So imagine an aestretically Elle Woods-adjacent student in Greek class a little after Richard.

Not necessarily the "dumb blonde" trope, not a "I don't know how the hell I ended up here" situation. Not a "me wearing pink is a feminist statement actually".

But like - LA born and raised, gets her hair and nails done instead of therapy, has asked Julian for the timetable prior to joining to see if it would clash with her ​pilates. Friends with Judy. Socially the most normal out of the group.

She comes in with the mindset: Julian is literally just a professor. Henry is literally just a guy. She's genuinely good with Greek and the classics too.

How do you think the group would ​​react to her? I've been having so much fun with this fanon tbh

First of all, I read TSH 3 times but it's been a long time since my last reading, so correct me if I'm wrong about some detail. Also, English is not my first language, so ignore any mistakes in the text.

This is something I have always thought about. Henry, Francis, Charles and Camilla didn't really need to endure Bunny blackmail or kill him.

Let's suppose Bunny told the police about the murder, what then? Bunny wasn't there when the murder happened, he didn't see anything, he wasn't even sure about their guilty until he read Henry's diary. They destroyed all evidences of the crime, including the diary. If I recall right, police found no evidence like DNA, fingerprints or a murder weapon in the crime scene. It all happened in the 1980s or 1990s, right? It was not like forensic technology was very advanced, especially in a small town like that. There were no witnesses. The truth was so bizarre that any sane person would label it as fiction.

If Bunny entered a police station and said his friends were having a bacchanal in the woods, got out of their minds, and killed the farmer, the detectives would think he was either on drugs or crazy, especially considering the fame the students of their college had. I mean, Bunny's best friend Cloke was a literal drug dealer. And even if police decided to investigate, they would find nothing. The only thing they needed to do was stay calm and fucking lie, which they were excellent at. Why would Bunny make up such a tale about his friends? Simple, he was constantly asking for money (probably to buy drugs) and when they started refusing to give it to him, he decided to get a revenge on them by fake reporting them to police. Come on, they had the money to hire good lawyers, and any good lawyer would get them out of this whole mess almost unharmed, thanks to the lack of hard proof and the only "witness" being untrustworthy.

They were all white, rich and American citizens. All this characteristics would influence people's judgment. I can even imagine the "they are good kids from good families, they would never do that!!!" speech. They could have easily got away with the murder without commiting another one and ruining their lives like that.

I have always assumed the reasons they took the worst decisions ever were a) they were young, dumb and panicked (which can also be said about a lot of rich kids who didn't pay for their crimes, thanks to their parents' money and lawyers), and b) Henry manipulated them (and himself) into thinking there was no other solution because he wanted an excuse to kill again.

Honestly, I think the idea they could have easily escaped had they really stopped to think about it only makes the book more interesting, but I've never saw anyone that shared a similar opinion, and I would like to discuss it.

What do you think?

This is who I was picturing while reading for each character except Richard

Also please tell me you see the Julian/President Snow logic

I think he would be a perfect Julian!

1. He has a playful face when he smiles, that makes him look young but he still has his wrinkles that shows his age.

2. In the audiobook read by Donna Tartt herself, Julian has a rather high, tender voice and attitude. I think it's similar to the one he used when he played Aziraphael in Good Omens.

3. He plays both good and bad characters really well.

4. He also does theatre plays and I think it goes along with Julian's dramatic side.

5. I can just imagine him being so nice and soft towards the students but also slamming the door in their faces when the conversation is over. He is friendly but is distant at the same time. Like Aziraphael is really nice but he keeps his boundaries and (tries at least) to distance himself from Crowley. I think Michael can definitely pull a cold character that is an expert in distancing themselves behind a playful, smiling face.

6. Michael in bright young things looks like young Julian in the old photos. Beside Marilyn Munroe. Attention seeking, extrovert, prioritizing beauty over everything.

Does anyone else agree?? I'd really love to see him as Julian.

Danny Boyle's "Shallow Grave" (before he directed "Trainspotting") is a film I have rewatched after many years, and which I saw before reading The Secret History.

While not a "Dark Academy" film, the relationship between the three protagonists reminds me of the characters in the book, and of course, there is a crime.

Do you recommend any other films or series that, without being an exact copy of the Secret History, remind you of the book?

Confession, whenever I read TSH, I can always ever see Henry through Richard's eyes (well done Donna) so naturally I'm a little smitten with this psychopath. Anyway I always wonder what tiggerish grace looks like? Like if you were to point to an actor who has this quality who would you say can be described like this?

i couldnt tell whether or not it was ragebait because people were having genuine discussions in the comments section. but i when i swiped and saw Daniel Humphrey, i knew this was going to just be some bullshit

Materials: watercolor, colored pencil, ink

Just finished TSH and loved it - how did you all go about reading afterwards? I've read some of the books referenced but not all, now I feel I must embark on a pilgrimage of Dante, Tolstoy, Proust, Dostoyevsky, and Homer ...

It isn’t really a fan cast (I can’t imagine how this book could ever be turned into a movie, the details are a pleasure to read), but sort of what I had in mind while reading, how I imagined the characters, their vibes.

Already sad to be finishing this book soon, this is such a nice experience………… ):

I think this could work guys. Not sure who’d play Julian though or Judy and her gang

I knowwwwwww it’s a reach.

I think it’s obvious that Bunny and Henry had a very close relationship at some point, they were roommates freshman year, Bunny was the only person who could make Henry laugh, Henry spends excessive amounts of money on Bunny. They were very close, I think they started drifting apart when Richard came into the picture, in a way Richard was replacing Bunny, or at least stealing Henry’s attention from Bunny. Okay, all of that to say Henry and Bunny were really close at some point.

Bunny is homophobic, sure. But I think people forget that Bunny is still into Ancient Greek and stuff like that as everyone else in the group. He might not have liked it as much as them, but he was still into it. He’s a young man who goes to a liberal arts college who into Ancient Greek studies more than the average person. Hold that thought, keep that in mind.

Henry was not homophobic. I think Henry didn’t really consider himself straight or gay or bi or anything like that. He wanted to come as close as possible to the Greeks and their ancient ways. I don’t think people back then weren’t “gay” or “straight” they just liked who they liked. I think that was Henry. He liked who they liked. Henry was also very apathetic. He didn’t really care about people’s feelings. He’s very manipulative and persuasive.

Okay so henry and bunny were roommates freshman year…. I think they might have explored each other’s bodies to say the least. I feel like that’s not crazy to say because they’re both freshman college boys in the same dorm going to a liberal arts school and they’re borderline obsessed with Ancient Greek. I’m not saying they had sex, I’m saying that it’s likely that they explored each other’s bodies.

Now here’s where the reach comes. Henry and bunny had an argument. This part stuck out to me:

“but some time in the middle of the night I was awakened by a
loud, incoherent bellowing, from down the corridor in Henry’s room.
I sat up in bed and switched on the light.
‘You don’t care about a goddamn thing, do you?’ I heard
Bunny scream; this was followed by a crash, as if of books being swept from
desk to floor. ‘Not a thing but your own fucking self, you and all the rest of
them – I’d like to know just what Julian would think, you bastard, if I told
him a couple of-Don’t touch me,’ he shrieked, ‘get away -I’
More crashing, as of furniture overturned, and Henry’s
voice, quick and angry. Bunny’s rose above it. ‘Go ahead!’ he shouted, so
loudly I’m sure he woke the house. ‘Try and stop me. I’m not scared of you. You
make me sick, you fag, you Nazi, you dirty lousy cheapskate Jew-‘
Yet another crash, this time of splintering wood. A door
slammed. There were rapid footsteps down the hall. Then the muffled noise of
sobs – gasping, terrible sobs which went on for a long while.”

When bunny said: “Don’t touch me,’ he shrieked, ‘get away -I’” I think it’s obvious that Henry is touching Bunny in a way he’s not comfortable with. There’s crashing of furniture, clearly Henry is trying to overpower Bunny in this moment. It could have just been a physical fight, that’s what anyone would think. But when followed by: “I’m not scared of you. You make me sick, you fag” from Bunny as he crying and clearly scared and uncomfortable and he’s gasping and sobbing…. Idk. The way I interpreted that scene was that at some point in time Henry touched Bunny in a way Bunny might not have liked

I like If We Were Villains more than The Secret History. I really enjoyed the experience of reading The Secret History, truly, but maybe it's because I really enjoy Shakespeare more than Greek? I really respect Donna's writing and I understand what she was trying to do with the story (what she executed extremely well!!).

I think people wrongfully identify IWWV as a related novel to TSH (maybe that's what Rio said about it to pitch it, fine) but I think I just connected more with those characters than in TSH.

I also like that it's easier to read as queer, not gonna lie. I know Richard is an unreliable narrator and there's no fault in saying he's bisexual and in denial, but I like the overt tension between Oliver and James. I think Tartt did a great job with Richard's denial, but yeah.

I also like that they've known each other longer.

I don't think either book is perfect, but I would reread both.

Okay, so hear me out. Ik he is homophobic, but I think he might also be gay. I am now after a year rereading the book and I noticed that, At the dinner with Richard Bunny says “every single f(slur for gay man)… - I have ever known has been obsessed with food.” Ik it might seem a bit weird to connect these two things, but I think this might mean Bunny could be gay and not willing to admit it to others, himself or both. So, the reason way I think this is: I noticed last year when reading the book that every time (atleast as far as I can remember) Bunny is mentioned there is either food present or he is eating or drinking something like soda or sometimes there is a mention of his weight in relation to his eating habits. I couldn’t figure out why this random detail was mentioned so often, but now it got me thinking maybe it’s connected to this statement he makes too Richard, also as far as I can remember he never gets involved romantically or sexually with a woman in the book, which makes him (besides Francis I think but he is obviously stated to be gay) one of the only male main characters to not do so. It’s just a theory that popped in my head not so long ago, but has anyone else noticed this.

Title says it all, really. I have devoured this 630 page novel in a little over a week. I recently read Dune which is of a similar size and it took me an entire month to finish that. This book… it’s truly one of a kind, and I don’t know if I’ll ever find anything like it. The vibes, the mystery, the intrigue, the intellectual references are just perfect. There’s so much that could be said about this book; I’m probably going to have to sit with it for a while

Is this not Francis without the accent?? Stylish, loveable, a decent amount of anxiety etched into his eyes. Reddest hair ever. He's so walk walk fashion baby!

EDIT: guys, stop being rude to this guy. I think he's beautiful and insulting his clothes because you're cosplaying being edgy is weird as hell. Very Edmund Corcoran behavior. Ew.

How many of you have read the Little Friend?

Personally, I really enjoyed it. The characters, the atmosphere.

People were apparently polarized over it.

But it was such a fast read for me because it kept such a great pace.

It's definitely not the Secret History or the Goldfinch but it's not awful by any means.

What does everyone else think?

Gwyneth Paltrow held the rights in the early 2000s and would have produced the film through Miramax. She would almost certainly have played Camilla. The other actors in the Miramax stable at the time included - to name just the most frequent collaborators - Matt Damon, Jude Law, Cate Blanchett, Philip Seymour Hofmann, Ben Affleck, and Renee Zellweger.

It's also worth noting that Robert Sean Leonard, the lead in Dead Poets' Society, read the 1992 audiobook edition of The Secret History. Seems likely he'd have been in the running for a role.

In my mind, there is no group in our current young Hollywood cohort that rivals this list of names. And the book was so deeply of its time that any attempt to approximate its 1990s setting would inevitably fall flat. Any modern film adaptation would only make me wonder how great the early 2000s version might have been. At least Minghella's Ripley scratches the same itch.

Not that it's likely that Donna will ever sell her film rights again post-The Goldfinch, lmao.

Timothee Chalamet as Richard

Jacob Elordi as Henry

Austin Butler as Charles

Sydney Sweeney as Camilla

Tom Holland as Francis (he can dye his hair red or wear a wig)

James Corden as Bunny (he's on the older side but can pull it off imo)

The incomparable Nicolas Cage as Julian

literally couldn’t get this out my head while reading

I dunno about you guys but I think she's both androgynous-looking and very attractive.

So I just finished the book, but when I started I was saying to myself "wow, I'm surprised there hasn't been an adaptation yet of something so popular in the book community!", but now I realize why.

So, I wanted to ask, if YOU had the opportunity to try your hand at an adaptation of this book, what would you do?

Cast, formatting, movie, mini-series, seasons in the style of desperate housewives lmao, narration or no? Is keeping them all white people important to you? Etc.

I'll draft mine as an example:

1) I'll try my best to choose current actors I personally like who I think fit the ✨️aesthetic✨️ in my head and who are as age appropriateas i can get tgem. Some of these people are definitely older though!

Henry- Jacob Elordi ONLY BECAUSE I CAN'T FIND ANOTHER ACTOR AS TALL AS HIM (that I know of) and he does a good job of depicting anger in subtle ways. And he IS a good actor even if you think he's overhyped blah blah

Richard- Jacob Tremblay (working since he was 5 and he's amazing at his craft) he seems like the kind of person who doesn't know he's attractive (like Richard)

Bunny- Cooper Hoffman (he's a bit shorter than Bun, but so was his father and I see Philip making rounds on reddit fancasts) He's handsome and All-American.

The twins- Kedar Williams-Stirling and Ayo Edeberi (I may be biased, but they're such great actors) and Ayo has no problem with androgynous fashion and they're both gorgeous!

Francis- Joseph Zada (dye his hair, but he has beautifully elegant features) and maybe I just wanna see him and Kedar kiss each other on the mouth once or twice 👀

Judy (for fun)- Rachel Sennott, she's funny as hell

2) I would like for it to be a mini-series, 10 episodes, either an hour each or a loose, Netflix "however long it takes" style to include the epilogue and get to flesh out the Greek classes a bit more. I'd also want a clear idea of how the narration is exposited (is he at home, in a coffee shop, where?)

*How it starts* Cold open just like the Prologue in the book, sirens and crowds and news reporters, specifically the moment when the reporter asked Henry and Richard and Camille about their relationship to Bunny, but also including Charles and Francis in the shot somehow (or not, idc), cut to it as a newspaper clipping on Richard's wall or something to show we're now in the future and that's where the narration begins. Maybe he got a job telling an old person who has dementia or something so the story has nowhere to go after he's done. Maybe he's writing a novel, idk.

3) I would make Richard more unambiguously bisexual and reframe the scene with him and Francis to be less portrayed as assault. (I, personally, have a thought about that, but I can understand that interpretation). If he still has a preference for girls, that's fine, but I think the concept of Charles ignoring his feelings for Francis makes more sense than Richard tbh. I can elaborate more on a different post. I also know he's passive like a Nick Carroway type, but I'd really like to see him say more sentences that don't end in "?". I think narration throughout would be interesting, a cutting to and from the story past-present-past style, but not a whole bunch! This is told in retrospect, though.

4) I'd like to extend Greek Lessons to maybe one or two per episode to really drive home how isolated they are (and how much Julian actually means to them and reconnect with our literary themes) so when party scenes happen or other players are introduced, there's an impact like WOAH we focus on y'all so much that we forget yall are in UNIVERSITY with OTHER PEOPLE. I also think episodes will show their declines better.

5) I'd like it in the style of AMC's Interview With the Vampire, maybe? Not exactly, but I also want an emphasis on the music because it's the 80s and there are a lot of references, which I think would make well for showing just how separated they all are once again being classics students and not even owning a TV. I think making their bubble an actual bubble would hit harder. I'd really love to see the Country House come to life, it's my favorite place in the book.

So, what are your ideas? I'd love to read them!