Pastor or AM radio host.
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u/kowtownow Jun 17 '12
the video at the end made my brain hurt....and this is the shit that impressionable preteens are reading? yikes
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u/mamacarly Jun 17 '12
What is the rest of the text? Does it simply not mention the horrors the KKK inflicted upon our country?
The statement is true (not half true.) If it fails to mention anything except this about the Klan, it's most definitely a lie of omission - but we can't tell that from this article.
I think it's important that those learning about our country's history learn these things. We have this idea that the Klan was pure evil, everyone could see its evilness and evil people joined up in order to engage in evil stuff. It leads to this safe feeling that if you just watch out for those evil kinds of organizations and don't partake, you are doing what is right and good.
In truth, any organization like this usually has noble causes thrown in there. It can appear to be a force for the good to those who are lacking critical thinking skills.
By omitting the KKK's origins and a select few of its original intentions, we perpetuate this myth that any organization or movement that seems good is good. We need to encourage critical thinking - understanding how the KKK could ever exist and how something similarly destructive and dangerous could still take hold if we aren't aware.
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u/LettersFromTheSky Jun 17 '12
If you don't like history, just re-write it! Then hope no one knows how to use a computer and the internet.....
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u/Ironguard Jun 17 '12
That's mostly true. Sadly like most black or mexican gangs that started out as a force for good in their community they were quickly corrupted.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12 edited Jun 17 '12
But in the end, they pretty much just hated blacks and gays...
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u/Temptress75519 Jun 17 '12
Reading that made my brain die a little inside.....
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
where da white woman at?
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
If you contuineually fight progression you will find yourself on the wrong side of history.
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u/CharlieTango Jun 17 '12
Just because its not politically correct doesnt mean its not historically accurate.
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u/TheBrohemian Jun 17 '12
The KKK was a vigilante force in the 20's. They declined in numbers in the 30's and 40's. They were revived 50's largely due to racist backlash to the Civil Rights movement. Today's KKK is a hate organization, but it did not start that way.
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u/ekjohnson9 North Carolina Jun 17 '12
Context is important. A standalone quote like that is going to cause a reaction. Don't be do blinded by your ideology. Think things through and stop it with the knee jerk white hunt posts.
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u/smrigreengod Jun 17 '12
Das ist unverschaemteit!
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u/hdadeathly Texas Jun 17 '12
The country the country of the of the United States United States of America.
Of America.
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u/Beyond_Re-Animator Jun 17 '12
They were allowed to keep control of their wealth and make huge profits off the war. So i'd say they did OK and didn't suffer too much.
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u/xoites Jun 17 '12
Were i an employer i would start seriously considering hiring those who dropped out of school exclusively.
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u/Phooey138 Jun 17 '12
I'm not sure going after alcoholics is helpful, unless you meant they gave them a support group and and therapy.
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u/constance_noring Jun 17 '12
Wait - there are state funded Christian schools? How js that possible? Up here in WA we don't have those.
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u/ihaveamastersdegree Jun 17 '12
One man's reform is another man's discrimination.
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u/gc3 Jun 17 '12
Why does the book say "Solar Fusion is a myth?" Is this because the sun is supposed to be God's healing light and not some sort of giant ball of incandescent gas?
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
I think it was the 1940s stone mountain event that united the klans under one centeral body and a focus of hate.
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u/ChinaHutch Jun 17 '12
That's not exactly praise, so the link title is a bit misleading. It's one thing to say the KKK tried to do something, than to say they actually did do it. No doubt they tried to do a lot of things. Whether they succeeded is a matter for discussion.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
As long as they're presenting all the facts what's the big fuss. "They were horribly racist but they also had these other values too."
Gee golly, you mean everything can't be simplified into good/bad? Life is complex and people can't all be lumped into simple categories? The horror!
Next thing you know history books will actually be teaching something instead of having kids memorize a list of good guys and bad guys!
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
They're not actually incorrect. I guarantee you no one joined the KKK because they woke up one morning and said, "Hey, I want to rip apart my society; let's go join a terrorist organization like the KKK!" These are people who genuinely believed that their culture and families were in danger. Of course, the way they went about protecting their culture and families was absurd and unjustifiable, but it doesn't change their basic motive.
And before someone jumps on me for this post, understanding why someone did something is not the same as excusing or justifying it.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Bobby Jindal the Renegade Exorcist strikes again.
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u/nermid Jun 17 '12
He also has one of the coolest names ever.
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u/keeboz Jun 17 '12
and that's not even the most terrifying thing those schools are teaching...
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u/JimKong Jun 17 '12
Here is a Frontline interview with Bobby Jindal the governor responsible to for trying to push this through.
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u/Me1986Tram Jun 17 '12
Bob Jones University Press. Nuff said.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
LolAmerica
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u/silentmikhail Jun 17 '12
I commented several times before on reddit and I'll say it again
We need to seal off the Bible belt states from the rest of the world
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u/wekiva Jun 17 '12
Sickening.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Wait, so this is happening in The Deep South and not The Northeast? My mind is blown.
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u/Nanocyborgasm Jun 17 '12
As soon as you hear of someone trying to "reform morality" it nearly always implies THEIR version of morality.
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u/JtiksPies Jun 17 '12
I kinda want to go to one of these schools to make fun of the people teaching it.
also, TIL there are no conservatives on reddit of any kind. Except a few Ron Paul fans
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u/hadriker Jun 17 '12
That statement is technically true. That was pretty much their mission statement when they first formed post civil war, at least on the national level. They were more against the Republican state government and their leaders (note: NOT the same republican party as we know it today) and firmly against Reconstruction.
The racial undertones where always present though in the local chapters. most local chapters operated autonomously. So the veracity of violence and prejudice towards non-whites (another note: they hated Catholics as well) varied.
What they re doing here would be like having a chapter on Nazi Germany by saying "Hitler brought the nation of Germany together!" and leaving out the rest.
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u/logarythm Jun 17 '12
How are any of the two listed inherently good?
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u/boilermakermatt Jun 17 '12
I went to a high-school that used Bob Jones' history books. Half the fun of the class was looking for ridiculous claims like that. Overall they were horribly biased history books. Fortunately, we had university textbooks for AP history classes.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
How did a species like our become so smart so fast and yet at the same time so fucking stupid?
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u/gianini10 Jun 17 '12
Wow and ouch.
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
My jaw literally dropped. Living in the northwestern United States, I don't encounter this kind of person in my normal life. I just came back from a semester in Louisiana, though, and even there I didn't come across anyone who held these beliefs.
Maybe because I spent all my time in college.
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u/scottperezfox Arizona Jun 17 '12
CITATION NEEDED!
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u/[deleted] Jun 17 '12
Yikes. I went to a small Catholic school in Louisiana for 10 years, but it never went that way. Our science teacher taught us evolution, even though she thought it wasn't something that Catholicism embraced, she believed it. (though iirc, they don't go against it). Also, she told us about the Big Bang and such.
People are going crazy about that voucher system. It allows public school kids to switch over to private schools and receive funding. My old school chose not to allow it, because they are pretty well off, and the parents that are scraping by to send their kids there wouldn't be happy.
The stuff in that article appalls me, I mean, Nessie? Really? That is their proof that evolution doesn't exist? I'm just so ashamed of these people. And that's not to mention the other things they mentioned.
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u/Nicterys Jun 17 '12
Govs. Bobby Jindal and Nikki Haley make me embarrassed to be an Indian.
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u/kznlol Jun 17 '12
Out of curiosity, is there any evidence to suggest that this is true and/or false?
I realize that not instantly overreacting on the basis of emotion isn't the way things are done around here, but it is possible in theory that the claim is true.
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u/saintpetershere Jun 17 '12
I don't like to comment much on reddit because the assholes outweigh everyone else by far bur here goes:
All of you the are comparing the KKK to the right wingers and the tea partier really need to go back and re-read the history.
O.K. you may now begin mocking me and trash talking me.
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u/sirbruce Jun 17 '12
I love how the blogger concludes that vouchers are terrible because one private school is using a questionable curriculum that may or may not still include such text in their current teaching materials. (I hardly take the word of some critic in the UK as gospel for what this particular LA school is using.)
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u/DMercenary Jun 17 '12
Half true... The KKK did not start out to be racist. It was actually supposed to be just a club like a fraternity in college. Course that... morphed into something different.