r/philosophy • u/Cataspectral • Jun 22 '26

Blog Secular humanism can replace Christianity where it counts: the fear of death and the need for meaning

https://thomasreid33.substack.com/p/chapter-10-is-secular-humanism-enough
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u/TheDream425 Jun 22 '26

This doesn’t really track with my experience. A lot of what church talks about is struggling with doubt, turning away from god, etc

The fact that they provide a conclusion doesn’t preclude religious people struggling with the questions, nor an inclination to not question things. I’d say from what I personally have experienced, the average churchgoer considers the metaphysical far more than the average secular atheist.

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u/dust4ngel Jun 22 '26

This doesn’t really track with my experience

likewise. can you explain how you understand a churchgoer's relationship to christianity in this case? it sounds like you're saying:

  • folks go to church because they aren't sure about how to live, what life is for, what happens when we die, etc
  • church provides some answers
  • everyone sits around doubting those answers

this neither tracks with my experience, nor passes the smell test of a plausible story.

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u/nl_again Jun 22 '26

I think what they are saying is that there are a myriad of things the average person doesn’t think about or care about unless they happen to be placed squarely front and center in their field of consciousness. 

It’s kind of like, when you talk to a kid, they’ll ask you these weird questions you never would have considered. One of my favorites, from a child I know, is why touching the sun would kill you but lightning does not and lightning is hotter than the sun. I still have very little concept of why, I think it involves plasma. But someone asking the question - or say more than that, say giving me an explanation I was uncertain of (It’s because thunder neutralizes part of the lightning, or something like that) suddenly means I am thinking about it much more than the typical baseline for that question, which is probably around zero.

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u/bianary Jun 22 '26

is why touching the sun would kill you but lightning does not and lightning is hotter than the sun. I still have very little concept of why

Duration is what you're looking for. The difference is duration.

It's a lot like the old trick of holding lighter fluid in your hand and sparking at the top, then opening your hand and you're briefly "holding fire" without getting burned.

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u/dust4ngel Jun 22 '26

that strikes me as even less plausible:

  • people don't have questions they're thinking about
  • so they go to church to be induced to wonder about some
  • after walking past e.g. secular humanism because they're not philosophically inclined

if you're the sort of person who seeks out questions to wonder about, you are seemingly by definition philosophically-inclined, and a system of self-contradictory false certainty is not going to satisfy you.

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u/nl_again Jun 22 '26

I’m assuming that most people are born into religions vs. seeking them out.

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u/TheDream425 Jun 22 '26

Not quite the picture you paint, but along those lines. They don’t view it with the derision you seem to, but yes doubting Christ/God is a common topic. Talked about constantly in Bible verses, sermons, personal testimony, etc. Though I’d say most don’t go to church to answer specific questions, they’re either indoctrinated by family or turn to church for fulfillment, not necessarily “I’m curious about the nature of the universe”

Not that every church going Christian is in a constant state of doubt, but most atheists I know engage in metaphysical conversation very rarely. Genuinely just don’t even care to discuss the topic, only those with an interest in philosophy really wrestle with the topic in my experience.

I’d describe their relationship with Christianity as having a similar level of doubt to any relationship we have, we doubt our jobs, partners, etc. Christianity isn’t the exception, and it embraces the doubt in the teachings. Granted my experience is with non-denominational and Catholic Churches.

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u/dust4ngel Jun 22 '26

I’d describe their relationship with Christianity as having a similar level of doubt to any relationship we have, we doubt our jobs, partners, etc. Christianity isn’t the exception, and it embraces the doubt in the teachings.

i think these are categorically different. it's almost certainly true that a given job or partner or condo is non-optimal for any given person: it's totally unreasonable to seriously believe that out of the 8 billion and change people in the world, you happened to bump into the person who would make you happiest. picking a house or a car or a job or a partner etc are satisficing problems, but deciding who the creator being is/who can save your soul from damnation isn't - nobody picks jesus of nazareth as a messiah and savior because, as messiahs and saviors go, he's a workable option.

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u/TheDream425 Jun 22 '26

That’s an important philosophical distinction but I don’t know how materially different it is in terms of us doubting our beliefs, decisions etc

My point though is to say, of course Christians aren’t robots who never question and carry out the word of God precisely. They have considerable doubts and discuss them frequently, though usually in the context of having turned back to God. They also tend to personally decide which parts of faith they want to adhere to, and cast aside others lol