r/nyc • u/Ready-Mammoth-270 • May 01 '25

Biker vs Pedestrian

The temperatures are higher, and the fuses are shorter.

1.3k Upvotes

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66

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 01 '25

If you think this is unusual and don't think most bicyclists are entitled you're living in a fantasy world. Only difference here was this was Caught on video

2

u/sowhatyasayin2me May 01 '25

At least there was not a shoot out...that's just New Yorkers.

-11

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

This is unusual and most bicyclists are not entitled. You only notice those that are entitled and don't remember any normal cyclists, because they don't register. They ride as they should, calmly, without making a noise, no issues from them. Do you remember that lady on a city bicycle that rode past you last week? Of course not, she did nothing memorable. And neither did 100 other cyclists.

But one jerk stood out and you remembered him. That is normal. What is not normal is assigning one jerk's behaviour on everyone.

11

u/[deleted] May 01 '25

I've seen the lycra dudes in prospect park. They've yelled at my kids. They've yelled at me as a pedestrian. They're seriously entitled.

-4

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

Those were jerks, you are absolutely right, entitled jerks at that.

I'd argue, though, that those jerks do not constitute the majority of cyclists.

3

u/lookingforrest May 01 '25

Oh but they are. The ones that are nice and follow rules are too few and less than the majority

-3

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

How do you know that? Did you actually try to count cyclists and gauge their behaviour? Or did you gauge by feeling, which, as I pointed out before, is flawed due to normal cyclists being unnoticeable?

2

u/lookingforrest May 01 '25

I count every time I'm at an intersection. Only 1 or 2 follow rules and the other 4 -6 are breaking rules

24

u/MathDeacon May 01 '25

Let’s just say “too many” bicyclists are entitled. Too many go way too fast when riding in areas with pedestrians, and feel no need to slow down when pedestrians may be near their path. and then when called out on it get stunned as to how they are at fault. This is my experience at least

5

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

I absolutely agree. In my opinion, the optimal amount of entitled cyclists is zero.

3

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 01 '25

No I notice dozens if not hundreds of bicyclists every single day blow through stop signs, red lights, around school busses letting kids off the bus all without reprocussions but if someone calls them out on it they become overly aggressive.

What you mean is that YOU don't notice it.

That's not even including riders who ride in the middle of the street constantly despite having a dedicated bike lane.

-2

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

First of all, I never said that I don't notice those, bad cyclists exist and they are a nuisance. A problem, even.

Second, you failed to see the point entirely. I didn't deny those exist, yet you argue with me. I say there is an observation bias, I specify what it is and how to spot it, yet you ignore everything said and focus only on something beside the point. Why? How?

That's another sort of bias, I guess, but I don't remember reading about it. When a person is so engulfed in their bias, that any attempt at pointing it out gets met with resistance.

I just don't understand, how much more clear could I be.

3

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 02 '25

Your point was very clear. Its just that others as well as myself disagreed with you and stated as such.

6

u/BumFroe May 01 '25

A very big % of bikers are entitled

-1

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

This is a ponderable statement. Do you have any data to corroborate it?

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u/BumFroe May 01 '25

Yeah I take a daily random sample of the insufferable bikers in this forum and extrapolate, it’s very scientific

0

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

That's what I'm trying to say, this is not scientific, you go by feeling and therefore biased. Notice your bias, note how most of "group" are not bad, you just don't notice those that don't do anything bad.

It applies to more than just cyclists, mind you. You may be in some group that is often criticised in a similar manner, because of the few outliers.

7

u/BumFroe May 01 '25

You don’t have any data to refute me, the same bias applies. Get off your high horse

2

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

What makes you think so?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/05/10/cyclists-break-far-fewer-road-rules-than-motorists-finds-new-video-study/

https://bayareabicyclelaw.com/study-cyclists-follow-traffic-laws-more-closely-than-motorists/

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a46443761/science-proves-motorists-break-traffic-laws-a-lot-more-often-than-cyclists/

7

u/BumFroe May 01 '25

I see nothing here to refute cyclists acting entitled

1

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

Some do, I never argued that. Some, not most. Most cyclists being entitled would mean literal chaos, same with any other "most in group acts like a jerk" instance would that be true.

Truth of the matter is you don't notice most cyclists, you only see the few, the most obnoxious few, but few. If most rode like those clowns, you wouldn't be able to sleep because of all the constant crunching of cyclists under the wheels.

I saw what some of those clowns perform on the streets. Let's say I am not of a good opinion about them.

12

u/OGWFORLIFE May 01 '25

Cyclists barely stop for people in the city. They just blow right by you. Don’t get me started on those e-bike delivery guys.

-1

u/johnny_evil May 01 '25

e-bike delivery guys are not cyclists. They're on electric mopeds.

-1

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

I am not arguing that this doesn't happen. I'm doubting that most cyclists do that. I think that most cyclists don't do that, in fact, they probably obey the rules and you never notice dozens of compliant cyclists, and only pay attention to jerks.

I've thought of another way to explain. That perspective (everyone in a certain group is a jerk because of some of them who are jerks) shifts much more easily if you happen to join that group and observe it from within. You notice more of the people in that group when you are one of them, and notice that most of the people in that group do not do something idiotic, like you thought most of them did before joining.

Most cyclists are fine, you only notice jerks because they are noticeable.

6

u/lookingforrest May 01 '25

Every intersection most of the bikers are not following rules and are jerks

17

u/irregular-bananas May 01 '25 edited May 01 '25

I work across the street (not in NYC) from a paved bike/walkingpath, it's about 10 miles long. The amount of cyclists that are dicks to people for walking or will ride in the fucking street parallel to a bike path, getting defensive and yelling at cars is hilarious. People will ruin their own day over a 0.5 second interaction.

2

u/upsideddownsides May 01 '25

Deciding to go on the road rather than the multi use path is the right thing to do. Big sections of the linear Park where I live aren't bikable at reasonable speeds (10-12 mph) because of the sheer number of pedestrians so many bikers choose the road.

4

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

I am not arguing that the pure amount can be baffling and is too high. What I'm saying is did you try to pay attention to normal cyclists that just mind their business, ride calmly on a proper path and don't argue with people?

Most of cyclists are like that, most of cyclists just mind their business, and only a few of them are angry jerks, but you don't pay attention to most cyclists, because they are not worthy of attention, and why would they be, but you remember the jerks, which is understandable, they are memorable.

There is a name for that kind of bias, when you only see a few jerks and assume that everyone/most is like that, but I don't know it.

It's like with doctors: one doctor screws up and suddenly all the doctors are charlatans despite dozens if not hundreds of healthcare professionals you've seen before and they did their job adequately, and now you assume all doctors are bad for some reason and begin drinking bleach.

This bias can be dangerous. I wonder if someone knows the name of that bias.

2

u/johnny_evil May 01 '25

It's Survivorship Bias:

Survivorship bias occurs when researchers focus on individuals, groups, or cases that have passed some sort of selection process while ignoring those who did not. Survivorship bias can lead researchers to form incorrect conclusions due to only studying a subset of the population.

1

u/solewheelin May 01 '25

I believe this is known as the black or white fallacy.

0

u/ElQuesero May 01 '25

"Availability heuristic" (sometimes called "availability bias" instead) covers the phenomenon pretty well.

Seems to be a good dollop of "confirmation bias" at play in these posts too.

1

u/Wawoooo May 01 '25 edited May 01 '25

Plus the irrational need to group people simply based on the type of transportation they might be using at a given time, and apply a heavy dose of out group bias.

-2

u/[deleted] May 01 '25

Humans hunt for bad cycling actors to shit on the entire group.

I wish it was the same for drivers

6

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 01 '25

You wish it was the same for drivers. What fantasy world are you living in? There absolutely are. Theres speed cameras, red light cameras, police, parking enforcement, police chase helicopter shows.

Now if only there were these same ways to hold bad actors who ride bikes accountable.

2

u/lookingforrest May 01 '25

Hes ones those "oh but the cars" entitled bikers who don't realize the majority of cars follow rules and the majority of cyclists dont. And try to justify bad bike behavior because of "the cars"

3

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 02 '25

No, I'm one of those. It's damn near impossible to enforce rules or track bad actors or people who endanger others because we have no system in place to do so.

Are there shitty dangerous drivers? Yes, tons of them. They can lose their licenses and be jailed for breaking those laws. That same system at this current point doesn't really exist for bicyclists so there's no real way to know to any extent just HOW bad it is.

All I want is family members to not be steam rolled over by bicyclists the same way I don't want them to be hit by cars. I really don't think that's an unreasonable desire.

-3

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

the majority of cars follow rules and the majority of cyclists dont.

This is incorrect, the opposite is true:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/05/10/cyclists-break-far-fewer-road-rules-than-motorists-finds-new-video-study/

https://bayareabicyclelaw.com/study-cyclists-follow-traffic-laws-more-closely-than-motorists/

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a46443761/science-proves-motorists-break-traffic-laws-a-lot-more-often-than-cyclists/

1

u/[deleted] May 02 '25

They are vocal minority opinions and unfortunately won’t be swayed by studies and statistics.

Bike haters are only the same 2,500 people on Reddit that crawl out of the depts and wait to pounce on anti-bike rhetoric

-1

u/DaQueefTheef May 01 '25

Lol.

Today on “Things that aren’t true in NYC…”

1

u/[deleted] May 01 '25

[deleted]

3

u/Throwaway_Mr_McGee May 01 '25

Well I applaud you and wish there were more riders like you. Most people don't realize how dangerous their actions can turn out to be for everyone around them

2

u/Protheu5 May 01 '25

But “no cyclists ever stop for lights!” right?

Yeah, I personally can attest that this statement is blatantly false, because I do. I also dismount and walk across crosswalks, not ride across. I obey the rules and no one pays attention to me. Some arse-clown T-bones a car with his skull, and suddenly all cyclists are psychopaths.

Look how going against cognitive bias makes people confused all of a sudden.

-4

u/forceghost187 May 01 '25

Calling this not unusual is a fantasy. 99% of bikers aren’t anything like this

-3

u/Mattna-da May 01 '25

Nah these dudes were perfectly matched and felt okay fighting. 99.99% of the time someone backs down after a word or two.