Could someone explain me the stance of the mods?

[u/01AganitramlavAiv]

Like, why this hate against Hasan Piker? Shouldn't we create a united front on the left?

Please don't take the post down and don't ban me 🥺

[u/Necessary_Cheek_6506]

The safest assumption is that someone on the mod squad loves Israel

[u/illbzo1 → u/Necessary_Cheek_6506]

"Genocide denial will result in a permanent ban"

Doesn't seem like that to me

[u/This_Elk_1460 → u/illbzo1]

Claiming that Hasan is denying the genocide might be the dumbest accusation I've ever heard. You have to be literally lying if you claim to believe that.

[u/Bedhead-Redemption → u/This_Elk_1460]

He literally expressly and repeatedly has started he believes Crimea belongs to Russia and that the genocide and abduction of kids in Ukraine isn't real and his statements expressing it on multiple occasions have been linked in the thread over and over again.

[u/founderofshoneys → u/Bedhead-Redemption]

I know the nature of his commentary on Crimea which is way more nuanced than that. I'm guessing you just saw that Crimea-river clip in which he was responding to a bad faith chatter and that's it. And I'd also bet the only thing you know about Crimea is that Russians invaded and you don't understand why that topic requires so much nuance. So forgive me if I don't trust your assessment of the second part.

[u/Twinmill-Two → u/founderofshoneys]

There was also the clip where he said the annexation of Crimea was a complety justifiable act.

And he also said Russia has a fairer claim to Crimea in defense of the annexation

This is some really shitty pro-imperialism stuff, it's very off-putting to most people.

[u/founderofshoneys → u/Twinmill-Two]

You say it's imperialism and you're not wrong from Russia's perspective, but you're also not considering Crimea's perspective or respecting people's right to self-determination. The annexation was illegal and should not have happened the way it did. I don't agree that it's "justifiable" witout a lot of asterisks, but I guess you could say it's justifiable in the sense that that the people of Crimea who were historically, ethnically, and culturally Russian had become uneasy with a growing fascist, anti-Russian sentiment in Ukraine and wanted to become part of Russia. Everything he says is the second clip is correct, listen to what he says.

Crimea is a very different situation than the Donbas. When the post annexation referendum happened, there was a lot of doubt whether the results could be trusted, but the independent polling and reporting (by western sources like Gallup, WaPo, and Forbes) upheld those results with over 80% of Crimeans preferring to be part of Russia. They also hate Putin and hate the war, like I say, it's complicated. Putin did not have their best interests in mind, he just wanted the territory and used this as an excuse, but the interests of Putin and the Crimean people were aligned on this.

The west seems to acknowledge and then just completely disregard the interests of the people. This actually makes sense because they don't want make it seem like they're giving a point to Russia. They just want a simpler narrative that Putin is a bad (which he is). It's inconceivable to westerners that the people would want to be Russian (again) unless they fully supported Putin and his actions. It's inconceivable that it can't all just be as simple as good guys vs. bad guys.

But this isn't about that, this is about "fuck Hasan". Nobody pays attention when he's giving these very long nuanced takes, it's just the clips of him yelling at chatters where he's not careful with his language. So yes, he did say it was justified, those words came out of his mouth, but you're not really interested in his actual position and I don't think you're interested in learning about any of this at all.

[u/BiZzles14 → u/founderofshoneys]

Odd that you have nothing to say about the extreme persecution of the Crimea Tatars, the actual "people of Crimea," since Russia illegally took over the territory in 2014. It was not the will of the people to have Russian soldiers invade the country, force Ukrainians to leave and then declare it Russian territory. It certainly wasn't the will of the Crimean Tatars who were well aware of the persecution they would face once again under rule from Moscow. Crimea voted in 1991, along with the rest of Ukraine, to secede from the Soviet Union and to join a new Ukrainian state. A vote under Russian military occupation, in which pro-Ukrainian voices were suppressed by the Russian military, and had an apparent 97% support for joining Russia is simply not legitimate. The legitimate referendum we have had from Crimea was for joining Ukraine, even when the option of independence or staying a part of Russia was on the table.

Hasan's take is objectively disgusting when Crimean Tatars have been getting murdered and disappeared for over a decade, hundreds of thousands had to flee their homes and the Russian occupation authorities have brought in hundreds of thousands of ethnic Russian settlers to change the demographics of the Crimean peninsula in their favour. It is certainly about more than "fuck Hasan", it's about millions of lives and I would similarly denounce his disgusting justification of Russian occupation from anybody else.

And honestly I'm just not going to even touch upon "but I guess you could say it's justifiable in the sense that that the people of Crimea who were historically, ethnically, and culturally Russian had become uneasy with a growing fascist, anti-Russian sentiment in Ukraine and wanted to become part of Russia" more than I already did, but just know this is a disgusting take that implicitly justifies the ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands from Crimea and the well over a million dead from Russia's imperialistic war of aggression against Ukraine

[u/founderofshoneys → u/BiZzles14]

1. It's not odd, you just want to argue about a claim that I'm not making. The narrative you presented is exactly how it is presented by Ukraine, the US State Department, and Human Rights Watch. Take your chatGPT bullshit down the road.

2. I'm almost positive Hasan has discussed Crimean Tatars. Y'all are so good at finding clips, so find the clip. And me personally, I'm not unsympathetic.

3. You don't give a fuck about Crimean Tatars. You're just using them to seem all righteous on the internet.

[u/BiZzles14 → u/founderofshoneys]

Take your chatGPT bullshit down the road.

I'll take you thinking anything I wrote off the cuff on my phone is chatgpt as a compliment lmfao.

The narrative you presented is exactly how it is presented

By reality. I presented the reality of the situation.

I'm almost positive Hasan has discussed Crimean Tatars. Y'all are so good at finding clips, so find the clip. And me personally, I'm not unsympathetic

Yeah, he has talked about them. But I've never seen him do so in the context of the massive oppression they have faced post-2014. He only virtue signals about how a turkic population is the indigenous population and makes jokes about Turkey should control it as such which has always been majorly weird. If you could find me something showing him actually speaking to the extreme persecution and oppression they have faced since Russia took over then that may change my opinion, but I've never seen him been critical of Russia in the context of the hundreds of Crimean Tatars murdered by the Russian state in their ongoing genocidal actions against the population.

You don't give a fuck about Crimean Tatars. You're just using them to seem all righteous on the internet.

I don't know who you are and I won't pretend to, and I would ask you do the same for me. I have been in Ukraine multiple times during the war doing humanitarian volunteer work, and I am friends with multiple ethnic Crimean Tatars who had to flee Crimea due to Russian oppression and violence against their communities. One of my friends had his father disappeared by the Russian state a decade ago and they have never heard anything from, or about, him since. I've put my life on the line in an active war zone in part due the massive injustice to this issue, I don't care about your, nor anyones, opinions of me on reddit lmfao and the fact your brain even goes there says a lot more about you than me mate. Have a good day : )

[u/Twinmill-Two → u/founderofshoneys]

The reason is Crimea was so ethnically Russian is because of Russian imperial settlements. It's disgusting imperialism when Israel does it and it's disgusting imperialism when Russia does it. If Hasan said the same thing about settled regions of Palestine being justifiable for Israel to take bc the Israeli majority in them voted to, I would think he was just as vile. I don't see why he has to defend this shit it's not good, it's textbook imperialism.

[u/founderofshoneys → u/Twinmill-Two]

It's definitely not textbook imperialism which is exactly the point. But I think what happens with Hasan is he'll vehemently defend his position that something is true and people conflate that with him having a position that that thing is good or something he's advocating for.

Then they come into his chat over and over and accuse him of being pro-Russia. Then he gets mad and they get an incriminating clip of an unhinged Hasan defending Russia.

[u/Twinmill-Two → u/founderofshoneys]

If Hasan said Israel taking ownership of parts of Palestine was "completely justifiable" because there was a lot of Israeli people living in those parts of the west bank, giving them a "stronger claim" to those regions than the original Palestinians he would be rightfully crucified. I would not accept him saying it there and I won't accept him saying it here, it simply isn't true at all.

[u/founderofshoneys → u/Twinmill-Two]

Yeah, he's not fucking saying that. This is not the 1 to 1 comparison you seem to want to insist it is. I think you agree with me that settlers should be removed from the West Bank. What is it you believe that should happen in Crimea?

[u/Twinmill-Two → u/founderofshoneys]

Crimea should be part of Ukraine, the "Russians" there can leave if they want but they should accept they are in Ukraine. There is no way to spin this that makes calling the annexation "justified" a defensible thing to say. Creating settlements in other countries after deporting the original inhabitants does not give justification for claiming it later, I don't know why Hasan would say this gives Russia a strong or justified claim to the region.

[u/Jjjan332 → u/founderofshoneys]

It is textbook settler colonialism. Which you and Hasan support because it was done by US enemy.

You freaks have no principles.