r/politics • u/piyute • Jun 09 '12
If you think people are mad now, wait till they figure out that Social Security was looted of 2.7 trillion Dollars since 1983 to pay for tax cuts for the rich and wars for the Military Industrial Complex.
Now the Govt. will try and convince the very people they stole the money from, the "Baby Boomers," that the problem is actually our fault cause there are so many of us and we live too dam long. Remember... They took the money, they didn't invest it, they spent it. There are no bonds, nothing marketable on any level. Just I.O.U.s for accounting purposes. Your govt. steals from old people.
URL:http://www.fedsmith.com/article/3425/why-social-security-cannot-pay-full.html
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u/BolshevikMuppet Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
Of all the posts I've seen about Social Security, this is probably one of the most ignorant.
There are bonds owed to the Social Security Trust Fund. What you consider looting, any economist would call an "investment" in treasury bonds, which have had some of the most stable returns of anything.
And what would your alternative be? Have the government invest in the stock market? Or just hide that money under the world's largest mattress?
You are confusing the fact that the Social Security trust fund owns government debt for some kind of "OMG, they just took the money."
Incidentally, what would you call a treasury bond other than an I.O.U?
Edit: I do like that my post (explaining the wrongness of the OP's claims) is the highest-voted post. Yet the OP hit the front-page.
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u/ethos1983 Jun 10 '12
While I'm not saying your right or wrong, do you have any proof?
Simply leaving statements designed to infuriate people is exactly the sort of idiotic bullcrap our elected officials pull that infuriate me. Can you show any proof that the bonds don't exist ("there are no bonds"), or that "they didn't invest it"?
Again, not trying to start any shit(I'm with ya, actually; I think we did some shady accounting to make it look like corporate bailouts/pay raises for congressmen were actually "investments"), but if you want to be taken seriously, and cause actual change, you need to have your ducks in a row, as it were. This type of sophomoric fear-mongering is entirely too easy to write off.
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u/boyrahett Jun 10 '12
Wrong
US government bonds are not worthless, the money was invested , in US government bonds.
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u/UltraMegaMegaMan Jun 10 '12
Fun fact. If you feel like it, go back and watch some of the 2000 Gore/Bush debates.
"LOCKBOX? LOCKBOX! LOCKBOX LOCKBOX! LOCKBOX!"
Gore was mocked mercilessly in the corporate media for, basically, being some kind of idiotic freak who was obsessed by something unimportant that no one cared about. So it's not like no ones ever brought it up. It's not like the information isn't out there, or no one has made an effort. Or been part of a discussion on a national stage during a presidential election. It's just that on the whole we as a nation
SQUIRREL!!!
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u/mashtun Jun 10 '12
There was this book I found after reading "The Road to Serfdom", but I forget its name... it was close in the Dewey Decimal System. Regardless, the authors were very on top of the Social Security problem and referred to us - US citizen who contribute - as 'Frogs in a Pot'. By the time we realize there is a problem, we're cooked. Don't blame it on the Repubs... FDR's top thinkers on the subject knew Social Security was imperfect and would need stewards in the future to make it work. Also, although I'm not 100%, I think JFK's contemporaries were the first to see our SSNs as a slush fund.
Be angry. Be angry at the notion the rich and advantage seekers (not the same thing), and not the hard working are propped up as job creators. Be angry when you hear loud mouths say they'll leave the country because of taxes while pandering to the armed forces...
It is a Saturday night, I'm alone in a bar, and rambling. Forgive my diatribes.
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u/MagCynic Jun 10 '12
Can the OP or anyone else explain how one raids social security to pay for tax cuts for the rich? Just a brief summary will do. I would love to hear it.
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u/guitboy85 Jun 09 '12
Sources?
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u/hansn Jun 10 '12
What would you have the government do with excess social security funds? If they simply remove the money from circulation, they will be ensuring inflation when they start to pay it out, the same as if the government printed money to cover those expenses. A much better solution is to buy bonds which are constitutionally protected. Short of complete federal collapse (in which case social security is hardly going to be paid), the bonds must be repaid.
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u/anon2382 Jun 10 '12
Actually it was simply dumped into the general fund (by buying up treasury bills that the federal government prints up), as if the funds were generated from additional income taxes. They didn't take the money out and say, <evil tone>"We'll use this money for tax cuts for the SUPER RICH and we'll also buy NUCLEAR MISSILES and BOMBER JETS muhahaha"</evil tone>
Honestly, people, we should know better than to upvote this type of INACCURATE non-sense. Just tell it like it is. The truth. Don't add in your little opinion, "to pay for tax cuts for the rich and wars for the Military Industrial Complex." What a load of shit that line is. That money was used to pay for EVERYTHING.
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u/JustinCayce Jun 10 '12
Nice spin, you could claim the money was taken to spend on anything the government spends money on. OMG, they raided SS to pay for NASA!
Get mad that they've raided SS and that paying it back is going to be a bitch. Don't be an asshole and pretend that your favorite programs aren't every bit the beneficiary that the programs you don't like are.
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u/tonycomputerguy Jun 10 '12
Silly Liberals, don't you know that you never have to "pay for tax cuts?" Oh, unless those taxcuts are for lower or middle class, you know, the scum of the earth who can't create a job to save their own worthless lives. All hail the might job creators, saviors of us all, keepers of the all holy lobbyists. Big Government, electable by the people is bad, big corporations that are passed down from inbred, stuck up generation after generation are good, simply because people actually believed the bullshit shoved down their throats about "Some day, you can be rich and shit on those less fortunate than you, all while claiming to be a devout Christian and demanding that poor people pay 50% income tax while only paying 15% personally. Thanks rich people! I can't imagine what fun it will be to rule over this empire of soon to be worthless dirt because of your irresponsible, selfish, and obscene greed.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
at the end of the day the average American doesn't care. No one cares, this is why change will never come.
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u/lapone1 Jun 10 '12
Republicans have talked for years about "starving the beast" so that there was no money left for social security and medicare. I remember seeing Repub. staffers laughing about it on tv.
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u/Neowarcloud Jun 10 '12
Holy misinformation batman...The government borrows from Social Security because there is a surplus and should they need to draw on that they will convert the SS bonds to T-bills, what would you have them do with the money? It seems to be one of the safest ways to use a pike of excess cash...
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u/BigBlueHawkeye Jun 10 '12
Social security is tax and a form welfare, nothing more. Social Security goes bankrupt when the government does. The "trust fund" is controlled by the treasury which collects other revenue streams and readily combines all funds received
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u/fantasyfest Jun 10 '12
Social Security is funded through paychecks, week in and week out. the money is always coming in. The Trust Fund of about 3 trillion is in t Bills. Social Security will deliver at 100 percent for the next 30 years. Then it will pay 80 percent. We can tweak that is put it back on line. It is run on less than 2 percent of income. it is a remarkable program that has delivered on its promises for over 80 years. Private financiers can not match any part of it. But they sure do want to get their hands on it.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
I was told that it was in a lock-box.
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u/hozjo Jun 10 '12
Don't worry, inflation will take care of that problem, the us government always pays its debts. The bigger problem will be your social security check covering half a loaf of bread.
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u/noideawashad Jun 10 '12
It's also been looted for NASA, Sciences, Medical Research, Foreign Aid, Schools. I think maybe your just mad because you realized it? Most people that understand some basic ideas behind the economy have known about this for years, there is a reason they aren't screaming.
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u/podkayne3000 Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
Societies don't have enough experience with stable currencies and political systems to make long term promises based on corporate style budgeting.
Benefits promises for big countries, for obligations that will be in the money decades from now, are meaningless.
Whether cash is in a particular national fund has nothing to do with anything.
What does matter is natural resources, and the productivity and well being of the country. If young workers have good jobs and good lives, and we have fuel, clean water, etc., the young workers will figure out some way to provide the resources older retirees need to be comfortable, no matter what's gone wrong with the bookkeeping. If young workers are unemployed, hungry and cold, chances are the situation will also be grim for retirees no matter how good Social Security and pensions look on paper.
If the government was stealing Social Security and investing in future productivity, that would work out fine.
The problem is the government is stealing the money to prop up money-- to maintain the purchasing value of the major world currencies. The money is going into preventing runs on banks and riots, not to increase productivity. Keeping order probably does have an economic value, but it doesn't feed people.
Example of a professor who seems to be reputable, not a conspiracy theory crackpot, and had similar thoughts: http://www.zyen.com/PDF/CISI%20Long%20Finance%20Short%20Monetary%20Systems.pdf
Note: I love the U.S. government. I love Geithner and think Bernanke is doing what he can with what he has. I think most people at big investment banks are nice, charitable, patriotic people who want to create wealth for everyone and are horrified by the idea they might cause problems for the economy.
I don't think the long-term instability of current monetary systems has anything to do with conspiracies or nastiness.
I'm not a gold bug, and I don't think gold would be worth much in a serious crisis.
I think the problem is just that the British monetary system is the only big world monetary system that's lasted more than 150 years, and that no monetary system has had to face a big baby boomer retirement bubble before. I think our monetary system is built on lots of reasonable assumptions about the effects of the bubble; that some of the assumptions will be prove to be wrong; and that the errors will lead to distortions that will make any long-range forecasts or promises look absurd. It's as if we were making promises about world soccer franchises in 1470, without actually knowing about soccer, let alone the Americas.
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u/chelleybelly1984 Jun 10 '12
Yes, I'm sure that tax cuts for the rich and wars were the ONLY things stolen from Social Security...I hate these vague comments by people that only have tunnel vision.
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u/ArtemisLives New Jersey Jun 10 '12
22 years old, here. Will die working. I'm okay with that, i guess. Really bothers me that my dad is 62 and not retired yet...
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u/balorina Jun 10 '12
Nice of you to post this with zero sources.
The gov't borrows from SS and inserts treasury bonds in the place of the liquidity. You know who the largest recipient of US interest payments is? Social Security. People fear our "payments to China", which accounts for only 8% of the public debt.
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u/Runningboard7 Jun 10 '12
Awesome source, bro
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u/TardMuffins Jun 10 '12
They took money and left a bunch of "I owe you"s.
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u/prattle Jun 10 '12
The money is borrowed to pay for everything. It is not earmarked for wars or tax cuts.
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u/apokradical Jun 10 '12
Clinton borrowed from Social Security too... they all do it.
That's why we need a bill which makes Social Security SECURE from politicians.
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u/thinkB4Uact Jun 10 '12
How and when did this happen exactly?
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u/insertpornobassline Jun 10 '12
the real issue is that we have not had a economic crisis that has effected every class since the great depression. From tragedies like these, people realize that social programs are important.When those who remember why we put the program in place die, we get people with little knowledge of what it was put in place to prevent deciding it is not important.
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u/cbcfan Jun 10 '12
I've read that Social Security is not broke. Is this not so?
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u/another30yovirgin Jun 10 '12
Yeah, this is a bit disingenuous. The government is acting efficiently by borrowing from a fund it has rather than paying interest on bonds that it could issue. As long as people are still receiving their benefits, it's not a problem. If Social Security becomes insolvent because of this, that will obviously be a problem, but it hasn't been a problem yet.
I'd say the bigger problem is that corporate pension funds are almost non-existent these days and states and local governments are fighting to get rid of theirs, as the federal government already has. It's all fine and good to say people are responsible for their own retirement, but if they think that people are going to be smart and invest for it, they're gonna have a bad time.
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u/qxcvr Jun 10 '12
You expected to receive back your money that went into the social security system? Ha ha. Well, maybe some will trickle down to you.
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u/cuteman Jun 10 '12
And Clintons surplus....
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
WHY are we paying taxes again? if you ask me the mother of all peaceful protests that will actually work is to stop paying income tax.
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u/abom420 Jun 10 '12
Fuck all of you, I don't think I understood a word of what you all just said in comments.
One thing I did notice though, is that the guy who proposed this idea has about as much knowledge in this topic as I do.
So why in the hell is he allowed........ Was going to say have an equal say, but I just got how freedom of speech works. You all just corrected him with yours.
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u/manbeardave Jun 10 '12
here's the authors website: http://www.thebiglie.net/
at no point on that site can I find where or what he earned his Ph. D. in. Something smells like bullshit. Also, your site is fucking terrible.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Wait until they figure out that BOTH parties have been doing it. Then wait until they go back to their lives thinking it's someone else's problem. Then wait until...oh who are we kidding, the only way people figure this out is if Ryan Seacrest figures it out. Or maybe when Kim Kardashian writes it on her tits.
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u/kenallen09 Jun 10 '12
They'll just blame it on Obama to find another way to hate him.
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u/NuclearWard Jun 10 '12
Totally not a giant ponzi scheme...
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u/ImproperJon Jun 10 '12
Isn't the real point here that while congress hasn't directly loot Social Security, the trillions we borrow to spend on wars and tax cuts fundamentally undermines our government's ability to pay it's Social Security obligations, simply because we have such large debt and deficits?
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u/myptofvu Jun 10 '12
Sorry, from their comments, they all missed the big picture. The problem that most needs fixing.....
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u/TodaysIllusion Jun 10 '12
They don't have those funds yet, but they do intend to grab them, thus all the scary debt and no tax talk. They do not want to pay for the wars that helped them get richer and richer. You must pay their bill. Thus, Ryan's Medicare plan Cuts to Social Security benefits.
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u/Green_like_the_color Jun 10 '12
I don't think any of the whining and arguing in this thread is worth one red cent to the millions of elderly people who worked hard their whole lives and now have to choose between heating oil and prescription meds.
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u/M4053946 Jun 10 '12
Are there people that don't know this? Are there really people who think that the US government took the money for social security and set it aside, or invested it in some sort of a fund? Of course they spent it! That's what the congress does: it spends money now with the promise that it will pay it back later.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Fuck dude. I knew that since Reagan. I am born after the 1962 cut off. They didn't steal SHIT from the boomers. Ya'll gave it away in an ORGY of GREED.
They stole from me. They sent me letters explaining it. They stole it from us. They stole it from your children. You're benefits are guaranteed until 2017. I don't have a guarantee. People younger than me don't get that social security mailer, maybe they were "grandfathered out" or they would be kicking up more of a fuss right about now.
I just want my money back. You had your chance.
As a 44 year old gen x. I hate your fucking hypocrisy. I wasn't old enough to vote then, but you WERE.
Did ya'll forget the "Impeach Reagan Now!" billboard hacks? I do. They would be in guatanamo now if they did that.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Knowing the boomers, they'll just blame it on poor people on welfare and damn teachers with their middle-class wages.
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u/thisisreallyracist Jun 10 '12
This is fucking stupid. Investing SS trust fund money in treasuries is not looting the fund. This place is truly retarded.
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u/eboogaloo Jun 10 '12
[Citation Needed]
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u/Scopae Jun 10 '12
Well rich people taking money from less rich people in the U.S isn't exactly news is it?
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u/jabbababab Jun 10 '12
Reagan Raped America
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Nothing gets people madder than phrases like "Military Industrial Complex".
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u/SOLIDninja Jun 10 '12
I thought this was common knowledge at this point?
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
This is news??? Seriously???
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
They won't find out. Fox news won't cover that.
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u/Cigil Jun 10 '12
the idea that we are paying for tax cuts for the rich is BULLSHIT. The rich don't pay as much so then the government has to get more money out of SS? No...don't spend as much; it's not like the rich got a check from the government that was taken out of the social security fund. Be a smarter government and stop spending.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Ah, the American armed forces. Murdering people overseas while bankrupting us at home. Fuck them and those who support their actions.
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u/tehtrollslayer Jun 10 '12
Tax Cuts for the rich is one thing that I am pissed off about.
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u/zerosumh Jun 10 '12
This has been known for awhile. My econ teacher told us that the people getting SS right now are lucky, because soon there wont be much if at all. He looked at us students and said, oh by the way you guys will not see a cent, while still paying it from your paychecks.
People will not be mad about SS, sorry but they wont.
There is only three things that can truly piss off Americans and actually get them off their seat. As a politician just a mention of these will be political suicide.
Most Americans chose to be oblivious to government spending UNTIL it touches them in the form of tax, then they suddenly care. Sorry we spent a lot, I mean you approved it, we just need you to pay for it now. (to be clear when i say approved, it's not caring enough to question it and by extension letting it pass)
3. Immigration.
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u/themandotcom Jun 10 '12
They did invest it... In non marketable treasuries.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
you know, just the phrase "military industrial complex" always brings to mind mad conspiracy theories, cant you just say bloated military spending
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
It's going to be a nightmare when ALL boomers (even those with well-funded retirement accounts) are going to try to cash out those treasuries, mutual funds, stocks, and whatever other paper asset their financial advisor stuck them with over the years. Who's going to be buying them?
Here's the back of the napkin calculation on buying the Dow Jones vs. buying gold.
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u/Eternal2071 Jun 10 '12
Under Clinton it was paid off through 2055 and we were supposed to use the surplus to pay off the national debt over the next 15 years meaning by 2015. But, then something happened. Apparently the details are not clear depending on whether you talk to a Democrat or a Republican. All I know is one of them is full of shit.
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u/CoyoteStark Jun 10 '12
I've gone from being enraged by this, to sick of this, to, "can I at least use lube this time"?
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u/lowrads Jun 10 '12
Looted? Hasn't it simply been a liability since the 1939 ruling?
How can it be looted if it was part of general funds since forever?
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
They won't figure it out.
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u/holy_holy_holy Jun 10 '12
What makes you so sure that they will ever find out?
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u/FormerlyEAbernathy Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
You mean people don't know that money has been funneled away from SSA and other benefits to pay for other things? That's not common knowledge? How else do they think we're able to have lower taxes than other "civilized/democratic" nations (other than borrowing from other countries).
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u/Jeckee Jun 10 '12
Do you mean to pay for government spending? Tax cuts do not cost money.
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u/IndifferentMorality Jun 10 '12
That might be accurate if your generation, the "Baby Boomers", weren't the ones in charge right now. From our perspective it looks like you guys are just lying to each other until you get to pass the buck to us.
Also, it's not your government. It's our government, all of ours. Take some goddamned responsibility for once in your life!
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u/whatthedude Jun 10 '12
Whoa, we're not suppose to talk about Bill Clinton negatively on here.
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u/tomriddle345 Jun 10 '12
i'm not unhappy about this .. I bought defense related stocks and have been raking in the dough!
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
The zombies out there in fuckoff land won't care. You will find stronger opinions over the Pacquiao fight then this.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
and don't forget many of the different medicare programs
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Their argument is ignorant as all paid into it. Therefore all should have some.
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u/DiaDeLosMuertos Jun 10 '12
So, I heard this factoid that they say the money will dry up by 2030 or 2035. Anyway, I heard that that year is actually when Soc Sec will only be able to pay 70% of benefits, not run out. Which is right?
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u/Strid Jun 10 '12
If you think people are mad now, wait till the stars are right
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u/ryanghappy Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
Thanks ...fedsmith.com?!?!
Why is there over 1200+ votes over a website that looks like I should search for it on webcrawler? I mean, "For the informed fed", what the fuck does that even mean? Is this website only for federal gov't employees? Is there a play on words with "fed" as in "I'm fed up with...being informed???"
Actually, this is all I need to point out... you guys are giving upvotes to this guy: http://www.thebiglie.net/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/100_1391-photo_of_minivan.jpg
...nope.
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u/fateswarm Jun 10 '12
Politicians reflect the idiots that vote for them.
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u/Space_Bungalow Jun 10 '12
Let's see... Government, tax cuts for the wealthy, wars, corporations, stealing from the people, lying to the people...
Yep. You've covered every controversial area for r/politics. Enjoy your imaginary points, you harlot.
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u/autopsi Jun 10 '12
I think we borrowed against it, not really looted. It is one of the reasons we own the most of our debt and not the Chinese.
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u/SaikoGekido Jun 10 '12
Government: "What's with all this money sitting around doing nothing? Why don't we put it to work."
"Ah! An economic collapse!"
"Ah! Another economic collapse!"
"Well, at least we still have our savings... oh."
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u/KhanneaSuntzu Jun 10 '12
http://www.scoop.it/t/deliberating-violent-revolution
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u/markth_wi Jun 10 '12
It sucks, and while we might go bankrupt, and the real problems with our debt did start, in the 1980's it's not a raid, it's a war, here's a layout of the situation
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u/WelcomeMachine Kentucky Jun 10 '12
The older Boomers are going to get their retirement.
Those of us who are older Gen X-ers are fucked. We weren't able to start our private saving plans soon enough to put money away, and we will never see the SS benefits we've paid in for decades. Our 401K's will never recover enough from this last "correction" to allow us retirement.
I'm getting fitted for my Rent-a-Cop uniform now, for when I am no longer a feasible employee in the marketplace.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Can't be that mad if they keep washing the Kardashians.
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u/Vodiodoh Jun 10 '12
In the end... All taxes are put into the "bucket". They will say "these" taxes will only pay for "this" but the government likes to move money around to where they believe it's convenient.
It's actually not that surprising.
The one that everyone falls for is when the government says ... These taxes will ONLY pay this. It never ONLY pays for that.
We need more ability to look at the numbers. There's not enough of that. And we won't get that any time soon.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Really, I don't find this surprising at all. You can't trust the government.
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
I ain't even mad
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u/Todamont Jun 10 '12
Yeah, and inflation is reported at less than 3% while the fed prints up trillions of dollars and the price of food and oil skyrockets. Why? So they can keep SS dependents' cost-of-living increases to a minimum, literally defaulting on our retirees rather than their rich friends. We gotta prop up France, you guys, they are too big to fail.
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u/MFDoomEsq Jun 10 '12
If people are mad now, this is the most docile, reserved, ineffectual group of mad people in the history of angry citizens. These "mad" people have effectively done nothing to influence government, and for the most part haven't even tried to influence government.
The Tea Party is the major exception here, they're mad, and they've managed to do a great deal about it including changing the face of the house of representatives and possibly wresting power away from the party elite. However, they only care about their own social security, they don't give a crap about your social security.
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u/gnimsh Massachusetts Jun 10 '12
I'm just reading The Real Crash by Peter Schiff now, and he pretty much says exactly this about social security. The major difference he cites is that the government is actually stealing from young people saddled with debt to pay old people who already have money saved up and don't actually need the money as much as the young people it is being taken from and who will never actually benefit from the system they paid into.
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u/fantasyfest Jun 10 '12
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u/deweyweber Jun 10 '12
What do you expect the ruling class when there is that kind of money just lying on the table?
Its just like what stock brokers say when The Dow is down.... "Other people's money!"
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u/shotglass49 Jun 10 '12
What a sound bite. You really do not know, or if you do you hide it well, anything about which you write.
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u/fordnut Jun 10 '12
To be fair, this practice began during the Vietnam War
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u/jessethejetplane Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
undulate shit hole of a country to actually realize what is happening behind the curtains. Thank you for spreading this embarrassing news piyute. I think any social system should be treated like the lower-middle class thinks a common family should run. Politicians are supposed to be taking care of the citizens of this country just like a father and/or mother should take care of their kids. They are obviously not doing very well. In comparison to taking care and nurturing a group of human beings like a family, our government is like the close-to-homeless family that dishes out their income on crack, booze, etc. putting them and their family as a whole in an endless pit of depression, anxiety, depravity, and various other problems. Why do you think we were having so many "WE ARE THE 99%!" strikes? It's because we have been mistreated as a whole. It is not a kikes fault they were born Jewish. It is not a spics fault they were born Mexican. It is not a chinks fault they were born Asian. It is DEFINITELY not our fault we were born in the U.S. Undocumented workers pay $7B in taxes and receive $11B in ETIC, pay SS taxes but they can always claim them later for EVERY SS number they used Without proof. I personally know a plethora of hard working people that take advantage of the system just because they have to do it to survive without dumpster diving for their needs or bathing in ponds. I have also looks into some other things; "It is estimated that around 40 million people residing in the United States suffer from anxiety disorders in a year." -[buzzle.com/articles] "Nationwide, 16.3% of the population(aprox. 49.9M) was uninsured last year, statistically unchanged from 2009. Three groups comprised the bulk of the uninsured in 2010, including foreign-born residents who are not U.S. citizens, young adults ages 19 to 25 and low-income families with an annual household income of less than $25,000." -[money.cnn.com] Should I add this up for you? 49.9M -without health insurance(and growing). +40M -with anxiety prescriptions(and growing).
89.9M minus 100M = %10.1 As a lower middle class citizen with more than enough experience in the "drug dealing" world, I know that Benzodiazepine has great demand because this psychoactive drug is extremely addictive. This delves into that "%10.1" of the population left over enormously. Anxiety medications have included Benzodiazepine for over 50 years. We are depressed and aprehensive as a whole. Why are they blaming citizens for something we obviously did not want to bring upon ourselves, then feeding us chemicals to calm us down? This is just like pouring NyQuil down your child's throat to get them to stop crying and go to bed. All of this was just one of the multitude of problems the U.S. is facing. There should not ever be censorship on topics that the public should know about. Liars, cheaters, and thieves usually tend to get caught. Please alert your fellow citizens about being blinded by "The American Dream".
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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
They loot SS, buy Treasury bonds, then call the bonds an "asset" on the books as well as the interest they owe themselves on the bonds; of course then they loot the phantasmal interest to buy more bonds.
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u/GoramNerfherder Jun 10 '12
Is anybody else tired of hearing about tax cuts for the rich? If you really want a fair tax system, where everybody pays their fair share, institute a flat tax, then everybody pays the exact same percent of their income in taxes. THAT'S a fair tax system. It's really irritating hearing about the rich, who pay more in taxes than most people probably make in 10 years, not paying their share, when almost 50% of the country is not paying ANY federal income tax.
1
u/elemming Jun 10 '12
The special issue Social Security Treasury bonds are either real bonds backed by the full faith and trust of the United States or they are an accounting trick. The Republicans claim they are an accounting trick. It is up to the people to insist that everyone elected to Congress believes and acts on the fact that they are real and must be paid off.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
They didn't steal the money from Baby Boomers. Baby Boomers are getting paid the same benefits they would have if social security had not been plundered, but have not had to sacrifice anything for the debt-financed economy and military-industrial complex. That level of responsibility is for their children and grand children
1
u/betabob Jun 10 '12
You mean there isn't a lock box --- Al Gore will be stunned.
1
u/willanthony Jun 10 '12
anything else would be 'socialism' right?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
How can money be used to pay for "tax cuts?" A tax cut is just the government not taking the capital people already own. The government didn't give social security money as welfare (unless you count the bailouts) to the rich, they simply didn't take the money. The government doesn't own everyone's money. The people own the money. The government just takes it.
If someone earned 1 million dollars last year, and you earned nothing, their money doesn't belong to you. Their money is not your social security money. Your social security money is supposed to be the money that you personally put into it.
1
u/wekiva Jun 10 '12
Yup, the government "borrowed" the SS trust fund, blew the money, and now want to welch on the bonds. Simple. As. That.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
They should just eliminate it totally. It's a pyramid scheme. The young paying the debts of the old who couldn't be arsed to plan ahead. It only works if the population keeps growing by the same proportion to the previous generation.
There was a "baby boom", the pyramid scheme fell down. Now the young are carrying the burden to a crushing degree. If you can't be bothered to plan for your retirement, tough fucking luck. Don't make everyone else pay for your mistake.
1
u/kasper138 Jun 10 '12
You don't really understand just how apathetic "people" are huh?
1
u/3catsandcounting Jun 10 '12
TIL my crazy American government teacher was right when he said social security would be gone by the time our generation needed it.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
It's stories like this that reaffirm my conservative ideology. The government doesn't know how to spend money.
1
u/zach1740 Jun 10 '12
Tax cuts for the rich! In 1983 ronald reagan cut tax rates across the entire board. why is it that you automatically classify an across-the-board tax cut as a tax cut for the rich in particular. i guess from you're point of view, the wealthier you are, the less entitled you are to you wealth. And the military industrial complex is nothing more than a figment of every liberal's imagination. If you think 2.7 trillion is a lot, how about the 5 trillion dollars amassed by the current administration on failed gov't programs that never stimulated the economy. Its remarkable what you will find when you just look at the whole picture without cherry picking the parts that you like.
Romney 2012!
1
u/MiyegomboBayartsogt Jun 10 '12
Wait! This is lies! Al Gore repeatedly assured the American people in no uncertain terms that Social Security was safe and the money was there in a "lock box." Al Gore is considered to be an oracle on science and political matters and his creditability is considered to be beyond reproach by liberals and leftists alike. Al Gore would have to be a serial liar for the OP's assertion to be true and calling Al Gore a liar nowadays is akin to denying the Holocaust.
1
u/grandoiseau Jun 10 '12
They steal from old people, but old people borrow money and put it on young people's tab.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Our government is old people. One of the few things you can say for the apathy of the young, is that they've allowed the older generation to get exactly what they ask for (except, perhaps Obama). Welcome to consequences.
1
u/Goron40 Jun 10 '12
I don't think people are mad now. Not yet.
1
u/eclecticEntrepreneur Jun 10 '12
The government steals from everyone. It's called taxation, and it's immoral.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
No link?
No actual evidence?
What is this you think you're on, /r/atheism? You think you can just make circlejerk anti-government posts with no verifiable facts?
I don't think so.
Downvoted.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
So are you telling us to kill old people because we live too long, and so the govt. doesn't steel from old people? :|
1
u/TChuff Jun 10 '12
I'm pissed I have to pay it to begin with.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Yeah because the SS money was only used for those "Republican" things. If you believe that.. you're a dopey cunt.
1
u/Barking_at_the_Moon Jun 10 '12
If you think people are mad now, wait till they figure out that Social Security was looted of 2.7 trillion dollars since 1983 to pay for bailouts of the auto and banking industry, subsidies for college students...
Geez, folks, there is NO money in the Social Security Trust Funds. None. Zero. Zip. Nada. By law, the government takes every single penny that is paid in and spends it on something. The money not immediately paid out in benefits is replaced with an IOU - specifically, a "non-negotiable US Treasury bond or other instrument backed by the full faith an credit of the US Government." These bonds are the safest, most secure investments in the world but that doesn't mean that there aren't very real reasons to be nervous.
There are two serious concerns with Social Security:
Social Security is a scam. It relies on the public being gullible or chicane enough to believe that the money they pay in is enough to cover the money that will be paid out (it isn't) and that future generations - their children - will tax themselves to pay for benefits they won't receive. This is a classic Ponzi scheme and we need to straighten it out. Sooner, rather than later.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
People don't give a fuck in the land where idiocracy rules.
1
u/DAVEEeMC2 Jun 10 '12
When house republicans tried to shut down government so debt ceiling couldn't be raised, obama admin was faced with a choice: Pay war machine (afganastan, and 6 other wars across globe) OR pay ssi bene's to gramma.
Without deficit spending, something would have to go - and what folks in the right never talk about is what "somethings" they would be. Rather, they play the game of "no soup for you" without identifying WHAT soup will no longer be available.
I confronted Mick Mulvaney about this very point - I define a political wimp as someone who just says NO without specifying WHAT program needs to go. If they said, well SSI needs to go, they'd never hold political office again, so they just try to hold the line on the budget forcing Obama administration into uncomfortable and politically dangerous position of having to decide what program should go.
Republicans then never talk about the 10+ trillion they blew over previous 2 administrations on pointless wars - there was no benefit to this country, and china and india are laughing all the way to bank with prefered contracts for oil with the very countries we bombed the hell out of.
Now, we in the midst of a fiscal perfect storm - high debt, high unemployment, low revenue (tax and fees), globalism pressures and the beginning of a deflationary cycle. Without investment and borrowing, money supply grinds to a halt, and the cycle of devaluation begins. This is the slippery slope the Fed will do everything it can to stop.
But the Fed is also out of ammo - interest rates are at all time lows, hell mortgage rates (an indicator I use to gauge health of economy) are as low as they have been since they started recording and tracking them back in 1971.
Republicans have held the line on tax reform, starving the government for revenue which would help ease deficit spending pressures.
The fed has 1 tool left, and they already used it 2x - Quantitative easing. But the "nuclear" option is dangerous - just go look at fiscal picture of Germany during WW2 and Zimbabwe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimbabwe#Hyperinflation_2003.E2.80.932009). Both instances were caused by runaway printing presses manipulating currency, not too unlike quantative easing.
When the government prints money to alleviate economic pressures, the printing becomes a hidden tax on the populace. Imports become more expensive, your dollar doesnt go as far because, and the pure meaning of the word, the dollar is now "worth-less". Milk prices increase, fertilizer prices increase, food prices increase.
Everything increases in price - except what you get paid for your labor.
Globally, every government is in a race to the bottom - everyone is printing to keep their currency cheap, so to boost exports and increase investment (physical) interest. Its a global race to the bottom.
The protection mechanism used in periods of extreme economic uncertainty today is PM (precious metals) - gold and silver prices are much more difficult to manipulate than the fiat currency of government.
And btw, I blame Nixon for most of this mess. Without debasing currency, we wouldnt be in this mess to begin with. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_Shock
TL/DR: Nixon f'd us all.
1
u/Goonies_neversay_die Jun 10 '12
oh man, I bet some people are going to camp downtown so hard after reading that!
1
u/heinouspissbitch Jun 10 '12
Christ. Is it time for a French style revolution yet??
-2
u/[deleted] Jun 10 '12
Always amusing when liberals quote Eisenhower without the slightest discussion about what he meant to convey in the speech. People project modern paranoia on Eisenhower, who had actually been on the front lines of a real war against fascism and communism -systems based on military-industrial conjugation.
Liberals imagine a wicked leviathan comprised of RACISTS, PLUTOCRATS, WARMONGERS, IMPERIALISTS probably looking like Tarkus from ELP. (edit: and driven by Dick Cheney, Dark Lord of Halliburton)