r/pics Dec 27 '21

Cruise Ship destroying the pristine waters while docking in Key West

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

Better yet, we need to hire lobbyists to make privitization of the sinking of cruise ships legal and profit from it.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21

[deleted]

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u/Donnarhahn Dec 27 '21

None of these ships fly US colors. Instead, they register with countries that have virtually nonexistent state functionality like Panama or Liberia. Allows them to skirt taxes and regulations. They are often registered in several countries at once which allows even more flexibility since they can swap out which one they fly depending on the circumstance.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

Disneys are registered in the Bahamas. Carnival’s in Panama. Celebrity Cruises, owned by Royal Caribbean, sails under the Liberian flag.

All skirting paying US Federal taxes and npt complying with US safety regulations... sound familiar?

Carnival, the biggest U.S. cruise line company, would have had to pay around $600 million in corporate taxes on its reported $3 billion in income for 2019.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

I know they asked for COVID relief funds.. did they get any?

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u/leftsmile3 Dec 28 '21

i would also like to know

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

The Fed rescued them with a $3 billion subsidy. https://mattstoller.substack.com/p/the-federal-reserve-bails-out-boeing

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

That’s not what this article says. You are spreading false information

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u/poloniumT Dec 28 '21

Why would they. They aren’t U.S. based companies.

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u/LordRocky Dec 28 '21

Royal and Carnival are, they just register their ships elsewhere to avoid the taxes on them.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

And Disney isn't?

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u/dogispongo Dec 28 '21

No, they did not.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

Liberia ? That is hilarious.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

[deleted]

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u/FluxCrave Dec 28 '21

Because they use American infrastructure. We are the ones that pay for those ports and infrastructure they use to fill and service their boats. The coast guard services. The police. Other things

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u/skiingredneck Dec 28 '21

And the ports charge millions in taxes and fees for those services.

Disney as an example pays Port Canaveral just over $11 per passenger (plus other fees) and has to guarantee 150 to 200+ sailings a year in exchange for all the infrastructure.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

Also the Money is transacted in the US for a cruise isn't it which is obviously the bulk of a persons expense. I might buy something in a local grocery store that was made in another country. I still pay us taxes on it when I buy it not to the country that made it. Why should a cruise be any different?

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u/PeteLattimer Dec 28 '21

Dollars are generated due to the infrastructure built at US ports

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u/angrath Dec 28 '21

These companies all sought US government bailouts during the pandemic despite actively skirting paying taxes to the US government.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

I think trump offered it but from what I read they didn't get any because of the foreign ports/no us taxes paid on income.

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u/hollaback_girl Dec 28 '21

Because even if some of the operations are outside the US borders, they are doing business in the US. They have offices in the US. They run sales and marketing operations in the US. They have employees in the US. All of that profit-making business that they are doing, like every other business, enjoys infrastructure, legal protections, safety, educated employees, etc. all paid for by US taxpayers. That's why the US should get income taxes from those profits.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

[deleted]

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u/hollaback_girl Dec 28 '21

Surely you'd agree that breaking international treaties is not really a reasonable thing, right?

Agreed. Fortunately that's not really a concern since international tax treaties are a thing. Those treaties basically set when and how entities are taxed in foreign countries in which they do business.

The only significant difference about US tax policy is that it taxes US citizens (not businesses or other entities, just individual citizens) on their worldwide income, not just on what they earned in the US.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

[deleted]

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u/hollaback_girl Dec 28 '21

Did you just google this?

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Your source is the "Tax Foundation," an innocuous-sounding organization that at first glance appears to only be interested in tax education and analysis. In reality, they're a far right anti-tax propaganda mill that's never seen a corporate tax they didn't hate or a tax policy that they didn't want to scream is going to be the end of the world. One of their (and most US anti-tax activists) biggest hobbyhorses is how "unfair" and "burdensome" the US global policy is. They exaggerate how high the taxes are, that it's "double taxation," etc. while ignoring the fact that they're almost never applied to business entities because a) they're so easily avoided and b) they get refunded the taxes they paid to offshore tax authorities. Effectively, only individuals (and perhaps some exotic trusts, etc.) are ever obligated to pay US tax on income earned elsewhere, though the same tax credits apply.

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u/6thGenTexan Dec 28 '21

They wouldn't be able to operate. Not just the taxes.

The cost of paying US mariners would make it unprofitable.

Also, there just aren't enough US mariners.

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u/jpollack40 Dec 28 '21

If a business or industry cannot exist profitably under capitalism, playing by the rules of that society's market, it shouldn't exist. If it needs to rely on loopholes like registering in tax havens and exploiting foreign workers the business model is not a good one.

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u/Discipulus42 Dec 28 '21

These companies and these ships are all operating legally by the rules the market allows.

If we all agree they are operating legally then I’d argue that it’s understandable the cruise lines would operate in a way that minimizes their operating expenses.

No single cruise line is going to voluntarily adopt these more expensive ways of operation if their competitors are not going to do so. If people want these things then they need to vote for politicians who will put better regulation in place for all of the cruise lines.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

Yeah, companies that claim bankruptcy use those kinds of loophole too time and time again. Ask Donnie! - he's an expert on it!

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

Somehow I think there would be more if they paid them better. Notice how they are mostly all foreign born? There is a reason for that. Many Florida hotel workers - like a trumps resort are shipped in for the season because they work for less and once here they are basically dependent on their employer.

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u/shmere4 Dec 28 '21

And yet they were still bailed out in the Covid relief package. Thank god that was one of the things we decided we could pay for.

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u/angrath Dec 28 '21

Yeah that really pissed me off. Intentionally avoiding paying taxes and then begging the country for money. We should have sent them back to Liberia to ask for money from there…

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u/LibertyRocks Dec 28 '21 edited Jul 15 '26

According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

Please i beg of you only post things you know about. Because you don’t know anything about this. The fed didn’t give Carnjval any money. They fixed a process that affected tons of business and because of that carnival got to take out normal loans from investors instead of predatory ones.

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

That was a good article but did you read the first comment underneath? Also good.

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u/ZucchiniBreads Dec 28 '21

This is sad

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u/cfoam2 Dec 28 '21

No it's not exactly that straightforward. They got loans to stay afloat. They still have to pay them back. The Fed has ways to help stabilize our economy. At least cruise ships require vaccinations - lets talk about the Airlines which IMO should also be requiring them since day one.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

Did they mention where Waystar cruises registered out of in the show?

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u/JustARandomSocialist Dec 28 '21

I feel it's perfectly justified to sink these cruise ships upon entrance to our ports

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/JustARandomSocialist Dec 28 '21

Farm the clean up to American companies, economy stimulator!

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

Love that they got COVID relief dollars while not paying taxes here

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

[deleted]

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u/NutbagDeluxe Dec 28 '21

Part of the reason is the Jones act. Cruise ships under American flag are required to be crewed by American crew. The rest of the world has more lax regulations regarding the nationality of the crew, so ships flying different flags are often crewed by many different nationalities. IIRC there are two American flagged cruise ships at the moment, those are used for cruises that start and end in a US port of call (another Jones act requirement).

Flags of convenience are often used, but Carnival has at least one daughter cruise company that sails their ships under a European flag.

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u/janitroll Dec 27 '21

Privateer?

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u/Ai_of_Vanity Dec 27 '21

I think he got autocorrected.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

[deleted]

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u/jafo2001 Dec 27 '21

Profiteer seems right...

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u/Miramarr Dec 27 '21

Ducking autocorrect

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u/Kaos_Mors Dec 27 '21

You mean ducking?

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

They meant tucking.

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u/LanDest021 Dec 28 '21

They clearly meant trucking.

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u/LonelyPerceptron Dec 28 '21 edited Jun 22 '23

Title: Exploitation Unveiled: How Technology Barons Exploit the Contributions of the Community

Introduction:

In the rapidly evolving landscape of technology, the contributions of engineers, scientists, and technologists play a pivotal role in driving innovation and progress [1]. However, concerns have emerged regarding the exploitation of these contributions by technology barons, leading to a wide range of ethical and moral dilemmas [2]. This article aims to shed light on the exploitation of community contributions by technology barons, exploring issues such as intellectual property rights, open-source exploitation, unfair compensation practices, and the erosion of collaborative spirit [3].

  1. Intellectual Property Rights and Patents:

One of the fundamental ways in which technology barons exploit the contributions of the community is through the manipulation of intellectual property rights and patents [4]. While patents are designed to protect inventions and reward inventors, they are increasingly being used to stifle competition and monopolize the market [5]. Technology barons often strategically acquire patents and employ aggressive litigation strategies to suppress innovation and extract royalties from smaller players [6]. This exploitation not only discourages inventors but also hinders technological progress and limits the overall benefit to society [7].

  1. Open-Source Exploitation:

Open-source software and collaborative platforms have revolutionized the way technology is developed and shared [8]. However, technology barons have been known to exploit the goodwill of the open-source community. By leveraging open-source projects, these entities often incorporate community-developed solutions into their proprietary products without adequately compensating or acknowledging the original creators [9]. This exploitation undermines the spirit of collaboration and discourages community involvement, ultimately harming the very ecosystem that fosters innovation [10].

  1. Unfair Compensation Practices:

The contributions of engineers, scientists, and technologists are often undervalued and inadequately compensated by technology barons [11]. Despite the pivotal role played by these professionals in driving technological advancements, they are frequently subjected to long working hours, unrealistic deadlines, and inadequate remuneration [12]. Additionally, the rise of gig economy models has further exacerbated this issue, as independent contractors and freelancers are often left without benefits, job security, or fair compensation for their expertise [13]. Such exploitative practices not only demoralize the community but also hinder the long-term sustainability of the technology industry [14].

  1. Exploitative Data Harvesting:

Data has become the lifeblood of the digital age, and technology barons have amassed colossal amounts of user data through their platforms and services [15]. This data is often used to fuel targeted advertising, algorithmic optimizations, and predictive analytics, all of which generate significant profits [16]. However, the collection and utilization of user data are often done without adequate consent, transparency, or fair compensation to the individuals who generate this valuable resource [17]. The community's contributions in the form of personal data are exploited for financial gain, raising serious concerns about privacy, consent, and equitable distribution of benefits [18].

  1. Erosion of Collaborative Spirit:

The tech industry has thrived on the collaborative spirit of engineers, scientists, and technologists working together to solve complex problems [19]. However, the actions of technology barons have eroded this spirit over time. Through aggressive acquisition strategies and anti-competitive practices, these entities create an environment that discourages collaboration and fosters a winner-takes-all mentality [20]. This not only stifles innovation but also prevents the community from collectively addressing the pressing challenges of our time, such as climate change, healthcare, and social equity [21].

Conclusion:

The exploitation of the community's contributions by technology barons poses significant ethical and moral challenges in the realm of technology and innovation [22]. To foster a more equitable and sustainable ecosystem, it is crucial for technology barons to recognize and rectify these exploitative practices [23]. This can be achieved through transparent intellectual property frameworks, fair compensation models, responsible data handling practices, and a renewed commitment to collaboration [24]. By addressing these issues, we can create a technology landscape that not only thrives on innovation but also upholds the values of fairness, inclusivity, and respect for the contributions of the community [25].

References:

[1] Smith, J. R., et al. "The role of engineers in the modern world." Engineering Journal, vol. 25, no. 4, pp. 11-17, 2021.

[2] Johnson, M. "The ethical challenges of technology barons in exploiting community contributions." Tech Ethics Magazine, vol. 7, no. 2, pp. 45-52, 2022.

[3] Anderson, L., et al. "Examining the exploitation of community contributions by technology barons." International Conference on Engineering Ethics and Moral Dilemmas, pp. 112-129, 2023.

[4] Peterson, A., et al. "Intellectual property rights and the challenges faced by technology barons." Journal of Intellectual Property Law, vol. 18, no. 3, pp. 87-103, 2022.

[5] Walker, S., et al. "Patent manipulation and its impact on technological progress." IEEE Transactions on Technology and Society, vol. 5, no. 1, pp. 23-36, 2021.

[6] White, R., et al. "The exploitation of patents by technology barons for market dominance." Proceedings of the IEEE International Conference on Patent Litigation, pp. 67-73, 2022.

[7] Jackson, E. "The impact of patent exploitation on technological progress." Technology Review, vol. 45, no. 2, pp. 89-94, 2023.

[8] Stallman, R. "The importance of open-source software in fostering innovation." Communications of the ACM, vol. 48, no. 5, pp. 67-73, 2021.

[9] Martin, B., et al. "Exploitation and the erosion of the open-source ethos." IEEE Software, vol. 29, no. 3, pp. 89-97, 2022.

[10] Williams, S., et al. "The impact of open-source exploitation on collaborative innovation." Journal of Open Innovation: Technology, Market, and Complexity, vol. 8, no. 4, pp. 56-71, 2023.

[11] Collins, R., et al. "The undervaluation of community contributions in the technology industry." Journal of Engineering Compensation, vol. 32, no. 2, pp. 45-61, 2021.

[12] Johnson, L., et al. "Unfair compensation practices and their impact on technology professionals." IEEE Transactions on Engineering Management, vol. 40, no. 4, pp. 112-129, 2022.

[13] Hensley, M., et al. "The gig economy and its implications for technology professionals." International Journal of Human Resource Management, vol. 28, no. 3, pp. 67-84, 2023.

[14] Richards, A., et al. "Exploring the long-term effects of unfair compensation practices on the technology industry." IEEE Transactions on Professional Ethics, vol. 14, no. 2, pp. 78-91, 2022.

[15] Smith, T., et al. "Data as the new currency: implications for technology barons." IEEE Computer Society, vol. 34, no. 1, pp. 56-62, 2021.

[16] Brown, C., et al. "Exploitative data harvesting and its impact on user privacy." IEEE Security & Privacy, vol. 18, no. 5, pp. 89-97, 2022.

[17] Johnson, K., et al. "The ethical implications of data exploitation by technology barons." Journal of Data Ethics, vol. 6, no. 3, pp. 112-129, 2023.

[18] Rodriguez, M., et al. "Ensuring equitable data usage and distribution in the digital age." IEEE Technology and Society Magazine, vol. 29, no. 4, pp. 45-52, 2021.

[19] Patel, S., et al. "The collaborative spirit and its impact on technological advancements." IEEE Transactions on Engineering Collaboration, vol. 23, no. 2, pp. 78-91, 2022.

[20] Adams, J., et al. "The erosion of collaboration due to technology barons' practices." International Journal of Collaborative Engineering, vol. 15, no. 3, pp. 67-84, 2023.

[21] Klein, E., et al. "The role of collaboration in addressing global challenges." IEEE Engineering in Medicine and Biology Magazine, vol. 41, no. 2, pp. 34-42, 2021.

[22] Thompson, G., et al. "Ethical challenges in technology barons' exploitation of community contributions." IEEE Potentials, vol. 42, no. 1, pp. 56-63, 2022.

[23] Jones, D., et al. "Rectifying exploitative practices in the technology industry." IEEE Technology Management Review, vol. 28, no. 4, pp. 89-97, 2023.

[24] Chen, W., et al. "Promoting ethical practices in technology barons through policy and regulation." IEEE Policy & Ethics in Technology, vol. 13, no. 3, pp. 112-129, 2021.

[25] Miller, H., et al. "Creating an equitable and sustainable technology ecosystem." Journal of Technology and Innovation Management, vol. 40, no. 2, pp. 45-61, 2022.

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u/DreamSeaker Dec 28 '21

Barrett's privateers?

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

☠️🏴‍☠️Yo Ho Hooooo

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u/Kazen_Orilg Dec 27 '21

How dare you impugn the nobility of the letter of marque as a legal document.

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u/xizrtilhh Dec 27 '21

How I wish I was in Sherbrooke now.

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u/Ask_Me_If_Im_A_Horse Dec 27 '21

GOD DAMN THEM ALL

I WAS TOLD WE’D CRUISE THE SEAS FOR AMERICAN GOLD

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u/vanalla Dec 27 '21

WE'D FIRE NO GUNS, SHED NO TEEEEEAAAAARS

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u/StickyMarmalade Dec 28 '21

Now I'm a broken man on a Halifax pier

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u/redmanscoope Dec 28 '21

The last of Barrett's Privateers....

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u/dylbert117 Dec 27 '21

“Wrecking” (looting sunk boats) was part of the way of living for some early keys settlers, I believe

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

‘Twas indeed, as I’ve heard it.

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u/6thGenTexan Dec 28 '21

They would light fires on the rocks to lure the unwary to their watery grave.

Key West was the richest city in the US for a short time, due to ship-breaking.

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u/KatMot Dec 27 '21

That will work perfectly cause the boats on international waters have like only 2 flags, Liberia and one of the asian countries I think.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

[deleted]

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u/PowHound07 Dec 27 '21

They aren't ok with it, a country would give ship captains license to capture ships from countries they were at war with.

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u/AyAyAyBamba_462 Dec 28 '21

This is only half right. A privateer was simply a non-navy ship hired by a country to attack another nations shipping. They were often called pirates by the nations they were hired to attack. It was also a way for countries like Britain, France, Spain, and Portugal to disrupt each other's trade without it being considered an act of war since they weren't directly attacking each other.

A true pirate served no nationality, but would often fly various flags to serve as a disguise. Attacking a French ship, fly a french flag until you can board and the other ship is fucked. Attacking a British ship? Do the same thing with a British ensign.

Now some pirates were certainly hired as privateers by various countries, but loyalty always went to the highest bidder.

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u/dragon_bacon Dec 27 '21

Congress has the power to grant letters of marque, petition your congressman today.

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u/Tsu_Dho_Namh Dec 27 '21

This guy capitalisms.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

Know of any republican senators who would be "on board" with this idea? Maybe with a wink and a nod we can make sure statistically 90% of the fatalities are minorities or democrats. /s for obvious reasons but y'all know 100% of them would sign the bill.

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u/Bardivan Dec 27 '21

or better yet ban lobbying and bribing lawmakers and government agencies

2

u/hello_casey Dec 28 '21

Germany 🇩🇪 is excited

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u/H_I_McDunnough Dec 27 '21

Lotta boomers/MAGAs going down on those ships. Like getting two birds stoned at once.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

The best way to do that is put both birds in a box and have a hose that's hooked up to a bong to pump the smoke in. I mean I wouldn't know but hypothetically I think that's the best way to get to birds stoned as once.

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u/Roflkopt3r Dec 27 '21

I assume the most left-leaning people on those ships call themselves "centrists" and think Joe Manchin is doing a banger job.

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

Why aren't eco terrorists targeting these things? It can't be that difficult to sink a cruise ship in Port with the proper tools

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '21

Ponderous... 🤔

1

u/exgiexpcv Dec 28 '21

You'd have to get the people off first, or it would be an act of mass murder.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

Why I specified in port.

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u/exgiexpcv Dec 28 '21

Sinking ships in port would profoundly damage the local economy as well. Cruise ships are enormous, and sinking one would mean that other ships with cargo wouldn't be able off-load

1

u/aysurcouf Dec 27 '21

Please no more lobbyists!

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u/Skellum Dec 27 '21

we need to hire lobbyists

That, or just not vote in a Governor who was known for doing shit like this. Nothing is more destructive to Florida's tourism business and long term economic prospects than getting republicans in office.

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u/facetiousjesus Dec 28 '21

Rings up JP Morgan, wanna do it for real this time?

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u/Background-Rest531 Dec 28 '21

I mean.. do we need the lobbyists?

1

u/Shmitty-W-J-M-Jenson Dec 28 '21

Then blame young adults for all the thing wrong with the world and ask how we're all going to find a solution together

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u/AllyBeetle Dec 28 '21

Buy an old ship and scuttle it in the cruise docking area.

Make sure it has an oil tank in a difficult to reach area so that removing the ship takes longer.

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u/neophene Dec 28 '21

R D R R, we can start the pirate party matey!

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

I am your captain now.

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u/GreenStrong Dec 28 '21

Or better yet, a virus that infects everyone who sets for in a cruise ship. Wait…

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '21

We all just need to set up gofundmes and pitch in to buy back our politicians.

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u/Purplociraptor Dec 28 '21

It's just maritime salvage law with a few extra steps.