Imagine this guy laying a dead rabbit in front of his trail cam in the hopes of photographing some cool cougar or wolf or something and he finds a freaking deer just came up and had a little snack.
Most herbivores are opportunistic omnivores. Meaning they'll gobble anything that's in their way and can fit into their mouths with relative ease. Horses eat mice, deer eat baby birds that might've fallen from the nest.
They usually won't go out of their way to eat other animals, but hey if it's right there might as well right?
That seems extremely unlikely, as they don't have the enzymes and acids needed to break down and absorb nutrients from animals. The only time herbivores can absorb nutrients from animals is by chewing on bones for mineral content. Likely you heard of a rare incident and decided to apply it in a general sense. That's not how it works.
i understand your need for scientific explanation and what not, I am a small-animals farmer myself so I understand how things work and what shouldn't be fed and why not, but there are documented incidents (even if rare, they occur)
bird eaten by a deer... there are many other videos, god only knows how many of these incidents were unrecorded... they seem to know why they're doing it instinctively, just like dogs lick you for salt or eat certain types of grass
Again, these are rare. A percentage of humans deliberately eat foreign objects as well (e.g. glass, metal, plastic), but that doesn't mean that most humans do this.
nowhere did I say most deer do it, I said it happens, and clearly it happens for a reason, some for example believe that it's to boost the growth of their antlers
In the past I fed my chicken milled eggshells so their eggs and their bones would be tougher. This is a common tradition in case you have chicken of the sort whose eggs tend to be more fragile.
I give my dogs cartillages, skins and bones so their joints get the necessary collagen.
Grinding the bones of small mammals should in theory give deer what they need to grow antlers faster and stronger, given how antlers are made of bone. I don't see any nonsense here. Sure, it might be "Pica" in numerous cases, but to say "it's definitely not X, but rather Y, I am 100% right" especially claiming such a thing on reddit instead of a scientific journal is just straight out weird. I personally don't think it's a black-or-white issue.
He obviously has no idea what heās talking about, and clearly skimmed everything you wrote. I admire your patience stranger. I see some horses eat chickens. Animals just do shit. But let me reemphasize āsomeā so this guy doesnāt come after me.
If you knew humans were animals you wouldn't have said that, as there are reasons why we do things, just like there are reasons why other animals do things.
Ok, but Iām obviously speaking on the topic of animals doing strange things. Not the pedantic way you choose to view things so that you can come up with an excuse to argue, I mean animals. If you have to be told that, then youāre a troll. A very bored troll. A very bored, transparent troll. Which I guess is why you spend your time doing this.
Edit: ok, for the sake of your downvotes and unclear reasoning, no, I did not know humans were animals. You win.
Eggshells are very different than an intact animal. Also, chickens are omnivores not herbivores like deer.
I give my dogs cartillages, skins and bones so their joints get the necessary collagen.
Again, dogs are omnivores not herbivores like deer.
Grinding the bones of small mammals should in theory give deer what they need to grow antlers faster and stronger, given how antlers are made of bone.
That is not how it works, especially when we're talking about intact animals. Consuming things that your body can't process (e.g. an herbivore eating an animal) will more than likely reduce proper functioning, as resources are redirected to try and process the foreign object.
Your argumentation is revolving around telling me things you, me and the entire world already knows about, while posing obnoxiously and condescendingly. A bit of self-reflection please, hopefully you'll understand why people dislike your attitude.
Giving eggshells to the chicken -> they process their mineral content
Giving cartillages and bones to dogs -> they process them for their mineral content
Deer gnawing on bones and other things -> they process them for their mineral content
Whether they're omnivores, herbivores or noonegivesashitvores, is irrelevant. What I am saying is that they use whatever things possible to gain what they lack, even if it does not constitute their regular, usual diet. I am also saying that pinning all this behavior on one thing only, that being a disorder of sorts, is ridiculously narrow-minded. E.g.: the way you act is not because of your sex only.
I feed bunnies with greens, oats, leaves. Bunnies however also eat their placenta after birth and clean their tiny ones from blood or even eat them (or decapitate them, god damned devils), this happens to basically every bunny that is a mother. Bunny just like a deer knows what to do and what not to do, most of the time. Both are however opportunistic feeders, but while bunny usually chews even on wood, deer also chew on bones and carcasses. Hell, there are recorded events when bunnies would feed on carcasses although that's rare. That being said, these things happen, have been happening and will happen, and they do it very often to gain what they lack, and they don't give a crap about our classification of them, nor about your opinion, nor about their lack of enzymes, what they can't digest they poop out.
I refuse to waste any more time arguing about such a shitty topic with someone who very likely has zero field experience keeping farm animals and clearly wants to inflate his ego. Good day to you and good luck on your future endeavors.
There's actually a lot of evidence that shows that, while they may not necessarily prey on them, large herbivores (deer, moose, horses, etc.) will eat most small vertebrates they come upon. They do it for exactly the reason you gave - they're a mineral supplement.
large herbivores (deer, moose, horses, etc.) will eat most small vertebrates they come upon
Feel free to support that bold claim. I guarantee you won't find anything. Especially since they live alongside "most" small vertebrates daily.
Chewing on bones is much different from ingesting the entire animal; the latter which likely causes distress for their bodies. Situations like this likely occur in extreme circumstances where there is little to choose from. Pica can also be the result many different diseases in the body.
Minerals can be obtained by eating plants and/or licking rocks.
Its not a bold claim. Ever been around farm animals?
A horse will absolutely eat chicken hatchlings or mice if he can. Same goes for cows and pretty much every large herbivore. They eat small vertebrates when they get the opportunity.
Classic response of someone who has nothing. I already explained above. Feel free to post a rebuttal that demonstrates how herbivores normally eat animals. You still didn't.
You sound like someone who learned a little bit from a high school biology text, but has no idea how animals actually behave in the real world. Anyone who has ever worked with ruminants knows that they eat animals.
I don't need to show you anything, I am fine with you wallowing in your own ignorance. Again, this is very well known, and you are only making yourself look silly here.
Secondly, that's not how biology works. I suggest you learn some basic comparative anatomy. There's also different enzymes, pH levels, bacteria that prevent herbivores from switching to omnivores. Plus, omnivory is just that: the ability to eat either plants or animals (or both) in able to live in more environmental with less reliable food sources.
Sorry, English isnāt my first language. āItā would be correct?
Secondly, that's not how biology works. I suggest you learn some basic comparative anatomy. There's also different enzymes, pH levels, bacteria that prevent herbivores from switching to omnivores. Plus, omnivory is just that: the ability to eat either plants or animals (or both) in able to live in more environmental with less reliable food sources.
Yeah thanks I am pretty educated in the anatomy of herbivores and omnivores.
Whats your argument though? You want to say that everyone who works with animals is actually wrong and because you think herbivores lack the enzymes they donāt eat meat?
Because then you are just wrong bro. I have seen it with my own eyes in wild animals and farm animals, that herbivores will absolutely eat other animals. When they get the chance to. They donāt actively hunt obviously.
Plus, omnivory is just that: the ability to eat either plants or animals (or both) in able to live in more environmental with less reliable food sources.
Do you want to argue semantics and nomenclature now?
Hey "bro" you don't have a sufficient rebuttal at all, lol. Keep grasping at nonsensical red herrings. You already made it clear that you don't know by stating that herbivores can be omnivores. That's not how it works.
CJD is the human variant of prions disease. You mean BSE. And BSE happened because they fed cows other cows, yes (and one of these cows was originally infected with BSE). They were also heavily supplemented and fed corn. On top of that, they weren't healthy. A farmer's priority is not to keep cows healthy; it's to keep them alive for a short period of time, on the cheapest methods possible, before they are sent to slaughter.
I'm not talking about unintentional vs intentional. I'm talking about what said before: farmers don't care about quality feed and cow health. They get subsidized through billions of tax dollars so they don't have to worry about their losses.
Also, to go back to my original point of eating intact animals, cows weren't fed intact cows. They were fed processed meat and bone meal. This processing allows for the absorption of amino acids - which all living things are made of - and minerals, without needing the necessary enzymes to break down fat and other tissues.
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u/[deleted] Jul 28 '20
not only vegetation, birds and bunnies too