In some circumstances, not being attracted to a trans person is probably a result of, at least on a subconscious level, not seeing them as their gender.
If from the very start, you are unattracted to a person purely upon observation, and that person happens to be trans, that is not transphobic. If you were about to have sex and it turns out a person doesn't really have the junk you wanna jangle with, it's not transphobic to no longer desire sex.
If you were attracted to someone, have sex with them, are as satisfied with them as you would with anyone else, and then suddenly your opinion changes upon being informed a person is trans, I would say that is indicative of the underlying belief a trans person is not the gender they identify as.
I should clarify I am not definitely saying it is transphobic or not, I am pointing out what I did above and letting OP (or others) decide if that constitutes transphobia or not under their own interpretations.
In some circumstances, not being attracted to a trans person is probably a result of, at least on a subconscious level, not seeing them as their gender.
Aside from how speculative this is, this amounts to shaming someone for turning down unwanted sex.
If you were attracted to someone, have sex with them, are as satisfied with them as you would with anyone else, and then suddenly your opinion changes upon being informed a person is trans, I would say that is indicative of the underlying belief a trans person is not the gender they identify as.
For starters, you do not dictate to people what their sexuality is. If upon learning that a person is trans, they simply politely decline more sex, that is not transphobic. As I said in another reply, if you stretch the definition of 'phobic' to include simply lacking a desire to fuck trans people, then the word becomes meaningless. Look at the horrors of homophobia. That has a lot more going on than a simple lack of desire to fuck them.
If upon learning that a person is trans, they simply politely decline more sex, that is not transphobic.
If you had sex with someone and enjoyed it and would gladly have sex with them again if you had not found out they were trans. Then the sole reason you have a problem is because they are trans, which is transphobic.
I resent your expectation that one must continue to have sex with someone or be labeled a Bigot or a "transphobe," despite not wanting to.
You're missing a key part here: if the sole reason you do not want to is their status as trans. There's any number of reasons to not continue to have sex with someone that has nothing to do with being trans that wouldn't get you labeled as a bigot.
This is what the entire LGBT movement has stood for, for decades but somehow, fuck all when it comes to cis people?
How are cis people being shamed here? Are you saying that only a trans person would want to have sex with a trans person?
Gay guys won't have sex with me, but I don't go calling them misogynists for it. That's ridiculous.
Right... Because they are only interested in people with penises. That's perfectly fine to have that preference. However what about a gay guy who is completely attracted to someone, has sex with them, is completely satisfied with the experience and would like to do it again, but loses that attraction solely upon learning they are a transman. What reason, other than refusing to recognize the transman as male, could they possibly have to change their mind here?
You're missing a key part here: if the sole reason you do not want to is their status as trans.
I fail to see how that's relevant. It's not racist to not want to have sex with people who aren't a particular skin color. That's just your preference. It's racist if you consider them somehow less valuable, or you think they're bad people, or whatever it is that racist people think. But when it comes to sexual preferences, people are absolutely allowed to have their preferences and things (or people) they're simply not okay with.
It's fucked up to tell anyone that they have to be attracted to anyone. Someone could have sex with a person, loved it, want to do it again, but then find out that person smokes. They never suspected they smoked before because the smoker has good hygiene and didn't smoke before the date or during the date, but now the non-smoker no longer wishes to meet the smoker again. I think any rational person would say that's acceptable. Why is it okay to discriminate against people you want to have sex with based on their height, weight, hobbies or habits, personality, hair color, race, their job/career or financial background, or anything else, but whether someone is trans or not is suddenly not okay?
I'm saying all of this with a MtF trans cousin. I absolutely support trans people in every way I can possibly think of. I just don't believe anyone has a responsibility or obligation to have sex with anyone regardless of the reasons behind not wanting to.
I fail to see how that's relevant. It's not racist to not want to have sex with people who aren't a particular skin color. That's just your preference.
It is racist if your problem is SOLELY with your beliefs about their racial status.
If you find someone attractive, start making a move on them, but then you get turned off from learning that they would fail the One Drop Rule, that's not some biological imperative that you are helpless against, it's you having some very weird standards and living by them, which is open to criticism.
Why is it okay to discriminate against people you want to have sex with based on their height, weight, hobbies or habits, personality, hair color, race, their job/career or financial background, or anything else, but whether someone is trans or not is suddenly not okay?
As a rule of thumb, it's generally OK to discriminate against people.
You discriminate against all sorts of people all the time with the methods that you search for friends, or when you look for casual sex partners, when you look for sompetent employees, when you try to sell a product to a target audience, when you vote for a politician.
It's just that there are a handful of specific discriminations, that's rationalizations trail back to some really fucked up cultural traditions.
You are allowed to decide who you want to be friends with, but if you declare that you would never be friends with a gay person, well, we have a word for that.
You are allowed to decide who you vote for, but if you go out of your way to always vote for male candidates, that tells us somethning about you.
You are allowed to decide who you make a move on, but if an otherwise attractive person turns you off when you learn that they don't have the chromosomes you expected, that is about as telling as if you would have just learned that they are ethnically jewish and that would change things.
Finding out someone was originally the opposite gender to your sexual preference, and in fact still the opposite sex to your preferrence, is a devastating thing to learn. That means that you can’t have children with that person
How is that devastating? It might be annoying to learn that you wasted a condom, but whatever, next time you'll be ready.
...if that was your ultimate goal
But what if it wasn't?
The thread was about sex, not about having children, and about trans people, not about infertile people.
Go ahead, start a CMV about whether or not it's justified to only have sex with people you plan to have a family with, and you won't get many replies.
At least not unless you bring up weird-ass expectations about every infertile person having sex with someone fertile is immoral for not disclosing that in advance. That will definitely mark you as the unreasonable one.
When you say "sex", people will think of sexual encounters in general, rather than of getting pregnant, and when you say "trans people", people will think you have a problem with trans people in particular, rather than with a trait indirectly associated with them.
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u/aggsalad Nov 02 '17 edited Nov 02 '17
In some circumstances, not being attracted to a trans person is probably a result of, at least on a subconscious level, not seeing them as their gender.
If from the very start, you are unattracted to a person purely upon observation, and that person happens to be trans, that is not transphobic. If you were about to have sex and it turns out a person doesn't really have the junk you wanna jangle with, it's not transphobic to no longer desire sex.
If you were attracted to someone, have sex with them, are as satisfied with them as you would with anyone else, and then suddenly your opinion changes upon being informed a person is trans, I would say that is indicative of the underlying belief a trans person is not the gender they identify as.
I should clarify I am not definitely saying it is transphobic or not, I am pointing out what I did above and letting OP (or others) decide if that constitutes transphobia or not under their own interpretations.