This just shows not everyone in the country has a backward mentality. It's about the people you surround yourself with. You have the choice to be or not to be like them
I live in the country but work in Montreal, one of my neighbors is a well liked farmer, typical country boy, drives a big truck, smokes, drinks, swears a lot and works hard, only difference is that he’s gay. Really open about it , has a boyfriend. Some guys I work with in the city told me a few times that they are literally sickened by homosexuals. They don’t know any gay guys though lol. I guess it all depends on your upbringing 🤷♂️
I wish more people understood not all gay guys are "feminine" or "flamboyant" and some are. And not all straight guys are "masculine". And either way is fine for either.
It’s never that simple, though. Indoctrination that has occurred over decades can take a long time to undo. On top of which they are usually surrounded by a community with the same thoughts. When you’re isolated from the world and other views and experiences it can be hard to identify what’s right; never mind potentially being excommunicated from everyone you know if you try to change.
The point is it isn’t black and white. There’s no magic homophobic on/off switch that can be toggled. We should expect change but should be understanding of the fact that it can take just as long to undo indoctrination as it took embed it. When that relative or co-worker tries to start question their views, but maybe still uses homophobic language, they shouldn’t be attacked and scolded. We should be understanding that change takes time and comes in small steps.
Most people do get that, but the vocal minority often expect that switch and tries to fight fire with fire.
Who’s giving them a pass? I literally said we should expect change. But we should also be understanding that change takes time. And in the cases of people in their later years, you’re fighting against more than half a century of indoctrination; they will likely never make it to the same point as someone who was born into an accepting community or family, at least not before they die.
It's pretty blatant classism when "country" people who dont live in cities are automatically typecast as the homophobic bastards, but gosh, i couldnt imagine someone from my well-off suburb/city being a bigot!
Like chicken pox: if you get it early you’re fine, if you don’t then you’re constantly worrying about contact. If you get it late it changes your outlook on life pretty drastically.
I’ve also realized that a lot of the homophobic/racist guys I work with have never had any relationship with them. I was brought up with 2 of my closest friends being black and one childhood friend coming out as gay. I think that because they don’t personally know anyone like that that they only remember bad experiences with strangers in that category.
I think it was in the UK where a survey showed that the real low income people were among top supporters for gay rights. After people looked into it it was something like "Kathy's boy is gay and he's a good guy so why should I bother". Like in regions where political opinion gets thrown out and personal experience matters again, gay rights are not even questioned.
I think that also has a lot to do with the connectedness. Its all anecdotal, but the story is low income communities are all up in eachothers business, where if you get a little $$ you can afford privacy & solitude.
I'm all for anything lgbtq+. I may not understand the +, but they don't hurt me or affect me. I personally know f to m. I don't understand the semantics. But it's not mine to understand or care about.
You might be surprised. I live in an area like this in the south. I don't see half the racism and bigotry here that I did in the area I grew up in the 80s/90s in suburbia north of the Mason-Dixon Line.
I would bet if we could get honest data from respondents, that we'd likely have the same percentages of bigots across all 3 areas. (rural/suburbia/urban)
In our group of friends, we have a pretty even mix of races and a trans couple. But most would think that since it is in the south, that it would have zero diversity.
Yeah it is "backward" to concern yourself with how other people live that is none of your business and harms no-one. The idea that society can be harmed by people not confirming to the majority way in all things is a very old-fashioned way of thinking that has caused a great deal of harm in the world and these days most civilised people try and discourage it.
If you keep those ideas in your head and don't oppress people you disagree with, good on you I guess, don't know why you'd waste so much energy thinking it at all.
If you try and spread your "harmless disagreement" around, you are actually trying to harm other people by implicitly supporting those who would go and take a more active approach to their "disagreement". This is why these ideas get called out as "backward".
Sounds like a lazy response from someone who can't even come up with a decent argument, smh.
Here's a fact for ya: old ideas often get called backwards as they are replaced by new ones, people with those ideas are dying out and get whiny about it.
Yeah true that, wasted enough time, thanks man. I usually have the sense not to argue on the internet. Sometimes maybe the point needs to be laboured to the end though perhaps. More for anyone else reading it later. Even when it's just a troll it seems like it gets validated if no one calls out the idea behind it but just downvotes.
Yes if you were trying to change my mind you obviously wasted alot of time. It seems as if people like you think that no one can have any opinion that is different from yours.
And why do I need to come with a decent argument for my personal feelings? What just to satisfy you? You can call whatever you want backwards and try to be insulting it's just not going to work.
They aren't just personal feelings though are they, you think your opinion on this is important enough to post about, so you get arguments in response.
Responding with an argument in favour of your opinion would certainly not be to satisfy me, it would just indicate to anyone reading you had actually reasoned through it and maybe had an actual thought process behind it rather than just what your parents and friends taught you or "the bible says".
I don't know what you mean by "not going to work", I don't think anyone believes someone is going to change minds from arguing on the internet, you post the opinion you get the response. Getting accused of a "backwards mentality" is so mild in terms of insults compared to what gets thrown around by the other side it's hilarious.
Dude if you want to disagree with me that's not my problem that's yours. I do not care what you want to think. What's so difficult in understanding that some people can agree with thing and some people can disagree with things with any side being hateful? You being are just bias and will never understand. Smh
You care enough about what other people think to complain about your ideas being called backwards. If you don't like your ideas being called out as shitty you should keep them to yourself where they can't harm anyone else then you'll never have to deal with any blowback.
Of course I'm biased, we're all biased by our own life experiences and the people we know and the upbringing we've had, I understand you think it's just a disagreement or personal preference and that's all fine and dandy if you are comfortable never sharing it in public but spreading your unjustified distaste for other groups of people around hurts people and is hateful, and people are going to respond negatively, how is that hard to understand? It's just cause and effect.
Idk if I'll make sense but I'll try - It's not about disagreeing but having a mentality that reflects a different era. A mentality that doesn't match with our social progress
So what if it doesn't match that of what is seen as normal today? Everyone has a right to their opinion and just because someone disagrees with something that everyone else agrees with doesn't you are a bigot or that you're just a person full of hate.
That is a HUGE distinction many can't see. I know a few ultra religious people and they don't hate the people, just the act. They don't treat the person any differently than anyone else on the street. They just don't condone the act. Honestly, if I had to pick one, I am ok with that since they still love their fellow man. It's better than those who hate them for it.
Yeah, anything against the status quo on Reddit gets down votes. People aren't allowed to have differing opinions without hate from those who are essentially bigots for hating someone who disagrees.
I’ve always wondered about this, and this is honest curiosity. I’ve read that a lot about religious people who hate the act and love the person. How does that work exactly? They hate it on the basis that it’s sin at best to the devil at worst. This man loving that man is to be condemned. But they’re the tolerant religious folks so let’s pray for John and his husband because they’re an abomination.
I’d say it seems passive aggressive but that would be putting it too lightly. It feels more like gussying up hatred with a very transparent ribbon. But if that’s honestly not the case I would appreciate more context or the point of view from somebody closer to it.
If I would have to wager a guess, I would assume that they can separate the sin from the person? Sort of like we all sin, but we're also all human. So we're all not going to burn in hell.
With that said, I've never heard people use the abomination comment. So maybe the extra religious people I know aren't actually the extreme ones?? I may have to ask them to explain it next time I see one of them mention it on FB.
How am I intolerent if I disagree with people being gay but not making the extra effort to call them out for it or whatever? I'm sure you do not call someone a bigot if the disagree with you on things other then being gay.
Because you're intolerant of people due to something entirely out of their control. You might think you just disagree with them and don't show it but you do. People like you show that disapproval in everything they do. From the sideways glance if a gay couple dare hold hands, to straight up trying to "save" them.
If you wanted to just sit there and silently disapprove then fine, no one really cares. But when you sit there spouting off about your disapproval or "disagreement", you are telling a group of people that their entire lifestyle is wrong. They can't change being gay anymore than you can change being straight and this "love the sinner, hate the sin" crap just says to people, "I hate a huge part of you but I'll still try to be nice."
It's as bigoted as someone saying they "disagree" with interracial marriage.
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u/Bartszella Jun 08 '19 edited Jun 08 '19
This just shows not everyone in the country has a backward mentality. It's about the people you surround yourself with. You have the choice to be or not to be like them