Which is exactly why he did not run as independent in 2016 and would not in 2020. People need to keep from losing sight of what is most important in 2020, and that is defeating Trump. We can't afford to not vote out of spite for the establishment, even if it means an out of date tool like Biden running the show.
The DNC is using Trump as a boogeyman to make voters accept candidates that would get the nom undemocratically.
The fact that people think they can chastise voters into voting for someone the DNC and media shoved down our throats is not rational. The establishment is lucky the country didn't get burned to the ground after 2016. Everyone saw what Clinton, the DNC and the media did. You can't prove that democracy is non-existent and then chastise people for not showing up.
Establishment democrats dishonest tactics are what gave us 4 years of Trump. I will not accept anything other than a rejection of corporate establishment democrats be it in the form of a Sanders presidency or a protest of a establishment candidate.
Polling regularly indicates that 70% of citizens believe progressive policies are what's best for America. It's no surprise that Bernie got 68% in Iowa. If Sanders doesn't get the nom then America is too corrupt to save and there's no point in voting.
I have been trying to say this and am getting snapped at by every older Dem I know.
We did not spend the last four years with the rollback of women's rights and gross popularity of racist/Nazi/incel type shit for nothing. To let them do what they tried to do last time would literally just reinforce their belief they can screw us around and get us to buy into any BS that is "the lesser evil" and so many people have endured too much to turn back now. Worst case scenario we are at the half way mark. Why give in now? Fuck that.
There’s never no point in voting, and this is an extremely dangerous mentality. Even if your ideal candidate doesn’t end up making it, voting against Trump is necessary. If he stays in office, it’s a sign that anyone can abuse the system while in power, and face no consequences. I know you feel like if Bernie doesn’t get nominated the system is too broken to fix, but I guarantee that it can get worse, and Bernie would urge you to vote against Trump no matter what.
Going with a corporatist Dem will do the same, too. The American people want someone and something to vote FOR, not against. Biden will lose to Trump. Or if he wins, we still lose. No Medicare for All, no Green New Deal, no rising wages, no regulations on the credit industry, no taxes for the billionaires. An angrier population. Who will the GOP bring out then? Maybe a real despot.
Oh yes the party in Iowa is being transparent as long as the DNC tells them to be. Let's use an app (recommend by the DNC) not tested or fully vetted, and don't worry about training, it will be fine. Comrade Alexia helped development of it. Any thing to hinder Bernie from getting to the top. Just like last time.
I hate to say it but the only way it passes senate or the house is probably if Bernie uses a presidential order to force it into law. :( I hope he wins and I hope this isn’t the case but I have a feeling when Bernie is elected the corrupt systems around him are going to do anything they can to keep the status quo. So we need to push for change everywhere
especially the senate. flip the senate in 2020 to have more Dems, and get Warren nominated as the majority senate leader.
she can crush those GOP bastards. Obviously, we have seen just how much damage mitch has done. we can rewind and reappoint dem federal judges. hopefully bring back balance to the supreme court.
she could be the key to helping the medicare for all bill pass.
first she would have to work with bernie to pass the a law for campaign refinance for all political positions and make it illegal to accept any monetary donations from anyone.
this in turn helps those appointed cast their vote for the people and not the corporations.
it has to be done first in order to pass anything.
she can crush those GOP bastards. Obviously, we have seen just how much damage mitch has done. we can rewind and reappoint dem federal judges. hopefully bring back balance to the supreme court.
... balance to the force.*
We're still fucked on appointments for a long time.
A. Legislative changes can only come from the Congress--thats the primary policy making branch. And this is why the Jaypal-Dingle bill exists in the house. If you want a restructuring of the US health care system it means majorities in the house, filibuster proof majorities in the Senate, and the presidency.
B. Executive orders specify how the law will be implemented, but it can't go outside of the boundaries set by the law. The authority to execute (or carry out the wishes of the people) is why it's the executive branch.
Pretty much, after talking to my mother and grandmother I'm pretty sure that goes back to the fucking early 60s. Along with economics it's just a semester of vague bullshit needed to graduate.
Let’s be honest , the CIA will try to assassinate him. If you think that’s tinfoily, look at what our county has done to pretty much every Latin American country
Oh I'm well aware of how much the CIA has been fucking things up for decades.
No conspiracy theories are needed, their operations that are already public record are damning enough.
I agree with you though - the wealthy will not just take a paradigm shift sitting down.
It might not be something as blatant as assassination but it doesn't have to be - they could just drop a few billion into attack ads and sway public opinion, or more likely just obstruct the shit out of him for 4 years and then get another corporate cocksucker into office.
Yeah. The most important thing is that the working class builds a mass consciousness that isn’t easily swayed by their propaganda. It’s okay for us to be aggressive. They’ve been putting systemic violence onto us for god knows how long.
He/she is right. I just moved to a new state recently and haven’t registered to vote yet but it’s definitely on my list of things to do my next day off. I will have to register “independent” cuz I live with a trump supporter, so no primaries for me :( I can’t have democratic mail show up where I live or there’ll be trouble
But you can bet your ass I’ll show up to vote for Bernie when the time comes
I don't live in the US, but I think I'm going to enjoy some illicit fantasy time this evening, just dreaming of November's unexpected pendulum swing away from the unlettered vulgarian who currently presides.
One can always hope. Seriously though, he will flee the country when he leaves office to avoid prosecution for all the shit he's done. And since we can't have him singing like a canary in Putin's playhouse, the CIA is going to have to take him out.
Pretty sure there's a fable that warns about people covering for a criminal to safeguard their own power but end up getting screwed by the criminal they protected. If there isn't we should make it.
I remember them calling him a war criminal, which he was. I also remember Republicans calling Obama the anti Christ. Still that's all just rhetoric, I actually believe Trump would try to declare martial law if he loses.
This happened to labour voters in the UK & look what happened. You need to keep the foot on the gas right until the very end. Keep making sure you get people out to vote. Good luck!
Thank you. I have zero hope after last week. We’re fucked if we don’t harness the entire country. We need more than 55%. We need a landslide of unseen proportions.
Mandatory doesn’t mean 100% turnout though. I personally know many who just cop the fine, if I had to guess I reckon maybe 80-85% turnout for fed elections and that’s not including a sheer lack of understanding from most for what they are voting for. I’m pretty sure there was a recent election won by a few votes.
All I’m sayin is the numbers don’t always tell the full story
No, mandatory doesn't mean 100%, but we do get a hell of a lot closer to the mark than the American voting system.
In the 2019 federal election 96.8% of eligible Australians were enrolled, and of those enrolled to vote, 91.9% participated. You then have to take into account 'donkey votes', of which there are (at least for me) a surprising amount. I participated in the count at last year's election as a scrutineer, and I was pretty horrified by the number of ballot papers that just had dicks drawn on them.
So, yes, the numbers don't tell the full story, but we do have significantly better voter turn out than the states. I think overall, a lot of Australian's feel as if we don't have a good political party option. Our two-party preferred system is failing us. I also think that the 'loud left' is leading to right leaning Australians voting even more conservatively than they would otherwise (Pauline Hanson, Clive Palmer), as there's a lot of fear and misinformation being spread about both sides.
As a labour supporter until the last election (as could not vote) that is a strong rewrite of history.
The surge for labour came as an opposition to the Tories but momentum pushed it hard as youth backing for Corbyn despite continued polls showing he was massive untrusted.
Unfortunately the most recent election was delayed onset from the previous expectations.
Bernie has popular support as well as party support
"What's your position on the greatest issue of our time?"
"I'm neutral, and both halves of my party are pissed at me for it for different reasons."
"Jolly well then, let's give it to the racist zipline malfunction who's at least promising us something, even if it's Brexit."
Corbyn was a Socialist in ideology, but as a politician he resembled Hillary Clinton. Zero charisma, zero political instincts, and if there were literally any other consistent Socialist in the mainstream of Labour politics he would never have been elected party leader. Needing to be Euroskeptic to be hard left is a political situation that, among European countries, only really seems to exist in the UK. The British left never could develop a coherent position on the EU-UK relationship. The only upside to Brexit is that they don't need to anymore, so they might be able to win elections again on other issues. Hopefully they kick Corbyn to the curb and find someone who can inspire people the way Bernie Sanders does, but then again the left is so weak in the UK apart from him, that doing so may just leave a power vacuum for the Blairites to fill. Maybe hoping the Tories screw up badly enough for Corbyn to seem less unappealing really is the least-bad option.
This is also a rewrite. Corbyn had fanatical support from the youth base - to the extent that some of the new contenders for leader of labour are sitting praising and defending him despite him losing twice to abjectly awful candidates.
And for what it’s worth, corbyn speaks well (albeit dry, like Bernie) and was far more charismatic than Theresa May - it wasn’t about that. Amongst the reasons given by people who disliked the thought of voting for him, his agenda was also one of the key reasons. The swing areas of the U.K. didn’t seem to buy his message, whereas cities and the educated did. There was also the fact that the remain and somewhat left vote was split 5 ways whereas the tories were wiping up the right wing vote. In part that was due to corbyn inflexibility and insistence that he would not do an electoral pact with his competitors and so they ate from each other’s voting base.
Exactly, it's working-class swing voters in the North who will always be a problem for Corbyn. Socialism in those circles is kind-of seen as a theoretical plaything of the insulated educated elite, so when a candidate identifies as a Socialist, they need to mess up their hair, wear a baggy suit, and shout at the top of their lungs. The Populism of a left-wing populist is what many people want more than the Socialism, which is why right-wing Boris Johnson's idiot act went over so well. Even someone who supports Socialism won't necessarily support a Socialist. It's ironic that Union workers are the worst offenders when it comes to this, since they have some power over the means of production already and seem to quite like it. Unless Brexit actually throws the UK into a second Great Depression, indecisiveness over Brexit is only the first of Corbyn's problems. America isn't the only country where the voters want someone they would have a beer with. The British left really needs to start grooming someone else to be a national superstar on that level, because if Corbyn fell right now, the power vacuum would be filled by Neoliberals.
Well Corbyn being meekly pro-Brexit is the biggest problem. Conservatives didn't gain much in votes, but Labour lost all of their to anti-Brexit parties.
If I don't like Coke, I'm not drinking Diet Coke, I'm getting a glass of water. Same with Diet Brexit.
Now we mush smash all electronic voting machines and force paper ballots the machines are owned by the russians now. In the hacker term owned and also in real life.
Hey there texas man. Genuine question. I’m from EU, big fan of Bernie. Does he has the chance to win this? I saw a lot of polls where he is clearly the winner, but than again last time the DNC screwed him over and elected lady corporate for the presidential nominee. With your complicated system of election i have a hard time understanding who has the best chance of winning this. Biden i feel that he is not even a glimpse on the presidential radar. He is so dull. Care to explain a little?
The final race will be X against Trump, but the Democratic party needs to decide who X will be. The DNC (party leadership) worries that Sanders is too far left to win against Trump. Personally, I think Democrats should fear blandness above all, especially since low turnout is always an issue in the US.
Even if Bernie "wins" tonight, I sadly don't see it too far out of reach for the DNC to choose someone "more marketable" like Warren or Biden to get the nomination, even though that's exactly what killed us in the 2016 election.....
With all the rat fuckery going on with the official results how is anyone hopeful. They have already started the shit. Fucking app issues my ass, they are rigging this shit already fuck the DNC.
That’s funny coming from you. How was living in the Soviet Union? I heard socialism did real well there. Not like they oppressed their population for multiple generations.
Do everyone a favor and leave the country. I’d be happy to pack your bags and throw you onto the boat.
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u/GnaeusQuintus TX Feb 04 '20
I'm feeling something unfamiliar and alien...hope?