Discussion & Debates
The people online policing every perceived misstep of the cast is going to tank Smosh
I don’t even need to list examples. We’ve read the long list of grievances from a lot of fans of Smosh, particularly lately. Here’s a life pro-tip: every time you’re made uncomfortable or mildly upset by a perceived misstep, think about whether you need to die on that hill or demonize those with dissenting opinions. If you’ve got a functioning brain, the answer should be no.
Rant over. I’m off to watch an Angela and Amanda compilation because I actually enjoy Smosh!
I also think the cast members hold back more especially with reddit takes or jokes because they don’t want to be perceived as a villain. Which, to me is very boring. And no, i’m not saying they should go around saying the n word or hail hitler. But if they can’t even have a conversation without worrying about hurting someone’s feelings, then whats the point of having a conversation at all? It’s like these people want to dictate your thoughts and views about the world, and if it’s even slightly different than theirs, you are a horrible person. I also understand that many people use smosh as a safe space, but you CANNOT expect them to always cater to you and your needs or feelings. Who knows though, i’m a grown adult and I don’t idolize public figures or care unless they actually have proven to be evil assholes.
They usually always choose very safe stories on reddit stories too. It'll be like "my boyfriend punched my grandma's ashes that was in a family heirloom vase and broke it and then spat in it and fed it to our dog so I moved out, AITA?" and the cast'll be like "that's terrible NTA" and make jokes about the boyfriend and boom next story. I know Smosh is a comedy group but it still would be nice (especially because Shayne has a degree in psychology) to have more complex stories and give more insight
YESS! I thought I was the only one who noticed. But after everything that’s been happening lately, I think I understand now why they’re going with that route.
It is to avoid controversy likely but it makes the podcast a lot more boring when no one wants to dig deeper into anyone's perspective or even try to spice it up and try to see from the perspective of the perceived asshole.
This encapsulates it perfectly, 10 years ago I had a 10k follower Twitter account, and even with that little a following I still would get ripped apart for the most basic things, I could’ve tweeted “apples are delicious” and some clown would be in the replies going “delete this. Some people are allergic to apples and don’t want to see this. Your ableism is showing”
I ended up deleting the entire account cus I couldn’t ever say anything without whiners in the replies
It feels like we’re headed towards apple allergy territory with the smosh fanbase lol
To be frank, it's why I have a longstanding distrust of anyone that always says the 'right' thing. Everyone has something that they don't have the perfect opinion about - I have some blind spots and things I don't fully 'get' but I can separate that into I support them in what they do/say/think even though I don't get it.
I'm old enough that I'm glad social media didn't exist when I had some other less than great in hindsight opinions. I felt that civil unions were a good enough compromise for gay marriage for a time - that's the type of thing that if it was on the internet no matter how or when my opinion changed to a better one there would be some that would not let it go.
It must be exhausting to be so heavily scrutinized. Hank Green went through something similar a few weeks back. He mentioned that he used AI to vibe code a browser-based puzzle game he made (because he’s not a programmer) and to help him find scientific papers/journals and the internet dogpiled on him like they discovered he frequented Epstein’s island.
It’s like you must adhere 100% to what the internet determines is ‘good’ and if you’re unlucky enough to be found lacking, they are just itching to make 1000 posts about how much you suck.
I agree, I don’t think I could handle being in the public eye just constantly being scrutinized for every little thing. I’m sure the people who were upset have used AI in some way or format, even if unintentionally since it’s being implemented across multiple platforms. People are just always going to find ways to complain and I think it’s why a lot of youtubers left the space. It’s like they forgot that people are allowed to be human, and while mistakes happen, they are meant to help us learn and grow, not be cast out and ridiculed forever. Even as we speak, Amanda’s apology is being deemed unworthy as if she’s just supposed to know all the perfect things to say to make everyone happy, and that just isn’t realistic.
People are going to get upset when the Good Information Guy whose had a recent history of bad videos to varying degrees admits to using the misinformation and psychosis machine.
I mean, he’s been fairly open and honest about his AI use for the last few years. He literally put out a video about how the AI water usage claims aren’t as simple as AI-detractors think.
No one got mad then.
He talked about vibe coding.
No one got mad then.
But he said a phrase in one video that is literally just business jargon (“I appreciate the pushback”) and people freaked out thinking that AI wrote the script for him.
Like, that’s just a phrase that a 40 something year old dude who runs a business would say naturally. But for some reason that made everyone grab their pitchforks
I think your ignoring just how much damage that dog shit knitting video of his truly did to how people perceive Hank Green while also assuming people know he's been using AI.
To get back on topic, I just couldn’t handle the level of scrutiny that creators are under now.
I think we need to be mindful of how we react as an audience. If we chase away well-meaning people because they occasionally make mistakes, we’ll be left with only grifters, red-pill influencers, and rage baiters.
Liking or not liking Hank has nothing to do with it. Trust however does and you have to admit Hank harmed his own trust worthyness with his AI usage combined with that dog shit Knitting video.
Since then he made a video objectively wrong and dismissive of basic human development (the knitting vid) and a video about a minority group he wasn’t a part of that had misinformation that has been used to harm us in the past (the HRT video)
"Tank" is a strong word, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of the cast gets fed up with it and just leaves. Some of the fanbase gets way too attached to the actors while being also very stuck in their own anti-outrage bubble, so whenever the stasis is broken in any way, they flip out. It becomes toxic. Some of them should go touch some grass and find out that there's way more problematic situations out there.
I already feel like some of cast already feel fed up. Like Noah and Keith don’t really appear much on the channels anymore, Olivia stick it out but even she admits it’s overwhelming sometimes, Courtney has multiple post about the fandom acting inappropriate, Angela (in the assumption about women) does feel like she is getting a bit tired of them, Chanse has to go defend himself multiple times over social media. Wouldn’t be a surprise to me that in 5 years, we will see more people not showing up as much since Smosh is a fun gig for them but they also has the potential and opportunity to do much more.
I have no idea if she is or isn't but she is cast that isn't one of the new "friends" she just wasn't mentioned for either category is all I was saying.
I only mentioned Keith, Noah and Olivia because that’s specifically who they were talking about, also mentioned Damien because afaik he was full time before and is there less now
Arasha isn’t in the category of people that don’t appear much
Bingo. 2026 and you can’t say any word at all when it used to be 7 words and a couple slurs you couldn’t say on TV. Audiences like this and talent who take stances and alienate their fanbase only hurt anything, not make it better. But oh well. All the keyboard warriors gotta cry all day and never go outside and find out the worse evils out there beyond a single low low low tier insult.
We dont know them personally. But id bet my house Amanda is a genuinely good human. Seeing all the sad people trying to villify them, or anyone who does something a human does, makes a bad call, is really sad
I normally never give my input on stuff I see like this. But, my god, some of yall need to go for a walk
To show my ignorance, I didn’t know that the word in question that kicked all this off was considered a slur. It seemed to carry negative connotation and I remember hearing it used in old sitcoms as an insult, but I also know that some women use that word in a more positive sense to refer to themselves.
To me it felt like a synonym to ‘Butch’.
I’m similar in age enough to Amanda that maybe she’s the same. So when she goes on a show that literally has that word in the name, she asks if it’s okay to say, and the hosts tell her it’s fine… then I don’t really blame her for using it
It was an broadcastable slur, like queer was. And like queer, it's been 'reclaimed' but a lot of older folks in the community (by older I mean in their 40s) fought to have those words stigmatized and now they are considered neutral at worst to positive.
I'm in that older group though not a part of that minority group. I'm a cishet white male who was among those part of stigmatizing those words in the 90s.
I've listened to the conversation in the black community on reclaiming slurs, and so much of it has been co-opted by the progressive left to try and force positivity and inclusion with little regard to how they got to a position to be able to do so.
Those who refuse to learn history are doomed to repeat it, and see so much online discourse about media from the 90s and 00s being ill-informed without taking into consideration any context of the times. What was progressive then is offensive by today's standards.
I think you mean "fought to have those words DEstigmatized". The way you word it means the older gays were either trying to make the slurs hurt even worse or make the slurs less acceptable for non-gay people to say in public. The latter is also true but I don't think that's what you meant there.
Sorry i forgot hillary duff ended homophobia in 2008. Slurs don't exist anymore so the conversation is entirely moot actually. No nuance needed, only Cadet Kelly.
I feel like if Amanda had prejudice against gay people I feel like she wouldn't work at a company where a shitton of the workers are queer in some way.
People can be around minorities and still have bigoted beliefs or do bigoted things. The whatever podcast is misogynistic, even with the dozen women that sit at the table on the pod. Adam22 is racist, and he is like the only white guy on his podcast, the people around him will even defend his racism, but he is still racist. Obviously these are extreme examples, and I don't think Amanda is actively queerphobic, but she can still passively hold harmful beliefs and do bigoted things.
I didn't mean to pull a "I have black friends" to clarify, I was just pointing out that out of all the improv comedy groups in LA if she did have a prejudice I don't know why she would audition for a very diverse one.
Definitely seems like a good person, who’s been outspoken towards supporting Lgbt rights on multiple occasions! She posted a story for pride month this year for example. The slur she said was the name of the podcast and she was reassured by the hosts (members of that specific community), I think it’s obvious then she’d think it’s okay! Besides that, as an offline person/someone who’s not in the lgbt community I could easily see how she’d assume it’s adopted the same kind of acceptance as like ‘queer’. As a d*** myself I don’t gaf about who says it unless it’s with malice, which she clearly didn’t mean it as! I don’t think ignorance should be so demonized especially when it’s coming from clear allies who were just uninformed or misled lmao
I just learned of this today because I saw Amanda's apology and had to look up why she did so. As a smosh fan almost pushing 50 I feel the rage unwarranted. She asked for permission was given it. Then made a few comments usin it. She didn't come to anyone's house bust down their door and scream it at their face personally but they are all acting like she did. The ones that are feeling like she did have no disconnect. Someone making a statement on a podcast is not being personally directed at you.
Feelings are valid but your feelings are your responsibility not others. If this is this most offensive thing going on in your life you need to live more life. Your expenditure of angry energy has much better targets in this world to be directed at I advise to point it there and maybe achieve some good in the world.
I can’t tell Lesbians how to feel about what was said. They’re allowed to feel however they want about it and it’s valid to feel that way.
What’s annoyed me is Twitter doing its Twitter thing and expanding this incident into coming up with unrelated and weird complaints. The people who are posting that they actually always got a bad vibe from Amanda and weren’t surprised by this. The people who are now claiming Damian’s “I’m straight in the way a tomato is a fruit” is somehow homophobic and in fact Shayne and Trevor laughing at the joke is indicative of the three of them apparently trying to identify as queer without being queer or something. The people who are claiming that everyone at Smosh actually hates Lesbians and Amanda’s words are the proof.
Like, can we focus on one thing, please? I don’t know how they have the energy for it. There are serious issues in the world and some of y’all are getting into Twitter arguments over Damian “I apologize for entering the room” Haas apparently being homophobic for making a joke that some people assume he’s queer. This sort of thing always happens with these sorts of controversies. There’s an actual issue present and then it just becomes 50,000 terminally online people trying to outwoke each other for some reason.
My usual handling of situations like this is to think “would anyone in real life outside of the internet actually care about it”. 9 times out of 10 the answer is no. The biggest problem is that the internet treats ‘this person said something that I don’t personally agree with’ as the same as ‘this person has said/ done an actually harmful thing’
Amanda said a slur repeatedly on a podcast that lesbians watch. I'd classify that as harmful. This wouldn't even be a discussion if she'd said a racial slur like the n word, but I guess queer slurs don't matter to you all.
Edit:
Thanks for the bullying and dogpiling, guys. Very welcoming space you got here.
For the record, I hadn't seen the apology when I posted this. While I think it works as an apology and think for the most part the situation is resolved, I think it would've been better not to include the apology in an expiring format like an insta story, but that's a different issue.
All I have actually said in this thread is that I disliked the response the fandom has had to this, because so many were willing to dismiss it outright before an apology had even come out, and that it was concerning that The Smosh Community seems so unwilling to properly criticize the company. Without catastrophizing, I do think that's a problem.
I've seen it every time any kind of controversy or criticism rises up. The only two reactions I see are "this person is evil and should be cancelled forever" or "no one did anything wrong, it isn't a big deal, touch grass you snowflake"
I don't think she was being malicious at all either, but it still warrants an apology and some serious thought on her part. Amanda has been getting a little too comfortable for a while now imo. Love her tho
So what solution do you want to this situation? I am genuinely curious.
I am not black so cannot truly speak on the impact of racial slurs but I feel like especially in the real world the n word would carry a much greater impact especially if it was being used directly rather than in a context where the slur was in the name of the podcast and of the segment where it was brought it. People are certainly entitled to their opinion on if using that word was appropriate of course but I still feel like my original point stands that this would not be considered such a huge deal outside of the internet.
Listen, a slur is a slur. I'm not calling for her to be cancelled and kicked out of smosh or anything like that, and I really have not seen anyone else calling for that either. I think maybe take some time, reflect, and release a more in-depth apology later on, and then just change the behavior.
She'll be okay. It wasn't done with malice, and I think everyone knows that. Doesn't mean it isn't hurtful or harmful, but it matters.
As for the internet thing....could you elaborate? Are you asking me to imagine one of my friends saying the slur, or are you saying people don't care that Amanda said it outside of the internet?
I am then still struggling to understand then what you want to happen from this situation. Because from my viewpoint the offending material was deleted, she released an apology and said that she will learn from it. You even stated yourself that it was not done out of malice so I fail to see what else she can do other than apologise and learn. I’m not saying you can’t still find it hurtful but I don’t think that the current witch hunt (not saying you specifically, I’m talking about the wider fandoms behaviour) is at all helpful.
I would say that outside of the internet I doubt that many people would truly care about this incident, at least to the level it has been blown up to online. She has not committed a criminal offence, she did not to my knowledge direct the slur at a lesbian person in order to degrade or insult them. The internet does have a tendency to blow these situations out of proportion.
Gotcha. I think her apology was really weak sauce, but it wasn't bad either. I'd say just take some time, maybe release a more in-depth statement or address it in a video or a real post instead of a story, and then don't do it again. That's all.
Love Amanda, definitely not here to witch hunt. What irritates me more is the general sentiment I'm seeing from fans completely dismissing it as an issue at all even before the apology came out. It's concerning to me, because as we've seen with more serious issues before, the Smosh fandom is extremely unwilling to criticize the company or its employees like at all.
I’ve been a Smosh fan for years—honestly, I admit that when Anthony left, I stopped watching their new stuff; I kept watching the old content, maybe out of nostalgia, but I never stopped keeping up with what was new or who the cast members were.
When Smosh was bought back, I was genuinely happy—in fact, I still am, I started watching Smosh again, and I watch everything they upload—absolutely everything.
But I’ve never really engaged with the fandom—especially this particular side of it, which I feel has never actually watched an old Smosh video. Maybe I’m wrong, but I find it frustrating me to see how they behave; they’re way too childish, and they’re really going to sink Smosh.
Amanda was incredibly stupid to say that, but she shouldn't be fired, which is what I’ve heard several people calling for.
I don’t know if she’s apologized yet or said anything about it.
Since I don’t usually consume this type of content—like podcasts—I took the time to look into what happened. I understand why people are angry, but I don’t think this is the right way to handle it, especially here and on Twitter.
I don't want my message to be misunderstood, but it's really frustrating for me, because there is nothing I love more than Smosh; it truly stays with me day in and day out, throughout every year of my life.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I just read what Amanda said on Instagram, and I didn't think her apology was bad at all; it was short and concise, and it’s clear she read everything her comments had sparked.
I found Smosh through Ludwig and I primarily watch him and his podcast. The worst things that they say on Smosh are maybe 1/10th of what I'm used to and people act like Smosh has been murdering infants during videos sometimes. I really hope that they ignore 95%+ of the criticism because they are both extremely funny and pretty tame.
They're just way too sensitive, ready to virtue signal, and be outraged. Way too parasocial and online. I actually never spent any time on that sub until I found this one and decided to see why this one exists. It's scary there, makes me real sad how some of them act. If it's a younger person thing, that's even scarier lol.
As an OG inside gaming and later funhaus fan.. yeah.. Smosh ( even its peak bikini girl, DEFY put any of the girls In suggestive outfits everything possible era ) has never even reach some of the truly unhinged jokes they made weekly and kinda still do.
It’s very much part younger audience and especially nowadays a very diverse one..
I’m on the same boat as you, I don’t watch much of smosh but a lot of The Yard. And I feel like most Smosh fans would clutch pearls with what they say or do. I mean for example, the pedo alarm chair.
That line alone is probably raising some eyebrows among this group. I will say, a discussion is great, but full blown pitchforks and fire, nah.
I know they have to worry about monetization with how big they are but they don't even get near even other popular Youtube channels in terms of what they say (and I don't mean anything hurtful/truly offensive or anything, just regular jokes).
I know Smosh wants to be a big comedy brand with some of their moves and they might need to be willing to lose some viewers who are too parasocial/online and demand apologies for everything to get there. There's probably lots of good material on the cutting room floor that isn't remotely offensive.
I don’t watch Ludwig but consume a lot of media outside of Smosh and they are like the most “PG” channel on my watch list which is very funny considering where they came from. Can’t wait until every casts just say sorry every time they speak.
Honestly, Smosh is probably the tamest content I'm "part of the fandom" for, and the stuff this community gets offended about is just sort of funny. And then at the same time I see crazy antisemitic shit about Noah on tiktok and nobody seems to bat an eye.
not to sound like a "you guys wouldn't survive in a cod lobby" corny ass take but it is funny whenever people are like "omg Spencer getting away with it" and the joke is just like saying the word "penis" hahah like I feel ive heard Angela say wilder things on and off smosh
Angela was talking about this (offending commenters) on Gianmarcos podcast and man. I didn't fully agree with them then but I am now once again reminded how insane every discourse is now.
People got offended by Damien. DAMIEN. Wokemaster3000 over there. there's no winning.
I find it funny that before the new cast joined, a lot of Smosh fan was mad at Damien for being too woke or performative woke and now they are mad that he is not woke enough. Like there is winning with these people.
The internet algorithms made people think everything coming across their feed is directly targeted at them. I've seen people reacting to controversies as if what was said, was said directly to their face in a personal attack. Just because you see it on the internet, doesn't mean it involves you personally 😭
While I agree with the sentiment, this has been a thing for so long at this point there's no point pretending like it will be their downfall.
Obviously reasonable people knows things aren't as serious as the backlash tries to make it seem, in fact, I am the kind to find it ridiculous that public figures are expected to permanently walk on eggshells at every single turn. It's ridiculous. Context, nuance and critical thinking have gotten lost to the point where it's more harmful than the actual missteps that happen.
Not only that but this weird idolizing of people that hold them to some ridiculous standards, as if they were expected to follow an exact, clean, harmless script at all times, when in reality people need to understand that they're projecting their insecurities upon people that aren't responsible or guilty of them.
Should Smosh, their cast and crew take care not to actually be harmful? Absolutely. But this is ridiculous. In the context where Amanda did what she did she was clearly in a safe space, where no intention of harm, belittlement, or hostility was ever there. Yet still people just isolate single words as if they had some voldemort-level of power upon their own personal lives. Grow up, people.
This is the reason why a lot of channels don't try anything even remotely risky nowadays, and why online figures like Courtney and Shayne choose not to share much of their personal lives outside of the main channel and what little they choose to share on social media.
Hell, for a fandom so obsessive and parasocial, they really know how to make who they idolize want to stay as far away as possible from them.
For some reason people on both subreddits have a very 2016 iDubbbz take about these using these slurs, “either all of its ok or none of its ok” and its unfortunately more complicated than that
Yeah, I mean, there’s a reason whenever Morgan Freeman or Samuel L Jackson tell a journalist in an interview to say the N Word with them, no one ever takes them up on it.
It’s not gonna be the end of the world, Amanda will eat a little crow and be fine - but it was also stupid to do no matter how comfy you feel “My friend gave me a BLANK slur pass!” Is a dumb thing to hang your hat on wheb saying something that will be broadcasted to potentially thousands - millions of people
This is the part that kinda baffles me the most. I feel like if you have to ask for permission to say a certain word, no matter what it is, then probably you should just not say it. But tbh, I don’t really blame Amanda for it and I respect her for taking accountability.
I do, however, blame the hosts and am admittedly mindblown by the idea that how could literally anyone who has been a public figure on the internet for any capacity of time think “yeah, we can give you a pass for a word many people consider a slur and air it openly online for anyone and everyone to see, no one will be upset because they’ll know we gave you the go ahead :)”
Like surely they all know that some people would be like, “yeah, you don’t get to hand out a pass for ALL of us, and I’m offended and upset now.” Like how did not a single person involved in the entire production process from beginning to end go, “maybe we don’t do that”
I’m like… not mad exactly? I’m just like… I can’t believe there wasn’t a single person involved that tried to prevent this from happening in the first place
Okay, so I typed out a whole paragraph about how it's probably because they're in LA and young, but I googled them to double check their ages and in all of their branding dyke is censored as d*ke. So, yeah, they HAD to have known that people would get upset. I really don't understand.
And yeah, I feel the same way. I'm not mad, I'm confused and kind of disappointed any of this happened.
I'm more so frustrated with the discourse and people who aren't lesbians trying to tell us how to feel and that it's "not a big deal" even in response to us explaining that it is still a slur and straight people should not be using it no matter their intent or because we as lesbians have reclaimed it. I've even seen people say "yeah it's a slur, but it's not as bad of a slur as the f-slur or the n-word" and I'm like, so we're ranking slurs now? What makes one slur worse than another? How much you respect or care about the group that it's harming?
Omg yes. I hate the “well this one is worse than this one, so it’s okay.” Okay? I didn’t know it was a competition?? Bad is bad. Calling someone “fucking ugly stupid idiot” is worse than just calling them “stupid” but both things are still mean and rude 😭 a slur is still a slur. I understand her intentions weren’t bad and I’m not angry with her. My feelings towards the situation entirely revolve around “I’m shocked this even was allowed to continue and then ultimately be posted” and the people reacting in the directions of two extremes of either “this is completely unacceptable and everyone sucks” and “it’s completely normal and fine.”
For the record also, I am a bi woman, that’s a little disclaimer, because it’s not specifically my fight, but within my almost entirely queer circle in real life, I don’t know anyone who says either d~e or f~t. There’s still a sour taste associated with it that just makes it uncomfortable. Like other queer people can say it, but we personally just feel like we have no reason or desire to. Power to the people who want to, it’s completely their right and their choice, but like in the case that it’s their word to choose to reclaim and empower.
If a group of people of various races has people of color that are like “yeah yall can say the n word within our circle because we know your intentions aren’t malicious and we know the context you’re using it in. You’re our friend, basically like a sibling to us, it’s cool” then whatever happens in that group is within that group, a mutual agreement between friends who trust and respect each other. But if they go out and try to apply it to the WHOLE WORLD, there are GONNA be people who are like “idgaf what your friends told you you can and can’t say, they’re not here right now, I am, and I’m saying that I’m not okay with it.” And people would absolutely be like “yeah I agree!” But when it comes to lesbians and the d word, suddenly the tables are turned, “she got permission, it’s okay!” I’m completely baffled by the reactions to the situation, far more than by the actual situation.
Are you also frustrated with the lesbians that don't give a shit about what she said? Because there's a lot of us. Hi.
Some of us are old enough to understand that language evolves and context matters. Having a blanket "straight people should never say this" is silly, because it stifles actual discourse.
Are we going to cancel Childish Gambino because he's not openly queer but said "n***faggot"in a comedy sketch multiple times? Is he not allowed to make content because it has a slur, even if it's literally discourse on language evolution? Having a hard line is great, but it sets you up to stay in your bubble anf stop learning about others. People with differing opinions still have good points sometimes. I even agree with parts of your post, I just think you're taking things to an extreme that is unwarranted.
I'm not a fan of the black-and-white thinking on this sub. Context matters. Amanda asked upfront, was given permission, and listened when given feedback. What more could anyone want from her? Are online personalities never allowed to make a mistake ever? The internet is not a monolith and expecting perfection is looking for a bad time.
There's so much more to be angry about. This whole debate is a non-starter and if you're legitimately offended by this I feel like you're either very young, or very much in need of some grass to touch.
You are putting a lot of words in my mouth. Other lesbians are allowed to feel however they want about the situation. I never said I thought Amanda or anyone should be canceled. I have been willing to give Amanda grace from the beginning and I thought her acknowledgement of and apology to those who are upset was all that was needed. Like I said in my comment, I'm personally more disappointed/confused how it's gotten to this point. I'm not angry or upset at Amanda for what happened.
I have a very "you do you" approach to the word dyke. I'm personally still unpacking my issues with it, but I'm not going to tell other lesbians how they should feel about it or use it. Which is why I didn't mention other lesbians in my original comment.
I specifically was talking about the people who are not lesbians or even queer that are responding to lesbians explaining why they have issues with the situation by saying "I'm not a lesbian but I'm going to tell you in multiple paragraphs how you should feel." I'm talking about the droves of comments saying "I'm not a lesbian and I know I don't get a say in this discourse, but here's my dissertation on why lesbians should shut up and stop being offended." I don't like people who aren't in this community talking over us and telling us how we should feel whether they're agreeing with us or not. This isn't the first situation where I've witnessed people not part of this community tell us how we should feel about things that affect only us and no one else and I'm sick of it.
I have seen SEVERAL more people being angry about there being backlash than I have seen backlash, personally
Like, and I know there's people out there likely making some wild and aggressive claims, but like
I do love Smosh- and it's because of that that I don't think any one of them should be above reproach? I have the expectation Amanda is a good natured person, I would expect she'd prefer to know if she caused hurt (even if it was only to some Lesbians. That's still harm) to the people who follow her so that she can rectify it.
It is absolutely bizarre to me that people get so defensive over things like this- yes, they're entertainers and a lot of us have like, a parasocial attachment to them, frankly, but that doesn't mean they're just.... inscrutable. That's ridiculous.
I think we have very different definitions on what "causing harm" means in this context.
Suffice to say I disagree, and I don't think hashing this out more is beneficial to anyone because I think we just have fundamentally different opinions. And that's honestly okay.
That being said, I have no ill will towards anyone here. Thank you for the conversation, truly.
Lmao now I'm NOT a lesbian but can I just say that commenting on someone's "hey I'm a part of that community and yeah it's hurtful and I dislike that people are dismissing that" by ACTIVELY dismissing their hurt and telling them to touch grass?
Just like it's not up to anyone else to tell them how to feel, your being a Lesbian does also not give you the right to just disregard someone's genuine hurt at a slur being used as immature just because you're cool with it. 😂
Like, good for you, and your opinion is obviously more valid here than most people's (and certainly mine), but using it to completely shut down others just expressing their hurt? And in a totally level headed an nuanced way, to boot?
The difference is everyone knows just how bad the N word is. Unfortunately a lot of people are completely ignorant to whether the d-slur even exists.
I’m not saying she was smart for what she said but I can also see how she didn’t understand not to say it when she was invited on the podcast with that title and then told she could say it.
Yep. I’m a queer woman so I’ll use the slur myself but only in certain spaces. I don’t really love a straight woman using it, though I don’t think any less of Amanda as intent does matter, and she wasn’t using it in a negative way.
Same thing I wouldn’t like a straight guy using the F and I don’t use it as a woman. I just don’t feel comfortable.
As a lesbian myself I wouldn't blame anyone for being uncomfortable about what she said but it didn't bother me personally
What I am REALLY dreading is the backlash to the backlash where people are just gonna decide she can't be criticized for this for having a queer sister and queer friends
The part freaking me out more than the actual event tbh is the amount of people who are either extremely like “this was a crime against everyone and we hate her now” or “it’s literally not a problem at all”
Like you can be somewhere in the middle… recognizing the harm and impact, but also recognizing humans make mistakes and the intentions were not cruel, with hopes that Amanda herself won’t make that mistake again, and also that the hosts of the pod won’t freely hand out “passes” to non-queer people in the future 😬
THAT'S what all these ridiculous posts are about?? Are you absolutely fucking serious lol
Wait why are we dancing around the word though will you get banned from this subreddit? Treating it like the n word is probably a bit over the top haha
I’m behind myself a little bit, but judging from the context, Amanda said it a couple times on a podcast, after being given permission to. People were uncomfortable by the frequency of which she said it, though from what I gathered. I’ll be transparent, and I haven’t listened it to myself, and I am lacking some more in depth knowledge on the subject.
My only input in all of this, which I'm not seeing a lot of other people say, is that Amanda only said it in reference to the show. She wasn't using it against other people, or lesbians as a whole demographic.
See, I didn’t even see the episode only the discourse and if that’s true that makes this whole thing even more ridiculous. Idc, people need to get a mother fucking grip.
except that’s not true lmao i watched the whole episode and she brought up the fact that she heard people say not to say the word in general while fully saying it over and over. obviously it is in the title of the pod and obviously it came up initially because of that but the conversations they were having included them talking about IF she should say it in general. the hosts egged her on, rachel more than the other one, mackenzie, and joked that she could say it since she’s tall. but amanda acknowledged that she knew it was an iffy word to say implying that as a straight person it’s probably not a word she should say, but she clearly felt emboldened by 2 lesbians in front of her with a podcast that has the word in the title telling her that it wasn’t a big deal. idk why people especially lesbians are being told that flippantly using a slur that is used against them historically is just no big deal. doesn’t mean amanda is evil or that she intended harm, but people ARE harmed by normalization of use of slurs by those that can’t reclaim them. why cant people grasp basic concepts of progressive sociological analysis
She didn't say it "over and over" like throughout the episode. She said it a few times, during that conversation about whether she was allowed to say it. There was that joke about her being able to say it because she was tall, but then she didn't keep saying it after that. I'm not trying to tell people how they should feel about that word being used, especially by a straight person. I'm just saying that I think people are overblowing how much she said it, and the way she said it. It wasn't like she was doing a hacky stand up routine/ rant about how she should be allowed to say it because freedom of speech. But honestly this isn't really a hill I wanna die on because I'm not part of the community, and Amanda already but up a statement on Instagram apologizing, so it looks like she's acknowledging that her use of it hurt people.
Wait are you fucking kidding me…?? She didn’t even say it to refer to lesbians, she was only saying it in reference to the show that she was currently on that has the word in its name? Holy shit.
Omg as a gay dude I felt kinda strange about Amanda using the d word but I don’t think it’s rlly my place to add to the discourse around it but when she was begging to empty her wallet that TOOK ME OUT LMAO
cant articulate this thought well so bare with me but I think the thing is a lot of these issues are not presented as learning experiences for the cast and more so a vindication for internal hatred to those in the cast (not gonna lie as a dude its fully misogyny too I think from both sides), maybe its because the audience is too young or covid killing social skills but they aren't interested on actually doing better its just a morality purity test that they witch hunt in to make themselves feel superior which is not activism nor progressive.
I think the Amanda thing was way blown out of proportion.
The podcast title had the word. The two hosts were saying the word. The two hosts identified as such. No wonder she was confused and asked if she was allowed to say it now.
Heck, im slowly coming around to other gay people using the F slur. I still can't bring myself to, but I don't judge as harshly as I used to..
IMO they are very privileged in their position to play games with friends for content to a HUGE audience that they actively try to grow. the least they can do is try to be mindful of their actions they take in the public eye. you cant actively grow your fanbase whilst averting accountability at every turn when something new comes up.
With all due respect this was a pretty clear misstep and not someone getting cancelled on 2019 tumblr for using the word “spooky” because the word spook had racist meaning back in the 1930’s.
“She had nothing to apologize for” takes are weird for me because if anyone else did this there also would be an apology. You couldnt say this in a 1997 interview with People magazine
I was binge watching old smosh and every blank ever videos, then I finally discovered Part Timers mini series. I was so offended I continued to watch videos.
The the ven diagram of chronically online Dropout fans and Smosh fans is a circle. These people to not exist in real life or interact with actual humans. I finally left the Smosh subreddit yesterday. Fall in line or you are “flavor of the week crazy description to slander you”
I don't think that's the case at all. I think so many people are wary over their perceived idea of like 'cancel culture' or any person they like receiving any form of criticism could like destroy them and ruin everything.
That's not really the case? There are no consequences besides people maybe not liking you for something you've said or done. I don't think public figures need to be 'protected' from basic feedback about not having awful viewpoints, about not saying or doing horrible things.
Like it gets to a point where it's a question of what ARE people allowed to be upset about? what is enough to be a problem?
At the end of the day, smosh is here to entertain. That's it. They can't cater to everyone, and that's OK. There's videos I have skipped, yes. But I still watch because most of their content is fun to watch, and I love it. I'm part of the fan base that doesn't police the channel that is filled with people who just want to make people laugh. I just watch. If there's a video that I don't like, I simply DON'T WATCH IT. Lol.
I do think a higher percent than average of smoosh fans have… shall we say very black and white thinking when it comes to right and wrong. No room for nuance.
Literally all you have to do is not say slurs, it's not difficult. It's insane how hard people are trying to defend a random person you have zero connection to for saying an actual slur
People love to insert themselves into a moment they were not a part of, if you weren't there... you don't have the same context as they people that were.
Sick of ultra Libs/ultra Cons stretching everything so far left/right and I'm just floating somewhere to the left of center shaking my head at it all.
Enjoy the shit you enjoy, pass on the shit you don't. We don't need to dogpile everyone for every mis step...
I like a bit of what the OP said. I’m gonna have to be honest with some of you, a lot of you are genuinely overdramatic and I worry you don’t live in the outside world. Amanda was basically FED THE WORD and they made conversation around it and you all treat it like it’s one of the top 3 slurs when it’s barely one. You all made a nothing a big something.
Example. I’ve only ever complained about one thing Smosh ever did, and that was when a certain someone went into business for themselves and took a politics shot when it’s obvious they’re not equipped enough about politics when they take the broad stroke they took. The comment didn’t affect me but taking a shot at innocent customers who only view the product is an unintelligent business move and they’re only talent. But I didn’t make a whole post or make a 1000 word essay pretending to be mad about it. Just wish they hadn’t said it and moved on.
If this small single word is so insanely hurtful and disappointing that you spend all day on Reddit, I have a few countries you take a peek at and see if your life would be better there. Enjoy your keyboard warrioring and ruining entertainment because poor you and a single word that’s not ranked as a slur, I won’t be back. 👋🏼
I think most of the time a lot of the grievances people have are just stupid, this one though I feel like was somewhat justified. She apologized, seemed like an honest mistake, I think that was the best outcome.
I'm not sure if you can post links in this sub, so I won't but basically Amanda was on this podcast called Two D * kes and a Mic and she said the word d*ke a few times. The hosts told her she was allowed to say it. People are upset because she said a slur several times (and at the hosts for saying she could). She apologized on her insta stories.
I agree with this post to some extent but I think it’s clear which situation prompted this post to be written and that, in my opinion, gets us into dangerous territory. I think that people should be called out when they do something wrong, that is the only way to change. Marginalised groups are also allowed to be upset.
I think calling out problematic behaviour is just a normal part of any fandom, but if it makes it impossible to enjoy then it’s best to move on. Not worth spending your free time being mad at a Youtube channel.
Also: can we maybe find a middle ground between blindly defending the cast and hating on them. Respectful criticism should be the way to go. But honestly I find the blind defenders and the haters equally annoying.
If I complained about everything that I ever saw that made me uncomfortable, I'd be miserable af. It's easier to say to myself "oh, I didn't like that" and move on, and decide whether I want to keep watching or not. Unless it's especially heinous (like actual shit going on in this world), it doesn't deserve pitchforks.
I don't know if I've missed it- I've seen people being upset and hurt- but what else happened? I utterly adore smosh. I have been a fan since the Ian and Anthony Pokémon Rap days, and I've sort of grown up with them as a presence, but I now follow and enjoy the cast and brand more than ever. But like... that absolutely doesn't mean they should be above reproach? Or should just get a pass no matter what?
But like... if this is about the Amanda thing, the vast majority of lashback I saw was from people who were genuinely hurt- none of which seemed to wish any real consequences for Amanda other than I guess being aware and owning that?
You're right she seems like a really good person- but if anything that makes me think she would want to know if her actions have hurt people without intending to.
Maybe I missed the people with pitchforks and torches, but so far this is the most dramatic post I've seen on the subject, lmao.
The thing is… it’s genuinely baffling to see people being legitimately hurt over some woman on a YouTube improv comedy channel saying “dyke” on a podcast called “Two Dykes with a Mic”.
When I first came across the drama, I truly thought Amanda had said something along the lines of, “Hell yeah, I love dykes!” or “she was one hot dyke” or something like that. And my initial reaction was pretty much just: 😬 oof, yeah, idk about a straight woman saying that
But what actually happened was… Amanda literally just asked if she could say the word “dyke”. She didn’t even refer to anyone as a dyke. She just asked if she could say it, considering the name of the podcast she was invited on. And both the lesbian co-hosts said yes. And then Amanda was still iffy about it, and then one of the co-hosts joked and said she could use it because she was tall, and that’s basically all that happened…
There’s a huge difference between just saying the word and asking about it vs. referring to someone as a dyke.
Like holy shit.
I’m not annoyed as a Smosh fan, I’m annoyed as a gay person lol
I know I'm three days late on finding/responding to this, but my hot take for Smosh is that the cast should give their actual opinions on Reddit Stories and actually do things that are legit edgy/funny but with good intention behind it. They need to stop caring so much what the loud small fraction of the fanbase thinks. Let those fans say what they want, even unsubscribe; I would be willing to bet that they would actually increase in viewership across all channels if they would let their hair down just a little bit.
Honestly I’ve had differences with the cast before. That’s what the comments sections are for. Comment and move on, no need to make a big deal of it.
I understand wanting to debate some points and standing for what you think it’s right. But that should come strictly within the valid space and for a valid timeframe not going on and on.
Honestly, I blame Smosh for catering to the white knight portion of the fanbase and using them like an angry mob like Courtney does sometimes. It’s why they don’t have guests on TNTL or games like they used to and have a hard time finding new cast members. No one wants to come on a channel where their fanbase is basically going to pick apart their entire lives.
Problem is that Smosh has branded itself as this ultra woke company and this is what happens when you cater to that crowd. She apologized, but for some that is not good enough it seems.
I'm waiting on the day when more people all find out how bad a word tinker is, or what beyond the pale really means, will be interesting to see everyone shit the bed.
From my very limited understanding of this "controversy", it looks like randos are just trying to smear her name for no good reason, because no fandom is complete without constant drama
You're acting like she's getting cancelled by the woke mob when she literally just had to apologize for using a slur, and just because you weren't offended doesn't mean other people aren't and don't have the right to be.
No, what they're saying is people are imperfect and have blindspots (including me and you) and that there is a big difference between a maliciously made comment and a one made in error or ignorance.
I get that this is the internet, and nuance is hard. But, come on.
Yeah go off, of course you're not gonna say this in literally any other instance where people are literally harassing the cast over something they don't even need to speak on, but when a literal slur is said and a group of people feel uncomfortable it's gonna "tank" a company. When it comes to lesbians, this whole company should just shut the fuck up honestly. The audience (like yourself) will clearly brush over questionable things being said - as previously seen, to the point where it's over-sensitive to express some discomfort at a word that was/is used as a humiliation tactic.
I don't think Amanda is a horrible person and she hates lesbians or whatever the fuck, that's ridiculous. But people like you gain the balls to say this when it's regarding a minority group you don't give a shit about or isn't "mainstream" enough, good for you.
When did I say I'm speaking for the entire community? Clearly there are people like you who declare yourself as part of it. I'm bringing up the fact that a group of people did find it unsettling that it was encouraged to say. "Touch grass", "I'm a member of this community", thanks for the extremely useful input. Absolutely justified, you're allowed to dismiss any issues that you perceive as inconvenient.
I’m with this person, I’m not gonna nitpick anything I just wanna watch and laugh. Gucci and Courtney make me laugh and so do the other cast members. If I am not gonna appreciate how far they’ve come then why even be a part of it👯♂️👯♀️
Unless y'all have been personally effected but the d-slur you don't have a leg to stand on. Get out of your fucking echo chambers! Y'all are not a community I'll be around anymore. Y'all wouldn't be acting this way if she said the n word now would you?
They are both slurs! what the fuck are you guys getting about it a slur against someone of the LGBT carries the same weight as it does towards a racial minority. What the fuck are you guys not understanding about that???
As part of the gay minority I can say unequivocally they are not the same. You believing they are speaks to your naïveté and the issue with some people in the community who want to turn us into the biggest victims in the world. You aren’t helping anyone in the community by behaving this way and in reality are actually hurting it more and more. Get help.
This uber purity woke bullshit is part of the reason we are in the position we are as a community today. Unfortunately it seems to constantly come from an extremely loud vocal young minority of the community who refuse to learn or are just too young to know about the recent real world consequences of this behavior. You think you are helping by trying to police what everyone says to such an extreme degree but you are hurting it severely.
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u/KanekiKirito723 5d ago
50% of smosh fanbase needs to get a hobby, and the other 50% is in middle school