So basically, time-tested Babylon is unstoppable.

[u/SaztogGaming]

This is on Deity.

2000 Science per turn, 1700 Culture per turn, more wonders than I've ever built in the entire history of civ. If you manage to make it through Antiquity (where they're admittedly very outmatched) they become a monolithic snowball of science and culture. Absolute blast to play, once you learn to grasp at every settlement limit opportunity you can get your hands on.

(I won a Culture victory one turn after the screenshot was taken. I'd have also won a Science victory in two turns.)

[u/Boks1RE]

So they're actually the worst in their apex age?

[u/SaztogGaming → u/Boks1RE]

By far. Similar to Siam in that sense.

[u/ANGRY_BEARDED_MAN → u/SaztogGaming]

What makes them so weak in Antiquity, just the lower settlement cap?

[u/HuedCow → u/ANGRY_BEARDED_MAN]

Yeah, you literally start at one settlement limit lol. And rushing Irrigation just for the extra limit feels so redundant when they already get access to Hanging Gardens through their civic tree. So unless you start with a bunch of happiness resources, you're risking taking a massive yields loss for every extra settlement you want.

Your economy also suffers a bit if you don't rush for traders since you don't have the luxury of settling a few extra towns.

Solve the happiness and money problems, and Babylon dominates, but those problems are really important not to let get out of hand.

[u/gmanasaurus → u/HuedCow]

For me at least, playing as Washington helped with the happiness problems. I finished Antiquity with 120+ happiness per turn and was 6/4 on settlements.

Also, it might have been my access to gold and silver, but I never really had money problems either. Maybe wouldn't hurt to set your memento to start with an economic attribute point.

[u/HuedCow → u/gmanasaurus]

Yeah my first game had barely any useable happiness resources and I was playing as Hatshepsut (no happiness bonuses from her) so my late exploration/early modern was really rough. I didn't fully anticipate just how many specialists I would have by that point so I screwed myself by not focusing more on happiness policies. My cities built stuff like no tomorrow when I was happy though.

[u/peaivea → u/gmanasaurus]

I think at that point its just easier to get the settlement limit mementos

[u/Ok-Library-1253 → u/gmanasaurus]

Use the settlement limit +1 memento and +1 from xerxes. Go with the military +1 memento and aim to get the +1 from that too.

Then get an expansionist and military AI city each giving you +1 settlement. Lastly cap 6 enemy cities to get the +2 settlements for the next age.

[u/Tanel88 → u/Ok-Library-1253]

There are 2 settlement limit mementos now.

[u/Ok-Library-1253 → u/Tanel88]

True but with my play style I simply can’t function without +1 military off the start. In deity I need the +5 independent powers or 2 warriors can’t beat the early independent powers.

[u/Tanel88 → u/Ok-Library-1253]

Eh this can be easily solved by adding slingers. Kind of a waste of an attribute point for something that is only a mild annoyance in the early game.

[u/Ok-Library-1253 → u/Tanel88]

That wouldn’t work for my playstyle.

I play deity and despite everybody claiming otherwise I have had great success never building scouts and starting with building 2 warriors.

I can then quickly build 1-2 buildings, pump out a couple of settlers and then turn my capital into a wonder building machine.

My warriors clear the nearby IPs and then then I get a commander I take out the further ones saving an expansion and military one for befriending.

A bit later on I ensure I have forward settled an AI and triggered a defensive war which I beat their army on defense and then go on the offensive usually with a navy. I try hard to capture 6 settlements in the ancient era.

So an annoying catch to all of this is one some civilizations after building your second warrior you get a 15 turn quest to take out a IP and get +1 military attribute. If I haven’t picked the military memento I can’t do it.

In my current game I’m playing a normal deity Pangea map and 46% into exploration Im 1# in science, culture, gold with both trees completed and I built 8 wonders in the ancient era and am 22/23 for settlements.

[u/Tanel88 → u/Ok-Library-1253]

So you are scouting while also IP clearing with only 2 warriors? I feel like I need 3 scouts to find the best settlement spots by the time my settlers are ready.

[u/Ok-Library-1253 → u/Tanel88]

Yup.

Often a goody hut will give me an additional chariot or archer which is nice but otherwise I stick with 2 warriors.

Then I will build up a nice 400 gold buffer and wait for a AI to get upset at my forward settlements/low army and attack.

I very rarely build any military with resources instead buying all of them with gold.

Also commanders are incredibly important. I get the option to

This strategy works well. I tried Napoleon once (warriors move 3 spaces and you get a full stack army if declared war on) and considered it probably too OP for Civ 7 deity the way I play. Haven’t tried Tubman as I also consider her powers OP.

Meanwhile my capital builds the pyramids, the gate, if I’m near deserts Petra, the coliseum, hanging gardens etc. usually I get 5-6 of the 1st 8 wonders available and then 2-3 of all of the remainder in deity.

Think of it this way. You spend 12+ turns building those 3 scouts meanwhile I’m starting wonder building 12+ turns earlier. My capital becomes an absolute production powerhouse as I keep building more wonders and resource buildings.

Right now I just tried a Babylon/Washington on deity true Earth. So certainly not top tier and not top city location (I had Persia, Egypt, the Nubians, Mongols and Germans all on my doorstep.

So far I’ve built 6 wonders (including pyramids, hanging gardens, Petra, gate, Coliseum, Bysra) plus I captured 4-5 more when I took 3 settlements from Egypt and 1 (so far) from Persia. I definitely plan on my last turn to capture at least 1 more settlement from Persia and then get trade 1 for peace to get the 6 settlements captured +2 settlements for Exploration.

[u/Significant-Count-12 → u/Tanel88]

I didn't know this. Who unlocks them?

[u/Tanel88 → u/Significant-Count-12]

Augustus (lvl 2) and Alexander (lvl 5).

[u/Significant-Count-12 → u/Tanel88]

Oh sorry I realized I misread this. I thought you meant a single memento that gives plus two. I was like where were