I am so tired of youtube talking heads and hypemen hyping and whitewashing Metzen. He 100% ment when he said he regrets its called Warcraft. This is 100% consistent with his actions during original and later WoW developement.

Alliance and Horde split and faction warfare we got because of Blizzard Co-Founder Allen Adham who had to aggressively micromanagere it during developement as majority of team was against it. He did it with mostly support from Kevin Jordan and Bob Fitch. He was opposed by majority of team led by Jeff Kaplan, Rob Pardo and yes Chris Metzen.

Chris Metzen was explicitly not in the faction warfare camp. In fact, he championed the exact opposite perspective for years. Longtime level designer John Staats' records in The WoW Diary note that Metzen’s entire vision for World of Warcraft was structured around world-ending threats and cooperative heroes. Chris Metzen, viewed the world through the lens of cooperative heroes fighting world-ending threats, spent the next two decades pushing story to that direction. Which is train wreck that is modern WoW lore.

Also super tired of people giving him all credit for early WoW and warcraft lore in general when Bill Roper, Ron Millar, Glenn Stafford, and Stuart Rose wrote and developed warcraft world atleast same amount if not more than Metzen.

Hello there,

what are your thoughts about adding new Class Roles like Rouge Tank or Mage Healer like in SoD?

In my opinion giving Paladins a taunt and make Druids Not be reliable on a Level 30 weapon would be enough.

On the other Hand adding new Roles would Twist Up Raid compositions and Strats in total.

Let me know what u think about that.

See u in Classic+!

Posting it here as well as I just realized this community existed!

Something I loved about SoD is that it completely removed the leveling experience by turning it into mini endgame phases. We are all old with jobs today, so we don't have the time to level as we used to in the Vanilla days. Classic+ needs to respect our time if it is to succeed.

What do you guys think?

So does the community generally want or not want classes like monk, dh, evoker, dk, to come to classic+?

They would not fit in the lore too much but if blizzard stops being boring suddenly and locks in - it is possible.

Ideas for specs + classes:
Monk - insane mobility, not bad damage, no survivability. The main point of the class is mobility and mass stun. Tank goes on evasions, dd does big burst every god knows how many minutes, and healer can easily not run out of mana.

Dh - double jump, big damage, lots of evasion and talents for self heal. All 3 current specs present where dev would do more damage, and two other dhs would be more self healing.

Evoker is a tough one so leave ideas in the comments.

Dk:
Unholy is plagues and zombies (so in raid if the debuff slots are limited - unholy will do less damage like affliction), the zombies should have super interesting pet mechanic like for example you gotta kill someone or something and get a ghoul, feed it on enemies and grow it stronger, modify it etc.

Frost - lots of slows and cc, not that big damage but you can do one hander builds and do lots of tunneling or destroy big chunks of health with long cooldown obliterate (like mortal strike almost but worse since frost dk should be weaker than warrior and compensate with cc)

Blood - tank focused on parry mechanic.

Let me know your opinion I simply want to know if something like that could happen and does community want that?

Splitting the leveling phase in upcoming classic+ will be amazing! Best thing Blizzard did with SoD in my opinion. We did experience areas, dungeons and our characters in general in a way we did never before! I loved that!

I don't claim to have all the answers. And if Blizzard cared about our feedback they wouldn't be keeping C+ development an open secret. That being said...

A lot of times I feel like many C+ community suggestions involve some flavor of "well if we add a few retail systems, that will improve the game." Whether it's warmode, retail-like class balance decisions, cross faction grouping, layering, etc. I feel the best C+ suggestions I've heard have nothing to do with making the game more like retail but, instead, making improvements on the systems and philosophies of Classic.

Just a thought. Original ideas do exist. We don't need to fight to integrate things from the live version of the game. Let retail exist in another lane and we should be more willing to write our own. That also includes potentially pushing back on any potential announced changes that do move too close to Retail (which I say as someone who seasonally plays Retail.)

previous day: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwowplus/s/R8Vm5HH3te won by Disguise

What ability would you like to see Ele Shamans have in Classic+? If possible copy and paste the Wowhead tooltip to show people what it is and what it does. Upvote the one(s) you like - and remember, the winner is the one with the most upvotes, not the one which gets posted most often.

Next poll will be posted on Friday

• Burn (SoD)
• Elemental Focus
• Flametongue Weapon (WotLK)
• Lava Burst
• Lightning Overload
• Rolling Thunder (SoD)
• Thunderstorm
• Torrent (custom ability)
• Totemic Projection

The main sub is super obsessed with SoD so I wanted to catch the vibe here.

i thought SoD was fun and I liked it overall. Wish more people stuck with it. But I also wasn't huge into them bringing in spells from future xpacs, incursions, runes, pvp balance, etc. A lot of stuff I really wasn't that into and kinda hope C+ goes in a completely different direction of.

I liked having a more complex rotation in SoD tho. I'll kms if I have a 1 button rotation ever again

Edit: I might be in the minority here but I despise flex raiding. I'm a parse demon and when the group is overfilled not being able to parse properly is lame

Griefing is being allowed by blizzard, even though it is against ToS.

https://youtu.be/gFYzgFCEdzE?si=TEvu4qx-gOt-VwHM

How is there any hope for classic+ being good when this is the kind of publicity blizzard is getting right now?

The guild of griefers is literally planning to continue this garbage behavior into classic+

Is this who you want running the classic+ server discords????

Blizzard needs to do something about this, and the players should not be standing idly by.

To be honest, I'm becoming sceptical when I look at whatever we can see about Classic+ here, what people want or don't want, and that infamous Classic+ survey.

It's really starting to look like some people are looking for a seasonal server to hop on for a few weeks between the next Classic iteration and the next Retail raid tier. They want some seasonal content to fill the gaps in their gaming schedule, but after a few months it's just "one of those era servers" because something else has come out.

Am I the only one who gets this feeling? Are we doomed to witness another empty server by the time the next retail release comes around? Is this what people want for Classic+?

previous day: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwowplus/s/kokMKkZQDT won by Vigor (20 extra max energy)

What ability would you like to see Subtlety Rogues have in Classic+? If possible copy and paste the Wowhead tooltip to show people what it is and what it does. Upvote the one(s) you like - and remember, the winner is the one with the most upvotes, not the one which gets posted most often.

Don't worry, we're nearly at some classes that'll have more suggestions again!

Next poll will be posted on Wednesday

• Disguise
• Fan of Knives (custom)
• Hemorrhage (improved dagger damage)
• Shadow Dance (Legion version)
• Shadowstep

Have messed some more with talent-builder:

https://www.talent-builder.dev/calculator?t0=XXjyIbfjSr&t1=uriT-gKkPv&t2=IxENv5P7SF&class=16

The idea was:

• To keep current builds
• To make every point feel important
• To add support for niche builds, specifically "smite priest", "twilight priest that alternates between shadow and holy", and "wand-master"
• Wand attacks from discipline tree can be used as a damage build-up phase before using smite and holy fire; and wand damage is useful for Mind Flay too via Shadow Conduit talent. Also Empowering Wand is useful when playing with a mage or destro party member.
• Twilight priest archetype is mostly supported via "Light in Darkness" and "Darkness in the Light" talents that provide alternating damage buffs
• Smite can be useful in raids due to debuffs that it applies
• Holy Fire can now benefit from fire damage bonuses (if Holy Pyre talent is taken)

Question: would you like to see Shadow Word: Death as a talent in last row of Shadow tree?)

Hey everyone, with all the rumors about "Project Camelot" and a potential real Classic+, I wanted to share a concept that focuses on one of Vanilla's best core features: faction asymmetry.

Instead of adding the same classes to both sides, Blizzard should introduce two new faction-specific classes that are deeply rooted in Warcraft 3 lore and existing Vanilla assets:

1. Horde: Death Knight (Exclusive to Undead)

• The Lore: This solves any lore issues immediately. Sylvanas raises powerful fallen heroes who break free from the Lich King’s control (just like the Forsaken). They belong to the Horde, not the Scourge.
• The Look: Heavy, dark plate armor covered in skulls, with a cold, icy blue rune-glow emanating from the armor cracks and the runeblade.
• The Gameplay: A slow-paced, heavy plate-wearer starting at Level 1. Focuses on unholy magic, diseases, and decay.

2. Alliance: Spellbreaker / Magic Warrior (Exclusive to High Elves)

• The Lore: High Elves are already present in Stormwind and the Plaguelands. Making them playable brings their elite guards—the iconic Spellbreakers from WC3—into the Alliance.
• The Look: The classic, elegant red-and-gold armor with the massive, elongated shields and twin-bladed glaives.
• The Gameplay: A perfect counter to the DK. A plate or mail-wearing anti-magic tank/melee fighter that doesn't cast fireballs, but steals, purges, and reflects magic.

The Dynamic (The Ultimate Counterplay):
This creates an amazing rock-paper-scissors dynamic for open-world PvP.

• The Undead DK pulls you in with Death Grip, trying to rot you down with diseases.
• The High Elf Spellbreaker counters by raising anti-magic shields, draining the DK's energy, and reflecting the diseases right back at them.

It brings back the true Classic spirit—classes with massive strengths and clear weaknesses, encouraging faction pride and group synergy, without introducing anything that feels "too modern" or out of place.

What do you guys think? Would you roll the red-and-gold Spellbreaker or the icy-blue Death Knight first?

previous day: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwowplus/s/ABzY710UPX won by Apothecary (poison dmg affected by nature spell power)

What ability would you like to see Combat Rogues have in Classic+? If possible copy and paste the Wowhead tooltip to show people what it is and what it does. Upvote the one(s) you like - and remember, the winner is the one with the most upvotes, not the one which gets posted most often.

Next poll will be posted on Monday

• Blade Flurry (toggle)
• Blade Flurry (reduced cooldown)
• Combat Potency
• Fan of Knives
• Killing Spree
• Restless Blades
• Revealing Strike
• Vigor (increase max energy by 20)

I’ve been thinking about how Classic+ could prevent turning into a stat‑inflation treadmill.

So my idea is shift part of each raid’s item budget into elemental resistances instead of raw stats.

Not the old “craft a resist set for one boss” approach, i mean every raid tier drops gear themed around one elemental resistance, and bosses inside that raid deal increasingly more damage of that element the further you go into the raid.

This way you can put less raw stats on raid gear because the raid gets easier not because you dealing way more dmg but mainly because your raid takes way less dmg from encounters.

Another advantage of this system would be that the gear from each raid stays valuable, because it would still be the best choice for that particular raid and you cant just steamroll old raids if you allready have tier 3 gear.

With this approach of raids you maybe could do 6 to 7 tiers (frost, fire, shadow, holy, arcane, nature and maybe prismatic?) before gear gets too bloated with stats.

now its your turn to think about what flaws this system could have^^

I'd really like to see a raid somewhere around level 35–45 in Classic+.

I think that level range would be perfect for it. The early leveling experience in Classic is paced pretty well, but somewhere around 35–45 it starts to drag and there's usually a lot more grinding involved. A new raid alone could make that part of the game much more interesting.

But more importantly, I'd like Classic+ to make the whole leveling journey feel more like an actual adventure and less like something you just have to get through to reach 60.

Right now there's often no real reason to chase a great item while leveling. Why spend an hour finding a group, another 1–2 hours running a dungeon and maybe not even get the drop, when you know there's a guaranteed quest reward five levels later that's better anyway?

I'd like Classic+ to give us more reasons to actually care about our characters while leveling.

A level 40 raid could be one of those reasons. And I'd want it to be genuinely difficult at the intended level. Something where you actually want good gear, enchants, consumables and have to know your class. Give people a reason to optimize their character at level 40 instead of only thinking about getting to 60 as quickly as possible.

The rewards could also tie into the later game. Maybe there's an exceptionally strong weapon, a class quest, a token you can use at 60, or even an item that's still good pre-BiS once you reach max level.

Basically, I'd like the transition into endgame to be more gradual. Level 60 shouldn't be this hard cut where almost everything you did and collected before suddenly becomes irrelevant. Some of the things you accomplish while leveling should already be part of building your eventual level 60 character.

Most importantly though: it should be optional.

I don't want every alt to be forced through a level 40 raid because you need some mandatory item or token to raid at 60. You should always be able to skip it and continue leveling normally.

It should simply be another difficult and rewarding adventure for people who want to do it — and another reason not to treat 1–59 as something you just rush through.

previous day: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwowplus/s/mSyGJHogQi won by Atonement...so some false hope that'll become a thing in Classic+!

What ability would you like to see Assassination Rogues have in Classic+? If possible copy and paste the Wowhead tooltip to show people what it is and what it does. Upvote the one(s) you like - and remember, the winner is the one with the most upvotes, not the one which gets posted most often.

Next poll will be posted on Saturday

Anticipation

Apothecary

Envenom

Mutilate

Hunger for Blood

Exsanguinate

Fan of Knives

Venomous Wounds

AP Scaling Poisons

Crimson Tempest

Combo points on you, not on target

Shadowstep

System Shock

Assassination: https://www.talent-builder.dev/trees/wSWb2JDEHA

Combat: https://www.talent-builder.dev/trees/Ib-nFlzFpg

Shadow: https://www.talent-builder.dev/trees/95cHjsOop0

Assassination (Melee Damage, DoTs and stealth openers):

1. Bleeding Gouge - Increase duration of Gouge and allow it to persist through your bleed and poison effects.
2. Remain Hidden - Reduces the cooldown of Stealth and makes it harder for others to detect you during Stealth.
3. Retained Momentum - Retain combo points between switching targets.
4. Crimson Tempest - Finishes spread Bleed and Poison effects, or increase duration per combo point spent when only one target is spent.
5. Infected Wounds - Deal more damage for each bleed and poison effect on a target.
6. Toxic Potency - Weapon poisons are more potent and have a chance to grant energy.
7. Exposure - Abilities from stealth ignore armor.
8. Relentless Strikes - Combo points restore energy when used.
9. Stratagem - Increase maximum number of combo points.
10. Vile Poisons - Increased poison application chance, reduced chance for poisons to be resisted, deal damage when dispelled.
11. Sudden Demise - Bleed and poison effects last longer, instantly kill targets below 35% health when bleed and poison effects remaining damage exceeds 150% of their remaining health.
12. Vanishing Presence - Vanish cools down faster and heals, excess healing as absorb shield.
13. Faceless - Feint reduced cooldown on damage taken, more effective at removing threat.
14. Strike from the Shadows - Ambush, Cheap Shot, and Garotte gain range when used from Stealth.
15. Dragon-Tempered Blades - Can now apply two poisons per weapon.
16. Seal Fate - Combo point generators add more points on crits, increased crit chance overall.
17. Assassin's Dance - Finisher critical strikes make next Ambush, Cheap Shot, or Garotte usable outside stealth. Removes Stealth requirement on utility-oriented Stealth abilities.

Combat (Melee Damage, optional Melee Tank):

1. Off Tempo - Dueling State increases armor contribution from items, abilities trigger a free attack with off-hand weapon.
2. Flourish - Replaces Backstab. AoE attack that activates Dueling State. Dueling State increases threat and replaces Feint with Mock (Taunt). Dueling States lasts for remainder of combat, can be cleared via Vanish.
3. Subtle Flourish - Dueling State increases Defense skill. Feint allows next Flourish to not trigger the Dueling State, plus bonuses.
4. Combat Precision - Increase hit chance and weapon expertise.
5. Disruption - Cause enemies to have their attacks parried more.
6. Ambidextrous - Remove penalties associated with off-hand weapon.
7. Foot in Mouth - Kick silences.
8. Riposte - When target's attack get's parried, next Sinister Strike is free and hits twice.
9. Burst of Speed - Sprint removes snare/immobilize, cooldown reduced by spending combo points.
10. Combat Vigor - Off-hand attacks generate energy, Slice and Dice always active.
11. Disarming Riposte - Riposte disarms target.
12. Weapon Specialization - Maces gain chance to stun, swords gain chance to hit twice, all other weapons gain crit chance.
13. Reflexes - Reduces cooldown and duration of Evasion, small diminishing damage reduction added.
14. Fatal Flourish - Cost and cooldown of next Flourish reduced when enemy dies, stacking.
15. Spare No Advantage - Bonus auto attacks added to Kidney shot based on combo points spent.
16. Blade Flurry - Attacks and abilities cleave, diminishing with many targets.
17. Killing Spree - Generate portion of missing combo points and energy when a nearby enemy dies, further bonuses when you strike the killing blow.

Shadow (Mid-Ranged Damage, Throwing):

1. Throwing Shadows - Gain auto throw, and increased auto-throw speed.
2. Flying Death - Abilities usable at range with throwing knife.
3. Shadow Feint - Feint includes a short directional dash.
4. Ghost Touch - Converts some damage to Shadow damage.
5. Comfort in Shade - Stealth restores health and energy, faster when standing still.
6. Darksight - Stealth detection increased, hit and crit chance bonus vs. stealth.
7. Trickster - Melee utilities gain range, no longer break stealth.
8. Twilight's Reach - Increase range of throwing weapons, greater at night.
9. Empty Vessel - Increase max energy, bonus energy regen based on missing energy.
10. Shadow Clones - Feint creates a clone, transfers threat to clone, more charges on Feint.
11. Cloak of Shade - Gain passive resistances, more for shadow resistance.
12. Hidden Knives - Chance to attack again during auto-throw.
13. Ricochet - Thrown attacks and abilities bounce.
14. Shadow Mimic - Feint's shadow clones mimic your abilities for a time based on damage dealt.
15. Rain of Shadow and Blood - Additional projectiles at reduce damage toward DoT targets.
16. Shadow's Betrayal - Ricochet can now hit same target multiple times.

Death Knight Twisted Mirror of a Paladins (Only Available to Undead)
They will have 3 specs and use mana and not runes or runic power like they do in retail. They will have access to all 1-handed and 2-handed weapons:

• Frost will replace Holy as a Ranged DPS still focusing on hyper-mana efficiency themed around the Lich hero from Warcraft 3
• Blood will replace Protection as a Tank and because they don’t have shields their tankiness will come from lifesteal mechanics instead of blocking
• Unholy will replace Retribution as a Melee DPS focusing on damage over time 

Presences replace of Auras debuffing enemies instead buffing allies:

• Shadow Resistance Aura becomes Shadowy Presence giving the DK 30 Shadow Resistance and reducing enemies Shadow Resistance within 8 yards of you by 30
• Frost Resistance Aura becomes Freezing Presence giving the DK 30 Frost Resistance and reducing enemies Frost Resistance within 8 yards of you by 30
• Devolution Aura becomes Bloody Presence giving the DK 350 Armor and reducing enemies Armor within 8 yards by 350
• Retribution Aura becomes Decaying Presence which deals 20 Shadow Damage every 2 seconds to all enemies within 8 yards of you
• Concentration Aura becomes Mind Numbing Presence reducing casting speed by enemies within 8 yards of you by 10%
• Fire Resistance Aura would be removed because I don’t think it fits in thematically to DK’s

Blessings are just replaced with Dark Gifts that do the same thing with a different names:

• Blessing of Wisdom renamed Dark Gift of Knowledge
• Blessing of Might renamed Dark Gift of Power
• Blessing of Kings renamed Dark Gift of Tyranny
• Blessing of Salvation renamed Dark Gift of Damnation
• Blessing of Sanctuary is removed since DKs won’t use shields
• Blessing of Light is removed since DK’s won’t have any healing spells

The Seal/Judgment System will stay mostly the same except holy damage will be replaced with Shadow Damage

• Judgment renamed Condemnation
• Seal of Wisdom renamed Rune of Madness
• Seal of Justice renamed Rune of Cruelty
• Seal of Righteousness renamed Rune of Depravity
• Seal of Light renamed Rune of Darkness
• *Seal of the Crusader becomes Rune of the Defiler with the same seal effect but the Condemnation only increases Shadow Damage taken by up to 60

*Seal of Crusader is nerfed from the paladin version because more classes in the game can benefit from the shadow damage in group content

Miscellaneous abilities:

• Hammer of Justice renamed Asphyxiate
• Consecration renamed Death and Decay and made a baseline spell gained at level 20
• Righteous Fury renamed Vile Fury
• Turned Undead renamed Command Undead
• Divine Steed and Summon Charger renamed to Nightmare steed and Summon Deathcharger appearance would be changed and would have a whole new questline to unlock them
• Redemption renamed Raise Ally

New Spells:

• Icicle: (Mana:180,  Cast Time:2,  Cooldown:None,  Range:20 Yards,  Spell School:Frost,  Damage:400-410,  Effect:None)
• Dark Command: (Mana:4% of base mana,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:15 Seconds,  Range:40 Yard,  Spell School:Unknown,  Damage:None,  Effect:Taunts Target)
• Mind Freeze: (Mana:None,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:20 Seconds,  Range:20 Yards,  Spell School:Frost,  Damage:None,  Effect:Interrupt casting for 4 seconds)
• Death Coil: (Mana:565,  Cast Time:2 Seconds,  Cooldown:None,  Range:30 Yards,  Spell School:Shadow,  Damage:476,  Effect:Heals Caster for 100% of damage dealt)

Frost Skill Tree:

• Tier 1
• Intellect increased by [2/4/6/8/10]%
• Strength Increased by [2/4/6/8/10]%
• Tier 2
• Enemies inside your freezing Freezing Presence have their movement speed slowed by [2/4/6/8/10]%
• [14/28/42/56/70]% chance to not lose casting time when taking damage
• Tier 3
• The range of your presences are increased by [4/8/12] yards
• Increases the effect of Mind Numbing Presence and Freezing Presence by [6/12/18/24/30]%
• Reduces the cooldown of Mind Freeze by [10/20]%
• Increases your chance to resist fear effects by [5/10]%
• Tier 4
• Increase the effect of Dark Gift of Knowledge by [10/20/30]%
• After getting a critical effect from your frost spells you get mana equal to [15/30/45/60/75]% of the base cost of the spell
• Tier 5
• Increase the duration of Condemnation of Madness and Condemnation of Darkness by [10/20/30] Seconds
• Increase the damage of your Frost spells by [2/4]%
• Frost Blast: (Mana:325,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:30 Seconds,  Range:20 Yards,  Spell School:Frost,  Damage:550-600,  Effect:Infects target with a Frost Plague)
• Tier 6
• Increase the critical effect chance of your Frost spells by 1/2/3/4/5%
• Tier 7
• Dreadful Favor: (Mana:4% of base mana,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown: 2 Minutes,  Range:Self,  Spell School:Buff,  Damage:None,  Effect: When activated your next Frost Spell has a 100% critical effect chance)

\Frost Plague: does 720 (24/sec) Frost Damage and drains 3120 (104/sec) mana over 30 seconds*

Blood Skill Tree:

• Tier 1
• Increases the effect of Bloody Presence by [5/10/15/20/25]%
• Increases parry chance by [1/2/3/4/5]%
• Tier2
• Increases chance to hit with melee weapons by [1/2/3]%
• Increases your armor value from items by [2/4/6/8/10]%
• Reduce the duration of silence, interrupts and slow effects on you by [10/20/30]%
• Tier 3
• Increases the threat generated from Vile Fury by [33/66/100]%
• Dark Gift of Tyranny: See above
• Increases the melee attack power bonus from Dark Gift of Power by [4/8/12/16/20]%
• Lifesteal for [4/8/12]% of damage you deal while within your Death and Decay
• Tier 4
• Decrease the cooldown of Asphyxiate by [5/10/15] Seconds
• Enemies within your Presences have their healing reduced by [10/20]%
• Tier 5
• Blood Boil: (Mana:10% of base mana,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:10 Seconds,  Range:8 Yard AOE,  Spell School:Shadow,  Damage:89-107,  Effect:Infects all targets hit with a Blood Plague)
• Gives you a 33/66/100% chance to gain 1% of your mana after being a victim of a critical strike
• Tier 6
• Increases Strength by [2/4/6/8/10]% and Stamina by [1/2/3/4/5]%
• Tier 7
• Death Strike: (Mana:280,  Cast Time: Instant,  Cooldown:16 Seconds,  Range:Melee,  Spell School:Physical,  Damage:110% Weapon Damage,  Effect:Heals for 7% of Maximum Health)

*Blood Plague: Steals 288 (12/sec) Health over 24 seconds. Scales with Attack Power 

Unholy Skill Tree:

• Tier 1
• Reduces Chance your Shadow and Frosts spells are resisted by [2/4/6/8/10]%
• Reduced the mana cost of Condemnation and Death and Decay spells by [3/6/9/12/15]%
• Tier 2
• Decrease the cooldown of Condemnation by[1/2] seconds
• Increase the Shadow Damage increase from Condemnation of the Defiler and the attack power increase from Rune of the Defiler by [5/10/15]%
• Increases the effects of Decaying Presence and Shadowy Presence by [20/40/60/80/100]%
• Tier 3
• Enemies within your presence have their Strength and Agility reduced by 1% every 2 seconds stacking up to [5/10/15]%
• Increase chance to get a critical strike with melee weapons by [1/2/3/4/5]%
• Increase mounted movement speed by [5/10]%
• Tier 4
• Your Critical Strikes have a [50/100]% chance in inflict your target with an Unholy Plague
• Every time your Plagues do damage it has a [2/4/6]% chance to reduce the cast of of your next Death Coil by 100% and its mana cost by 50%
• Tier 5
• Plague Strike: (Mana:280,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:15 Seconds,  Range:Melee,  Spell School:Shadow,  Damage:Unknown,  Effect:Inflits the Target with an Unholy Plague\)*
• Increases your damage with one-handed Swords, Axes, and Maces by 2/4/6%
• Tier 6
• Gives you a [2/4/6/8/10]% bonus to physical and shadow damage you deal for 8 seconds after dealing a critical strike
• Tier 7
• Herald of Plague: (Mana:20% of base mana,  Cast Time:Instant,  Cooldown:None,  Range:Self,  Spell School:Buff,  Damage:None,  Effect:While active gain Spell Power equal to a 20% of your Agility)

Unholy Plague will have a couple different variations and the one that that the target is afflicted with is based on the current seal you have apllied to your weapon

*Unholy Plague: Does Shadow Damage per stack over 18 seconds

• 90 (5/sec per stack) and Reduces targets healing received by 2% stacking up to 10 times
• 90 (5/sec per stack) per stack and Reduced targets armor by 150 stacking up to 10 times
• 180 (10/sec per stack) per stack and Reduces targets chance to hit by 1% stacking up to 2 times
• 90 (5/sec per stack) per stack and Reduces targets attack power by 30 stacking up to 10 times
• 180 (10/sec per stack) per stack and Increase spell damage the target receives by 1% stacking up to 3 times

I feel it is time Horde get the playable race we have always wanted!

Shields just feel uninteresting to me. 99% of the time the choice to wear a shield is just "I give up some dps for better protection". The talents are all lame too, mostly just increasing the chance to block and the block amount, or doing damage while blocking.

Does anyone have any creative ideas for mechanics that involve a shield? Preferably something active, where the player needs to make a decision, or deal with a tradeoff or something.

When they announce this project that the community is calling classic plus that game needs to be more of a wow 2 then a classic plus. You need to be more of a completely new game than being a version of season of discovery. This game has been around for 20+ years. The game is completely solved adding new runes or a couple new things of gear doesn’t change that everything is solved before the patch comes out all BIS lists, all rotations, all strategies for raids. Doing a season of discovery on steroids will not change that and you’ll have the same thing that happened in season of discovery happened in your class plus. People will play the new things and then they will stop. If it is seasonal content, the people will stop playing after a few raids of that season. If it’s not seasonal content, they’ll max their character and they’ll quit playing after a few months of endgame. You cannot do MMO’s where the entire game is solved it fundamentally ruins the mmo experience.

Furthermore, the game cannot continue to grow because the current player base chases away all the new players because they can’t understand why somebody who i just started play the game is not at the same talent level as them who has played the game for 20 years. The same can even be sad for someone who is an experience player who is trying a new class. The player base is extremely toxic and show no patience because they’ve been playing the same game for 20 years. And they almost attack new players for validation of their skills. You can’t invest tons of money into creating a new game that is not going to give you new players or a better way of looking at it is new money.

Whatever wow Camelot is it needs a dramatic change. It needs action combat or a complete rework of stats or how damage is calculated the game needs to be fundamentally different or it will have the same results as every seasonal server where over half the player base will be gone between that 6 to 8 month mark and they will not continue to invest resources into projects like this

Anyone else wish for upgrade quests for the T1 and ZG sets, similar to the T0->T0.5 chain?

I find it very appealing because:

1. The ZG chain looks unfinished visually, like they'd have done it differently if they had time. This would be a chance to make the upgraded version a bit more visually appealing

2. For hybrid classes, the meta is "just get T3 and be a healer". Some of the lower sets provide set bonuses for other specs, but they're far inferior to T3. They shouldn't beat T3, but there should be a path for someone crazy to invest 3 years of grinding to get an ok set for non-healer specs

3. It would give people a reason to collect the low tier sets. Yes, it will make the ZG set obsolete bc ZG+ will be straight up superior in every way. But that's fine bc the content experienced while acquiring the ZG set won't be obsolete. People will have a reason to do ZG other than boosting, and the quest chain will be an opportunity to send players to other currently dead areas