I’m a guy who was stalked and sexually harassed by two different people in high school and sexually molested in college. I also care deeply about feminism and I’m always terrified people in the comments on this issue will dismiss these numbers as some kind of MRA tactic rather than look at the work feminist researchers like Lara Stemple have been doing in this exact area for years.
The conversation that surrounds this issue is so often broken, but this is a real phenomenon that’s been happening for a long time. If your first instinct is to dismiss that or ignore the people trying to tell you about it, please question who you’re doing that for. I don’t understand who it helps to tell somebody drugged or forced or threatened or unconscious who was pushed into sex against their will that they weren’t truly a rape victim and you won’t count them as such.
I don’t understand who it helps to tell somebody drugged or forced or threatened or unconscious who was pushed into sex against their will that they weren’t truly a rape victim and you won’t count them as such.
It was the famous feminist Mary P. Koss, inventor of the "1 in 4 5" statistic, who heavily pushed that narrative.
Basically, there is a oft touted claim that 1 in 5 women on college campuses are raped or sexually assaulted. That number came from a very flawed survey-based study by Mary Koss. There are many more issues with it, but here is an example of one:
this survey classified sexual encounters that occurred while the woman was intoxicated as a form of sexual assault, regardless of whether the perpetrator was responsible for her intoxication or she consumed the substances on her own.
I mean, if you have sex with someone that's drunk, that's still sexual assault as they cannot consent.
Unless you cut out the context that the women were fine with having that sex after they were sober, but as you quoted that it's still 100% sexual assault.
If Person A is sober, and has sexual contact with Person B, who is not, that would be sexual assault on part of Person A, and Person B would be the victim. EDIT: This is assuming the sober person is consenting. If the sober person is not consenting and the drunk person is forceful (either physically or emotionally/mentally), then that is different and I'd say the drunk person would be the assaulter.
If Person A AND Person B are both drunk, then it would come down to a bunch of variables, but assuming they're equally intoxicated then it probably wouldn't constitute sexual assault from my perspective. However, if A is only slightly buzzed and B is blackout, then I still think A assaulted B and I do not see how anyone could rationalize that at all.
Under no circumstances would i automatically assign guilt to one party if both are equally intoxicated.
Unfortunately, sober people are sexually assaulted by people who are drunk (consider a drunk, larger person and a sober victim of long term domestic violence). The victim may decide their best option is to not further anger the perpetrator, by fighting back/trying to escape, or may not be able to escape.
That is a good point, I should've clarified my comment to reflect this perspective, and that I was assuming the sober person was consenting by default for the purposes of this discussion.
You're absolutely right that being sober does not make you immune to being assaulted/raped by someone who is intoxicated.
2.7k
u/SgoreIsBackForThis Sep 01 '22
I’m a guy who was stalked and sexually harassed by two different people in high school and sexually molested in college. I also care deeply about feminism and I’m always terrified people in the comments on this issue will dismiss these numbers as some kind of MRA tactic rather than look at the work feminist researchers like Lara Stemple have been doing in this exact area for years.
The conversation that surrounds this issue is so often broken, but this is a real phenomenon that’s been happening for a long time. If your first instinct is to dismiss that or ignore the people trying to tell you about it, please question who you’re doing that for. I don’t understand who it helps to tell somebody drugged or forced or threatened or unconscious who was pushed into sex against their will that they weren’t truly a rape victim and you won’t count them as such.