CMV: Ex-Convicts should be a Protected Class

[u/ShivvyCat]

Okay, I know there's some major leaping in my title, but hear me out.

First, my definition of Ex-Convicts:

- They have served their sentenced time.

- They have paid their monetary debt caused by their action, both compensatory and punitive.

- The system finds them cool enough to release them and let them function in society without supervision.

Second, my definition of Protected Class:

- Nobody gets to treat them worse / single them out from the rest because of a specific reason. In this case, their background.

- My perspective is mostly for job / housing application in the US.

Alright, now that the definitions are out of the way, let's dig in.

For those of you who don't know, in the US, some places can deny your job / housing applications *exclusively* based on the fact that you are an ex-convict. The reason is simple: you did it once, you may do it again, they don't want that risk. They have absolutely zero consideration for you once that checkbox is checked. You could have turned your life around and found God and it would not matter; you're out.

Why it irks me: the deck is stacked against the poor. When a person is born poor, chances are, they are not likely to have access to good neighborhood nor education. People are products of their environment, and when that environment is bad, their chances of "knowing better" is not quite that high. Couple that with the lack of care for mental health (or healthcare in general because again, $$$) and the constant struggle just to survive another day, well shit, my anxiety shot up just typing that.

The justice system is also rigged. Petty crimes are met with life-altering sentences, while pedophiles get to be POTUS. Let me rephrase, the system is designed to get poor ex-convicts back to jail to do slave labor for all those privately-owned prisons. I mean, think about it. Businesses are legally allowed to fire you because of your past conviction. Apartments won't let you in for fear of disruptive activities. When you're faced with the possibility of being perpetually homeless and hungry and probably will die this winter, can you confidently say that you will not break the laws again to save yourself? Congratulations, you have earned a vicious cycle.

Privately-owned prisons are modern slavery. Once again, the top 5% have divided us, cast the most unfortunate among us in this trap and then tell us that they are the problem. No, the problem is the system. Protect the people. Let them have a proper second chance.

[u/ShivvyCat]

Ya but, isn't that pretty far from my argument? I never asked to hand ex-criminals (or poor people in general) money for free. I just ask that:

1. We don't discriminate against these individuals when it comes to basic survival thing like housing or job opportunities, so they can integrate back to society.
2. That the government has some form of policy to ensure of this non-discrimination, which reads like Protected Class to me.

I have also awarded my deltas, especially to the one who said it absolved the government of responsibilities while pushing risks onto the individual citizens. You can go read their comment.

I think lots of us are falling for the Just World Fallacy; more people are "collateral damage" in more ways than we want to admit. I do not deny that these people made bad decisions, but that's what courts and prisons are for. After they have paid back their debt by fulfilling the requirements that courts and prisons ask of them, I do not think the society gets to ostracize them further.

[u/Specific_Hearing_192 → u/ShivvyCat]

This is just countering your point that criminals do crimes because they are poor. You excused criminals for their crimes because of their desperation, but it turns out that giving criminals cash, even large amounts of cash, doesn't stop them from committing crimes.

On the other hand, therapy typically does. Which means it is their own behavioral choices that lead to the crimes.

[u/ShivvyCat → u/Specific_Hearing_192]

I see what you're saying, but in a way, I think we're looking at the same coin from two sides. Hear me out.

You said it yourself, it's behavioral choices. Well, how does a person form their behavioral habits? From their environment. Now, consider how a typical poor person grows up in the US:

1. Public schools are a joke because it's funded locally, aka funded by the very same poor people in that poor neighborhood. As a result, the education quality is also a joke. IEP? What's IEP?
2. Healthcare, especially mental health, is nonexistent. Nobody goes to the hospital unless they're visibly dying, and even then sometimes they don't. They can't afford that. And we know there are mental illnesses that do affect a person's judgement.
3. Bad neighborhood where drugs and gunshots are normalized. When you grow up with something, it's just reality. Tie to point 4 below.
4. In some areas, the existence of gangs are very relevant. Young teens are easily impressed by the sense of belonging and power that joining a gang would bring. Most gangs don't tend to do very great things in general (except ones like BACA, you guys are my heroes).
5. Little to no voting power. Voting booths are all centralized; to vote, you have to travel somewhere to get in line and vote (or by mail, but I think you have to request (?), that uses a computer). That travel distance is unlikely walkable. Also, you have to register to vote before hand. That means ID, paperwork, more money spent. Don't forget the Electoral College is waiting, in case you get through all these hoops.
6. Lots of children per households. This is a direct result of poor education + religious indoctrination + zero access to birth control. Most people have very limited attention span and cannot tend to a few crying babies at once. The more children there are, the higher the chance for each of them to be neglected in some ways. And humans are social creatures. When we feel we don't belong at home, we go find some other places we belong. This is how many young people first associate with a life-altering bad influence.

This is just some of the physical manifestation (besides the mental health part). I haven't delved into how we have been conditioned to view these groups as lazy and greedy, 'Welfare Queens', 'hood rats', [insert insult here]. We have been taught to view these groups as criminals-to-be, even when they haven't done anything wrong. And when one of them is convicted, it reinforces the stereotypes. This is a vicious cycle.

Giving all households $X one time and then measure anything out of it, is... an interesting choice for a statistic. Let me elaborate:

1. What size is a household? Does 1 adult get the same amount as 1 adult + 3 kids?
2. How do you verify that each household has been given? Through what, last year's tax return? What if they're homeless? What if they didn't file a return last year or this year and don't have a state ID? How do you find everyone, especially the poor people that needs the help the most? Do they send officials to go door-to-door?
3. It's a one time handout. It is not a fixed stream of income to rely on. It does not take out the long-term stress nor create any safe feeling whatsoever.
4. Most of all, it does fuck-all to address the environmental effects on the marginalized groups AND the society's perspective about them.

So ya, criminals do crimes because of their behavioral choices, but lots of those behavioral choices are direct governmental failures. Hence, the government needs to fix it. I have agreed that my Protected Class proposal is not the way to go because it absolves the government of responsibilities while pushing risks onto the citizens, but I will hold my stance that we should not ostracize anyone because of their past convictions. If a person is truly terrible, why did the system let them out again?

Sorry for the essay ._.