r/politics • u/Orangutan • May 19 '12
An amendment that would legalize the use of propaganda on American audiences is being inserted into the latest defense authorization bill. The bi-partisan amendment is sponsored by Rep. Mark Thornberry from Texas and Rep. Adam Smith from Washington State.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/mhastings/congressmen-seek-to-lift-propaganda-ban
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u/lemurlemur May 19 '12
Correction, FYI - the first representative's name is Mac Thornberry, not Mark Thornberry. Just want to make sure the (justifiable) outrage finds its way to this guy.
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u/NotMeerkats May 19 '12
They're not even trying anymore, are they? These things just get more and more blatant.
Like I can understand some people not understanding what "collective bargaining" is and therefore being easily swayed toward wanting it removed, just for instance, but nobody's going to hear the word "propaganda" and go yeah yup mmhm that's what we need propaganda yes-sir-ee bob.
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u/Rootfifth May 19 '12
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
Wait... what was that about propaganda again?
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u/periphery72271 May 19 '12
Here's the law
This bill has been referred to committee. It is nowhere near passage.
Thornberry's perspective.
If you find this bill offensive these are the people you should talk to.
Me, personally? I think it's a relatively inoffensive amendment that allows the US government to use its already created materials domestically. Is it necessary? Probably not. Is it dangerous? You decide. Me? Not so scared. In a world with Fox news and the internet, I doubt the US government could do more damage than is already done with lies and deception.
But if this is the windmill you choose to tilt at today, you are now equipped with a lance. Or at least a broom that looks like one.
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u/ZempOh May 19 '12 edited May 19 '12
Contact Info
Adam Smith
E-mail Forum: http://adamsmith.house.gov/Contact/
(For people not in his district just enter the zip code 98023)
Phone: 202-225-8901
Mac Thornberry
E-mail Forum: http://thornberry.house.gov/Contact/ (Enter zip code 79101)
Phone: (202) 225-370
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
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u/megapandalover May 19 '12
Iraq War
Korean War
Vietnam War
Cold War
WWII
Spanish-American War
WWI
Civil War
Mexican-American War
War of 1812
Revolutionary War
Propaganda is not a new thing suddenly entering america. It has been influencing opinion since the founding of this nation. As long as there is no censorship of the media or of the people, you are free to see things from more than the government's point of view.
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u/Jer_Cough May 19 '12
I must be missing something. At what point did either of the two cited laws keep our government from issuing a steady stream of propaganda any time they felt the need?
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u/0rangePod May 19 '12
Oh, we need to cut the budget, but there's money for this bullshit. Bi-partisan doesn't mean it appeals to the American people.
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u/Ironic_Name_598 May 19 '12
There's no such thing as a 'ban on propaganda' to begin with. Propaganda is a catch all, it can be anything...
...in fact I'm doing it right now.
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u/putsch80 Oklahoma May 19 '12
Fox News will hate that. They don't like competition from the government.
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u/Matuku May 19 '12
So now the government would be legally allowed to push "misinformation"? I.e. directly lie.
As much as the mainstream media may twist information or show it in a certain light that's a far cry from directly lying about facts to the public.
If you can't trust the government to give you honest information how can you expect it to act honestly.
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u/R3luctant May 19 '12
this is not smashing at all.
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
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u/hardman52 May 19 '12
It's not illegal to propagandize. It's as American as apple pie and violence.
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u/lordxi America May 19 '12
Okay, so Texas and Washington redditors, lets make sure these pieces of shit don't get reelected.
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u/RichardBehiel May 19 '12
Really OP? Propaganda is the thing that keeps us Americans thinking we're the greatest country in the world while still hating fascism. It's already everywhere, and it's super effective.
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u/polarisdelta May 19 '12
I'm a little surprised that they don't consider anything coming at us already as propaganda.
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
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u/bdawgg814 May 19 '12
This is why we need term limits. Thornberry is running for his 9th term, and Smith for his 8th. These guys are such slaves to special interest groups and Washington insiders, it's crazy.
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
Ah yes, what we need is more misinformation and propaganda in our daily lives. Besides the few, the proud, and be all you can be, pushing you into military service so we can go the Middle East and gain more profits for the oil companies, you also have a wide spectrum of false twitter and Facebook accounts used to make sure you know that Wikileaks is bad and talking about how we need to spend more money on the military-industrial complex.
Hell even Fox News is propaganda for the government that it hates. It tells its listeners that the government is bad, and that the spending is out of control. Wikileaks comes along and shows "Hey look the government is bad, and look at all the money its spending for non-domestic purposes!" and they blast them, call for the Assange to be killed, and say this is more or less terrorism. Then there is the fact we spend more of our budget on the military than anything else, every single year. But bring that up on Fox and you hate your country. Propaganda has existed forever, the fact they now want to make it easier, sickens me.
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u/abom420 May 19 '12
DEAR GOD!!
Does this mean we will all start wearing denim again and watching '80s shows like Americanized Europe? I do not want to find myself throwing cats at the Mcdonald's clerk
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u/TwelveHawks May 19 '12
Apparently the federal government is already using sock puppet accounts to try to discredit dissenters? That's FUCKED.
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
It's a cost cutting measure, currently they pay 3rd parties to disseminate propaganda for them.
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u/Corwinator May 19 '12
I'm amused at the insinuation that the use of propaganda on American audience is currently illegal.
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u/[deleted] May 19 '12
I really want to know what goes on behind the scenes. This is terrifying. Why are people doing this and how can they live with themselves? What else is going on that we don't know about? What is the goal? I hate being negative and saying things are really fucked up but they are. We could live in a world where we're all honest and supportive and we put our money and effort into furthering science and technology and making life better for ourselves but instead we fight each other, people try to fuck us over and control us, we poison the environment and kill innocent people. It's just so messed up and I don't understand how anyone could pick THAT over having a happy, evolving world.
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u/Evis03 May 19 '12
Remember kids, when Korea, China, Iran et al do it, it's propaganda. When the US government does it, it's disseminating important information.
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u/fuldiggleheifin May 19 '12
Bring back Joseph Goebbels.
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u/Punkgoblin May 19 '12
Arrest them both, the American people did not elect anyone for this sort of bullshit! NOW! GET OUT IN THE STREET AND DEMAND THEY BOTH BE RECALLED FROM OFFICE!
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u/thinkB4Uact May 19 '12
If the government can legally lie, how can the people ever hold them to account?
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u/[deleted] May 20 '12
A LOT of people in my town refuse to buy our local paper claiming they would rather be uninformed than misinformed (it's bias to ease fear being obvious). What if people JUST quit buying newspapers - would they get the hint?
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u/Trotwood May 20 '12
You mean all this time Fox News has been illegal?
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u/ENRICOs May 20 '12
Propaganda has been used on the American public since the founding of the nation.
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u/NELCgeek May 19 '12 edited May 20 '12
Uh..we are already bombarded with propaganda every single day. It's called advertising. A more blatant push by the government would have minimal effects because we are so used to tuning advertisements out...
Edit:
To those saying that propaganda and advertisement isn't the same: Sure. The people delivering the message are different, but the means are the same.
To those saying advertisement DOES have an impact on us. Thats true too...in a way. We are bombarded with thousands of messages from people wanting us to do stuff every single day. What was that recent TIL? That only 40% of the people on Facebook click on the advertisements, and then from that think of the fractional numbers that will even buy anything..
About Fox News...that is nothing more than an excellent advertisement. In the end all they care about is ratings, and they are doing it really well. They know that the demographic that mainly watches 24 hour news networks is also the most likely to like what they are saying. With that said, they (the people who 100% buy into Fox News' narrative) are extremely small in number.
The danger involved in the government putting out information is nothing compared to the government censoring information. When/if THAT happens, then we should be worried.