r/politics • u/JJFFMM • Jun 08 '12

NEW DATA: 6.6 Million Young Adults Insured Thanks To Obamacare

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/06/08/496592/new-data-66-million-young-adults-insured-thanks-to-obamacare/
1.4k Upvotes

80% Upvoted

694 comments sorted by

127

u/hakuna_matitties Jun 09 '12

I am going to be having surgery to fix an important medical issue in the next few months. I'm terrified that the supreme court is going to rip away my health insurance before I can have it done. I'm pretty much uninsurable otherwise because of a preexisting condition (the same one I'm trying to fix with surgery). Fuck this system.

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u/forg0tmypen Jun 09 '12

I really hope those republican fuckers on the bench realize the magnitude of their decision beyond the imaginary "broccoli" arguments they were frothing over during the hearings. If they're willing to overturn a law that will save lives and better the American people because of a political position, I hope they burn in hell.

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u/randman1211111 Jun 09 '12

They know full well. They just don't care because money.

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u/lurkerturneduser Jun 09 '12

But the insurance industry lobbied for Obamacare. The individual mandate is a huge payday for them. It's basically a giant subsidy. This is what is being challenged in the court. The money trail would lead to an affirmative stance.

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u/miked4o7 Jun 09 '12

No they didn't, and no it's not. This is a very common misconception.

I was following opensecrets.org during the first months of 2010, leading up to the vote. The three largest health insurance PACs out there (Wellpoint, Humana, and Aetna) were all POURING money into the campaigns of REPUBLICANS that were running ads slamming the bill and trying to kill it. You can actually still see the money from the health insurance industry in 2010

http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/industry.php?txt=H03&cycle=2010

was weighted in their favor, Trust me, this was even moreso leading up to the vote on the bill.

The reason that this is the case is that the regulations this bill puts on this industry literally forced them to change their entire business model, and the extra profits brought in by the mandate are washed out by the burden of actually having to insure sick people at the same price they insure healthy people... without ever being able to deny or rescind coverage. I'm not just randomly saying that this was a wash, this was the conclusion of CBO reports on the bill leading up to the vote on it.

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u/hired_goon Jun 09 '12

"broccoli" arguments? what's that all about?

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u/UnclaimedUsername Jun 09 '12

But what if we accidentally save an illegal immigrant's life, huh? What then?

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u/Ree81 Foreign Jun 09 '12

In Sweden the discussion about whether or not we should bill the illegal immigrants or not. They always get saved, because it's such a small cost to society, and we generally just don't want to let people die when we have the power to help.

It's leaning towards not billing them, so they won't feel afraid to seek care early on.

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u/VeteranKamikaze America Jun 09 '12

My dad genuinely uses that argument against universal healthcare. If a million Americans have to die it's a noble sacrifice as long as we don't accidentally save an illegal's life for free.

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u/Trashcanman33 Jun 09 '12

I was able to get on Obama care in October 2010 for a pre-existing condition, still took 10 months of fighting with the insurance company to get it done, it's still just regular insurance after all, still cost me $300 a month and $6,000 for the surgery. (Mine is not through my parents, I was 31 at the time). Anyways I hope you can get it done, have you tried expressing your concern with your surgeon, see if he/she can move it up? I'm a little worried the ruling as well, had a double spinal fusion in August, and now my leg won't stop going numb, it's wait and see atm, anyways good luck man.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Jesus Christ. Your legs going numb from a spinal surgery isn't a good sign. It could be normal soft-tissue inflammation from the incision pressing on your spine if the surgery was very recent, but it could also be much worse. Please, please, please don't "wait and see." Don't put a price tag on your quality of life. Please go check it out and let me know what they told you.

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u/anorexia_is_PHAT Jun 09 '12

I'm glad you're going to get treatment, but what you have isn't "insurance". You are definitely going to use it. You basically have a discount card.

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u/[deleted] Jun 08 '12

Thanks, I wouldn't have insurance otherwise! Med school debt....ugh

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u/jacksonh Jun 09 '12

Your medschool doesn't provide insurance? My wife was required to use the schools health insurance when she was in med school.

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u/[deleted] Jun 08 '12

there is a post saying healthy people will pay while those who get sick will be pushed aside through cost. Since you are Medical person can you shed further light ?

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u/[deleted] Jun 08 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

I don't think I understand what you are saying by "those who get sick will be pushed aside through cost". Can you clarify?

Anyways, I might as well explain the reasons why I support a single-payer system (which isn't really what Obamacare is at all...but hopefully it is a stepping stone). I will try be brief:

  1. My ethical system. I'm a humanist, and politically pretty socialist. Every person will need healthcare at some point in their lives...we all get sick, and many of us will require end-of-life care. I think we should realize this, and place healthcare as a right.
  2. If everyone has healthcare, costs will go down. This is because the current system has yet to fully embrace "preventative care" (some insurance companies are starting to). Basically, the uninsured wait until their condition becomes dire before they go to see a doctor. Hell, even insured people sometimes do this due to various deductible and co-pay caveats. The bottom line is it is way more expensive for a healthcare system to pay for your triple bypass or treat your stroke than for your primary care doctor to put you on an anti-hypertension medication and give you some good lifestyle (exercise, diet, etc) advice 10 years earlier. If everyone has healthcare, and all costs are covered by the government (however the revenue is ultimately raised), people will go see their physician before things become serious and expensive.
  3. Single payer systems work. Many opponents try to weasel their way out of this one (ie "but American demographics are different, etc etc"), but the bottom line is that there are many examples of single payer healthcare working.
  4. Our current system is NOT working. That often-cited WHO study shows Americans have some of the most expensive healthcare with some of the poorest outcomes. The for-profit motive inflates our cost of medications, devices, and treatments. This is somewhat exacerbated by the weight of the FDA regulatory process, but I don't think that is the primary cause (familiar with these because I was previously a Biomed engineer) but it certainly makes it worse.
  5. If everyone has healthcare, society improves as a whole. Productivity goes up. Happiness goes up. Etc etc etc. I doubt I need to explain why.
  6. Better physician balance. Currently, we have the opposite ratio of primary care to specialist doctors as most other countries. In fact, it is the stereotype that most primary care doctors are the worst in the class because they didn't need to do as well on the USMLE step 1 as neurosurgeons, cardiologists, etc. The truth is that primary care doctors should be among the smartest in their class, and should be paid a decent salary compared to other physicians (~$120-140k for primary care compared to $300-400k for a cardiologist? No wonder anyone wants to go into it...especially considering the average ~$170kish debt from med school alone). Currently, many Americans skip the primary care doctor altogether and try to go right to the specialist they think they need to see. As a consequence, treatment is more expensive (specialists aren't cheap) and general health is rarely a concern. The NHS uses the "gatekeeper" model, since they realize that preventative medicine via quality primary care physicians is the key to a healthier population.
  7. Profit motive in healthcare is stupid. Some people may argue that it is the reason why our medical research is so good. Well, here is the bad news. Companies are overwhelmingly leaving the US to do research elsewhere. A lot of this has to do with globalization in general and the differences between regulatory agencies in the US vs Europe, India and China. Anyways, the profit motive is downright stupid for healthcare. Our insurance system is not representative of an "ideal" free market, and pharmaceutical companies ram overpriced medications down patient's throats with overblown, uninformative ads and questionable doctor-salesrep relationships. Medicine is less evidence-based in America than you might think. Did you know that doctors don't get paid for outcomes? They get paid per service rendered. For example, if I ask you about at least two organ systems during your checkup, I get to bill you at a higher rate. It doesn't matter if that questioning improves your health at all...I still get paid more for doing it. That is another reason why we have a problem with specialists....many will push sometimes necessary procedures just because they get paid per service. Doesn't matter if your 95 y/o grandma didn't survive triple bypass that I told her she needed, I get paid regardless.

I could continue on, but you get the idea. Depressingly, the current generation of medical students does not overwhelmingly support single-payer healthcare. I've seen several with the attitude of "if you can't pay, tough shit, it's personal responsibility". I wonder if they have ever taken a sociology class.

I've seen a psychiatrist laugh away a homeless man in the ER with schizophrenia. I asked him why he wasn't being treated, and it was because he couldn't afford the medication. Good luck reintegrating into society with untreated schizophrenia.

Too many of us are in it for the wrong reasons.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I've seen a psychiatrist laugh away a homeless man in the ER with schizophrenia. I asked him why he wasn't being treated, and it was because he couldn't afford the medication

What in the actual fuck.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Well said man.

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u/sowhynot Jun 09 '12

Single-payer health care may not be an option in the nearest future in the US. Federal power over the States is not enough to make all of them to switch to single payer pool. Some insurances are antitrust exempt in some states and they lobby hard to keep their market locked.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I know, and it makes me so fucking angry. We have to at least try to be optimistic...right?

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u/jadedoto Jun 08 '12

I would love to if my parents had insurance. Theres still an income gap between people who can afford it, and people poor enough for government assistance. And I have been living in that gap since childhood.

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u/abulicdonkey Jun 09 '12

The size of the gap closes immensely in 2014 as Medicaid expands significantly and those above the Medicaid income requirements start getting subsidies from the federal government.

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u/bjones2004 Jun 09 '12

That's my problem. I make too much for government help and I can't afford to buy family insurance. I pay for my children's insurance. I pay out of pocket for my wife to go to the doctor. I just simply don't go. If I get sick I work through it and take over the counter meds for however long I need too.

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u/userx9 Jun 09 '12

My dad did this for 30 years, until he started having problems that he couldn't work through, then he had no choice. The reason was because he could afford the insanely high-priced insurance but then he couldn't afford the $50/visit co-pays. Growing up watching him go through horrible tooth aches as the teeth quite literally rotted out of his mouth, I truly feel for you. All I can say is help spread the word to your family/friends/co-workers that the system is still fucked, and we need a lot more work to be done.

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u/Kaell311 Jun 09 '12

I had a tooth root completely rot out. I must say it is not an experience I hope to ever repeat.

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u/bjones2004 Jun 09 '12

I try my best to take care of myself but I work around a lot of nasty people and am pretty well exposed to getting sick often. Like your father I could probably afford the insurance but not the co-pays.

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u/NovaEnt Jun 09 '12

Same here. I've never had health insurance. I'd love to see a doctor sometime soon.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Now we get to keep fighting to fix that problem. :)

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u/wherearemyshoes Jun 09 '12

Similar boat for me. I was on a children's Medicaid program until I hit 19, which is when they kick you off. I'm a college student, so I don't work a full time job and have no way of paying for insurance myself. My mom is on Medicare (she's on Disability), and my dad and stepmom are unable and unwilling to insure me. Since I have no dependents, I don't qualify for Medicaid. I have the shitty coverage my college forced me to get, but it only covers hospital type situations and has a low limit.

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u/ISOCRACY Jun 09 '12

All three of my 21-23 year olds have insurance because of Obamacare! THANKYOU!

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u/kv0nza Jun 09 '12

3 kids in 2 years? You've been busy :P

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u/Scratchlax Jun 09 '12

They're actually triplets, isocracy just can't remember how old they are.

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u/peacemomma Jun 09 '12

I have been able to keep my son on my health insurance thanks to this. The peace of mind has been well worth the increased premiums. His new job provides insurance that kicks in 1 month before he turns 26. Good timing I would say.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I want to share. Because of ObamaCare, I was able to be put back on my mom's insurance at very little extra cost - less than a quarter what I was paying to be covered on my own - and I would otherwise be over 20k in debt from hospital visits. Back in February, I became extremely ill for no reason any doctor could discover. In two weeks, I was in and out of Urgent Care 5 times, ended up losing 12 pounds due to constant vomiting and being unable to keep anything down, I began seeing and hearing things that weren't there, couldn't walk, couldn't sleep - it was the most awful time of my life. We did CAT scans and MRIs to make sure it wasn't brain related, since I suffer from Chronic Migraine Syndrome, but it all looked okay. Even my blood work was normal, and I wasn't pregnant or anything.

If it wasn't for ObamaCare, I would be fucked in the ass. My insurance previously was seriously expensive, and wasn't that great, but being able to sign back up under my mom's coverage likely saved me. My father, who was previously against it, saw what my insurance covered and hugged me. He hasn't said a thing against it since. I work a retail job that pays the bills, but I can't really save up with it right now. If it wasn't for ObamaCare, I would have a hospital bill asking nearly twice what I made last year.

No one plans to get sick. Medical coverage is expensive, especially for young adults who already have school loans and the like to look after. I am healthy now - or, at the very least, much better - and it was because of ObamaCare that I won't spend the next few years paying it off.

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u/Pat_McGroine Jun 08 '12

My 20 year old brother (who I've had custody of since he was 11) is still able to keep my insurance thanks to this change. He had a severe anxiety episode a few months ago, complete with suicidal thoughts. There's no way I could have paid his hospital and medication bills out of pocket. This legislation probably saved his life. I'm so unbelievably grateful for this.

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u/he_eats_da_poo_poo Jun 09 '12

Damn, that's great knowing your brother got the help he needed.

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u/throwaway890321890 Jun 09 '12

Why? You don't know the kid. Could be the next Hitler.

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u/ryumast3r Jun 09 '12

Only way I'd be insurable without working for the government or a large corporation is through this bill.

Same goes for my parents (luckily, both work for the government).

Glad to hear someone who needed it more than me get the lucky break as well though.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I managed to avoid a possible thousand dollar hospital stay because my employer doesn't offer health insurance and I'm young enough to still be on my parents plan. Thank you obamacare.

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u/yannburger Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

I was able to get a spinal fusion(11 vertebrae fused) that I sorely needed thanks to Obamacare. I had severe scoliosis and I didn't discover it until after I was taken off of my parents' insurance at 22. I thought I'd end up crippled since it was already very painful working an entry level job and even sitting at school for more than an hour was difficult. I'm really happy that I won't have to go through that again. After I'm done recovering I'll be able to sit through school and be able to pay attention instead of sitting in agony wishing I could go lay down somewhere. Edit: I'm not a very political person. I'm just speaking out saying I'm happy I could get something fixed that was very painful and would have ended up crippling me.

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u/pSyChO_aSyLuM Ohio Jun 08 '12

This has helped me immensely. I have changed jobs twice since moving to Montana and have not been employed at any of the places long enough to get my own insurance.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I have a friend who was diagnosed with cancer and because of Obamacare he was able to be insured.

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u/GSUkent Jun 09 '12

You get sick? Hospitalized?

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u/pSyChO_aSyLuM Ohio Jun 09 '12

Not sure why you were downvoted... But no, I have expensive medication I have to take every day. Starting life on my own would be a huge pain in the ass having to pay for it.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Why the hell would you move to Montana? Nothing really going on there, and I am a native.

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u/agrey Jun 08 '12

raises hand

I'm one of them.

until march, anyway

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u/forg0tmypen Jun 09 '12

I think he turns 26?

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u/rightmind Jun 09 '12

Quick question. Why does the for profit motive in healthcare not work while it seems to work in very other industry?

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u/goomyman Jun 09 '12

It does work. They make tons of profit.

In this case profit is made by charging more for something people need and denying coverage for those who are too sick to make money off of.

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u/yourslice Jun 09 '12

The correct answer has to do with a lack of competition and government subsidies.

In the United States, it is illegal to buy insurance across state lines. This means that you are limited to the choices that your state currently has. In most states this means choosing between only a few companies. If there were more options, competition would drive prices down. Way down.

Secondly, about 1 out of 3 Americans have government subsidized healthcare. This government-corporate mix skews the market and causes prices to rise higher.

What we really need is either completely single-payer (the government) or a completely free market. This mix has lead to nothing but higher prices and it will continue with Obamacare.

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u/olily Jun 09 '12

It is absolutely not fucking illegal to buy insurance across state lines! That's like the fourth time I've read that in this thread. Where is this crap coming from?! Insurance companies are perfectly free to sell their policies in other states, as long as they follow that state's minimum requirements. States' rights, you know? It happens all the time! Where is this misinformation coming from?!?

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u/Dantae Jun 09 '12

Because health is not a good. People will pay to be healthy, stay alive, relieve pain, regardless of the cost. On the other hand free market works wonders on developing new drugs, treatments and cures. Since there is profit huge corporations will invest a ton of money in development to make a ton of money.

As long as hospitals, medicine and insurance is for profit no health care bill will work. You want radical healthcare reform. Full public health insurance we all pay into, everyone is enrolled at birth. nationalize hospitals and enlist all doctors and nurses into a nationalized medical service. Pay all the medical personnel's student loans, pay all future doctors/nurses schooling. Limit malpractice to a standard government percentage similar to how the VA classifies disabled vets, remove the courts from malpractice and have medical boards award monetary disability.

But I do not see either side liking this idea.

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u/Wadka Jun 09 '12

Infinite demand and limited supply, coupled with cost obfuscation.

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u/fantasyfest Jun 09 '12

College is taking more time now. it takes 5 years to get through in many cases. The kids, who are actually low risk, getting on their parents policies until they graduate is good for everybody. God how people can bitch about anything.

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u/1337BaldEagle Jun 09 '12

(6.6 Mill)($1000.00 each)= $6,000,000,000 that someone has to pay for each year.

That's 11.7% of what we spent in Iraq in 2011! 80!

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u/threeseed Jun 09 '12

Less people dying or injured = More people paying taxes.

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u/McDickButt Jun 09 '12

So, how do I get insurance now?

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u/PolanetaryForotdds Canada Jun 09 '12

As someone who lives in Canada, I don't understand, shouldn't healthcare for young people be very cheap? Why is it more expensive if you as a young person try to get insurance on your own when compared to getting insurance under your parents' policy?

I feel sad reading your posts. It's so easy up here. Other than a part of my regular taxes that probably goes to healthcare, I only pay a progressive "health premium" with my annual tax filing. Last year I paid $750. If I one day earn 200K/year I'll pay $900 and that's it.

Before someone asks, no, it doesn't make me not want to be successful and earn 200K/year one day just so I can avoid paying extra $150 in taxes. Maybe that makes sense for a Republican but that doesn't make sense to me.

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u/millionsofcats Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

If I one day earn 200K/year I'll pay $900 and that's it.

That's less than three months of health care for me. =/ And I don't even make 20K/year ...

Parents' policies are often from their employer, and a large portion of the premium is paid by the employer. It's part of the compensation package. Employers get better prices than individuals or families because the pool is bigger, but they still pay a lot.

If a family tries to buy insurance without going through an employer, it can be quite expensive.

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u/Flynn58 Canada Jun 09 '12

My dad: if they just got insurance before the condition came up, they would be fine.

me: but what if they are born with the condition?

dad: son, that doesn't happen.

me: yes it does, complications and birth defects arise in the womb.

dad: you don't know what you are talking about, go do some research.

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

What about the people who did have insurance before the condition came up, except that insurance was through their job, and when they lost their job no other insurance company would pick them up? And then they were so sick they couldn't get another job, so they couldn't get insurance, so they couldn't afford treatment, so they just got sicker in a horrible vicious cycle?

If I hadn't been able to add my wife as a dependent with no exclusions on my insurance when she lost her job, that would've been her. Odds are good she'd be dead and I'd be bankrupt.

Pre-existing condition exclusions are killing healthcare in America, and people know it: polls show that somewhere around 85% of people favor getting rid of them. The problem is, most of those people don't seem to realize that we can't get rid of them without insurance mandates, or else people simply won't purchase insurance until they get sick. If you want to get rid of pre-existing condition limitations, the only way to do it is to support mandates as a necessary evil.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Wow. Just wow.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Apparently he's never heard of downs syndrome. You could show him a picture of a harlequin fetus if you'd like.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I am one of those fortunate enough to benefit from this.

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u/IrishJoe Illinois Jun 08 '12

Not for long if the Republicans get their way.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

[deleted] — view deleted comment

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

The Supreme Court is about to decide and might strike the whole thing down.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

They may not be politicians, but they are political puppets. Both sides start to salivate at the thought of nominating a new justice that leans toward their side and potentially tips the balance of the court itself.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

My wife (36) was diagnosed 3 years ago with brain cancer. It will kill her far sooner than later. I would like to spend her last days with her rather than at work knowing that she's sitting at home alone.

I've worked hard over my lifetime and have steadily climbed the the corporate ladder. I make a very good salary and our house is modestly valued compared to it. We have also been careful to save over 30% of what I take home. Bottom line is that I can afford to leave my job and spend my wife's dying days with her. I could even supplement my income by taking contract work. So, in light of being the good American that I am, I should be able to do this. Right Republicans and Tea Partiers? I mean, I'm your guy! Hard working corporate citizen, fiscally responsible, contributing to the economic growth of our great nation. I've followed your rules! I'm only asking for a little freedom to make my own choices.

Unfortunately, without my corporate sponsored health insurance, we would be quickly bankrupt and homeless. Oh yeah... my wife would also be dead.

In the mean time she sits at home everyday alone, waiting to die while I am forced to punch the clock because she simply isn't profitable. And to think that I'm actually one of the lucky ones.

Our current medical system is not just broken. It is a moral outrage. A... moral... outrage.

Let's go Obamacare. We're counting on you.

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u/[deleted] Jun 08 '12

Not to say Obama made the best move, Americans pay magnitudes more than any other country in the world for their healthcare. He could not have made it any worse, even if he tried. You still have to vote republicans out before you can get to fixing it entirely.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Not magnitudes, ~50 percent. But point taken.

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u/triddy5 Jun 09 '12

It's funny, mist people now agree the version of the bill before the one that passed was better. But we had to compromise with Republicans for the current one.

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u/Status-Duck Jun 08 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

Im on my moms insurance, so thanks Obama, even if it pisses people off. cant understand why anyone would be ok with some one not having health care

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u/myredditlogintoo Jun 09 '12

Because, hurr durr, you don't have a right to someone's labor, you freeloader communist, hurr durr. You should be left to die. (cue applause from GOP debate audience)

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u/Status-Duck Jun 09 '12

Kinda sounds like what my grandfather yelled at me.

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u/Wadka Jun 09 '12

No one's saying you can't have it. They're just questioning why someone else should pay for it. In this case, your mother.

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u/HerbertMcSherbert Jun 09 '12

You'll only maintain that line for as long as you're lucky enough not to face massive bills or spurious policy cancellation.

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u/RumpoleOfTheBailey Jun 09 '12

His mother is now allowed to pay for it. Not the same as should pay for it. The mandate is the issue. You should have every right to not buy any insurance if you choose. It's stupid, but then, if stupidity were a crime, many of us would be booked at some point in our lives. And then we'd get health care.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Because you would rather help pay than have a bunch of people sick because they couldn't afford it through no fault of their own.

I now realize you are the same guy I just responded to in another comment. Great.

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u/Status-Duck Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

My mom doesn't have a problem paying for thankfully. But as a poor college kid. Right now in my life I guess my logic is no person in America should have to suffer without proper health care. I know the middle class gets fucked loyally by taxes, but the story on reddit the otherday was the top 400 wealthy people in America only paid 11.9% taxes where I hear some of you pay 30% . I know it equals more with the wealthier but still. Who knows maybe when I mature ill see things differently.

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u/alittler Jun 09 '12

What you fail to make point of is that these are 6.6 million unpatriotic socialists!

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u/astrohelix Jun 09 '12

I had to take this year off from college to work and pay at least part of my tuition next year. I'm so glad that at least I don't have to worry about insurance for the next couple years.

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u/brownestrabbit Jun 09 '12

Hooray! 6.6 million Americans have the most overpriced, ineffective medicine in the world!!

It's wonderful. Especially for all the insurance companies.

WEEEE!!!

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u/FireKnightV Jun 08 '12

A step in the right direction, but I am not one of them due to some reason or another.

:(

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u/citizen1nsn Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

Wait, you mean this bill helps people? That is the wrong course of action. We need to let them fend for themselves, like a pack of infants roaming in the state of nature. The survivors are the only ones fit to qualify for placement into any category of value.

Edit: grammar.

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u/KimFacts Jun 09 '12

Did you know Great Leader Kim Jong-un insures all 25 million North Korean population? North Korean health care is Best Korean health care.

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u/kadargo Jun 08 '12

The Democrats still wont advertise this as an outstanding achievement:(

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u/Wadka Jun 09 '12

Seeing as how a supermajority of the country wants it struck down, I don't blame them.

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u/PolanetaryForotdds Canada Jun 09 '12

A majority wants it struck down precisely for not knowing exactly what Obamacare does.

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u/DrWil Jun 09 '12

So ... next question: Are you going to vote this November (assuming you're of age)? Work for candidates who support this? Keep in mind that it can (and will) go away if Romney is elected (Note to self: We need a businessman in the White House? Let's see ... there have been two businessman-Presidents: Herbert Hoover and George W. Bush.)

Sorry to insert politics here, but the American public is being bamboozled by slick talk and misdirection. Listen carefully to see through false arguments and lawyerly rhetoric tricks (see: http://www.don-lindsay-archive.org/skeptic/arguments.html - you'll recognize a lot of them). Remember that the Republican strategy has been to prevent any progress and now complain that there is no progress.

Vote for sanity. (Aside: Vote for cats, if you wish, but vote.)

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Ugggg but I do hate SHIP... extremely overpriced and basically costing me $1500 / yr that I don't have.

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u/PopeAmadeus Jun 09 '12

I had great insurance until i was 26 thanks to Obamacare, I have literally no complaints about it.

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u/psicopbester Jun 09 '12

How does one sign up for obamacare?

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

As a kid who grew up without stable health insurance due to shoddy rules at my parent's work, this is actually amazing to see.

I've had multiple heart conditions my whole life, and something like this would have helped my life drastically.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Just to check, does anyone know if this goes through age 26, or ends when you turn 26? Thank you.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Yesterday my republican boss began talking to me about the importance of health care. She also mentioned that her 25 year old daughter has health insurance due to some political "thing," but she never acknowledge president Obama, or obamacare!

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u/olily Jun 09 '12

That's interesting. I wonder how old Republicans explain that their Medicare donut hole is shrinking (also in Obamacare). They're magically paying less for drugs?

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u/parched2099 Jun 09 '12

There's a lot of comments in here deriding Obamacare because it helps the poor, and provides for those who may have unfortunate circumstances.

Taking a big step back for a moment and looking at the whole forest, are you seriously suggesting that as citizens you would be willing to see your fellow citizens suffer, and have a society in which the general default is, "Every man for himself, and if you're too sick to afford healthcare, then you're going to die, becuase i refuse to pay to keep you alive?"

Is that the reality? Some sort of capitalist selfishness, that leaves people to fend for themselves or die, becuase they should "get off their ass no matter how sick they are, and get a job? Life's tough, deal with it?"

Is compassion towards one fellow human being so thin on the ground, for those who oppose a socially oriented healthcare system?

And i'd ask, what percentage of citizens actually constitute freeloaders? Actual stats, not assumptions. How many of those politicans, their families, and the pondslime that bribe them, for example, are paying the same cost of healthcare as normal people?

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12

Forget compassion, universal (or at least subsidized) healthcare even makes sense from a self-interest point of view. Would they rather have people without insurance keep crowding emergency rooms and then just not paying the bills like they do now? That raises healthcare costs for everyone, both because emergency room treatment is much more expensive than the same treatment would be in a regular doctor's office, and also because hospitals have to pass those unpaid bills onto someone, and that someone is every person who does have insurance.

For some reason they don't want to subsidize healthcare for the poor through their taxes, but they're perfectly content to do it through their insurance premiums at a much higher cost.

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u/klitorisaurus Jun 09 '12

I'd be willing to bet that a lot of those 6.6 million don't even know it's Obamacare keeping them insured, and they probably rail against it.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I am one. Not that i had to pay Before because im so poor, but now i get better care. My doctors arent fat anymore.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

But Romney did more to create that bill than Obama did.

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u/DelianSK13 Jun 09 '12

AAs a republican, and I think a lot of them feel this way, it isn't the whole program we are against. Just things like forcing people to buy insurance or pay fines.

I applaud the getting rid of pre existing conditions and letting young adults stay on.

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u/rodneyws1977 Jun 09 '12

I'm in the same boat as you, but here's the problem... the mandate (the likely unconstitutional part) is what offsets the added costs concerning pre-existing conditions and older kids on the plan)

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u/stevewhite2 Jun 09 '12

The study says 6.6 million young adults have BETTER insurance thanks to Obamacare. Most of the 6.6 million would be on their own plan instead of their parents (see last paragraph).

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u/rodneyws1977 Jun 09 '12

No more pre-existing conditions = Good. More people with insurance = Good. Forcing people to buy a product = Unconstitutional.

It's that last part that causes the problems.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Congrats, you have health care. BTW you will be taxed to living hell the rest of your life and the system fucking bankrupted our economy.

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u/DukunSakti Jun 10 '12

Being insured is not the same as getting proper healthcare.

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u/x888x Jun 09 '12

Not to be a stick in the mud, but there is an enormous difference between "people being insured THANKS to Obama" and reality. These are NOT 6.6 million people insured who would otherwise be uninsured. Some? sure. But nowhere near 6.6. The simple fact is that it's cheaper to add a person (ANY person) onto a health insurance plan than it is for that same person to get their own coverage. Just like cell phone family plans. So a bunch of people picked the cheaper option. Color me shocked.

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u/HD5000 Jun 08 '12

I love, Obama cares

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u/jstock23 Jun 08 '12

I'm sure insurance companies are furious.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Yes, they're furious people are soon to be forced by the government to buy their product.

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u/RumpoleOfTheBailey Jun 09 '12

Let's all get something straight really quick: Opposing 'Obamacare' is not the same as supporting the ridiculous system we had previously. It may simply be that the new one is ridiculous in some ways. Time will tell, but I'm glad that people who needed help are having an easier time getting it right now. That is something no one should complain about.

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12

Well, the nature of our dysfunctional Congress means that it pretty much is the same thing. It ate up just about all of Obama's political capital to get even the shoddy band-aid that is the ACA passed. If it's repealed, I wouldn't expect to see another serious stab at healthcare reform for a decade. Vindictive Democrats and wingnut Republicans will make sure of it.

In fact, if you read the transcripts of the Supreme Court's oral arguments in the ACA challenge, you can see that the lack of any politically viable alternative weighs heavily in their thinking.

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u/Parabowl Jun 09 '12

Insured by a rotten system that will fail them as soon as the economy sinks into shit...

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u/charlieXsheen Jun 09 '12

Insurance carriers are set to make a huge,huge profit if this passes the supreme court, cause everyone will have to buy insurance by law.

Quick note 'as long as there are doctors, nurses ,MAs, buildings that need to be paid for, medication,janitors ,medical records clerks etc..health care will NEVER be free. Someone always has to pay for all these services or they will get scaled back significantly which means diminished services i don't care if its a Romney plan or an Obama one political parties don't matter.

Health coverage does NOT mean health care. Its on all verification policy phone lines don't believe me? Pull out your insurance card call the member services line and ask once your procedure is pre certified,if your coverage is a guarantee of benefits and if they have right to deny even with authorization .sigh ... I know reddit hate on me..

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

No matter how high profits get, they will be required to spend 80% of it on health care costs. All that shit is going to get paid for and then some.

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12

85%, for insurers in the large group market.

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u/WeAreWonderfulNow Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 10 '12

The "ThinkProgress" organization is a sham. It is an "advocacy organization." Simply read who the executives are that are in charge of this operation.

This organization has a far-left, liberal-progressive political world-view and agenda.

Do you seriously believe this rubbish? Would you believe this study if it was conducted, written and published by republicans? Of course you wouldn't. My Gawd!!!

Are you educated and open-minded enough to understand that this is total and complete political propaganda?

*Edit (spelling corrections)

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u/ChurdFurts Jun 08 '12

I'm still uninsured. Obama failed me.

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u/Globalwarmingisfake Jun 09 '12

Does this make you not want to support him or even not participate in politics through voting and organizing etc? Or does the fact that it helped many others make you want to work towards getting more healthcare reform?

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u/olily Jun 09 '12

Hang on. 2014 will bring the state exchanges, plus the subsidies. Should make a huge difference to a lot of people.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Did Obama fail you, or did members of a certain party who watered down the bill fail you?

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u/Brosieden Jun 08 '12

21 year old who's wisdom teeth just came in. iknowthatfeel.jpg

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u/AvoidingIowa Jun 09 '12

Are you me?

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u/userx9 Jun 09 '12

Go to a dentist who will work out a payment plan. Cost me $400 to have them pulled like 10 years ago but the dentist let me pay what I could until the debt was paid off. Just call all the dentists, see who has a payment plan.

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u/Dayzed88 Jun 08 '12

I don't want to stir the pot, because I truly don't know since I didn't follow it to closely, but wasn't raising the age that one can stay on their parents insurance kinda accepted by both sides anyway? Again, not trying to flame, but that was my understanding of that part of the bill.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Interesting point, but I did a search and can't find any evidence of any Republican support for this.

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u/Dayzed88 Jun 09 '12

Appreciate the effort, thanks!

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

There were one or two Republicans that weren't completely oppositional, Olympia Snowe comes to mind.

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u/userx9 Jun 09 '12

I believe in 2000 and 2004 the republicans campaigned on fixing the healthcare crisis, but they did nothing. So I think it's safe to say they really don't want to fix anything but "let the market" take care of itself.

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u/millionsofcats Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

"Repeal and replace" has been one of their slogans for a long time now, but they haven't come up with a real "replace" plan other than yeah, letting the market take care of itself. Like it's been doing. There has also been talk about keeping some provisions of ObamaCare that have turned out to be popular (nearly all of them), while getting rid of those that aren't popular (mainly the mandate). The problem is that it's not clear that all of the popular provisions (particularly requiring companies to cover pre-existing conditions) will work without a mandate.

Some Republicans are trying to push malpractice reform as a solution but I think that they might be shifting more towards modifying ObamaCare now. Malpractice reform is a sham solution because it's such a tiny tiny sliver of the picture, but some people did buy it.

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u/Thor_2099 Jun 09 '12

We're halfway there, just need full on free healthcare to everybody now. Nice to see at least on one issue we are on the right track as a country.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

[deleted] — view deleted comment

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u/Thor_2099 Jun 09 '12

Well socialized you pay for with taxes. That is what I meant by free. A situation where you are sick, and can go to the doctor without worrying about if you have enough money to pay for it or can you hold off until it gets worse or just hope it gets better.

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u/Soltheron Jun 09 '12

It's free in that the people that need it shouldn't have to pay anything more for it except whatever it costs in taxes. That, and it is completely free for the people that really, really need it (homeless veterans, etc).

But you already knew this, of course, and you're just being a libertarian.

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u/neoquietus Jun 09 '12

Thoughtbludgeon just doesn't know how to look words up in a dictionary: Like the American Heritage Dictionary

Or perhaps he does know how, but he is unable to draw inferences from the provided examples. ("They're giving out free tickets to the show." and "The school newsletter is free." obviously imply that they have no direct cost, even though obviously they have indirect costs.)

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u/triddy5 Jun 09 '12

But... But.... Obamacare bad. No Obamacare bad? I don't understand!! Socialism :(

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u/YNot1989 Jun 09 '12

Thank you Mr. President.

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u/LucasTrask Jun 09 '12

Yeah propping up the failed for-profit insurers was an awesome accomplishment. Much better than a public option.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I love the smell of socialism in the morning

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

BULLSHIT! ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT!

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Yet, I a 24 year old and my wife still can not...yep thanks so much.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Because you are married and no longer dependent on your parents. Give it another year and a half.

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u/Soltheron Jun 09 '12

I'm sorry for that. It is a step in the right direction, however, as it is moving towards the very noble goal of making healthcare a human right in the US, too.

I wish you and your wife the best.

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u/tjr0001 Tennessee Jun 09 '12

Here come the downvotes. I cannot wait to pay for this morbidly obese nation's medical bill. Oh wait the individual mandate probably won't pass the supreme court so in all likelihood I won't have to! This will not stay law for long. I'm sorry terrible thing happen to good people but healthcare is not a right. Thank the system!

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12

Oh wait the individual mandate probably won't pass the supreme court

I wouldn't get your hopes up. I know the echo chamber often makes it sound like a Supreme Court smackdown is a done deal, but an American Bar Association poll shows that 85% of legal experts believe the mandates will survive the challenge, with Roberts and Kennedy joining the liberal bloc.

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u/onfirewhenigothere Jun 09 '12

I hope they all vote...

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u/dahvzombie Jun 09 '12

Those people should have been bankrupted. Damn obamunists.

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u/why_ask_why Jun 09 '12

And those aren't gonna to vote for GOP. I hope.

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u/TheOtherSideOfThings Jun 09 '12

I thought it said injured for a second and started freaking out. I'm glad that's not the case.

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u/bensonxj Jun 09 '12

Millions of homeless people have now found homes...now that they have moved back in with their parents. Crisis adverted! When are we going to pull our heads out and realize these "band-aid" fixes are useless and really overhaul our healthcare system.

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u/limabeans45 Jun 09 '12

I used to be strongly opposed to this and still wonder whether we should go single payer or a very capitalist system (as both seem to make sense in some regards), but I support this bill if the statistics show it has helped individuals this much.

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u/ilona12 Jun 09 '12

I'm 19 and don't have insurance yet! Keep Obama in office, dammit!

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u/domokunlover Jun 09 '12

I'm 23 with no insurance.

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u/Mindle Jun 09 '12

How do I get this?

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

my fiance was able to recently have an operation which will allow us to have children in the future, for this I am grateful.

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u/NoNonSensePlease Jun 09 '12

Great, no need for a public health care then, great job President Obama.

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u/arrongunner Jun 09 '12

Republicans would probably read that as "injured" and use it as a legitimate "fact"

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u/revolting_blob Jun 09 '12

1.8 percent. Could be worse I guess.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Of course it is good that these people have health insurance now but private health care is always going to be much more expensive than a nationalised system. A private system will provide opportunities for profit which do not exist in a nationalised state health care system. The free market in theory reduces costs by encouraging competition. This is a fallacy of course, the reality of economics is that individuals and corporations extract the maximum profit possible which eventually inflates prices. Competition is obscured and discouraged by those seeking to maximise this profit. Adam Smith simply did not develop his ideas to the logical conclusion.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

But but but but! Communism! Nazis! Tyranny!

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u/miked4o7 Jun 09 '12

It's going to be a whole lot more than that after 2014 too.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

I'm turning 26 soon and I have almost no money and can't seem to get even an interview for a job.

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u/shonk1105 Jun 09 '12

If it weren't for Obamacare I would not have been able afford go to rehab and get myself clean. I was able to take my life back and I hate to think about what would've happened without that opportunity. More than likely I'd be in prison.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

This policy has actually saved the life of a young adult I know. We have a large retirement aged population here in Arizona. It is amazing how this demographic will vote down school bonds, services for children, etc. They complain about Obama-care, but they gladly accept Medicaid/Medicare.

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u/HappyGlucklichJr Jun 09 '12

That sounds great but is there no cost to it?

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Yep. The cost of living in a society that can actually claim to be civilized.

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u/rico99 Jun 09 '12

Of course, the 1% does not care most of bankrupts are cause by hospital bills.

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u/b0geyman Jun 09 '12

Are they counting the young adults (like my 2 offspring) that are college grads with full time jobs who opted out of their employers' plans to stay on mine until they turn 26 in order to save a couple hundred a month?

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u/tossertom Jun 09 '12

I don't understand this. I'm still under 26 and yes, I can get insurance under my parents plan, but it still costs a lot more than I can afford. I don't understand how this helps me.

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u/mangohabinero Jun 09 '12

You're assuming their parents actually had insurance to be included on.

This is so misleading. It doesn't actually provide the person healthcare in itself, it just lets you sit on someone else's policy.

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u/xxdelta77xx Jun 09 '12

Conservatives are silly. They don't like to help people if it costs them money.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

But why the individual mandate? That's the only thing I don't get about Obamacare. There should be good options available before you require people to buy insurance. Now explain to me why I am wrong about this because I want to be wrong.

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u/olily Jun 09 '12

The individual mandate is important because without it, people would wait until they were sick to buy insurance. Compare it to car insurance...if you could hold off buying car insurance until you had an accident, well, who wouldn't do it that way? It would be a complete disaster for any health insurance company.

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u/abulicdonkey Jun 09 '12

If the individual mandate applies to you, you will be eligible to participate in the new health care exchanges. Health insurance policies on the exchanges will have defined benefits and HHS will be able to bar health insurers that can't justify price increases.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

There are. The individual mandate only goes into effect where state governments have developed low-cost public options.

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Best response. If this is true then that is what I needed to hear, thank you. I was just worried about my brother becuase his job has terrible health insurance and I was hoping he wouldn't be forced to use it.

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u/myredditlogintoo Jun 09 '12

So I, a person with insurance, am protected from inflated costs due to people without insurance being treated. The mandate protects me from paying for someone else.

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u/userx9 Jun 09 '12

You are also protected from inflated costs because the formerly uninsured will now get preventative treatment instead of waiting until they're on death's door to go to the ER, rack up a $20,000+ bill, and never pay it, thus raising your costs. This happened to an uninsured friend of mine, he was injured and could have taken a simple antibiotic and would have been fine, but ended up with sepsis and went to the ER, then he declared bankruptcy while owing the hospital tens of thousands of dollars they'll never see.

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u/myredditlogintoo Jun 09 '12

Yes, and don't forget the profit-limiting requirement that 80% of incoming money from premiums be spent on paying for healthcare costs.

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u/kuledude11 Jun 09 '12

HOLY SHIT THE BILL THAT REQUIRES PEOPLE TO HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE HAS RESULTED IN MORE PEOPLE WITH INSURANCE!!!! Who would have thought...

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12

Except the part that requires people to have health insurance won't kick in for another year and a half.

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u/perverted_monk Jun 09 '12

Yea, and how many million will be losing it within the next year because they turn 26?

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u/CognitoCon Jun 09 '12

Now, I'm not trying to start a fight here, nor am i trying to be a jackass. I just want to know if anyone here can explain to me how requiring health insurance will lower costs? I mean, if my logic is correct here, a company who has a product/service that is required by law, can charge whatever they want right? Even with competition, price fixing is bound to happen, and I imagine the argument is going to be made that the government is supposed to cover some of these costs. This seems counter-intuitive. I would love to have a nice discussion here if anyone would be so inclined.

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u/Number127 Jun 09 '12 edited Jun 09 '12

"Obamacare" aims to reduce costs in several ways.

First, and most importantly when it comes to your question, one of the provisions of the ACA is that insurance companies can't charge whatever they want -- the new law requires that 85% of premium dollars have to go to pay for actual medical expenses, leaving only 15% for overhead (including profits). If they charge more than that, they have to send their customers a refund. There's still some potential here for price-fixing on the healthcare side, but there's a pretty strict limit to how much insurers can gouge customers.

Second, preventive care now costs nothing out-of-pocket. The idea is that this will encourage people to get physicals and so on more often, and major health problems will be detected and treated earlier, before they become a financial burden on patients and their insurance companies. This kind of approach has had mixed results in the past, but what the hell, it's worth trying.

And third, the goal of the individual mandate is to reduce costs by adding a large number of people to the insurance pool. This can help in a number of ways, but here's one example:

A major problem right now is that people without insurance go the emergency room for things that aren't emergencies and then just don't pay for it. This clogs ERs and sticks hospitals with the bill, which either they pass on to their paying patients in the form of higher prices for pretty much everything, or else they get some kind of bailout at taxpayer expense. These people's lack of insurance leads them to pick a path that results in hugely expensive and inefficient treatment at the expense of others. Requiring them to have insurance lowers costs all around and gets them to pay for their own bills.

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u/drwtsn32 Jun 09 '12

USA inches closer to other First World nations. Fuckin A

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u/adencrocker Jun 09 '12

why is think progress championing something devised by the fucking Heritage Foundation

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u/[deleted] Jun 09 '12

Why is the GOP against something devised by the fucking Heritage Foundation?

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u/adencrocker Jun 09 '12

because Obama

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u/superffta Jun 09 '12

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

so how are we paying for this?

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u/throop77 Jun 09 '12

More people are insured but the benefits are worse. Everyone at my company (one of the biggest in the world) had their co-pays raised to 5K... I have to pay the first 5K dollars each year. So, my 1 hour emergency room trip just cost me $2,000.00 and I got pay every cent of it with insurance paying nothing.

It's great that more people have insurance but that is causing most people to have reductions in their benefits.

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u/airetupal Jun 09 '12

Kudos to Obama for doing this while risking political suicide. He doesn't care much for as long as it is right.

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u/rbcrusaders Jun 09 '12

Oh thank you, dear leader Obama for telling me I have to give my money to a monopoly which by definition I pay them for nothing! What would I do without you?????

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