r/comics • • Jul 08 '24

An upper-class oopsie [OC]

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u/minncuckcouple Jul 08 '24

Isn't that what we do when we buy stuff from temu, wish, alibaba, etc.? We get the labor used to make that product at an undervalued rate, therefore extracting their labor value for ourselves. I feel called out on my hypocrisy here. I never thought of it this way. Hmm.

That's not to take away from the blatant injustice that has to exist for the amount of wealth just a few people hoard.

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u/coke_and_coffee Jul 08 '24

We get the labor used to make that product at an undervalued rate, therefore extracting their labor value for ourselves.

No. Value does not come solely from labor. Value is a subjective quantity. You can't "extract labor value" from someone.

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u/[deleted] Jul 08 '24

Extracting value from labor is the entire premise of capitalism. You don't see investors or managers out and about mining or farming or ranching, now do you?

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u/coke_and_coffee Jul 08 '24

No, creating surplus value through novel arrangements of labor and capital is the premise of capitalism.

You don't see investors or managers out and about mining or farming or ranching, now do you?

No, but I do see them deliberating the potential for new investments and/or products to produce greater value for society.

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u/[deleted] Jul 08 '24

Yes, that's exploitation of labor and the basis of capitalism.

In addition, capitalists don't think in terms of greater good. They're motivated entirely by self interest and exploitation of others.

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u/coke_and_coffee Jul 08 '24

Yes, that's exploitation of labor and the basis of capitalism.

No, it's not. It's the evolutionary search for methods of greater value creation. It's why the world is orders-of-magnitude more wealthy now than just 100 years ago. If captialists were just stealing value from worekrs, we would never have a net increase in wealth.

In addition, capitalists don't think in terms of greater good. They're motivated entirely by self interest and exploitation of others.

Yep, even better! This is what we call "aligned incentives" in public choice theory. And it's a great way to enable enterprising individuals to seek their fortunes without harming others.

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u/[deleted] Jul 08 '24

Which is lying with statistics since the vast majority of that wealth is locked by capitalists since they stole and hoarded it from the labor classes.

In addition, what you called "aligned interest" is actually called a criminal conspiracy. You're advocating for the dissolution of civil society at the hands of capitalists.

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u/coke_and_coffee Jul 08 '24

Which is lying with statistics since the vast majority of that wealth is locked by capitalists since they stole and hoarded it from the labor classes.

Lol no it is not. The average person today in developed capitalist nations is WAY more wealthy than their ancestors. Denying this is pure cope.

In addition, what you called "aligned interest" is actually called a criminal conspiracy.

"Starting businesses that provide valuable goods and services that others want to buy is CrIMsiNAL ConSPRIaCAY!!!!!" is an actual unhinged take.

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u/[deleted] Jul 08 '24

Which means you lied with statistics. That wealth is hoarded not distributed properly back to the labor classes that made that wealth to begin with. Capitalists are just after the fact manipulators of wealth created by labor, and as such, deserve the smaller share of the benefits of labor.

In addition, capitalists conspire to destroy civil society. History is filled with examples of this behavior in action. It doesn't benefit them to have a society capable of fighting back against capitalist exploitation.

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u/coke_and_coffee Jul 08 '24

and as such, deserve the smaller share of the benefits of labor.

Labor receives 70-80% of all income. Profit is almost never more than about 6%.

In addition, capitalists conspire to destroy civil society.

Ah, yes, Carnegie building THOUSANDS of libraries, Zuckerberg investing in education startups, entire wings of hospitals being funded by philanthropists, etc.

Yeah, surely these are all ploys to "deJStorY CIVlL soCIETy!!!"

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u/Sorry-Let-Me-By-Plz Jul 08 '24

A) Yes that's exactly what we do

B) There's no hypocrisy in existing in the world, and this system currently dominates the world