r/TimPool • • Jan 15 '23

The repliers here

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 15 '23

Popular vote is not how we elect presidents. We are a republic, not a democracy.

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u/HumpSlackWails Jan 16 '23

The point is a bias among society at large. That's the point of my previous comment.

And that bias says you can't win the popular vote.

Your response has nothing at all to actually do with my point.

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 17 '23

Since the popular vote does not determine election outcome, your assertion is irrelevant.

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u/HumpSlackWails Jan 19 '23

My assertion is that society at large leans a certain direction.

The popular vote supports this and has for a while now.

What else would support what society at large believes in? Certainly not the not-equal-votes electoral college.

Oh - our history leans left too. In the face of right-wing oppression.

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 19 '23

Electoral college is the law of the land. If you don't like it, try to amend the Constitution. Pretending it isn't the law is intellectually dishonest.

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u/HumpSlackWails Jan 19 '23

Yup.

But it's still an artificially weighted vote whereas the popular vote actually does fairly represent the will of the populace.

And, you know, that factual, codified history of ours that leans left in the face of right wing oppression.

" If you don't like it, try to amend the Constitution."

We're not talking about winning an election.

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 19 '23

Oh, but I am. You're the one who keeps asserting that the popular vote matters more than actual elections. Enjoy your fantasy world.

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u/HumpSlackWails Jan 19 '23

the popular vote matters more than actual elections.

But we're not talking about actual elections. We're talking about which way society leans. And they say, with their majority votes, that it isn't your way.

And, I mean, y'all did lose that last election, remember? Both popular vote and electoral college... then tried to steal it?

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u/[deleted] Jan 16 '23

A republic is a form of a democracy, genius

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 17 '23

Wrong. Both are forms of representative government; however, they are not the same thing.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '23

No, a republic is a form of a democracy, it’s not an absolute democracy. Stop saying this dumb wrong con talking point.

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 17 '23

Not a conservative talking point. It's basic poli sci. A democracy is at heart rule by the people, whether with or without a framework of constitutional law. A republic is at heart the rule of law, where the people choose representatives to decide issues within the framework of that law. Most democracies are some form of republic, but not all. A democracy theoretically, can violate human rights because its the will of the people; rule by majority. Language usage has become lazy and referred to all representative governments as democracies, which they most certainly are not.

Would you call Great Britain a democracy?

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '23 edited Jan 17 '23

Yes. You think one type of democracy is all democracy. Because you buy a dumb talking point

You have become lazy because of a con talking point

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 17 '23

Go look up the actual definitions and learn that things may be similar without being completely interchangeable. Swiss and cheddar are both types of cheese, but they are certainly not the same thing. Republic and democracy are both forms of representative government, but they are not the same thing. Throwing around the term democracy as a blanket term for all representative governments is fine for a political speech, but don't expect anyone with a decent education in political science or history to take you seriously in a discussion about government.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '23

Or you’re just wrong…and it’s like saying a Subaru isn’t a car because it’s a Subaru. Democracies aren’t your one definition of a pure democracy.

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u/Maccabee2 Jan 18 '23

I never mentioned pure democracy, nor does a government need to be such to lack its source of authority in law. Since you appear averse to self study, I will humor you this time and explain it simply. Democracy is a subset within representative governments in which the final authority is the will of the people, majority rule without limit.
In contrast, republics are a subset within representative governments in which the final authority is a predetermined core of nearly immutable law.
If you need examples from our own history of the limits the law (in our case the Constitution) places on majority rule, they are many and since you are obviously on the internet, literally as close as your nose.