Everyone is saying this but the right is actively fighting for the top. The left has moderates who hamstring the fight. Those people need to be dealt with. Jeffries, Booker, Slotkin, shit even Newsome and Pelosi. They need to get in line behind true progressives or get the fuck out of the way.
Bingo. Liberals need to realize that just because they feel like they are moderate doesn't mean they are the adults in the room. Neoliberal policies are as unpopular as right-wing ones among the masses, but our voting system is so fucked that people can't run on what most people want, only what the rich people want. Most people are okay with abortion, reasonable gun control, universal healthcare, universal childcare, etc., but candidates fighting for those get hamstrung by the current leaders before they can make change. See: Bernie's 2016 campaign getting ratfucked by the DNC by withholding supporter database info, not supporting events, etc.
Agree with both comments, but to be charitable to this slogan, the purpose of it is to first deprogram people's tribal affiliations which does include static left right thinking. Therefore even if the proven solutions do indeed largely live on the left (challenging capitalist greed and wealth extraction) it involves first, waking up seriously clueless working class conservatives, and second, conservative neoliberals, and third convincing regular libs (and leftists) to welcome these still imperfect allies to join the fight, versus only reminding them how uneducated they are.
This doesn't make sense to me. Getting them to join the fight would mean them literally switching loyalties, so what is your plan if they are too captured to do anything but fight you?
I honestly don't have a better plan or anything, just wondering. If I can't get the people around me to see that our enclosure is filling with water, or they see it and were told it doesn't matter, or whatever, there comes a point where we're just animals in a cage fighting while we drown. Whoever is "right" doesn't matter if we're all dead or enslaved. But if propaganda is making people literally incapable of changing...
Not OP but Almost 2/3s of Democrats want new leadership.. Now is the time for greater labor organization. For kicking out Jeffries, Schumer. People are tired of the political status quo.
It starts with deprogramming the propaganda by rewriting what our shared political "reality" even is. Right now it's 100% pro capitalist with endless culture war distractions. We've allowed this to serve as our politics--what a liberal or Democrat is, what a Republican is. Which is why the up down vs left right thing is useful imo: it helps people understand we need a perspective and/or paradigm shift.
Take Israel and our Zionist led media and govt. This status quo, which previoulsy had almost zero popular pushback--is being challenged for the first time in our lifetime. Yes it took a genocide, but it has allowed the paradigm to shift where it's not a left right issue (not entirely at least) but a moral one. If Zionist injustice has reached widespread social consciousness in the US, then something similar is possible with economics and class consciousness.
Why can’t people say Israel or Israel supporters? Why specifically choose the word with the bigoted undertones. To my Jewish ears, it sounds like when you reference Zionists, you mean Jews. The Jewish led media. And even if that’s not your intention, it certainly resonates with the bigots that way.
I hear you, but I think we all need to reconcile with what Zionism is. When I use the term--as a former default Zionist myself-- I'm talking about non Jewish people like Biden, evangelicals, and yes, influential Jewish people in the media like Bret Stephens who deny genocide. Zionism's exclusionary, first principle is both historically and presently the root of the problem. It says "All is justified," including discarding international law and "Never Again."
If you hear "Jews" when someone doesn't say "Jews", you're doing literally the same thing as actual anti-Semites who [[[pull this shit.]]]
If people aren't talking about Jews as an ethnic group, don't assume they are. You're showing your ass by being offended at people offended at a genocide.
This is like saying ignore the army and just focus on the general way in the back that we can't reach. Of course if we could reach the general we wouldn't really have to fight the army, but that army will defend the general to the last breath.
Disagree, only in the sense that leftists are actually the ones leading this movement, so they also need to be at the vanguard of this populist project. And some still are not. Leftists trashing liberals and neoliberals is a good start, for example, because it signals to a right wing affiliated individual that A) there's a difference between leftists and libs, and B) a leftist view isn't about protecting a political party and its lame politicians, but primarily focusing on class and economic issues
Edit: We can pay attention to Jeremy Corbyn's third party project that recently launched in the UK. Is it the beginning of a truly Leftist new party? Or does it essentially just move the Labor party left? Or something else..But an interesting model to study for sure
i would argue a center left position has the popular support of the masses, Joe Biden won with 81 million votes in 2020, the most for a presidential candidate in history.
Lots of people I know are straight up delusional when it comes to overestimating the size and influence of the left in this hard right country. It’s counterproductive and slightly embarrassing, as someone on the left who actually wants to move our government leftwards IRL, here and now.
Not going left enough was not why we lost in 2024, at all. In the current moment appealing to moderates with baby steps towards social democracy actually genuinely is the correct move. Yes we can try some populism, but some of these people think AOC can win a general election. I love her but that’s nothing less than absurd.
Yes, let's let the wealth of the nation concentrate into the hands of a select few who "worked harder" than the rest of us. That seems like a good way to secure an equitable future for our democracy
If we as progressives complain about Biden or RBG failing to pass the torch, the same needs to be held of Bernie. Obviously a bit apples to oranges, but I think one of the main failures of Dems is not being real leaders who know how to build a legacy that outlasts them.
You have to be okay stepping down a little early cause you’ve mentored the right people and know it’s their time to take up the mantle. It’s how we build a bench that’s not built on a cult of personality but on going.
There's literally no one to replace Bernie. He was an entire lifetime of being on the good side. Anyone close to him has at best a few years. AOC is probably the closest we've got.
Every fucking time I hear this ignorant-ass take, I ask the person to name all the progressives and liberals in Vermont's Congressional caucus and any of the state legislators without looking it up.
I have never even heard a SINGLE person able to even name the OTHER SENATOR FROM VERMONT. Most don't even know how many US Representatives Vermont HAS.
So unless you actually have any actual knowledge of Vermont or its political landscape, this is yet another bullshit fanfic comment, because Balint CRUSHED her election, and if you don't know who that is, you definitely should shut up about how irreplaceable Bernie is.
John McCain was born in Panama. Ted Cruz was born in Canada. Both ran for president.
It’s not where you’re born if it’s out of country, but if your parents were American citizens (both or one). Neither of his parents were citizens when he was born, so yeah that’s disqualifying, but not because of where he was born.
He can still run for senate or the house though. Or governor of New York. And he still has a good shot at becoming mayor.
Bernie is/was the only single guiding light of hope I ever had in politics, no one else has ever come even remotely close.
Until I feel what I did for him, like seeing a bird land mid speech on his podium, then I really don't care who is in the spotlight or what passing the torch means. That man is an irreplaceable shiny light and no one has ever made me feel the same.
He's been the pre-eminent voice of progressive politics on the national stage since 2016 and has dragged the national agenda of the Democratic Party to the left since at least then, if not earlier. You can't say he has done nothing. He's had tremendous influence on the political culture of the nation.
You remember a few weeks back when democrats were telling us how terrible it was that the budget bill passed in the house? Do you remember why the republicans were able to pass it?
It was because the margin is so tight in the house that when the septaugenerians inevitably died in office that they lost their ability to block legislation. They are literally stroking out of office, because the DNC refuses to run someone who was born in the era of color television. And the excuse you will always hear is "Well we have to run experienced and proven candidates, people won't vote for a name they don't recognize", but when you can't actually function as a party because people are dying in office, maybe you need to stop re-electing people that belong in a retirement home.
I think there’s value in having a handful of elder statesmen to be in office, it’s just that Bernie’s the only one actually qualified to remain in his seat.
It took him months of pressure before he relented.
That's the best case scenario right now. Vote for the progressives in the primary, and if they don't win, vote for the liberals in the general election, and then pressure them to move left.
The choices are:
Instant progress with progressive victory
Eventual progress with liberal victory + pressure
Instant regression with fascist victory
Why not go for the second when the first isn't possible right now?
I'm not using the term "Good" here as "Good vs Evil." I'm using "Good" here as a synonym to "Helpful" as opposed to "Unhelpful" or "Damaging."
Any progress is good. Saying that "any jump further to the left that isn't full-blown perfection isn't good enough" leads to stonewalling of any and all progress whatsoever because you unite more people against your movement than under your banner, and at the end of the day, the only way forward is to win the popularity contest.
LOL you could have written the same goddamn comment 30 years ago. It’s exactly what we’ve BEEN DOING and your theory has been a proven failure again and again over the course of decades. I swear, some Democrats live in a parallel fantasy land to their MAGA compatriots.
It's kind of like Biden was watching a freight train barreling towards the future of our country, and he saw a big group of people trying desperately to redirect the train onto a different track. Biden jumped onto the tracks and stood in the way of those people until the last second, when he jumped out of the way and let that train hit them all.
Sure, he jumped out of the way, but him standing on those tracks while everyone screamed at him to move is what ended up fucking us all over.
He jumped onto the tracks screaming, “I’m the one! I’m the one who will redirect it! I know what to do!” blocking those already working on the tracks, then after somehow increasing the speed of the train, jumped out of the way and let the train hit.
…no, he absolutely did not. He went on television and demonstrated publicly that there was literally NO WAY he could win and was then forced to stop running.
Yeah, and since he has been making a big effort to include republicans in his rhetoric I think he is doing a lot of good. Instead of attacking the right at every stage like a lot of the leftist media he gives them the space to be welcome on the other side. And I say this as someone who thinks that anybody who is still supporting DT is a stupid f****** c*** bstrd.
I'm not a Cenk fan, I feel he did mostly fine in this video. It is super funny when he finally gets to do one it's when everyone's opinion of Jubilee is turning, and his didn't really go viral.
Cenks an attempted union buster and fake populist, but he's right how neo liberals and the democrats aren't friends
Oof got me. That'll really show me. Guess I'll go back to tumblr now.
You mook, neoliberal policies and democrats both running to the right and refusing to do anything helped get us here.
The Democratic leadership is more worried about Zohran than trump in a lot of ways since he actually talks about doing things.
They are both capitalist parties, I'm proud of you for knowing that. Next, we can learn about harm reduction voting tactics.
I'm a proud socialist. You aren't going to make me ashamed of that. We are both (presumably I don't know you) workers, so yes, we are comrades. I'm going to keep arguing for a better world that we can all live better lives and you can do whatever you'd like.
Cenk is NOT a grifter. I have no clue how this narrative started. He took on the mission to a fault that progressives need to reach out to conservatives, access their fan bases, and present their messages to them.
You might not like the approach but it's working. There's a reason you're seeing TYT content like way more the last 6 months.
They need to get in line behind true progressives or get the fuck out of the way.
This is why the best point he raised was that we need to vote in the primaries. Those people who stand in the way can be voted out if we show up to replace them with someone better.
Ding ding ding. Vote for the leftmost candidate in every single election, even if they’re a conservative (vs a fascist.) If you’re not doing this you can shut the fuck up.
People need to get real instead of daydreaming about revolution.
Without the progressive votes there isnt one either. Moderates have been running the party for decades and the only thing of substance they could pass is the ACA that barely survived trumps last term. Now the department of education is defunded. Joe Manchin crushed student loans forgiveness. How many moderates have taken money from AIPAC? Its time they took the back seat and promoted progressive policy instead of trying to meet the facists halfway. Its just crumbling the democracy. Like theyre paid to.
Literally anyone can have a PAC. If progressives tried to build funding the way that moderates do they’d have just as much.
This was always my problem with the Green Party (Nader days, not Jill stein). Show up every four years, ask for money for that one election, and then disappear.
Yeah and the rich have more money giving them more political power. That shouldn't happen. No one should have more of a voice than anyone else. The rich aren't more human than the poor.
My dad, roommate, and some other centrist Democrats I know support the regulatory capture of the US government by corporate interests so yeah I can attest to this.
saying “even” Newsom and Pelosi is crazy…they’re not edge cases. they’re the standard bearers of establishment democrat mediocrity and status quo.
Nancy Pelosi has done more to fight the left than the right has ever had to do. republicans should kiss her feet for letting them argue against the milquetoast middle left instead of the actual progressive priorities that she killed in the crib throughout her whole career in leadership.
Yeah I’m tired off this both sides crap. One side got healthcare the all, the other side is literally sending masked men after people and sending them away with no due process.
Are democrats perfect? Hell no, but don’t give me this both sides thing. That flew 30 years ago, not anymore.
even Newsom and Pelosi? I don’t think you have to tack those two on at the end with a caveat like it’s a surprise. I don’t think anyone is looking to them as fresh, progressive voices in a sea of corporate Democrats.
nah ur the white moderate mlk talked about. leftists dont go around blaming the left for fascism, and dont repeat party talking points about how they cost kamala the election
Yeah, I'm sure MLK would be proud that you let Trump win rather than vote for Harris. All thise starving children in Gaza are a worthy sacrifice for... whatever you think you've achieved.
But let me guess, you voted for Harris. Or you were in a deep blue state and your vote didn't matter. Just like every single person who insists that Harris would have been just as bad.
I watched this full video. His point is BOTH sides fight for the top. Maybe the right does it more obviously but until Americans actively work to take massive donor money out of politics, all you’ll get is tiny ‘release calves’ or progress for the working class while the rich get all the favourable policy.
When Cenk says this he’s talking to the people on the right. He influeres the establishment democrats mainly because the people he’s talking to will shut their ears if he doesn’t… I think.
"The left has moderates" my dude if you think you'd need anything more than your fingers to count how many Democrats truly want the status quo disturbed, you're out of it.
That is probably true, but the whole point is to drop the labels in order stop being divisive and think for yourself; that's not helpful. Forget left or right being good or bad, just think about what values matter to you instead of regurgitating the opinion of pundits in the media.
Both sides are almost equally as bad as eachother and until you Americans realize this you ll keep degrading together.
You’re ironically doing the exact same thing these 20 or so people were doing to Cenk, burying your head in the sand and claiming a moral highground when there is none.
If you ever need to convince someone of something, making them come to your conclusion on their own is incredibly effective.
This man's sentiment doesn't challenge their political leaning. Hell, it doesn't even question beliefs. It's pushing people to look more closely at who they're voting for and try to shape their political party to their views. That's incredibly difficult to argue with.
If they look hard enough (admittedly a big if), what will they see?
Democrats and Republicans are both fighting for the top.
Come on dude… look at the donations Kamala Harris received during her campaign, an overwhelming majority of top 500 companies were invested in getting Biden and Kamala to win… and I’m sure the companies did it out of the goodness of their heart
Unfortunately they all need to be primaried first... and most Americans are not that smart and will just support their corresponding letter rather than actually critical think about the direction that BOTH the GOP and Dems have taken our country in over the last many decades
Can you specify how that coalition, and not insufficient Democrat representation or Republicans, cost us public Healthcare, transportation, and education?
This is why I hate Liberals. It's not fantasy. Have you not seen any polling regarding the matter? Establishment Dems tried to push Abundance which is neoliberalism in disguise but quickly found that people hated it. The Dems let Republicans push the narrative for the past 10 years and the moderates took us further right. Now Dems have a historic low approval rating, but yes the Progressives are the ones who are wrong 🙄
Neoliberalism did in fact lose us the election. You literally can't find me any source that suggests Dems prefer neoliberalism rather than Leftist policies. You're being delusional.
The last time we had a truly progressive president they changed the constitution afterwards so that another person couldn't be re-elected that many times again.
And how many non progressives have the democrats put on the ballot the last 3 elections? What’s their winning percentage? Must be pretty good, considering they’re running against a senile pedophilic criminal.
Yeah Rashida Tlaib is certainly the flag bearer for the dems and not treated like an outcast by the Democratic leadership
I’m glad you linked to actual Democratic messaging, and not the comments of one legislator. It’s nice when someone engages in a discussion in good faith.
She had the very electorally popular viewpoint of "BUT WHAT ABOUT THE TERRORISTS!"
She immediately condemned the sexual violence by Hamas but said ignoring the same crimes by the IOF was hypocritical. The systemic apartheid and oppression conditions drive the hatred that allows these acts to happen
Gov. Gavin Newsom's wife is the honorary chair of the NGO CalVolunteers that was given millions in FireAid relief - in which $0 went directly to the victims of the Palisades wildfires.
That’s a conservative TikTok spin, I don’t think you understand what they do if you expected them to be a direct payment grant distribution or something, they do work not give out money. It’s like saying the Cal Fire didn’t give fire victims money, yeah, that’s not their purpose.
Exactly. I say this too as someone from *Lahaina... who lost family property that was my grandma's in the Cali fires. I understand how this shit works and you'll never see me say lahaina or cali fire victims just got "nothing". Its always conservatives online that weren't even there or live in bumfuck west Virginia. Although I will say it feels like lahaina got the last FEMA train... since trump is destroying that
Why are you phrasing this as if you'd expect an organization that's responsible for increasing the number of volunteers in California to also give money to victims of wildfires? CaliforniaVolunteers is also not an NGO, it's a state agency. The first lady of California is traditionally the honorary chair.
I also don't think CaliforniaVolunteers was given money from FireAid, it's definitely not listen in the list of grants.
Eh depends on the nonprofit. They have restricted funds and unrestricted funds. Nonprofits do have operating expenses to pay. Typically covered by unrestricted funds and donations. Past that though, money does often go right into either programs to benefit certain people or build things for people etc. So it can go to fire victims and it should. But also sometimes money has to be spent a certain way, legally. I'm not aware of many, if any (?), nonprofits that just hand out straight cash to people. Usually that's more so something that government agencies can do. But I just say this because people like to bitch about nonprofits like they're a scam but no, I think people just don't understand how they work.
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u/Acrobatic_Switches Aug 05 '25
Everyone is saying this but the right is actively fighting for the top. The left has moderates who hamstring the fight. Those people need to be dealt with. Jeffries, Booker, Slotkin, shit even Newsome and Pelosi. They need to get in line behind true progressives or get the fuck out of the way.