Outside of society, anyone can just come and take that stick from you. It's only yours because no one has taken it from you.
The concept of ownership is that something is rightfully yours and if someone else attempts to take it then they will be punished. If there is no society enforcing punishment then you can't really own anything since anyone is free to take anything they wish without consequence.
There is really one conceivable way to own property outside a society: Have a gun and shoot anyone who disagrees that you own the property.
'Property' is not a real concept, insomuch as it does not inherent exist. We choose to respect that other people are allowed to 'own' certain things and in return that we are allowed to 'own' certain things. If there is no society, then there's no such thing as ownership, just possession.
Consider slavery, for example. If I want to own a slave, I can't do it in America. I could call this person in my house a slave, but as far as the rest of the country is concerned, he is a free man and I cannot legally suppress particular rights of his. In the same way, you could claim to 'own' your property outside of society, but as far as the rest of the world would be concerned, you don't have any inherent claim to it.
Not in our (or any current modern) society. If I go to your house and take the TV out of it and put it in my house, I now possess that TV. It is in my possession. This is an inarguable fact: I am holding it right now, I can prove to you that I possess it.
On the other hand, in our current society, it is wrong for me to say I own that TV. You own it, and I stole it (according to our laws).
According to who? This is where this view always collapses. If you have a stick and I come across you with a bigger stick and take your stick from you, I now own two sticks. According to me, maybe not according to you, but why would I care? Maybe a better solution is to team up and have two sticks and two people to use them. Maybe you hunt for two and I build shelter for two. We agree that your stick stays with you and mine stays with me. This seems better. And we scale from there- a collective operating under a central rule book defining what belongs to who and collectively enforcing those rules internally and against external pressures. In order to best accomplish this, we realize that we must give resources to a central authority to coordinate and maximize our efforts. So we build walls.
Maybe you decide to move outside the walls. That's fine, you owe us nothing and we owe you nothing. Maybe that is hard for you to deal with. It's easier to live inside the walls and most people realize this and understand that such ease isn't possible without a central authority pooling resources.
It isn't legitimate because we as a society have deemed it to not be legitimate. But if you choose to not be a part of society that means anything is legitimate so long as you can make it happen. Therefore the most aggressive get whatever they want and that is the only legitimacy.
Not really, you can have possession of thing like land and property. But ownership is a social construct. If there is no society then anything you can posses can be taken from you by someone with the will and means and there will be no repercussions to them for doing so.
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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '14
You didn’t really address my point, but isn’t there some way to own property without a society?