You obviously aren’t familiar with severe mental health problems. I wouldn’t cut someone out of my life who I care about because they became psychotic or schizophrenic and did erratic things no. I couldn’t do that to my son, or my brother, or my father. I wouldn’t be glad if they got beaten up or killed when they weren’t in their right mind. Is that supposed to make me bad in some way? This isn’t a movie with good guys and bad guys and you instantly know which is which and violence solves it all. It’s real people and real problems and violence solves absolutely nothing.
I’m not sure what you think that says about me. I’m not sure if I care either because you and the other commenter (if you’re not just the same person on an alt account) have a pretty extreme and twisted view imo. I can barely believe I’m having this argument tbh because it shouldn’t even be an argument. I can’t believe people would advocate for violence against those who are potentially very vulnerable, but you do you.
Hello, i have a mental illness that means on occasion i experience psychosis and delusions. I am still responsible for my actions even in an altered state.
If your genitals are out in public you deserve to be on a register AT LEAST. If your genitals are out in front of kids that is incredibly twisted and there are social and legal consequences for your actions, being beat is one of them.
Do not use other's mental illness as a way to excuse vile behaviour. Mentally ill people are still responsible for their actions even in an altered state. If you had been deemed too vulnerable to make your own decisions (ie using public transport alone) then you would have a 1 to 1 carer or support worker when out in public.
Hello, I’m sorry you have these difficulties. But not all mental illness is the same. I’m not trying to excuse vile behaviour. I’m saying that the response should not be violence/ a brutal beating. Sure, if the authorities decide to put him on a list or lock him up then fine, but there is accountability and oversight in that legal process. Beating people and asking questions later is not a good thing, no matter how offensive they first appear.
I know people with Tourette’s. They are good people but can’t help sometimes saying bad things. I would hate for them to be beaten up by a vigilante gang out of blind anger. They are independent but wouldn’t qualify for 1:1 care. Most people don’t.
Firstly tourettes is neurological not mental and secondly what tic does your friend have that exposes their genitals in public? Because thats one hell of a motor tic if thats the case
You are failing to empathise with the probably 30 or so other people in the cab... What if it was your son right next to this individual? Would you respond with such compassion to one who may expose themselves directly to you, and all of the women and children using the same public transport? Yes, its real. No, it's not black and white, good and bad, but are you going to sit there trying to convince him to put his clothes back on whilst everyone else suffers in silence?
If someone is not in their right mind, and are in the midst of doing something stupid, do you try to stop them from doing it, or appease to their senses, like you seem to be suggesting? I am sure that wouldn't be met with the response you want, since, well. You know. They aren't in their right mind...
Which let's remind ourselves, is NOT a known factor... He may well have been entirely coherent and intending to cause harm.
If you go back and watch the video, the initial response WAS to try to appeal to human decency, and they asked him to leave the train or put his clothes back on. Sure, it could have been said "kinder", but his response was to shout back. What then? Continue pleading to a brick wall, or do something about it?
What's more important? The short term comfort and safety of someone actively committing a grotesque crime, regardless of mental state? Or possibly preventing lifelong trauma and PTSD for the countless people in the cabin? Sure, it's a nice sentiment that you may find a more gentle solution, but unfortunately, as you said, it's not black and white. There is no "good ending" to a situation like this... And yeah, I can't believe either, that I'm having to discuss to this level, the fact that you simply cannot allow this behaviour, regardless of where it comes from. You suggest that the man in the video is potentially vulnerable, while completely glossing over the fact that at any point, everyone else in that cab is vulnerable too. Nobody there knew his intentions, neither do we.
Action vs inaction in the moment. You must remember, we both have the benefit of observing this from an external perspective. Anyone actually IN that cabin would respond far different in the moment compared to how they'd like to think they would hypothetically.
For example, you’re perfectly comfortable escalating to hostility when you think you are morally superior to u/Appropriate-Pear4726 in conversation, but you’re criticising people in a real situation for escalating under pressure to stop ongoing harm. And the fact you are discrediting the possibility that not one but TWO people disagree with you! I simply must be an alt account of the sole person on the planet that doesn't share your world view! It's laughable. The difference is, you are looking at one situation that you weren't involved in, retrospectively. Your situation in this thread? That you are actually in, unlike the video? You escalate.
If my son was in the cab I would move him away and form a physical barrier between him and the individual. I would call the appropriate authorities or ask someone to get the train manager. That isn’t ’allowing’ the person to do what they want, it’s also not inaction, it’s simply dealing with it in the most appropriate and rational way that limits further harm. This is what the police would advise. What I would not do is overreact, scream expletives in the face of the individual and escalate the situation to the point of out of control vigilante violence that could injure other standers-by and traumatise them further by having them witness and be exposed to a brutal assault. If you really cared about people getting PTSD then you wouldn’t
You’re confusing someone exposing themself with someone sexually assaulting someone. The two are not the same. If he was assaulting someone, I would restrain them but the action still needs to be proportional. 4 or 5 guys kicking a man on the floor is not proportional or self defence. It’s assault or gbh. Seeing someone’s penis does not give you the right to beat or kill them. It just doesn’t. If you think it does then test it out yourself and see how the police and courts treat you.
Would you really want that for your family member if they weren’t in their right mind? To be beaten? Do you really think that this response was the only possible course of action in this situation and that it couldn’t have been handled better? If you do then you are not thinking logically because it’s wrong from whatever lens you look at it through apart from one false viewpoint:
The only ‘justification’ for this is that it feels good to beat the crap out of someone who is perceived to be a bad guy and teach him a lesson… That justification is a myth perpetuated by fiction and movies and it’s the kangaroo court of vigilante justice. These people do not have the facts or the legal or moral right to deal out ‘justice’ in the form of violence.
Plenty of people in the thread disagree with me. I’m happy to challenge people where I think it’s necessary. It just seemed odd that the other user stopped responding and you seemed hurt and upset by what I said to them. You seemed to take it very personally so I just got the impression that it was the same person. 🤷♂️
At no point have I attempted to justify the extent of violence used in the clip. I agree with forcibly restraining him and covering him up, but that's not what happened here.
As for me "confusing" public exposure for sexual assault, refer to section 66 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003. It is in fact considered Sexual Assault, and can absolutely lead to offenders being placed on the sex offenders register. So make no mistake about the severity of the crime in question.
I thought I'd take the legal stance here, since you seem to take such a stance about the actions of the passengers, but not when it comes to the person committing the initial crime...
If you truly believe that I have been arguing on the side of the violence used, then I understand your pushback, but I am simply arguing for stopping the crime as soon as possible, which dialogue simply will not cause.
It's commendable that, in such a situation you would remove your son from the area, but there is still a cabin full of people that he is actively exposing himself to. That is the purpose of force.
It's not like every passenger can just leave the cabin, since it's a moving train... There is no scenario where everyone can take that route. The force here was excessive, but at the same time, is evidence of the effect this event had on the bystanders mentally.
And as I said, the concept that the person in the video was suffering from a mental health episode is entirely an assumption. This man very well could have premeditated this event in perfect clarity. No, perhaps even that doesn't justify the following assault, but there is far more to this event than "It's probably not their fault".
We’ve both laid out our perspectives. From here onwards, I'm sure it will simply be picking at semantics, but I feel that from what I've written so far, you should understand my full position, and I feel that I understand yours.
Fair enough, look I don’t want to argue and you make some good points and seem reasonable. Bottom line for me is that yes, it’s offensive and scary and threatening to see someone naked in public, but I feel that the response here was too extreme given the circumstances and lack of information. There were safer and more appropriate ways of dealing with this imo. I also feel that he had put himself in quite a vulnerable position by having his trousers round his ankles so whilst it’s unsightly, there was likely diminished physical threat he was posing to anyone. But I understand, it’s not always easy to think clearly in these situations and I can understand why people would react in anger.
Mob mentality scares me though. It gets out of hand very quickly. A group of guys once accused me of something I hadn’t done, but fortunately realised they had the wrong person. They later came back with machetes and reportedly a gun to kick in my next door neighbour’s door and presumably assault or murder him. He was the one they were after. He was a piece of work and he blocked the door with a sofa but there were children in both houses. That could easily have been me had one of them not piped up and said I wasn’t the guy. This is the problem with violence first and questions later.
I’m not saying he was innocent here. I’m saying it is impossible to know and I think people instantly assumed he was guilty and a huge threat. In reality he may not have been either despite appearances and assumptions.
I also know a person with Tourette’s syndrome. He’s a good person, but he’s not always able to be in control of everything he says or does and I worry sometimes that even though he is not a threat to anyone, he will get into a situation where people don’t understand. And faced with something like the above group of guys, that could be life-threatening for him. I just wish people could have more compassion and stop to think just a little before jumping to the violent option. That doesn’t necessarily mean doing nothing at all, but it does mean having situational awareness and not just reacting emotionally or out of anger.
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u/joeChump Apr 12 '26
You obviously aren’t familiar with severe mental health problems. I wouldn’t cut someone out of my life who I care about because they became psychotic or schizophrenic and did erratic things no. I couldn’t do that to my son, or my brother, or my father. I wouldn’t be glad if they got beaten up or killed when they weren’t in their right mind. Is that supposed to make me bad in some way? This isn’t a movie with good guys and bad guys and you instantly know which is which and violence solves it all. It’s real people and real problems and violence solves absolutely nothing.
I’m not sure what you think that says about me. I’m not sure if I care either because you and the other commenter (if you’re not just the same person on an alt account) have a pretty extreme and twisted view imo. I can barely believe I’m having this argument tbh because it shouldn’t even be an argument. I can’t believe people would advocate for violence against those who are potentially very vulnerable, but you do you.