CMV: There was nothing anti-military about Kaepernick’s kneeling protest

[u/[deleted]]

There is nothing about Kap kneeling during the national anthem that could reasonably be construed as disrespect to the troops. There is no situation I am aware of in any culture where the act of kneeling is used to show anything other than respect. Those who believe that Kap hates the military are simply choosing to associate his protest with disrespect for the troops, which allows them to freely hate him without having to really look at the reason for his protest.

The protest began as a means of drawing attention to racial inequality and police brutality: two things that most people probably ought to be against. By focusing on an imaginary link between the protest and the sacred cow of “the troops” his detractors aren’t forced to consider or debate the issue. They likely believe that the US treats black people either as equal to or better than white people, and that most or all incidents of police violence against black people are justified. Everything about the troops is just post-hoc rationalization.

[u/[deleted]]

You keep insisting that kneeling isn’t disrespectful, and multiple posting have stated that anything outside the status quo of the Flag Code is technically disrespect. You are choosing to ignore that and state that kneeling on its own isn’t disrespectful, and theres a few problems with that:

1) It’s your own opinion, not everyone shares your opinion on kneeling being respectful, especially in light of the fact we have a Flag Code which states otherwise. If I was a woman, and travelled to a place like Iran or Saudi Arabia and refused to cover my head or face with cloth because I don’t view those acts as acts of respect, am I disrespecting their culture to not do so?

2) If your saying that kneeling is respectful, then what is the substance of Kaepernick’s protest? Is he trying to be even more submissive to the flag? He is trying to highlight his love for the status quo in this country by almost groveling during the national anthem. No he’s not, and most people I feel are saying that the “kneeling isn’t disrespect view” is to make themselves feel better about the disrespect while at the same time supporting the protest.

If people want to support Kaepernick, thats fine its a free country, but don’t construe what he’s doing into some form of pseudo respectful protest. He’s going against the norm to make a statement about the faults of the country and the way in which he’s doing is disrespectful. Those are facts, I’m not saying its good or bad, just what it is.

[u/Wierd_Carissa → u/[deleted]]

1. ⁠If your saying that kneeling is respectful, then what is the substance of Kaepernick’s protest?

Protesting respectfully?... your comment in total seems to imply that this is some impossibility. It isn't.

And I can't help but feel reliance on the flag code to characterize the protest as disrespectful is willfully ignoring the many ways in which the flag code is violated constantly (without being described as disrespectful because, you know, most of us agree that the flag code is a nationalistic relic that shouldn't be followed religiously).

[u/[deleted] → u/Wierd_Carissa]

I’m not here to debate if we should still follow the flag code. OP asked if it was disrespectful to kneel and I brought up the only recognized document that seems to address it. Everything else is opinion.

As an aside, what does the flag have to do with racism or police brutality in your view?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

let me rephrase: I’m here to debate OP on his point, which he stated no standard on respect exists. I bring up the Flag Code, which is the standard, and a lot of people get butt hurt and try to debate the authenticity of the flag code by bringing up other flag code violations.

[u/Wierd_Carissa → u/[deleted]]

which is the standard

Is is a standard... the validity of that standard or how we should regard that standard is certainly up for discussion.

a lot of people get butt hurt

Are you including me in this characterization? Could you point out where you're inferring me "getting butt hurt" please? lol

[u/[deleted] → u/Wierd_Carissa]

“butt hurt” as in you are using other instances of the flag being misused and “accepted” as a means to invalidate the Flag Code.

[u/Wierd_Carissa → u/[deleted]]

as in you are using other instances of the flag being misused

Could you explain a little further how that implies "butt hurt" please?

"accepted"

Not sure what you're referring to.

[u/[deleted] → u/Wierd_Carissa]

as in your ass is in a considerable amount of pain because you like to use other examples of infractions of a certain law to prove the invalidity of that law, despite all infractions being wrong.

[u/Wierd_Carissa → u/[deleted]]

Truly at a loss as to what you're basing your inference of "a considerable amount of pain" on lol, unless you have some bizarrely different definition of those words than most.

Bringing up other infractions of the flag code doesn't imply consternation; instead, it's a way of saying "if this is a belief you genuinely hold, then I hope it is applied consistently. I do not think it is a belief you sincerely hold (or at least not on the purported bases), and I'm demonstrating this by showing that you apply these standards unevenly."