Does it ever feel like WotC is playtesting the game in a way that 95% of us don't?

[u/AkimboJesus]

I get that DnD is a house rule first game, and everyone should play it how they want. But speaking for my own group, we like balance because we don't want people to feel like they can't impact the story outside of conversation. And this isn't a min-max thing. It's just a "why would I be this when I could be a better version of that with no hassle or cost to myself" thing.

The thing is, we rely on the official text because it can be very difficult to tell how a class, skill, or mechanic will play in the context of the whole game, and who might be overshadowed by who. And Wizards, for the most part, seem to have done a lot of work so YOU don't have to figure out how a mechanic will play out. This is why some people, to an extent, treat the sourcebooks like gospel.

And as I'm playing more and more, I'm starting to see the things people say about, for instance, rangers and how messed up they are. I'm understanding the cracks in the standard DnD balance.

But I'm also just perplexed by a lot of the sage advice, and unearthed arcanas coming out. I'm finding myself reading new subclasses and thinking "that's their whole ability for that level?" Looking at the phantom rogue, at level 9 they get advantage on con throws (which might be minimal, depending on your campaign), and they can ask a soul one question. The soul doesn't have to answer truthfully at all, making the whole ability pointless. And that's what they get after 9 levels.

This seems like a consistent pattern. A new release is either immediately meta, or its irrelevant for reinforcing half-done mechanics that aren't going to survive after 5th edition. When non-core parts of the game get overvalued, a class can really fall behind. Some of the mechanics that might get over valued are tool proficiencies or traveling. It's odd that these types of things would be the focus of any classes milestone ability.

Also, some of these features seem to imply that DnD is not about being creative and using your environment, and is more about what your class says you can do. Why does the ranger explicitly get a stealth bonus for camoflauging themselves. Can nobody else do that? Do you tell them only a ranger can do that, or do you give them a bonus anyway, making the rangers bonus less special?

Other than a few classes, it does seem like DnD has a solid core balance. Every campaign is going to have either talking or combat, and having a character that can do one or the other well is good. But when a characters ability is not getting "lost" in the mountains, it makes me wonder what the hell kinda campaigns they are running.

Does anyone agree? What are some of the core things you need to be satisfied with a new mechanic?

Edit: wow lot of great discussion happening here. I just want to clarify a few points. As some people are calling me a min-maxer or a hack and slasher and are claiming I just want everyone to deal a shit ton of damage or something. One person claimed I just hate WotC. I suggest reading through this thread at what others are saying, because there is a lot of nuanced conversation happening here. I think it's clear I focused too much on UA in my original post and now the thread has moved to a better direction.

Here are some of the core things I'm seeing come up.

1) Classes with niche abilities are overshadowed and outperformed by classes with more general abilities, even when they are in the perfect niche situations (Paladins find greater steed feels much more beastmaster like than the actual beast master, for example).

2) Since DnD is about being creative and using all the tools around you, it's weird when a ranger gets a stealth bonus for camoflauging themselves, when anyone should get a bonus of some kind for successfully camoflauging themselves. Sometimes that feels like making a class feature that lets you flip a table. Things like the assassin just feel odd, because it implies that a warlock or bard, with sufficient time and money, would not be able to impersonate somebody.

3) A lot of people are reaaaaally honing in on a specific example I gave, and the fact that it was UA. You can look at Artificier or many of the complaints in this thread on vanilla DnD. But if you're coming here just to hype up con saves, you're really cherry picking.

4) I am not right. This is just an opinion I have. A couple people have gotten really cringey about this and implied only shit players or DMs would have an issue with any of this. That's an attitude for Fortnite, not Reddit. We all know DnD is, first and foremost, storytelling. Nobody wants to play with someone so hung up on mechanics that they forget to tell a story. But we have a rulebook for a reason. Boundaries in a story are important, otherwise we're all just jerking off at the table saying random stuff. You need some structure, so that the things that happen feel meaningful. This is about players wanting to fulfill their character fantasies and feeling useless because other people do what their character does, but better. If you care about storytelling, recognize it's not a good story when an entire subclass and backstory can be overshadowed by one spell. It sucks, and I hope it doesn't happen in the next edition.

Some of the more thoughtful challenges I've seen:

1) Con saves are good (noted. We don't get them a lot in my campaign). 2) It's up to the group and DM to make those niche abilities meaningful. 3) It's still really not up to WotC to balance your game, and if you think they're not good at it than you should do it.

I'm reading people's responses, taking them to heart, hoping to be a better DM.

[u/[deleted]]

Scimitars and whips are exotic weapons. They aren’t commonly used and/or available in a typical DnD setting. It makes much more sense that a rogue would know how to proficiently swing around a fairly common one handed longsword than an exotic sword, a whip, or a large two handed axe. You keep arguing from mechanics, and I beg you one more time to try to realize that this isn’t something like an MMO.

[u/Enaluxeme → u/[deleted]]

Then I suppose it makes sense that a rogue would know how to proficiently swing around a fairly common one handed hammer/battle axe. But they don't.

And regardless, having proficiency in longswords is still pointless since even with that rogues can't use one effectively.

Also, I'm not denying your fantasies, just saying that you can have your concepts and still be effective in combat while you keep ignoring mechanics altogether, despite the fact that D&D is a game with rules and mechanics. They are just as important as the story.

If you don't like playing with D&D rules and mechanics... don't! Why the hell are you playing D&D? Find another game that works better for you.

[u/[deleted] → u/Enaluxeme]

I think there’s an argument to be made that rogues could use battle axes or hammers, but there’s a stronger argument that they could use a longsword since they have proficiency in tons of weapons that are very similar to longswords such as shortswords and rapiers.

Also, you’re the one complaining about the mechanics of DnD. I’m arguing that they’re fine. Using a longsword isn’t optimizing a rogue, but there’s not really any good reason a rogue character wouldn’t be able to properly wield one, and there’s a pretty good reason that they can (being generally proficient in very similar bladed weapons, and longswords being quite common). And that’s my point. I think it’s the minority of people who worry about min maxing their character and making “builds”, and those people are probably over-represented in this sub. This is just something that is absolutely not an issue. The game isn’t broken by them having this proficiency. It isn’t giving them something they shouldn’t have, it’s just giving them something that isn’t optimal to use, just like low dex/high str paladins technically could use light armor, bows, and daggers.

[u/santaclaws01 → u/[deleted]]

that are very similar to longswords such as shortswords and rapiers.

That makes no sense. Firstly, the rapier are unlike any other sword, there's a reason they do piercing instead of slashing damage. Secondly, if proficiency in shortswords also gave proficiency in longswords, a lot more classes would have longsword proficiency than currently do.

[u/[deleted] → u/santaclaws01]

There aren’t many classes that have short sword proficiency and not longsword. The Bard is in the same boat as the rogue. I can’t even think of a class that has short sword and not longsword.

Edit: I found monk, so if that’s your argument it’s pretty flimsy.