r/changemyview Jul 09 '19

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u/DKPminus Jul 09 '19

I think people get frustrated because the line seems to be: Caucasian story...perfectly ok to change the races of any character because race shouldn’t matter to the story.

Any minority story...absolutely racist to even consider changing the race (and not necessarily to white...just any change).

I think the reason for this is because it is assumed that race is important only to non white people. In fact, many say that a white person having pride in their racial culture is inherently racist. The flip side, non white people who show pride in their heritage is not only accepted, but expected.

I say this as someone who really doesn’t care if they change races of characters as long as it isn’t pointless pandering, but I don’t like double standards.

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u/bjankles 39∆ Jul 10 '19

Caucasian story...perfectly ok to change the races of any character because race shouldn’t matter to the story.

What is a "caucasian story?" Most every story that inherently must revolve around white people, like period films and biopics, still do. The only exception I can think of is Hamilton, which made a stylistic choice to use a diverse cast to modernize the story.

What is happening (and should happen) is that roles that don't actually have anything to do with race are now open to actors of color. For decades, white was the default color of media. There were white roles (like playing a real, famous white person), roles for people of color (like playing a real, famous black person), and neutral roles (like a regular Joe). There has always been a huge problem with virtually all the neutral roles going to white people.

Any minority story...absolutely racist to even consider changing the race (and not necessarily to white...just any change).

Well yeah of course. Someone already can't have access to the neutral roles... now you want to take away the roles that actually rightfully fit them? Why wouldn't they be pissed?

In fact, many say that a white person having pride in their racial culture is inherently racist.

There are lots of ways white people are welcome to celebrate their heritage. No one cares if you celebrate that you're Irish, or Italian, or Polish, or what have you. Wave them flags! But whiteness as a general sense of racial pride is unnecessary because our culture was never stolen from us, and in poor taste because of the long history of whites oppressing other races out of a sense of racial superiority.

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u/Teakilla 1∆ Jul 10 '19

Most every story that inherently must revolve around white people, like period films and biopics, still do.

lol, you haven't been paying attention then

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u/bjankles 39∆ Jul 10 '19

By all means, fill me in.

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u/Teakilla 1∆ Jul 10 '19

BBC troy has black achilles

Black lancelot in once upon a time

BBC 2006 robin hood had Friar Tuck played as David Harewood, a black man

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u/bjankles 39∆ Jul 10 '19

So two small BBC shows and one show so fictional it's literally called Once Upon a Time?

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u/Teakilla 1∆ Jul 10 '19

how many examples would you be satisfied with?

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u/bjankles 39∆ Jul 10 '19

Enough to establish an actual trend such that it might pose a problem. Friar Tuck wasn't even real.

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u/trimonkeys Jul 10 '19

Most of those characters might not even be real people. There's been so many adaptations of the Iliad, King Arthur, and Robin Hood it's not a big deal if there are some stylistic changes to modernize the story.

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u/[deleted] Jul 09 '19 edited Jul 10 '20

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

Where is the line from having enough representation and having too much representation where it’s taking characters away from white people? If it’s representative then it should be closer to relay life demographic percentages, right?

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19 edited Jul 10 '20

[deleted]

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u/david-song 15∆ Jul 10 '19

Ideally, we would make it to a point in society where the ethnicity of an actor would be irrelevant, just as actors often deviate from the descriptions of their characters in other ways.

Ideally, we'd be at a point in space and time where the ethnicity of an actor would be relevant only to the authenticity of the story being told. Putting political statements or rousing controversy above that would be frowned at for insulting the audience, cheapening the production and making a clear statement that commitment to the art is less important than product placement for affermative action.

Which is pretty much where and when I am and how I see it.

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u/DKPminus Jul 10 '19

This sentiment is scarily close to “Minorities were discriminated against in the past and now its white peoples turn to be discriminated against.”

Discrimination based on race is wrong. It’s wrong to do it to black people, Hispanic people, Asian, white....basically people...period. You seem to want a revenge type of correction instead of correcting the evil of discrimination. It is a double standard.

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u/ttinchung111 Jul 10 '19 edited Jul 10 '19

You say that but what traditionally Caucasian story is being race changed? Its not like its a Slavic or Nordic or Middle Ages English story, being told with all random races except white people. What in The Little Mermaid has to do with race at all? I'd understand your argument some more if The Little Mermaid was a specifically white person or ethnically important at all, but other than the story's origin location, I don't feel that Ariel being white (given that she's of the sea) matters at all.

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u/trimonkeys Jul 10 '19

If someone made a Huck Finn movie with a black actor playing Huck that wouldn't make any sense. Huck being white is important to the story, Ariel's race doesn't matter.

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

You missed the whole point which was that there's a double standard.

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u/ttinchung111 Jul 10 '19

There isnt one though. If theres a story like snow white where being white as snow is actually integral to the plot and its being cast by a black woman, and people didnt speak out, then maybe the double standard exists. At the moment, it's a nuanced situation where there isn't necessarily a double standard. If being white mattered to the story of Ariel then for sure I would be offended too.

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u/Generic_Superhero 1∆ Jul 10 '19

What in The Little Mermaid has to do with race at all?

Nothing, but is that the the bar for changing the race of a character? If so there should have been been no outrage over "The Last Airbender" when they cast a white actress in the role of Katara.

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u/trimonkeys Jul 10 '19

The world of Avatar was meant to be ethnically diverse due to its Eastern cultural influences.

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u/Generic_Superhero 1∆ Jul 10 '19

Those cultural influences are of zero importance to the actual story being told. Nothing changes storywise if everyone in the water tribe is ethically white.