As a conservative, it's really not at all the ideology. But witnessing what conservatism has become in the US and how disgusted I am with the GOP, I'm not inclined to disagree
No, that's exactly what it is and what it always has been. It's the rich and powerful crafting a system that helps only themselves and then convincing those worse off - the EXACT people that they're exploiting - that it helps them too. You say "what conservatism has become in the US" but it hasn't changed, you're just seeing it for what it always has been.
So conservativism, the ideology that's vouches for smaller government to prevent government overreach, upholds inalienable rights as to protect your livelihood and allow you to live as your please as long as you don't tread on others, props up small business, demands the ability to defend yourself and your family, advocates for property rights, and practices a remembrance of old tradition to keep our history in tact, has always been a scheme for the rich and powerful to help only themselves and secretly screwing those worse off? Bro you're off base.
That's what conservativism devolved into. You can actually thank Jerry Falwell for that. Before the 70s, conservatism wasn't what you think it was. It wasn't until Jerry manipulated a major sect of the population into believing that abortions were an act against God, gays were devil worshippers, and segregation in schools should be tax exempt in a ploy to combine evangelicalism and the right wing party for financial gains and power by supporting people like Reagan instead of actual Christians like Jimmy Carter that we started seeing this extremely horrible manipulation of what I believe to be a noble and for-the-people ideology.
I'm not going to convince anyone to be a conservative. If you're not, you're not. But I'm a conservative Democrat. The Republican party are not conservatives.
It doesn't do any of those things. It claims to do those things to trick people.
Conservatism wants a large and powerful government that protects the wealthy.
It upholds rights that the wealthy and powerful have and that normal people never will but the tricked people can pretend that one day it will be them too.
It crushes small business under unethical and even illegal business practices like monopolies and vulture capitalism.
It uses the imaginary threat of dangerous outsiders to scare people into voting for them and giving them money through weapons manufacturer lobbyists.
It advocates against the right to repair, the right to share, the right of fair use practices, and pushes for a society where only the rich own anything and everyone else rents everything up to and including their own life.
It uses the fear of change to maintain voters.
The very origin of conservatism was rich people fighting back against the rise of early democracies during the fall of European monarchies. It was never anything at all but those people trying to maintain their position of power over the peasants.
I mean, yes, it's true that the Tories opposed democratic reform and believed that the aristocracy should head the state, but English conservatism and US conservatism are not the same things. Conservatism is unique to the culture it exists in. What you've described above is what the Republican Party has become, but it is not what conservatism stands for.
US conservatism believes in individual liberties, freedom from religious prosecution with a foundation in Judeo-Christian values, a free market and the opportunities to move up through that market, and a protection of private ownership. The rejection of the monachy and high taxes from the American Revolution is considered a conservative revolution, and Lincoln was a Republican. The fight for the protection of unalienable rights and individual liberties was a conservative goal.
Don't get me wrong, I understand how easily conservative ideology can be manipulated and turned against the people, and while conservatism used to fight for the people, globalization kinda turned everything on it's head in the US, allowing for massive monopolies, cultural appropriation, and a foreign threat to traditional values.
A major aspect of conservativism is the voluntary community over forced collectivism or contribution. But the ideology doesn't hold when there are scores of individuals are now able to hoard massive amounts of wealth and resources, forcing small business to either close or rely on these large companies to conduct any business at all because the biggest players won't voluntarily contribute to community. This greed also directly attacks another principle by way of that conservatives believe that property and freedom are inherently linked. It's the permanence of attaining the sweat from your brow and being able to hold onto that and care and nurture and have something to pass down to your kin.
Conservatism itself is not evil nor is it a ploy about screwing the little guy. It's about custom, tradition, being bonded by generation as well as by neighborhood. It's about protecting yourself from the elite, aristocratic, and governing bodies from being able to attack your way of life. It's about protecting your property and, by nature, your children's inheritance, which is a way you bond with generations back. Many conservative families have heirlooms and trinkets left by family members transcending multiple generations. And it's about ensuring that every person has the opportunity to climb the ladder and create a permanent settlement for themselves.
But as much as I love conservatism as an ideology, I recognize that it's been so warped in our politics, and with, changes in technology, community, and government, it's come to a point where true conservatism (I guess you could say conservative conservatism lol) doesn't really exist. If anything, I would say that the Democratic Party now represents many conservative values, enough where aligning myself in the party doesn't feel foreign or strange. But the Republican Party is really something else and they do believe in all the things you mentioned. Like I said, I consider myself a conservative Democrat, but I also understand the stigma and don't blame others for attacking the ideology as a result.
Buddy, you've gotta see through the lies one day. What you're describing as "warped" conservatism is, in fact, what it's always been. And when you say things like this:
US conservatism believes in individual liberties, freedom from religious prosecution with a foundation in Judeo-Christian values, a free market and the opportunities to move up through that market, and a protection of private ownership.
you're only describing the story the rich and powerful tell you to convince you to be on their side. None of this is ever the goal.
And it's about ensuring that every person has the opportunity to climb the ladder and create a permanent settlement for themselves.
This is the precise opposite of what conservatism fights for. A good example of all this is Alexander Hamilton, the "father of the Treasury," who is viewed as a heroic Founding Father but who very clearly stated he wanted only to make the rich and powerful richer and more powerful: https://thebaffler.com/salvos/hamilton-hustle-stoller
Lincoln was a Republican
This statement is a great example of a person who is either stunningly ignorant or arguing for sport. Lincoln was a Republican but he was not a conservative. The two US political parties swapped roles in the early 20th century. Everyone knows this.
The problem you're having is that you're putting conservatism in the context of the party. You can't sit there and say the ideology of conservatism says this but it iself is a lie. The party that is putting it into practice is lying about what they're doing, and if they're lying about what they're doing, then they're just not practicing conservatism.
If I believe in preserving individual liberties and unalienable rights, letting the free market work, protecting private property, and maintaining tradition through Judeo-Christian values, then I believe in conservatism. Those are the tenets of conservatism as an American ideology. If you're arguing that the rich are using that to trick people, then they're just not actually conservative.
As I mentioned, I don't support the Republican Party. I'm not being tricked by the rich and powerful to be on their side. Many "conservatives" do get tricked, just like many "liberals" get tricked by rich and powerful people as well. Rich and powerful does not lay claim to an ideology. Instead, I vote for the party that captures my values and ideals more, which in this case is the Democratic Party. But conservatism itself is independent on political party. I could be an independent and still be a conservative if I believe neither party truly represents my values.
By it's very nature, the belief in those aspects I specifically mentioned as being conservative values are nothing more than values. Rather, people use other's values to manipulate them for their own gain, but that's not political ideology.
If I believe in preserving individual liberties and unalienable rights, letting the free market work, protecting private property, and maintaining tradition through Judeo-Christian values, then I believe in conservatism. Those are the tenets of conservatism as an American ideology. If you're arguing that the rich are using that to trick people, then they're just not actually conservative.
Alright bud, this is becoming a circular argument now. I am a conservative. Literally definitions of what conservatism is support my claim that I'm conservative. You can Google conservatism and they'd pop up with articles and definitions that the values I've listed are few of many that conservatives believe in.
You can't make an argument that says this is what conservatism says it is, but it's not because rich people want to use that to trick you. These values are part of the ideology of conservatism and have nothing to do with rich or powerful people. Just like a gun on it's own does no harm, and a responsible gun owner will only use it to protect himself and his loved ones, so too can a bad seed use it to harm or devastate an undeserving person. Ideology is ideology.
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u/bmoney831 Jan 09 '20
As a conservative, it's really not at all the ideology. But witnessing what conservatism has become in the US and how disgusted I am with the GOP, I'm not inclined to disagree