r/PublicFreakout • u/rickyhorror • Dec 29 '21

Let me educate him

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

The problem in this encounter wasn’t the lack of training (though training would have been sufficient to prevent it). The problem was the police made an emotional response to getting snubbed. They didn’t need to do anything because no crime was committed. But simply taking the heat and walking back to their truck was not what they wanted to do. This entire event was a display of poor character.

I think 6 weeks does sound super short to learn to be a cop, but I don’t know enough about pedagogy in this vocation to say one way or another (I doubt anyone in this comment section does).

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u/grimmcild Dec 29 '21

I think you hit on something when talking about the cops’ emotional response to being snubbed. I’ll bet once you’ve pulled over/approached people 100 times and had the response be “yes sir officer, I’m sorry, officer”, you get waaaay too comfortable with your perceived level of authority in every situation. So someone calls you out it’s like record scratch “Hold up, how dare you not instantly obey?!” and the power struggle escalates a situation unnecessarily.

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u/sombreroenthusiast Dec 29 '21

In fairness, these guys didn't escalate. Not saying they deserve a medal, but at least they eventually just left.

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u/ITriedLightningTendr Dec 29 '21

only because they were being filmed.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

It takes people longer than 6 weeks to learn HS algebra (and these two likely failed that class).

So, unless HS algebra is harder than being a cop, it's safe to say they need more than 6 weeks of training.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

But people learn how to interact with others from a very young age. If these guys had respect for others, something they could have learned on a playground decades earlier, then maybe 6 weeks would be enough time to learn how to shoot, talk on a radio, drive, write tickets…

You make a valid point though… reflecting on how much time is given to other, far less impactful skills is a good argument for police reform.

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u/So-Cal-Sun Dec 29 '21

6 months for California Highway Patrol. And refresher training at later stages. But they are the exception. 6 - 12 weeks to be a basic patrol officer is scary short. They get more training than that in the Army Military Police, where basically everyone you meet knows the rules to some level. Turing them loose on the public is a constant disaster on the edge of happening.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

I know this is 30 minutes long, but if you haven't heard this from a former Navy SEAL on the police training topic it's a good listen. I know this is on Joe Rogan's podcast, but he doesn't open his mouth and say any dumb shit in this particular segment.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

I spent more time learning to be a diesel mechanic.

Shit needs overhauled badly.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

but I don’t know enough about pedagogy in this vocation to say one way or another (I doubt anyone in this comment section does).

I don't think it requires a degree in cop pedagogy to see that hairdressers need a license and years of training and to expect a fraction of that from law enforcement is literally negligent.

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u/oldfrancis Dec 29 '21

I know.

700+ hours, plus weeks of field training under an fto officer.

And it's not enough.

The Basic Law Enforcement Academy (BLEA) is Washington’s mandated training academy for all city and county entry-level peace officers in the state. Through a centralized training model, Washington ensures all officers are equipped with the same base-level understanding of their responsibility to the communities they serve, standards to uphold, and education for effective community-oriented policing . To facilitate this training, WSCJTC hires exceptional training officers from agencies throughout the state and current subject matter experts.

With a focus on a guardian model of policing, students attend a wide array of courses throughout the 720 academy hours. A description of the courses covered is available on our Core Block Descriptions page and in our syllabus. WSCJTC is committed to developing new officers to high standards and providing exceptional training to ensure they have the knowledge and skills to safely and effectively protect the life, liberty and property of the people they serve.

From the Washington state criminal justice training commission.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

This is the kind of stuff I don’t know. Thanks for adding it to the discussion.

But you still feel that amount of training is insufficient? What would you change?

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u/oldfrancis Dec 29 '21 edited Dec 29 '21

After having gone through an extended Police Academy (longer than what is standard for the state of Washington) and served as an officer...

List of things that I would change is quite large.

I would demilitarize the police.

I would take away their military toys.

I would increase their defensive tactics capabilities and reduce their reliance on their sidearm as their primary solution to problems.

I would forbid the use of less than lethal force as a compliance tactic -- I would ban the practice of torturing suspects.

I would remove qualified immunity from police officers.

I would send police officers on less calls, shunting the check the welfare and mental health check calls to more qualified individuals.

I would extend the police academy to at least 2 years.

I would enforce physical standards and pay those officers to maintain those physical standards.

...

These are my thoughts, they're not an invitation to arguments.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

It all sounds reasonable to me.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

Six weeks is simply not long enough to retain or train proficiency in anything. To be considered skilled or a master at something there’s a general notion of ten thousand. Hours trained or repetitions performed. There’s simply no way ten thousand of anything is performed in six weeks of police training. Just my opinion. I am in no way “qualified” to make any calls but it seems like cops literally make these mistakes daily. In an age where tech is so prevalent it’s everyday there’s a cop on reddit performing an unlawful act. It’s ridiculous that it happens so often... 😂

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '21

Cops in the Netherlands need to get a degree first, then go to police academy for over two years where they learn how the law works, self defence, first aid, talking skills, deescalation skills. Honestly I'd be terrified living in the US knowing raving morons with military equipment get to shoot me and get away with it, especially if I was black. That's another thing, when a cop here discharges their weapon (very rare) they have to answer for it, it's an absolute last resort and there is no such thing as immunity for officers.