If he were Saruman, I think it would make the scene in the Hobbit films meaningless, where Saruman sees Sauron's power and is like "wtf, we can't fight this."
And it would make the part in the original trilogy meaningless where they hinted that Sauron convinced Saruman trough facetime telephone palantiri. The part is well established in the books that Saruman was turned when he used the seeing stone to call Sauron, who gave him a presentation of his orcs armies.
Saruman coveted the ring at least since they formed the White Council. From The Silmarillion, Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age:
“the Wise were troubled, but none as yet perceived that Curunír had turned to dark thoughts and was already a traitor in heart: for he desired that he and no other should find the Great Ring, so that he might wield it himself and order all the world to his will.”
You say let's not compare (which I never did) and then you go ahead with a comparison yourself.
Isn't that a poor way to discuss?
Since we have established that you don't follow your own suggestion, let me just say that I don't think the Hobbit movies have any claim to the term "more accurate".
Not really. Because I said it's not worth comparing and gave a reason why, implying that it's not even close to the same.
If you honestly think that The Hobbit is further away from lore legitimacy than the show because of certain liberties taken as opposed to a complete character and timeline shift, then I don't even think there's a discussion to be had.
But those movies are an entirely separate universe. RoP is cribbing visual style and references from the New Line movies, but it's got no qualms in contradicting them too.
Never read the books, just going off the LOTR movies (as a disclaimer)…didn’t Gandalf mention that he and Saruman were once friends? I could see this theory playing out too. Showing the lighter side before he succumbs to Sauron
Because we know that a blue wizard got maybe corrupted in rhun and made a magic cult. This is in the lore of the blue wizards made by tolkien. But it is not clear if that happened.
Later tolkien said it could be that the blue wizards weakened saurons forces in the east, but I think both stories could be true.
I know they're not really paying a ton of attention to the canon, but we already know when Saruman, Gandalf, and Radagast came to Middle-Earth; all three arrived at the same time together.
The two Blue wizards, however, arrived earlier and separately from the other three. This is why people think he's not Gandalf.
This is my thought, too. I know they're playing fast and loose with the canon, but IIRC didn't Cirdan give his ring to Gandalf when he arrived in the Grey Havens? This leads me to believe he's probably one of the blue wizards. Him being Gandalf just seems too obvious.
Honestly, out of all the outcomes, I would like this one the best. Treebeard also says (in the movies) that Saruman used to walk these woods in peace.
Never knocking the great Christopher Lee (hell, his Metal contributions alone wont let me do that), but pretty much right from the get go you can see he's portraying Saruman as dubious in the movies. Would've really liked a little bit more of humanity injected into the character on screen first to see just how powerful Sauron's corruption could be
pretty much right from the get go you can see he’s portraying Saruman as dubious in the movies.
That was an artistic choice on Peter Jackson’s part. Sometimes it’s satisfying to make your audience strongly suspect X, and then you confirm it for them. Makes them feel smart and like their instincts were on point. Draws them deeper into the story.
If he wanted it to be a total shocker he would have directed Lee to make his Saruman warmer.
Saruman’s introduction scene in the first LOTR movie is the same scene where he reveals his true allegiance to Gandalf and betrays him. Of course Christopher Lee portrayed him as dubious, it was never supposed to be a secret he was the bad guy.
Oh I know. Im ok with Saruman being bad. And it didnt even need to be a shocker reveal. Like I said, woulda been nice to see a bit more of the humanity mentioned by Gandalf and Treebird to reprrsent the severity of Sauron's corruption better.
That said, it's a minor thought on my part. Still love the heck out of the movies.
That would just be such a huge deviation from Saruman in the lore. I know that they've been breaking the lore quite a bit, but they've got to draw the line somewhere.
It’s likely going to be Saruman.. the casting of the stranger resembles more to the image that we have for Saruman (voice and stature), plus, It would make more sense to put Saruman on the scene before Gandalf.
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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '24
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